Guild Wars 2

Zach.3264:

colesy.8490:

Zach.3264:

Painbow.6059:

Zach.3264:

Stop with the “AH is for new people” already..
It’s in the grandmaster line. No where does it state “this is for new players only”.
It’s a trait, it’s there to be used by anyone who wants to.

It’s like saying only new players use Selfless Daring because they don’t have any friends to heal them.

I really do think half of you forget that there are a large portion who play MMO’s for enjoyment, and not to fuel their ego about being “best” or “better” than others. If someone wants to play AH then let them, there’s nothing wrong with it whatsoever.

Because while your team is suffering to get out enough damage to kill stuff fast enough you are sitting happy with your useless skill less build not giving a fudge about anything. Being a guardian is about being a ‘selfless defender’ not a self-healing-waste-of-potential. If you want to play AH in pve go ahead but just know that it’s like a wet fish flopping on the side of a boat

Not at all. I run AH in Fractals all the time and it’s great. My damage is still decent and I can survive easily enough to continue to do damage/heal others.
Plus, I run Hammer, when traited I can have my auto-attack symbol down 100% of the time if I don’t use #2. This applies constant -33% damage to my group.
And again.. you’re forgetting, not everyone plays to be as effective as possible, some people actually play for enjoyment, you know?

do you slot in utilities dependent on situation or shouts for AH procs? You don’t need AH if you’re playing properly since you will be mitigating damage at the entire party well enough to not need to heal, well, yourself. Also, I find fun in efficiency so I don’t see why you bring the fun argument in. Meta is fun.

And that is exactly my point. “I find fun in efficieny so I don’t see why you bring the fun argument in”.
You’re thinking about only yourself. Not everyone shares the same opinion as you. Why should everyone else be pidgeon holed into playing what’s most effective because you think it’s the correct way to play?

If you’re meant to play a certain way, then wouldn’t Anet purposely make everyone play said way, and not give them the option to play differently?

Odd you would say he’s only thinking about himself when he’s advocating a build with more team support and you’re advocating a build that specializes in keeping only you alive.

We get that not everyone wants to run a meta, and that’s fine. But when a person is asking for advice we will still give it to them. Yes, we are often operating under the assumption that everyone wants fast, smooth runs. As Obtena and various people have pointed out, not everyone finds that fun. Ok, that’s fine, then you could just say if you want faster, easier runs choose the the meta build(s). It has been proven beyond a shadow of doubt that this is the best build for fast, easy runs. But if you aren’t interested in faster, smoother runs there are plenty of options including the AH build that excels in keeping you alive in trade of dps and team support.

laharl.8435:

Zach.3264:

colesy.8490:

Zach.3264:

Painbow.6059:

Zach.3264:

Stop with the “AH is for new people” already..
It’s in the grandmaster line. No where does it state “this is for new players only”.
It’s a trait, it’s there to be used by anyone who wants to.

It’s like saying only new players use Selfless Daring because they don’t have any friends to heal them.

I really do think half of you forget that there are a large portion who play MMO’s for enjoyment, and not to fuel their ego about being “best” or “better” than others. If someone wants to play AH then let them, there’s nothing wrong with it whatsoever.

Because while your team is suffering to get out enough damage to kill stuff fast enough you are sitting happy with your useless skill less build not giving a fudge about anything. Being a guardian is about being a ‘selfless defender’ not a self-healing-waste-of-potential. If you want to play AH in pve go ahead but just know that it’s like a wet fish flopping on the side of a boat

Not at all. I run AH in Fractals all the time and it’s great. My damage is still decent and I can survive easily enough to continue to do damage/heal others.
Plus, I run Hammer, when traited I can have my auto-attack symbol down 100% of the time if I don’t use #2. This applies constant -33% damage to my group.
And again.. you’re forgetting, not everyone plays to be as effective as possible, some people actually play for enjoyment, you know?

do you slot in utilities dependent on situation or shouts for AH procs? You don’t need AH if you’re playing properly since you will be mitigating damage at the entire party well enough to not need to heal, well, yourself. Also, I find fun in efficiency so I don’t see why you bring the fun argument in. Meta is fun.

And that is exactly my point. “I find fun in efficieny so I don’t see why you bring the fun argument in”.
You’re thinking about only yourself. Not everyone shares the same opinion as you. Why should everyone else be pidgeon holed into playing what’s most effective because you think it’s the correct way to play?

If you’re meant to play a certain way, then wouldn’t Anet purposely make everyone play said way, and not give them the option to play differently?

Odd you would say he’s only thinking about himself when he’s advocating a build with more team support and you’re advocating a build that specializes in keeping only you alive.

We get that not everyone wants to run a meta, and that’s fine. But when a person is asking for advice we will still give it to them. Yes, we are often operating under the assumption that everyone wants fast, smooth runs. As Obtena and various people have pointed out, not everyone finds that fun. Ok, that’s fine, then you could just say if you want faster, easier runs choose the the meta build(s). It has been proven beyond a shadow of doubt that this is the best build for fast, easy runs. But if you aren’t interested in faster, smoother runs there are plenty of options including the AH build that excels in keeping you alive in trade of dps and team support.

Funny thing is, all you PvE Elitest `presume` everyone is running in guild groups or w/ very experience dungeon runners. =]

For the average pugger, it most likely IS better to be more focused over healing due to the FACT your teammates ~won’t~ know the subtleties of what you’re provided (IE Aegis, Blocks, etc).

All your all blanket statements do nothing to help people.

Amins.3710:

laharl.8435:

Zach.3264:

colesy.8490:

Zach.3264:

Painbow.6059:

Zach.3264:

Stop with the “AH is for new people” already..
It’s in the grandmaster line. No where does it state “this is for new players only”.
It’s a trait, it’s there to be used by anyone who wants to.

It’s like saying only new players use Selfless Daring because they don’t have any friends to heal them.

I really do think half of you forget that there are a large portion who play MMO’s for enjoyment, and not to fuel their ego about being “best” or “better” than others. If someone wants to play AH then let them, there’s nothing wrong with it whatsoever.

Because while your team is suffering to get out enough damage to kill stuff fast enough you are sitting happy with your useless skill less build not giving a fudge about anything. Being a guardian is about being a ‘selfless defender’ not a self-healing-waste-of-potential. If you want to play AH in pve go ahead but just know that it’s like a wet fish flopping on the side of a boat

Not at all. I run AH in Fractals all the time and it’s great. My damage is still decent and I can survive easily enough to continue to do damage/heal others.
Plus, I run Hammer, when traited I can have my auto-attack symbol down 100% of the time if I don’t use #2. This applies constant -33% damage to my group.
And again.. you’re forgetting, not everyone plays to be as effective as possible, some people actually play for enjoyment, you know?

do you slot in utilities dependent on situation or shouts for AH procs? You don’t need AH if you’re playing properly since you will be mitigating damage at the entire party well enough to not need to heal, well, yourself. Also, I find fun in efficiency so I don’t see why you bring the fun argument in. Meta is fun.

And that is exactly my point. “I find fun in efficieny so I don’t see why you bring the fun argument in”.
You’re thinking about only yourself. Not everyone shares the same opinion as you. Why should everyone else be pidgeon holed into playing what’s most effective because you think it’s the correct way to play?

If you’re meant to play a certain way, then wouldn’t Anet purposely make everyone play said way, and not give them the option to play differently?

Odd you would say he’s only thinking about himself when he’s advocating a build with more team support and you’re advocating a build that specializes in keeping only you alive.

We get that not everyone wants to run a meta, and that’s fine. But when a person is asking for advice we will still give it to them. Yes, we are often operating under the assumption that everyone wants fast, smooth runs. As Obtena and various people have pointed out, not everyone finds that fun. Ok, that’s fine, then you could just say if you want faster, easier runs choose the the meta build(s). It has been proven beyond a shadow of doubt that this is the best build for fast, easy runs. But if you aren’t interested in faster, smoother runs there are plenty of options including the AH build that excels in keeping you alive in trade of dps and team support.

Funny thing is, all you PvE Elitest `presume` everyone is running in guild groups or w/ very experience dungeon runners. =]

For the average pugger, it most likely IS better to be more focused over healing due to the FACT your teammates ~won’t~ know the subtleties of what you’re provided (IE Aegis, Blocks, etc).

All your all blanket statements do nothing to help people.

I run pugs fairly often still, I often log on too late to get in on guild tours. I pug arah p4 almost every night, sometimes with 4 brand new arah players. This build works in pugs as well, because it’s a very team focused build.

I’ll definitely agree that most pugs won’t notice the subtleties of what a good guardian is providing. They will often only notice if you’re dying a lot. I’m fine with that, I understand not everyone has total situational awareness, myself included. That’s why we usually recommend wearing knights gear until you are experienced enough to run full zerk.

Zach.3264:

Painbow.6059:

Zach.3264:

Stop with the “AH is for new people” already..
It’s in the grandmaster line. No where does it state “this is for new players only”.
It’s a trait, it’s there to be used by anyone who wants to.

It’s like saying only new players use Selfless Daring because they don’t have any friends to heal them.

I really do think half of you forget that there are a large portion who play MMO’s for enjoyment, and not to fuel their ego about being “best” or “better” than others. If someone wants to play AH then let them, there’s nothing wrong with it whatsoever.

Because while your team is suffering to get out enough damage to kill stuff fast enough you are sitting happy with your useless skill less build not giving a fudge about anything. Being a guardian is about being a ‘selfless defender’ not a self-healing-waste-of-potential. If you want to play AH in pve go ahead but just know that it’s like a wet fish flopping on the side of a boat

Not at all. I run AH in Fractals all the time and it’s great. My damage is still decent and I can survive easily enough to continue to do damage/heal others.
Plus, I run Hammer, when traited I can have my auto-attack symbol down 100% of the time if I don’t use #2. This applies constant -33% damage to my group.
And again.. you’re forgetting, not everyone plays to be as effective as possible, some people actually play for enjoyment, you know?

If you enjoy to suck, I play fractals in pugs up to max with full glass cannon no problem. You can run 15,15,0,20,20 with hammer, be more useful and deal more damage

Amins.3710:

laharl.8435:

Zach.3264:

colesy.8490:

Zach.3264:

Painbow.6059:

Zach.3264:

Stop with the “AH is for new people” already..
It’s in the grandmaster line. No where does it state “this is for new players only”.
It’s a trait, it’s there to be used by anyone who wants to.

It’s like saying only new players use Selfless Daring because they don’t have any friends to heal them.

I really do think half of you forget that there are a large portion who play MMO’s for enjoyment, and not to fuel their ego about being “best” or “better” than others. If someone wants to play AH then let them, there’s nothing wrong with it whatsoever.

Because while your team is suffering to get out enough damage to kill stuff fast enough you are sitting happy with your useless skill less build not giving a fudge about anything. Being a guardian is about being a ‘selfless defender’ not a self-healing-waste-of-potential. If you want to play AH in pve go ahead but just know that it’s like a wet fish flopping on the side of a boat

Not at all. I run AH in Fractals all the time and it’s great. My damage is still decent and I can survive easily enough to continue to do damage/heal others.
Plus, I run Hammer, when traited I can have my auto-attack symbol down 100% of the time if I don’t use #2. This applies constant -33% damage to my group.
And again.. you’re forgetting, not everyone plays to be as effective as possible, some people actually play for enjoyment, you know?

do you slot in utilities dependent on situation or shouts for AH procs? You don’t need AH if you’re playing properly since you will be mitigating damage at the entire party well enough to not need to heal, well, yourself. Also, I find fun in efficiency so I don’t see why you bring the fun argument in. Meta is fun.

And that is exactly my point. “I find fun in efficieny so I don’t see why you bring the fun argument in”.
You’re thinking about only yourself. Not everyone shares the same opinion as you. Why should everyone else be pidgeon holed into playing what’s most effective because you think it’s the correct way to play?

If you’re meant to play a certain way, then wouldn’t Anet purposely make everyone play said way, and not give them the option to play differently?

Odd you would say he’s only thinking about himself when he’s advocating a build with more team support and you’re advocating a build that specializes in keeping only you alive.

We get that not everyone wants to run a meta, and that’s fine. But when a person is asking for advice we will still give it to them. Yes, we are often operating under the assumption that everyone wants fast, smooth runs. As Obtena and various people have pointed out, not everyone finds that fun. Ok, that’s fine, then you could just say if you want faster, easier runs choose the the meta build(s). It has been proven beyond a shadow of doubt that this is the best build for fast, easy runs. But if you aren’t interested in faster, smoother runs there are plenty of options including the AH build that excels in keeping you alive in trade of dps and team support.

Funny thing is, all you PvE Elitest `presume` everyone is running in guild groups or w/ very experience dungeon runners. =]

For the average pugger, it most likely IS better to be more focused over healing due to the FACT your teammates ~won’t~ know the subtleties of what you’re provided (IE Aegis, Blocks, etc).

All your all blanket statements do nothing to help people.

The best part to me is that its all because of dungeons! LOL! Gotta run da meta for arah p4, because Simin is scary. The big spider from ac is also scary and its really really hard to beat if you use anything other than the meta build.

Aza.2105:

Amins.3710:

laharl.8435:

Zach.3264:

colesy.8490:

Zach.3264:

Painbow.6059:

Zach.3264:

Stop with the “AH is for new people” already..
It’s in the grandmaster line. No where does it state “this is for new players only”.
It’s a trait, it’s there to be used by anyone who wants to.

It’s like saying only new players use Selfless Daring because they don’t have any friends to heal them.

I really do think half of you forget that there are a large portion who play MMO’s for enjoyment, and not to fuel their ego about being “best” or “better” than others. If someone wants to play AH then let them, there’s nothing wrong with it whatsoever.

Because while your team is suffering to get out enough damage to kill stuff fast enough you are sitting happy with your useless skill less build not giving a fudge about anything. Being a guardian is about being a ‘selfless defender’ not a self-healing-waste-of-potential. If you want to play AH in pve go ahead but just know that it’s like a wet fish flopping on the side of a boat

Not at all. I run AH in Fractals all the time and it’s great. My damage is still decent and I can survive easily enough to continue to do damage/heal others.
Plus, I run Hammer, when traited I can have my auto-attack symbol down 100% of the time if I don’t use #2. This applies constant -33% damage to my group.
And again.. you’re forgetting, not everyone plays to be as effective as possible, some people actually play for enjoyment, you know?

do you slot in utilities dependent on situation or shouts for AH procs? You don’t need AH if you’re playing properly since you will be mitigating damage at the entire party well enough to not need to heal, well, yourself. Also, I find fun in efficiency so I don’t see why you bring the fun argument in. Meta is fun.

And that is exactly my point. “I find fun in efficieny so I don’t see why you bring the fun argument in”.
You’re thinking about only yourself. Not everyone shares the same opinion as you. Why should everyone else be pidgeon holed into playing what’s most effective because you think it’s the correct way to play?

If you’re meant to play a certain way, then wouldn’t Anet purposely make everyone play said way, and not give them the option to play differently?

Odd you would say he’s only thinking about himself when he’s advocating a build with more team support and you’re advocating a build that specializes in keeping only you alive.

We get that not everyone wants to run a meta, and that’s fine. But when a person is asking for advice we will still give it to them. Yes, we are often operating under the assumption that everyone wants fast, smooth runs. As Obtena and various people have pointed out, not everyone finds that fun. Ok, that’s fine, then you could just say if you want faster, easier runs choose the the meta build(s). It has been proven beyond a shadow of doubt that this is the best build for fast, easy runs. But if you aren’t interested in faster, smoother runs there are plenty of options including the AH build that excels in keeping you alive in trade of dps and team support.

Funny thing is, all you PvE Elitest `presume` everyone is running in guild groups or w/ very experience dungeon runners. =]

For the average pugger, it most likely IS better to be more focused over healing due to the FACT your teammates ~won’t~ know the subtleties of what you’re provided (IE Aegis, Blocks, etc).

All your all blanket statements do nothing to help people.

The best part to me is that its all because of dungeons! LOL! Gotta run da meta for arah p4, because Simin is scary. The big spider from ac is also scary and its really really hard to beat if you use anything other than the meta build.

As I said before, it’s about efficiency and making the run go smoother. Of course, pretty much any group composition can successfully complete any instance (Simin would give some tanky groups a run for their money though). I’m just advocating the meta over AH, because as I said, I ran AHEM for 6 months. The meta is superior in team support, dps and damage mitigation. AH is superior in keeping yourself alive. So choose what you like, that won’t stop me from giving advice to people who ask.

Zach.3264:

Painbow.6059:

Zach.3264:

Stop with the “AH is for new people” already..
It’s in the grandmaster line. No where does it state “this is for new players only”.
It’s a trait, it’s there to be used by anyone who wants to.

It’s like saying only new players use Selfless Daring because they don’t have any friends to heal them.

I really do think half of you forget that there are a large portion who play MMO’s for enjoyment, and not to fuel their ego about being “best” or “better” than others. If someone wants to play AH then let them, there’s nothing wrong with it whatsoever.

Because while your team is suffering to get out enough damage to kill stuff fast enough you are sitting happy with your useless skill less build not giving a fudge about anything. Being a guardian is about being a ‘selfless defender’ not a self-healing-waste-of-potential. If you want to play AH in pve go ahead but just know that it’s like a wet fish flopping on the side of a boat

Not at all. I run AH in Fractals all the time and it’s great. My damage is still decent and I can survive easily enough to continue to do damage/heal others.
Plus, I run Hammer, when traited I can have my auto-attack symbol down 100% of the time if I don’t use #2. This applies constant -33% damage to my group.
And again.. you’re forgetting, not everyone plays to be as effective as possible, some people actually play for enjoyment, you know?

do you slot in utilities dependent on situation or shouts for AH procs? You don’t need AH if you’re playing properly since you will be mitigating damage at the entire party well enough to not need to heal, well, yourself. Also, I find fun in efficiency so I don’t see why you bring the fun argument in. Meta is fun.

I wont get into this discussion whats bad or whats good, its gettgin old, but just to make one thing clear.

Shouts are minor when it comes to AH, in fact i often run wvw builds with not a single shout in them and still use AH because if you play in a coordinated team, AH is just absurdly strong. A single shout heals for about 700. One single hammer chain and MB can can distribute 40 applications of boons, sometimes even 45 boons, to the team. No need to ever use shouts just because you run AH.

So stating AH is bad based on people using shouts is wrong, it might be so that the individual is bad when they havent udnerstood how little shouts contribute to AH. Just pick the proper weapon.

Brutaly.6257:

I wont get into this discussion whats bad or whats good, its gettgin old, but just to make one thing clear.

Shouts are minor when it comes to AH, in fact i often run wvw builds with not a single shout in them and still use AH because if you play in a coordinated team, AH is just absurdly strong. A single shout heals for about 700. One single hammer chain and MB can can distribute 40 applications of boons, sometimes even 45 boons, to the team. No need to ever use shouts just because you run AH.

So stating AH is bad based on people using shouts is wrong, it might be so that the individual is bad when they havent udnerstood how little shouts contribute to AH. Just pick the proper weapon.

I don’t believe anyone has stated AH is bad solely on the use of shouts. We’re also discussing the validity of the build in pve, not wvw, much different. The core reason AH is inferior in pve is because you’re sacrificing too much team support and dps in favor of heals for yourself. Dps and damage mitigation are the 2 most important aspects of fast, smooth dungeon runs, the meta supplies this far better than the AH build.

The best support build would be hammer/x 15/15/0/20/20.
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fUAQJASRlUgqC3FSKEfIFSmCRCBtPAQ1HiHMFYkHB

You get perma prot, perma vigor, blind/vuln spam, auto attacking symbol maintains 5-6 more vuln if you do nothing but auto attack, traited consecrations for purging flames/wall/hallowed, traited shouts, traited extra condition removal, and decent damage. Get full zerker trinkets and weapons. For armor you can go with knights if you want more survival or zerk if you want more damage and can deal with it. AH is a lot of points better spent for damage or the right support and that is what is best for pve.

laharl.8435:

The core reason AH is inferior in pve is because you’re sacrificing too much team support and dps in favor of heals for yourself. Dps and damage mitigation are the 2 most important aspects of fast, smooth dungeon runs, the meta supplies this far better than the AH build.

Here is the problem. The thread isn’t actually about how superior something else is over AH … it’s just that certain people turn these threads INTO that discussion because they have an agenda to push.

OP wants to know if that combo is viable … AH+EM is a good combo if you want to run AH. In fact, What other combo with AH would be better than this? THAT’S what the discussion should be here.

You’d get a far better return from AH if you just went with Writ of Persistence and used a hammer or mace imo.

Obtena.7952:

laharl.8435:

The core reason AH is inferior in pve is because you’re sacrificing too much team support and dps in favor of heals for yourself. Dps and damage mitigation are the 2 most important aspects of fast, smooth dungeon runs, the meta supplies this far better than the AH build.

Here is the problem. The thread isn’t actually about how superior something else is over AH … it’s just that certain people turn these threads INTO that discussion because they have an agenda to push.

OP wants to know if that combo is viable … AH+EM is a good combo if you want to run AH. In fact, What other combo with AH would be better than this? THAT’S what the discussion should be here.

The op’s first post is “is it a viable support build for Pve? or something like 0/15/30/20/5?”. He didn’t say he needs AH and wants to know what goes well with it. He’s looking for a viable support build.

If I were to ask this question I wouldn’t want someone to say " Yeah, it’s viable, anything is viable in pve". I would want some input, some insight into what is more viable. So we told him of builds with far better support than AHEM. If he decides he would rather go with AHEM, that’s fine, to each their own. I still feel it’s my duty to let new guardians know that there is far better support, then they can make the choice.

I understand you seem to take great issue with people advocating meta builds. I advocate these builds out of experience, particularly to this thread as I ran AHEM for nearly 6 months. The meta builds, especially the one linked by obal, will the give the op far more team support than AHEM.

There also isn’t a conspiracy with an " agenda to push". The only agenda is to help newer players. If they don’t choose the build I recommend, no biggie, I wish no ill will and I hope they excel. It’s not everyone’s style.

Oh yeah, playing ‘properly’ and ‘correctly’ … You would almost think that if this was a real thing, it would come from Anet, not players.

Fun is part of the argument because what you value isn’t the same thing as what other people do.

By “properly” I mean effective use of traits and utilities. And by efficient I mean aiding as best you can to complete content with the resources available (these resources being your traits, utilities, gear and the player’s willingness to make strong use of their abilities).

And that is exactly my point. “I find fun in efficieny so I don’t see why you bring the fun argument in”.
You’re thinking about only yourself. Not everyone shares the same opinion as you. Why should everyone else be pidgeon holed into playing what’s most effective because you think it’s the correct way to play?

What I’m trying to say is that I enjoy efficiency. When I think of fun, I think efficiency, therefore I play for enjoyment. Suboptimal builds and amateur mistakes irritate me, it doesn’t matter who it’s from, a player I’m partying with or myself. The difference is, most players don’t care about improving while I will go out of my way and bust my balls to learn an encounter if I perform poorly on it (repeated wipes on Alphard being the most recent example, eventually figured out that reflections have to be centred directly on her and that stacking right on top is basically suicide since you can’t see scorpion wire in case it goes through reflections).

Funny thing is, all you PvE Elitest `presume` everyone is running in guild groups or w/ very experience dungeon runners. =]

I don’t. It’s only recently that I started running in more and more premades because pugging just makes me legitimately angry, there’s a couple people in the dungeon forum who I’ve vented to in-game because of how frustrating it can be having to see players who camp on low-DPS weapons, use blatantly low DPS gear or poor traits (the moment I see strength in numbers on my screen I just roll my eyes).

For the average pugger, it most likely IS better to be more focused over healing due to the FACT your teammates ~won’t~ know the subtleties of what you’re provided (IE Aegis, Blocks, etc).

This is why you advertise “experienced only”. Yeah, most “experienced” players are actually bad, but every now and then I come across gems where we flawlessly hit 25 stacks of might from fire fields and blasts pre fight, melt a boss down and everyone is clearly using the right weapons and strong weapon rotations and not just smashing 1 through to 5 because they want to be pressing more stuff.

The best part to me is that its all because of dungeons! LOL! Gotta run da meta for arah p4, because Simin is scary. The big spider from ac is also scary and its really really hard to beat if you use anything other than the meta build.

You can kill Simin with five bearbows and the only reason people constantly bring up Spider Queen is because they can’t do content any harder than AC, note how Arah is never mentioned when it comes to “stacking is exploiting!” threads because most players aren’t good enough to even do anything besides faceroll AC, COE and COF.

OP wants to know if that combo is viable … AH+EM is a good combo if you want to run AH. In fact, What other combo with AH would be better than this? THAT’S what the discussion should be here.

It’s not a good combo because it’s overriding long term might stacks and the very nature of AH is just bad because small heals aren’t going to do much to your survivability. All it means is that you give up on useful traits like reduced cooldowns on consecrations, clearing three condis on activation of virtue, blinds, vuln stacking on blind and damage modifiers.

Take 10/30/30/0/0 as an example, you lose X%+ from virtues 25, -20% cooldowns from virtues 10 and group condi cleanse from virtues 20 (or 20%+ damage modifier from unscathed). You also lose honour 5 which means you won’t have perma-vigour which makes you a hell of a lot more survivable than AH. Yes, you will hit I believe two damage modifiers and vuln stacking, but you’re giving up two extra modifiers and group support for AH.

I’m making an effort to be civil here and once again I’m getting it thrown in my face.

colesy.8490:

Oh yeah, playing ‘properly’ and ‘correctly’ … You would almost think that if this was a real thing, it would come from Anet, not players.

Fun is part of the argument because what you value isn’t the same thing as what other people do.

By “properly” I mean effective use of traits and utilities. And by efficient I mean aiding as best you can to complete content with the resources available (these resources being your traits, utilities, gear and the player’s willingness to make strong use of their abilities).

And that is exactly my point. “I find fun in efficieny so I don’t see why you bring the fun argument in”.
You’re thinking about only yourself. Not everyone shares the same opinion as you. Why should everyone else be pidgeon holed into playing what’s most effective because you think it’s the correct way to play?

What I’m trying to say is that I enjoy efficiency. When I think of fun, I think efficiency, therefore I play for enjoyment. Suboptimal builds and amateur mistakes irritate me, it doesn’t matter who it’s from, a player I’m partying with or myself. The difference is, most players don’t care about improving while I will go out of my way and bust my balls to learn an encounter if I perform poorly on it (repeated wipes on Alphard being the most recent example, eventually figured out that reflections have to be centred directly on her and that stacking right on top is basically suicide since you can’t see scorpion wire in case it goes through reflections).

Funny thing is, all you PvE Elitest `presume` everyone is running in guild groups or w/ very experience dungeon runners. =]

I don’t. It’s only recently that I started running in more and more premades because pugging just makes me legitimately angry, there’s a couple people in the dungeon forum who I’ve vented to in-game because of how frustrating it can be having to see players who camp on low-DPS weapons, use blatantly low DPS gear or poor traits (the moment I see strength in numbers on my screen I just roll my eyes).

For the average pugger, it most likely IS better to be more focused over healing due to the FACT your teammates ~won’t~ know the subtleties of what you’re provided (IE Aegis, Blocks, etc).

This is why you advertise “experienced only”. Yeah, most “experienced” players are actually bad, but every now and then I come across gems where we flawlessly hit 25 stacks of might from fire fields and blasts pre fight, melt a boss down and everyone is clearly using the right weapons and strong weapon rotations and not just smashing 1 through to 5 because they want to be pressing more stuff.

The best part to me is that its all because of dungeons! LOL! Gotta run da meta for arah p4, because Simin is scary. The big spider from ac is also scary and its really really hard to beat if you use anything other than the meta build.

You can kill Simin with five bearbows and the only reason people constantly bring up Spider Queen is because they can’t do content any harder than AC, note how Arah is never mentioned when it comes to “stacking is exploiting!” threads because most players aren’t good enough to even do anything besides faceroll AC, COE and COF.

OP wants to know if that combo is viable … AH+EM is a good combo if you want to run AH. In fact, What other combo with AH would be better than this? THAT’S what the discussion should be here.

It’s not a good combo because it’s overriding long term might stacks and the very nature of AH is just bad because small heals aren’t going to do much to your survivability. All it means is that you give up on useful traits like reduced cooldowns on consecrations, clearing three condis on activation of virtue, blinds, vuln stacking on blind and damage modifiers.

Take 10/30/30/0/0 as an example, you lose X%+ from virtues 25, -20% cooldowns from virtues 10 and group condi cleanse from virtues 20 (or 20%+ damage modifier from unscathed). You also lose honour 5 which means you won’t have perma-vigour which makes you a hell of a lot more survivable than AH. Yes, you will hit I believe two damage modifiers and vuln stacking, but you’re giving up two extra modifiers and group support for AH.

I’m making an effort to be civil here and once again I’m getting it thrown in my face.

Its doesn’t matter, its pve.

Aza.2105:

colesy.8490:

Oh yeah, playing ‘properly’ and ‘correctly’ … You would almost think that if this was a real thing, it would come from Anet, not players.

Fun is part of the argument because what you value isn’t the same thing as what other people do.

By “properly” I mean effective use of traits and utilities. And by efficient I mean aiding as best you can to complete content with the resources available (these resources being your traits, utilities, gear and the player’s willingness to make strong use of their abilities).

And that is exactly my point. “I find fun in efficieny so I don’t see why you bring the fun argument in”.
You’re thinking about only yourself. Not everyone shares the same opinion as you. Why should everyone else be pidgeon holed into playing what’s most effective because you think it’s the correct way to play?

What I’m trying to say is that I enjoy efficiency. When I think of fun, I think efficiency, therefore I play for enjoyment. Suboptimal builds and amateur mistakes irritate me, it doesn’t matter who it’s from, a player I’m partying with or myself. The difference is, most players don’t care about improving while I will go out of my way and bust my balls to learn an encounter if I perform poorly on it (repeated wipes on Alphard being the most recent example, eventually figured out that reflections have to be centred directly on her and that stacking right on top is basically suicide since you can’t see scorpion wire in case it goes through reflections).

Funny thing is, all you PvE Elitest `presume` everyone is running in guild groups or w/ very experience dungeon runners. =]

I don’t. It’s only recently that I started running in more and more premades because pugging just makes me legitimately angry, there’s a couple people in the dungeon forum who I’ve vented to in-game because of how frustrating it can be having to see players who camp on low-DPS weapons, use blatantly low DPS gear or poor traits (the moment I see strength in numbers on my screen I just roll my eyes).

For the average pugger, it most likely IS better to be more focused over healing due to the FACT your teammates ~won’t~ know the subtleties of what you’re provided (IE Aegis, Blocks, etc).

This is why you advertise “experienced only”. Yeah, most “experienced” players are actually bad, but every now and then I come across gems where we flawlessly hit 25 stacks of might from fire fields and blasts pre fight, melt a boss down and everyone is clearly using the right weapons and strong weapon rotations and not just smashing 1 through to 5 because they want to be pressing more stuff.

The best part to me is that its all because of dungeons! LOL! Gotta run da meta for arah p4, because Simin is scary. The big spider from ac is also scary and its really really hard to beat if you use anything other than the meta build.

You can kill Simin with five bearbows and the only reason people constantly bring up Spider Queen is because they can’t do content any harder than AC, note how Arah is never mentioned when it comes to “stacking is exploiting!” threads because most players aren’t good enough to even do anything besides faceroll AC, COE and COF.

OP wants to know if that combo is viable … AH+EM is a good combo if you want to run AH. In fact, What other combo with AH would be better than this? THAT’S what the discussion should be here.

It’s not a good combo because it’s overriding long term might stacks and the very nature of AH is just bad because small heals aren’t going to do much to your survivability. All it means is that you give up on useful traits like reduced cooldowns on consecrations, clearing three condis on activation of virtue, blinds, vuln stacking on blind and damage modifiers.

Take 10/30/30/0/0 as an example, you lose X%+ from virtues 25, -20% cooldowns from virtues 10 and group condi cleanse from virtues 20 (or 20%+ damage modifier from unscathed). You also lose honour 5 which means you won’t have perma-vigour which makes you a hell of a lot more survivable than AH. Yes, you will hit I believe two damage modifiers and vuln stacking, but you’re giving up two extra modifiers and group support for AH.

I’m making an effort to be civil here and once again I’m getting it thrown in my face.

Its doesn’t matter, its pve.

That’s the worst possible advice you could give to a new player, and not helpful to the community at all. That comment only cements that you don’t know the game mechanics very well and shouldn’t be commenting here.

laharl.8435:

That’s the worst possible advice you could give to a new player, and not helpful to the community at all. That comment only cements that you don’t know the game mechanics very well and shouldn’t be commenting here.

You are entitled to have your own opinion of me, it doesn’t matter. The reality of the situation is that pve is so simplistic that ultimately it doesn’t require any optimized build to get from point a to point b.

Aza.2105:

laharl.8435:

That’s the worst possible advice you could give to a new player, and not helpful to the community at all. That comment only cements that you don’t know the game mechanics very well and shouldn’t be commenting here.

You are entitled to have your own opinion of me, it doesn’t matter. The reality of the situation is that pve is so simplistic that ultimately it doesn’t require any optimized build to get from point a to point b.

You haven’t even followed the conversation at all. Again, we’re talking about efficiency. We’re talking about the ease it takes to get from point a to point b. If you don’t realize certain builds do it better, than you are no good in pvp either. Sure, with great skill some people can have success in pvp. But they would do even better to arm themselves with a good build. If you don’t recognize this, you will never excel in any aspect of the game, pvp or pve.

When you recognize that a good build will help you achieve success easier, you’ll be a better player, and you’ll see more success in pvp.

laharl.8435:

Aza.2105:

laharl.8435:

That’s the worst possible advice you could give to a new player, and not helpful to the community at all. That comment only cements that you don’t know the game mechanics very well and shouldn’t be commenting here.

You are entitled to have your own opinion of me, it doesn’t matter. The reality of the situation is that pve is so simplistic that ultimately it doesn’t require any optimized build to get from point a to point b.

You haven’t even followed the conversation at all. Again, we’re talking about efficiency, please try to keep up. We’re talking about the ease it takes to get from point a to point b. If you don’t realize certain builds do it better, than you are no good in pvp either. Sure, with great skill some people can have success in pvp. But they would do even better to arm themselves with a good build. If you don’t recognize this, you will never excel in any aspect of the game, pvp or pve.

If you want to proceed with telling me what I’m doing and not doing, then continue.

Aza.2105:

laharl.8435:

Aza.2105:

laharl.8435:

That’s the worst possible advice you could give to a new player, and not helpful to the community at all. That comment only cements that you don’t know the game mechanics very well and shouldn’t be commenting here.

You are entitled to have your own opinion of me, it doesn’t matter. The reality of the situation is that pve is so simplistic that ultimately it doesn’t require any optimized build to get from point a to point b.

You haven’t even followed the conversation at all. Again, we’re talking about efficiency, please try to keep up. We’re talking about the ease it takes to get from point a to point b. If you don’t realize certain builds do it better, than you are no good in pvp either. Sure, with great skill some people can have success in pvp. But they would do even better to arm themselves with a good build. If you don’t recognize this, you will never excel in any aspect of the game, pvp or pve.

If you want to proceed with telling me what I’m doing and not doing, then continue.

I didn’t tell you anything you’re doing, just going by what you’re saying. Once you get to the point where you realize some builds excel more than others at certain tasks, like getting from point a to point b, you’ll see your pve and pvp game improve.

laharl.8435:

Aza.2105:

laharl.8435:

Aza.2105:

laharl.8435:

That’s the worst possible advice you could give to a new player, and not helpful to the community at all. That comment only cements that you don’t know the game mechanics very well and shouldn’t be commenting here.

You are entitled to have your own opinion of me, it doesn’t matter. The reality of the situation is that pve is so simplistic that ultimately it doesn’t require any optimized build to get from point a to point b.

You haven’t even followed the conversation at all. Again, we’re talking about efficiency, please try to keep up. We’re talking about the ease it takes to get from point a to point b. If you don’t realize certain builds do it better, than you are no good in pvp either. Sure, with great skill some people can have success in pvp. But they would do even better to arm themselves with a good build. If you don’t recognize this, you will never excel in any aspect of the game, pvp or pve.

If you want to proceed with telling me what I’m doing and not doing, then continue.

I didn’t tell you anything you’re doing, just going by what you’re saying. Once you get to the point where you realize some builds excel more than others at certain tasks, like getting from point a to point b, you’ll see your pve and pvp game improve.

No, its exactly what you are doing. You were magically able to know me when I said “Its doesn’t matter, its pve”.

From there you ignorantly tried to tell ME, what I do not know, what I do not do. How crazy is that? Since you have a short term memory, let me highlight what you said:

“That comment only cements that you don’t know the game mechanics very well and shouldn’t be commenting here.”

“You haven’t even followed the conversation at all.”

“If you don’t realize certain builds do it better, than you are no good in pvp either. "

You should ask yourself where in the world did you come up with half the stuff you said to me.

such banter, much funny

Aza.2105:

laharl.8435:

Aza.2105:

laharl.8435:

Aza.2105:

laharl.8435:

That’s the worst possible advice you could give to a new player, and not helpful to the community at all. That comment only cements that you don’t know the game mechanics very well and shouldn’t be commenting here.

You are entitled to have your own opinion of me, it doesn’t matter. The reality of the situation is that pve is so simplistic that ultimately it doesn’t require any optimized build to get from point a to point b.

You haven’t even followed the conversation at all. Again, we’re talking about efficiency, please try to keep up. We’re talking about the ease it takes to get from point a to point b. If you don’t realize certain builds do it better, than you are no good in pvp either. Sure, with great skill some people can have success in pvp. But they would do even better to arm themselves with a good build. If you don’t recognize this, you will never excel in any aspect of the game, pvp or pve.

If you want to proceed with telling me what I’m doing and not doing, then continue.

I didn’t tell you anything you’re doing, just going by what you’re saying. Once you get to the point where you realize some builds excel more than others at certain tasks, like getting from point a to point b, you’ll see your pve and pvp game improve.

No, its exactly what you are doing. You were magically able to know me when I said “Its doesn’t matter, its pve”.

From there you ignorantly tried to tell ME, what I do not know, what I do not do. How crazy is that? Since you have a short term memory, let me highlight what you said:

“That comment only cements that you don’t know the game mechanics very well and shouldn’t be commenting here.”

“You haven’t even followed the conversation at all.”

“If you don’t realize certain builds do it better, than you are no good in pvp either. "

You should ask yourself where in the world did you come up with half the stuff you said to me.

“That comment only cements that you don’t know the game mechanics very well and shouldn’t be commenting here.”

That was in response to you saying “It’s pve, it doesn’t matter”. It’s elementary to most that build does matter in pve in relation to speed, efficiency, ease and in some cases, success of a dungeon run. If you believe build doesn’t matter at all, why do you keep commenting here?

“You haven’t even followed the conversation at all.”

That was in reference to your comment saying it’s only about getting from point a to point b. This entire time we’ve been talking about what is more viable in doing so, not just getting there. This seems to have flown over your head.

“If you don’t realize certain builds do it better, than you are no good in pvp either. "

Simple logical deduction here. Pvp and pve are quite similar, a build tailored for a job will give the player an edge, a higher success rate or an easier run. You don’t believe that a tailored build matters in pve for a given task, when it’s obvious it does, just like pvp. If it’s so hard for you to realize this in pve, it’s equally as hard in pvp. In pvp, I run tailored builds that will excel in the task I want to achieve, just like pve. This is a very simple connection and one that will help your game once you realize it.

Anyway, you’ve taken this way off course (yes, I’m guilty of following). We’re were discussing support builds for pve, lets just stay on track.

laharl.8435:

“That comment only cements that you don’t know the game mechanics very well and shouldn’t be commenting here.”

That was in response to you saying “It’s pve, it doesn’t matter”. It’s elementary to most that build does matter in pve in relation to speed, efficiency, ease and in some cases, success of a dungeon run. If you believe build doesn’t matter at all, why do you keep commenting here?

“You haven’t even followed the conversation at all.”

That was in reference to your comment saying it’s only about getting from point a to point b. This entire time we’ve been talking about what is more viable in doing so, not just getting there. This seems to have flown over your head.

“If you don’t realize certain builds do it better, than you are no good in pvp either. "

Simple logical deduction here. Pvp and pve are quite similar, a build tailored for a job will give the player an edge, a higher success rate or an easier run. You don’t believe that a tailored build matters in pve for a given task, when it’s obvious it does, just like pvp. If it’s so hard for you to realize this in pve, it’s equally as hard in pvp. In pvp, I run tailored builds that will excel in the task I want to achieve, just like pve. This is a very simple connection and one maybe some day you’ll realize.

Anyway, you’ve taken this way off course. We’re were discussing support builds for pve, lets just stay on track.

I haven’t followed the conversation? You would do well to apply that to yourself and others here advocating builds. None of which have anything to do with the OP’s question. The OP asked if his build was viable, unless you are capable of changing the definition of viable then it means can he be successful with it. The answer is yes, he/she could.

Furthermore, if you want to talk about contributing you would be better off trying to attack people who saying things like “ah sucks learn to dodge roll”. Because that kind of behavior isn’t helping “new players” either. The question is why didn’t you? Probably because you are in agreement with what they are saying. So for you, its ok for others to say things that aren’t particularly helpful as long as you are in agreement with them. I’m sure if I made a post like “AH sucks” then you wouldn’t of bothered to try to project upon me.

What I said about pve, bothered you because it undermines the importance of your agenda. If pve isn’t difficult then by proxy it negates any importance a “meta build” may have.

Also about comparing pve to pvp….just don’t. In most cases you always win in pve no matter how slow it is or what build you are running. In pvp ones build will simply determine if they win or lose. That is not the same.

In regards to going off topic, this thread went off topic as soon as it became about AH sucks, so run this build. So in that regard, you best take it up with the people who deviated the thread at the beginning.

Aza.2105:

laharl.8435:

“That comment only cements that you don’t know the game mechanics very well and shouldn’t be commenting here.”

That was in response to you saying “It’s pve, it doesn’t matter”. It’s elementary to most that build does matter in pve in relation to speed, efficiency, ease and in some cases, success of a dungeon run. If you believe build doesn’t matter at all, why do you keep commenting here?

“You haven’t even followed the conversation at all.”

That was in reference to your comment saying it’s only about getting from point a to point b. This entire time we’ve been talking about what is more viable in doing so, not just getting there. This seems to have flown over your head.

“If you don’t realize certain builds do it better, than you are no good in pvp either. "

Simple logical deduction here. Pvp and pve are quite similar, a build tailored for a job will give the player an edge, a higher success rate or an easier run. You don’t believe that a tailored build matters in pve for a given task, when it’s obvious it does, just like pvp. If it’s so hard for you to realize this in pve, it’s equally as hard in pvp. In pvp, I run tailored builds that will excel in the task I want to achieve, just like pve. This is a very simple connection and one maybe some day you’ll realize.

Anyway, you’ve taken this way off course. We’re were discussing support builds for pve, lets just stay on track.

I haven’t followed the conversation? You would do well to apply that to yourself and others here advocating builds. None of which have anything to do with the OP’s question. The OP asked if his build was viable, unless you are capable of changing the definition of viable then it means can he be successful with it. The answer is yes, he/she could.

Furthermore, if you want to talk about contributing you would be better off trying to attack people who saying things like “ah sucks learn to dodge roll”. Because that kind of behavior isn’t helping “new players” either. The question is why didn’t you? Probably because you are in agreement with what they are saying. So for you, its ok for others to say things that aren’t particularly helpful as long as you are in agreement with them. I’m sure if I made a post like “AH sucks” then you wouldn’t of bothered to try to project upon me.

What I said about pve, bothered you because it undermines importance of your agenda. If pve isn’t difficult then by proxy it negates any importance a “meta build” may have.

Also about comparing pve to pvp….just don’t. In most cases you always win in pve no matter how slow it is or what build you are running. In pvp ones build will simply determine if they win or lose. That is not the same.

In regards to going off topic, this thread went off topic as soon as it became about AH sucks, so run this build. So in that regard, you best take it up with the people who deviated the thread at the beginning.

The op is asking for help, simple as that. I was simply trying to provide that for him. I have experience with the build he proposed. He was also asking about support, so I recommended a build I know to have better support than the AHEM build. I was staying on topic by trying to help him. You think telling him it’s pve, it doesn’t matter is good advice and staying on topic, I don’t.

The comparisons I made between pve and pvp are completely valid. A tailored build will make you better at your job in both game modes. There is really no refuting this, much as you may try. The fact that you don’t yet realize this means you should really stop trying to give advice to new people when you’ve so much yet to learn yourself. This is a simple idea that applies to almost all games, pve and pvp alike.

laharl.8435:

The op is asking for help, simple as that. I was simply trying to provide that for him. I have experience with the build he proposed. He was also asking about support, so I recommended a build I know to have better support than the AHEM build. I was staying on topic by trying to help him. You think telling him it’s pve, it doesn’t matter is good advice and staying on topic, I don’t.

The comparisons I made between pve and pvp are completely valid. A tailored build will make you better at your job in both game modes. There is really no refuting this, much as you may try. The fact that you don’t yet realize this means you should really stop trying to give advice to new people when you’ve so much yet to learn yourself. This is a simple idea that applies to almost all games, pve and pvp alike.

You are a hypocrite, you aren’t concerned about giving good advice to a new player, if you were you would of bothered quoting those who were acting like kitten when AH build was mentioned. You didn’t bother because it suits your agenda and you are in agreement with them.

Also, I never said different builds didn’t help you perform better in pve. You actually said that for me and continue to say it for me. Find me the post in this thread where I disagree with “A tailored build will make you better at your job in both game modes.”. Find it.

Zach.3264:

Stop with the “AH is for new people” already..
It’s in the grandmaster line. No where does it state “this is for new players only”.
It’s a trait, it’s there to be used by anyone who wants to.

It’s like saying only new players use Selfless Daring because they don’t have any friends to heal them.

I really do think half of you forget that there are a large portion who play MMO’s for enjoyment, and not to fuel their ego about being “best” or “better” than others. If someone wants to play AH then let them, there’s nothing wrong with it whatsoever.

I agree. Full zerker build, like demonstrated in the video is very misleading. I will state my point again as I have stated in this forum before: The best guardian never fall. Those who argue AH is bad please tell me where is your damage when you are down, and where is your support for the team when you are down? AH shares the same philosophy as the condi build for thief. You will down even faster than you kill with zerker build, while condi or AH for guardian kill slow but with steady damage.
Another notable point is that full zerker guard is a good choice ONLY if you have a organized team. For most of the players who are seeking for random party members I do not suggest you run zerker with guard and mislead by people who argue AH is bad.

Aza.2105:

laharl.8435:

The op is asking for help, simple as that. I was simply trying to provide that for him. I have experience with the build he proposed. He was also asking about support, so I recommended a build I know to have better support than the AHEM build. I was staying on topic by trying to help him. You think telling him it’s pve, it doesn’t matter is good advice and staying on topic, I don’t.

The comparisons I made between pve and pvp are completely valid. A tailored build will make you better at your job in both game modes. There is really no refuting this, much as you may try. The fact that you don’t yet realize this means you should really stop trying to give advice to new people when you’ve so much yet to learn yourself. This is a simple idea that applies to almost all games, pve and pvp alike.

You are a hypocrite, you aren’t concerned about giving good advice to a new player, if you were you would of bothered quoting those who were acting like kitten when AH build was mentioned. You didn’t bother because it suits your agenda and you are in agreement with them.

Also, I never said different builds didn’t help you perform better in pve. You actually said that for me and continue to say it for me. Find me the post in this thread where I disagree with “A tailored build will make you better at your job in both game modes.”. Find it.

No need to start in with name calling. Sure, some people are more hostile than they need to be. I’m not the forum police, I took issue with you because of how far off base you are.

After colesy’s post explaining multiple reasons why a tailored dungeon build is better for dungeoning, you said “It doesn’t matter, it’s pve”. You imply that any random traits thrown together will provide the same outcome simply because it’s pve. Sorry, but that build and others like it will make for easier, faster dungeon run. Not all builds are created equal.

laharl.8435:

Aza.2105:

laharl.8435:

The op is asking for help, simple as that. I was simply trying to provide that for him. I have experience with the build he proposed. He was also asking about support, so I recommended a build I know to have better support than the AHEM build. I was staying on topic by trying to help him. You think telling him it’s pve, it doesn’t matter is good advice and staying on topic, I don’t.

The comparisons I made between pve and pvp are completely valid. A tailored build will make you better at your job in both game modes. There is really no refuting this, much as you may try. The fact that you don’t yet realize this means you should really stop trying to give advice to new people when you’ve so much yet to learn yourself. This is a simple idea that applies to almost all games, pve and pvp alike.

You are a hypocrite, you aren’t concerned about giving good advice to a new player, if you were you would of bothered quoting those who were acting like kitten when AH build was mentioned. You didn’t bother because it suits your agenda and you are in agreement with them.

Also, I never said different builds didn’t help you perform better in pve. You actually said that for me and continue to say it for me. Find me the post in this thread where I disagree with “A tailored build will make you better at your job in both game modes.”. Find it.

No need to start in with name calling. Sure, some people are more hostile than they need to be. I’m not the forum police, I took issue with you because of how far off base you are.

After colesy’s post explaining multiple reasons why a tailored dungeon build is better for dungeoning, you said “It doesn’t matter, it’s pve”. You imply that any random traits thrown together will provide the same outcome simply because it’s pve. Sorry, but that build and others like it will make for easier, faster dungeon run. Not all builds are created equal.

Right, so you responded to me because I wasn’t agreeing that AH is bad. You confirm what I was saying. Like I said, if I so happened to be on the “AH is bad, bad players use it” bandwagon. Then you wouldn’t had singled me out. Because yeah its ok to be hostile as long as they are in agreement with you. How messed up is that?

You are a hypocrite and its not even name calling. Because if you were so concerned about how advice was given to new players as you initially said, then you would of also applied that logic to the posters who were in agreement with you but were hostile to AH users.

I asked you to find where I disagreed with such a statement “A tailored build will make you better at your job in both game modes.” Are you going to show me where I disagreed?

Aza.2105:

Right, so you responded to me because I wasn’t agreeing that AH is bad. You confirm what I was saying. Like I said, if I so happened to be on the “AH is bad, bad players use it” bandwagon.

I’m on the “AH is bad for PVE, misguided or stubborn players use it” bandwagon like most that you would label as “AH is bad, bad players use it” bandwagon.

Anything is pretty much viable in this game but it doesn’t mean it is optimal or good. For PVE it’s best to run a build that does good dps and the proper support at the same time instead of dumping 30 points to get a selfish trait and have a very underwhelming adept and master traits on top of that. You miss out on too much and won’t get to experience or learn the true potential of the class or do all you can do for your group. You can supplement extra survival with gear choice if need be. With the number of blocks, projectile defense, blinds, cc, prot, vigor, and dps potential at a guardian’s disposal survival shouldn’t be an issue with some practice and experience.

People just seem to have 1-2 bad experiences and give up on it or are just too stubborn to try and post things like omg zero dps dead zerker! It gets just as old as someone saying zerk is great and rest is trash which adds some hostility to both sides I guess.

Aza.2105:

Right, so you responded to me because I wasn’t agreeing that AH is bad. You confirm what I was saying. Like I said, if I so happened to be on the “AH is bad, bad players use it” bandwagon. Then you wouldn’t had singled me out. Because yeah its ok to be hostile as long as they are in agreement with you. How messed up is that?

You are a hypocrite and its not even name calling. Because if you were so concerned about how advice was given to new players as you initially said, then you would of also applied that logic to the posters who were in agreement with you but were hostile to AH users.

I asked you to find where I disagreed with such a statement “A tailored build will make you better at your job in both game modes.” Are you going to show me where I disagreed?

I don’t know why you’re going on about this hypocrite thing. I singled you out because you were giving bad advice that wasn’t helpful to a new player or the community. You’re acting like a jumped you for being rude or something, I never mentioned you acting hostile until you called me a hypocrite.

As far as disagreeing with “A tailored build will make you better at your job in both game modes.”, you didn’t, you outright said build doesn’t matter in pve. I drew the valid comparison between pve and pvp. It’s simple, if you don’t realize how a build affects pve, then why would anyone expect to realize how a build affects pvp? You’re build affects how you interact in the game world, it affects every combat situation you’re in, be it pve or pvp. This is very basic.

laharl.8435:

After colesy’s post explaining multiple reasons why a tailored dungeon build is better for dungeoning, you said “It doesn’t matter, it’s pve”. You imply that any random traits thrown together will provide the same outcome simply because it’s pve. Sorry, but that build and others like it will make for easier, faster dungeon run. Not all builds are created equal.

laharl.8435:

Simple logical deduction here. Pvp and pve are quite similar, a build tailored for a job will give the player an edge, a higher success rate or an easier run. You don’t believe that a tailored build matters in pve for a given task, when it’s obvious it does, just like pvp. If it’s so hard for you to realize this in pve, it’s equally as hard in pvp. In pvp, I run tailored builds that will excel in the task I want to achieve, just like pve. This is a very simple connection and one maybe some day you’ll realize.

Aza.2105:

Also, I never said different builds didn’t help you perform better in pve.

Aza.2105:

It doesn’t matter, it’s pve.

Performing better = does matter.

laharl.8435:

Aza.2105:

Right, so you responded to me because I wasn’t agreeing that AH is bad. You confirm what I was saying. Like I said, if I so happened to be on the “AH is bad, bad players use it” bandwagon. Then you wouldn’t had singled me out. Because yeah its ok to be hostile as long as they are in agreement with you. How messed up is that?

You are a hypocrite and its not even name calling. Because if you were so concerned about how advice was given to new players as you initially said, then you would of also applied that logic to the posters who were in agreement with you but were hostile to AH users.

I asked you to find where I disagreed with such a statement “A tailored build will make you better at your job in both game modes.” Are you going to show me where I disagreed?

I don’t know why you’re going on about this hypocrite thing. I singled you out because you were giving bad advice that wasn’t helpful to a new player or the community. You’re acting like a jumped you for being rude or something, I never mentioned you acting hostile until you called me a hypocrite.

As far as disagreeing with “A tailored build will make you better at your job in both game modes.”, you didn’t, you outright said build doesn’t matter in pve. I drew the valid comparison between pve and pvp. It’s simple, if you don’t realize how a build affects pve, then why would anyone expect to realize how a build affects pvp? You’re build affects how you interact in the game world, it affects every combat situation you’re in, be it pve or pvp. This is very basic.

laharl.8435:

After colesy’s post explaining multiple reasons why a tailored dungeon build is better for dungeoning, you said “It doesn’t matter, it’s pve”. You imply that any random traits thrown together will provide the same outcome simply because it’s pve. Sorry, but that build and others like it will make for easier, faster dungeon run. Not all builds are created equal.

laharl.8435:

Simple logical deduction here. Pvp and pve are quite similar, a build tailored for a job will give the player an edge, a higher success rate or an easier run. You don’t believe that a tailored build matters in pve for a given task, when it’s obvious it does, just like pvp. If it’s so hard for you to realize this in pve, it’s equally as hard in pvp. In pvp, I run tailored builds that will excel in the task I want to achieve, just like pve. This is a very simple connection and one maybe some day you’ll realize.

Aza.2105:

Also, I never said different builds didn’t help you perform better in pve.

Aza.2105:

It doesn’t matter, it’s pve.

Performing better = does matter.

I’m still waiting man.

CMstorm.8679:

oh, well for mostly solo survival stuff, but how else can I make that build just as team supportive…that might not work so well just because AH is mainly a self-supportive kind of thing…

Either a really bad fail or a really poor coverup of a fail. If you’re trying to solo, why are you even considering AH to begin with? No doubt everyone has already made you aware of the meta. You surely know DPS is the way to go. If you will not go that route, and are very adamant about your trait line. Monks Med is at least more useful than AH if you are playing strictly solo.

Aza.2105:

laharl.8435:

Aza.2105:

Right, so you responded to me because I wasn’t agreeing that AH is bad. You confirm what I was saying. Like I said, if I so happened to be on the “AH is bad, bad players use it” bandwagon. Then you wouldn’t had singled me out. Because yeah its ok to be hostile as long as they are in agreement with you. How messed up is that?

You are a hypocrite and its not even name calling. Because if you were so concerned about how advice was given to new players as you initially said, then you would of also applied that logic to the posters who were in agreement with you but were hostile to AH users.

I asked you to find where I disagreed with such a statement “A tailored build will make you better at your job in both game modes.” Are you going to show me where I disagreed?

I don’t know why you’re going on about this hypocrite thing. I singled you out because you were giving bad advice that wasn’t helpful to a new player or the community. You’re acting like a jumped you for being rude or something, I never mentioned you acting hostile until you called me a hypocrite.

As far as disagreeing with “A tailored build will make you better at your job in both game modes.”, you didn’t, you outright said build doesn’t matter in pve. I drew the valid comparison between pve and pvp. It’s simple, if you don’t realize how a build affects pve, then why would anyone expect to realize how a build affects pvp? You’re build affects how you interact in the game world, it affects every combat situation you’re in, be it pve or pvp. This is very basic.

laharl.8435:

After colesy’s post explaining multiple reasons why a tailored dungeon build is better for dungeoning, you said “It doesn’t matter, it’s pve”. You imply that any random traits thrown together will provide the same outcome simply because it’s pve. Sorry, but that build and others like it will make for easier, faster dungeon run. Not all builds are created equal.

laharl.8435:

Simple logical deduction here. Pvp and pve are quite similar, a build tailored for a job will give the player an edge, a higher success rate or an easier run. You don’t believe that a tailored build matters in pve for a given task, when it’s obvious it does, just like pvp. If it’s so hard for you to realize this in pve, it’s equally as hard in pvp. In pvp, I run tailored builds that will excel in the task I want to achieve, just like pve. This is a very simple connection and one maybe some day you’ll realize.

Aza.2105:

Also, I never said different builds didn’t help you perform better in pve.

Aza.2105:

It doesn’t matter, it’s pve.

Performing better = does matter.

I’m still waiting man.

lol, try reading it.

laharl.8435:

Aza.2105:

laharl.8435:

Aza.2105:

Right, so you responded to me because I wasn’t agreeing that AH is bad. You confirm what I was saying. Like I said, if I so happened to be on the “AH is bad, bad players use it” bandwagon. Then you wouldn’t had singled me out. Because yeah its ok to be hostile as long as they are in agreement with you. How messed up is that?

You are a hypocrite and its not even name calling. Because if you were so concerned about how advice was given to new players as you initially said, then you would of also applied that logic to the posters who were in agreement with you but were hostile to AH users.

I asked you to find where I disagreed with such a statement “A tailored build will make you better at your job in both game modes.” Are you going to show me where I disagreed?

I don’t know why you’re going on about this hypocrite thing. I singled you out because you were giving bad advice that wasn’t helpful to a new player or the community. You’re acting like a jumped you for being rude or something, I never mentioned you acting hostile until you called me a hypocrite.

As far as disagreeing with “A tailored build will make you better at your job in both game modes.”, you didn’t, you outright said build doesn’t matter in pve. I drew the valid comparison between pve and pvp. It’s simple, if you don’t realize how a build affects pve, then why would anyone expect to realize how a build affects pvp? You’re build affects how you interact in the game world, it affects every combat situation you’re in, be it pve or pvp. This is very basic.

laharl.8435:

After colesy’s post explaining multiple reasons why a tailored dungeon build is better for dungeoning, you said “It doesn’t matter, it’s pve”. You imply that any random traits thrown together will provide the same outcome simply because it’s pve. Sorry, but that build and others like it will make for easier, faster dungeon run. Not all builds are created equal.

laharl.8435:

Simple logical deduction here. Pvp and pve are quite similar, a build tailored for a job will give the player an edge, a higher success rate or an easier run. You don’t believe that a tailored build matters in pve for a given task, when it’s obvious it does, just like pvp. If it’s so hard for you to realize this in pve, it’s equally as hard in pvp. In pvp, I run tailored builds that will excel in the task I want to achieve, just like pve. This is a very simple connection and one maybe some day you’ll realize.

Aza.2105:

Also, I never said different builds didn’t help you perform better in pve.

Aza.2105:

It doesn’t matter, it’s pve.

Performing better = does matter.

I’m still waiting man.

lol, try reading it.

I did and the only thing I see you doing is continuing to have a nice conversation with yourself.

Aza.2105:

laharl.8435:

Aza.2105:

laharl.8435:

Aza.2105:

Right, so you responded to me because I wasn’t agreeing that AH is bad. You confirm what I was saying. Like I said, if I so happened to be on the “AH is bad, bad players use it” bandwagon. Then you wouldn’t had singled me out. Because yeah its ok to be hostile as long as they are in agreement with you. How messed up is that?

You are a hypocrite and its not even name calling. Because if you were so concerned about how advice was given to new players as you initially said, then you would of also applied that logic to the posters who were in agreement with you but were hostile to AH users.

I asked you to find where I disagreed with such a statement “A tailored build will make you better at your job in both game modes.” Are you going to show me where I disagreed?

I don’t know why you’re going on about this hypocrite thing. I singled you out because you were giving bad advice that wasn’t helpful to a new player or the community. You’re acting like a jumped you for being rude or something, I never mentioned you acting hostile until you called me a hypocrite.

As far as disagreeing with “A tailored build will make you better at your job in both game modes.”, you didn’t, you outright said build doesn’t matter in pve. I drew the valid comparison between pve and pvp. It’s simple, if you don’t realize how a build affects pve, then why would anyone expect to realize how a build affects pvp? You’re build affects how you interact in the game world, it affects every combat situation you’re in, be it pve or pvp. This is very basic.

laharl.8435:

After colesy’s post explaining multiple reasons why a tailored dungeon build is better for dungeoning, you said “It doesn’t matter, it’s pve”. You imply that any random traits thrown together will provide the same outcome simply because it’s pve. Sorry, but that build and others like it will make for easier, faster dungeon run. Not all builds are created equal.

laharl.8435:

Simple logical deduction here. Pvp and pve are quite similar, a build tailored for a job will give the player an edge, a higher success rate or an easier run. You don’t believe that a tailored build matters in pve for a given task, when it’s obvious it does, just like pvp. If it’s so hard for you to realize this in pve, it’s equally as hard in pvp. In pvp, I run tailored builds that will excel in the task I want to achieve, just like pve. This is a very simple connection and one maybe some day you’ll realize.

Aza.2105:

Also, I never said different builds didn’t help you perform better in pve.

Aza.2105:

It doesn’t matter, it’s pve.

Performing better = does matter.

I’m still waiting man.

lol, try reading it.

I did and the only thing I see you doing is continuing to have a nice conversation with yourself.

Then you didn’t actually read, oh well.

laharl.8435:

Then you didn’t actually read, oh well.

You project so much that you are incapable of making a objective response to someone. Look at what you quoted and what you got out of it. What you really are doing is writing about what you seen in my quote. Which has nothing to do with me. If you were wise, you would of asked what I meant.

CMstorm.8679:

is it a viable support build for Pve? or something like 0/15/30/20/5?

Depends what you mean by viable….

I see AH as a stepping stone because you don’t need that extra healing when you are experience with the dungeon, rather put them into more dps traits to hurry things up.
(Trust me, when you are able to clear a dungeon in 20 minutes, you would not like to spend 40 minutes next time.) offense is the best defense.

Honor traits are just weak compare to others.

Why not trying both out? the AH and Meta. we can argue all day everyday, but it is you who is going to utilize it for the best of your interest.

Don’t forget your trinket/armor/weapon are also part of the build. wear knights gear when you are starting out, and slowly move to zerker until you reach that limit where you won’t be able to survive most of time.

Aza.2105:

laharl.8435:

Then you didn’t actually read, oh well.

You project so much that you are incapable of making a objective response to someone. Look at what you quoted and what you got out of it. What you really are doing is writing about what you seen in my quote. Which has nothing to do with me. If you were wise, you would of asked what I meant.

I answered your question, you just didn’t read what I actually said.

Aza.2105:

Coltain.1395:

Is it good for soloing PVE? Yes it is, especially if you’re newer to the game and want a “safer” choice. That said, there are better options out there (build and gear) that open up more game styles – team support, tanky DPS, DPS, etc.
IMHO it’s a bad habit to rely on AH(+EM) for survivability when you can use dodging, blinds, retaliation, gear choice and active gameplay while freeing you from a very limited build.

I’m not sure why players gauge their performance with trash mobs. The only time blind is useful is for trash.

Because unlike most games, trash can murder you in this game. Take the Grawl shaman fight for example, without his army of lavas, that fight would be just a tank n spank, but with those things around, that fight obliterates PUGs. You got entire dungeons like CM and some parts of Arah that’s basically about handling trash.

Personally, I think AH is terrible in stuff like CoF, areas where if you’re taking too much damage as a Guardian, you’re just doing it wrong. But in places like some high levelled fractals, where you just will take constant noticeable but non-lethal damage simply because there’s so much crud flying around, AH has some merit.

The combination of increased crit power (if you run a knight/Zerker build) and that with it and you having experience, you’ll very rarely need to disengage to heal, it can be a net damage increase, especially with the mass heal of a staff when you switch to it to might everyone.

The other argument for it is if you use Scholar runes. Having its constant heals means its a lot easier to keep up the 10% damage boost because Guardians have a tiny HP pool.

I mostly run in mes/guard/war parties (don’t judge me) and almost only log on to run fractals these days so I might have a biased view though.

Well assuming you can only keep scholar with AH using staff..you gain 10% deeps but lose like more than 50% because staff is a kitten weapon that deserves to be deleted just as the AH trait.
Applying boons to heal is a highly stupid idea. There is the greatsword heal, the hammer symbol heal, virtue of resolve passive when traited and even regeneration/life steal foods. Hell, you can run food, hammer symbol and virtue of resolve at the same time and still suck less than the AH crowd.
PS: Dying in cof is very easy. For example at the first boss of p1 when people decide to akf range while you get burned to death.

@Op : I use this build since ages (0-15-30-20-5) but without Empowering might and 9 time out 10 I just carry my team in donjon. People can sell you all their berzerk gear but in the end it’s a pain to rez all these folks.

In this build, I’ve seen that Writ of the mercifull is a way better choice then empowering Might You may gain a lot when everyone is in range but most of the time, they will be out of range.

PS: I love to spam F1 when mobs are dying. Renewed Justice is tha best.

Good to see the Guardian forum has yet to progress beyond “NO YOU’RE WRONG” since I last visited.