Guild Wars 2

It was so fun!
I was roaming around with my P/D Thief in WvW when suddenly a Guardian appeared. I know Guardians are, by far, the “hardest” class I can face, since they are the most durable and it’s really difficult to take one down in 1v1 unless they are zerker (ugh!). Still, I engaged the fight as I always do.
This time it was different. Usually, the first thing a Guardian does when “meeting” me is play defense, trying to get to the closest safe spot (Camp, Tower, even Sentries are helpful in these occasions). But this time, the Guardian accepted the fight head on, to my great surprise and pleasure.
After 30 seconds from the first hit, we were both still at full health. It was the first time this happened in all the fights I had in WvW. He was sitting still in his burn-blocks and perma retal. He couldn’t do anything because he was constantly crippled by my Black Powder, but I couldn’t just attack carelessly so I had to rely on single, high burst damage spikes. Thing is, after fighting for about 3 minutes (I even had to swap Basilisk Venom with Thieves Guild, hoping to get a higher damage output without hitting myself too much, with no success), I realized that was not a fight any of us could win. Everytime I tried to be a little more offensive, I took so much damage from his Retal that I had to back off and get some health back – of course, he did the same whenever I healed myself.
Eventually, a small group of players from my Server came and started attacking the Guardian. Funny thing is, even if we were, like, 5-6 people, he still managed to survive long enough to enter the closest tower.
It was fun: it is usually me, as a P/D thief, who trolls other people, not Guardians.

Now, the reason why I posted this here is to get some information by more experienced Guardians about what build he was using. That’s because I’d really like to get that commander book (there aren’t commanders in my server during late night, and I would really like to help my server sometimes), and after seeing this I thought a Guardian would fit the role really well, as it is far more survivable than a Thief, a Mesmer and an Elementalist during a fight.

So, in your opinion, what equipment/traits/skills was that Guardian using? Keep in mind that he was wielding a GS (he did not swap weapons during our fight), that his primary source of damage was burn/reta, and that he managed to get away safely after being chased for 30 seconds or so by 5+ people.
Thanks in advance for your replies (if I get any of course >.<)

Almost guaranteed that he was a Healway variation. That would be this guy.

You can tell healways primarily by the heavy use of shouts and dodgerolls. And of course the immunity to conditions… Usually they are weapon swapping a lot though.

Sounds to me more like the guardian was badly trolled by you. P/D thief is the biggest troll spec in the game. Anyway, it was just a healing speced guardian.

“You can tell healways primarily by the heavy use of shouts and dodgerolls. And of course the immunity to conditions…”
^^
I wouldn’t necessarily agree with that. Almost all guardian builds include heal on dodge, shouts and a good amount of condi removal.

You can tell healways by them having poor damage output and getting healed a lot upon roll/generally being impossible to take down without multiple people.

I know the OP didn’t ask how to kill said Guardian, but: boon removal/stealing and overwhelming condition spam.

Herein lies one of the biggest issues I have with this game. For any game really that has a light armor thief / stealth type class.

" P/D Thief ", light armor class using a dagger and pistol thinking they should be able to take down another class using heavy armor, great sword, insert other weapon of choice, or shield.

Just mind boggling if you want a honest opinion.

cannons.8109:

yeah i think OP was the one trolling. got outplayed badly by a guardian and runs away when he gets in trouble, and even swaps out utilities to try again. if you had outplayed the guardian, he would be dead. You should have honored your duel and finished what you started.

Well, I figured that something like “hey look at me I am here you can’t do anything to me otherwise you die” it’s more of a troll than what I did.
I “wanted” to finish the duel, it is not my fault if other people came in. Plus, what’s wrong in swapping utilities? It’s one of the keypoints of P/D gameplay to be able to reset fights at ease. Maybe he swapped something too, who knows? I know very little about Guardians, that’s why I posted this in the first place ^^

Thanks for the awesome replies though! He was not dodging that much, he almost wanted me to hit him. I believe he dodged only when out of blocks/aegis, expecting a backstab
Neither of us got under 50% health for the entire fight though.

EDIT: please, do not make the mistake of thinking that I am that kind of thief who believes to be the best out there. I get killed too, and I still lose 1v1s from time to time (I consider running away with every utility on CD and 20% health a loss). I do not expect to win EVERY 1v1 I start. I came here asking for advice about the setup that Guardian was using, in order to counter that as a Thief and in order to improve my knowledge about this class which fascinates me a lot in regards of commanding.

Black powder weapons are why people stopped wearing armor in pre-Rennaisance Europe. Because metal slugs going a few hundred feet per second pierce metal. First the armored cavalry reduced their armor to three-quarter plate, then they left off the armor on their arms as well, until they were left with just a cuirass and helmet. The shape of the cuirass and helmet changed from domed or rounded to a rounded wedge in an effort to deflect bullets by forcing them to strike the armor at an angle, which increased the effective thickness of the metal.

Infantry followed a similar path, needing mobility to compete with rifles. Before full plate went completely by the wayside, European style infantry would carry thick daggers which were used to kill armored infantry that had been knocked off their feet, usually stabbing them in the neck between the bottom of the helmet and the gorget, or in the armpit which may have been mailed but not covered by a plate.

So eh, makes sense to me.

Yup Foofad. However, we have this wonderful thing called offensive and defensive magic /rollseyes

Don’t get me wrong I know what I said and read your reply. Makes sense. However, the whole thing goes out the door once you add that wonderful ‘magic’ layer

Want to counter a Guardian? Run S/D like every other Thief.

foofad.5162:

Almost guaranteed that he was a Healway variation. That would be this guy.

^^ Yep.

Burns on Blocks, Retal, Sword/Focus + GS… Dodge Rolls and Boons to boot.

Super troll build…. dodge’s in and out of combat.

Crapgame.6519:

Yup Foofad. However, we have this wonderful thing called offensive and defensive magic /rollseyes

Don’t get me wrong I know what I said and read your reply. Makes sense. However, the whole thing goes out the door once you add that wonderful ‘magic’ layer

That goes both ways – thieves use Deception magic (same school as Mesmer) for their stealth and many of their weapon skills.

hihey.1075:

cannons.8109:

You should have honored your duel and finished what you started.

It’s one of the keypoints of P/D gameplay to be able to reset fights at ease. .

There’s just something so very, very wrong with that statement. One of the reasons WvW/PvP in this game is messed up.

Christos de Soufre.3802:

I know the OP didn’t ask how to kill said Guardian, but: boon removal/stealing and overwhelming condition spam.

That works in PvP, the OP was talking about WvW.

GSSBlunaspike.4153:

Christos de Soufre.3802:

I know the OP didn’t ask how to kill said Guardian, but: boon removal/stealing and overwhelming condition spam.

That works in PvP, the OP was talking about WvW.

Even in WvW, a competent S/D thief will kill a Healway guardian of equal or lesser skill. I haven’t personally died to one yet, but I’ve been given close enough calls to know that it’s completely possible for a competent boon-steal spammer to kill a boon-reliant build.

The condition spam might not be quite as viable for a Thief, so I probably should have just left that out. However, I’ve heard enough stories to know that Necros are a big problem for a lot of boon-heavy Guardians in WvW as well.

Though to be fair, I haven’t been out roaming in weeks.

Christos de Soufre.3802:

GSSBlunaspike.4153:

Christos de Soufre.3802:

I know the OP didn’t ask how to kill said Guardian, but: boon removal/stealing and overwhelming condition spam.

That works in PvP, the OP was talking about WvW.

Even in WvW, a competent S/D thief will kill a Healway guardian of equal or lesser skill. I haven’t personally died to one yet, but I’ve been given close enough calls to know that it’s completely possible for a competent boon-steal spammer to kill a boon-reliant build.

The condition spam might not be quite as viable for a Thief, so I probably should have just left that out. However, I’ve heard enough stories to know that Necros are a big problem for a lot of boon-heavy Guardians in WvW as well.

Though to be fair, I haven’t been out roaming in weeks.

I was more talking about the condition spam. In PvP it’s a real threat. In WvW you can just eat the condition reduction food + melandru runes and the way the reduction works is pretty broken.

Well when you put it that way, sure.

Christos de Soufre.3802:

Well when you put it that way, sure.

Lol. I like the honesty.

Amins.3710:

foofad.5162:

Almost guaranteed that he was a Healway variation. That would be this guy.

^^ Yep.

Burns on Blocks, Retal, Sword/Focus + GS… Dodge Rolls and Boons to boot.

Super troll build…. dodge’s in and out of combat.

Does the burn on block trait have a cooldown? For example using Shelter on Hundred Blades will give 8 seconds of burning. Also, does it stack with Rune of Guardian’s 6th bonus of adding burning on block, giving 2 seconds of burning for 1 block?

I have been a guardian since beta, and I dont use forum builds.

When a D/D theif fights me they kill their selves, not just because retaliation…

My build lets me burn when I block, heal when I roll, I use two shouts, one gives 5 sec retaliation/stability, other gives 10 seconds retaltion + 7 others.

Its not perma retaliation, max is 15 seconds though.

I have 3.4k Armor, 3.9k Atk, 18K HP

With all that attack, any squishy that gets close to my GS is what I want, I want people to stand in melee range of me, if by chance they try to kite me I pull out my scepter/focus for anti kite work.

Not every player uses other peoples builds, some are atcually very good at making their own builds to play with. But with over 12 years of MMORPG experience, this comes very easy for me.

Littlefeather.8623:

I have been a guardian since beta, and I dont use forum builds.

When a D/D theif fights me they kill their selves, not just because retaliation…

My build lets me burn when I block, heal when I roll, I use two shouts, one gives 5 sec retaliation/stability, other gives 10 seconds retaltion + 7 others.

Its not perma retaliation, max is 15 seconds though.

I have 3.4k Armor, 3.9k Atk, 18K HP

With all that attack, any squishy that gets close to my GS is what I want, I want people to stand in melee range of me, if by chance they try to kite me I pull out my scepter/focus for anti kite work.

Not every player uses other peoples builds, some are atcually very good at making their own builds to play with. But with over 12 years of MMORPG experience, this comes very easy for me.

yea… great..

Crapgame.6519:

Christos de Soufre.3802:

Well when you put it that way, sure.

Lol. I like the honesty.

:P I don’t often take full Melandru + Lemongrass into consideration because it’s so extreme. I know it’s popular with people in the current condition-heavy meta though.

Christos de Soufre.3802:

:P I don’t often take full Melandru + Lemongrass into consideration because it’s so extreme. I know it’s popular with people in the current condition-heavy meta though.

Is making memes out of other guardians, like, a thing now?

sorry, it’s what happens when I haven’t been able to play the game for days

lolled anyway.

/15

Wait, wait, wait.
WAIT
So in WvW you don’t need condition removal because two food items will reduce it to nothing!?
Is that a thing?

Jax.5261:

Is that a thing?

6x Superior Rune of Melandru and a Bowl of Lemongras Poultry Soup gives you a tidy -65% condition duration and -25% stun duration. Envious?

Littlefeather.8623:

I have 3.4k Armor, 3.9k Atk, 18K HP

Pic or it didn’t happen.

No seriously though. I’ve been messing around in the build calculators and I almost get those numbers, but they make up a ridiculously inefficient build.

Care to share?

Jax.5261:

Wait, wait, wait.
WAIT
So in WvW you don’t need condition removal because two food items will reduce it to nothing!?
Is that a thing?

The important thing to note is that it does NOT reduce it to nothing. It’s additive with condition duration. So a guy with +65% Duration versus a guy with -65% Duration will do 100% Duration conditions. It doesn’t make conditions useless or condition cleansing pointless. It does help though.

Boon Duration cleric geared guardian probably. He probably had protection up when you hit him, which more than likely made your damage insignificant.

foofad.5162:

Jax.5261:

Wait, wait, wait.
WAIT
So in WvW you don’t need condition removal because two food items will reduce it to nothing!?
Is that a thing?

The important thing to note is that it does NOT reduce it to nothing. It’s additive with condition duration. So a guy with +65% Duration versus a guy with -65% Duration will do 100% Duration conditions. It doesn’t make conditions useless or condition cleansing pointless. It does help though.

Yeah, it’s mostly only useful to even the playing field. I guess imagine if you didn’t have it. Necros are the worst, and considering fear is affected by both ways it’s really helpful.

The reason it kind of sucks is that if you don’t have + duration enough to reach the 1 second mark it does make you immune to some things. If you put a 2 second burn on them and they have mel+lg then it reduces it to under the 1 second mark.

It’s to the point of either take the increased condi duration food, or don’t even bother with conditions. Warriors are really strong with it because they have access to dogged march.