Guild Wars 2

Accessories has worse stat conversion than the armor.

But imo the interesting part is if you stack celestial stats in most of your gear,

I have 11 pieces atm, 6 armor, scepter/focus and amulet/2 rings and im actually finding some interesting gameplay in these even thoug i didnt expect it.

What they offer is great sustain combined with decent crit chance and superior crit damage and subpar power.

And the interesting part is that power can be gained in normal gameplay to buff their effective power way passed a unbuffed berserker.

In order to do that you need time (approx 12 s) and to get that time you need sustain which they have.

Its not as straightforward as a normal gear but im starting to get realy interested in them tbh and if the rumor is true that they will add boonduration to them im gonna pee in my pants. That would just be so great and allow to use some offensive runes to boost base power passively.

I doubt it would be anywhere as strong as the runes. Just look at the giver set. Each pcs is an “unfair” 1% boon duration.

I run a PVT guard because sometimes my dungeon group just fails too hard or is too squishy. I’ll take my guardian in and tank everything like a boss. If we need dmg i bring my warrior. But if this is your only lvl 80 then go full zerk because it makes dungeon runs faster. I just bring my guardian for fail pug groups that are too squishy and dont know how to dodge.

Obtena.7952:

XRay.1920:

Zerker stats are the absolute top in pve.

Sigh. Nothing like coming in on page 6, reading one post and thinking your on top of things Ay?

I appreciate your attempt to troll, but considering that I read the whole thread and that the post I quoted wasn’t even on the last page, I’m gonna disregard it, the same way I disregard anyone who suggests pvt as epic awesome gear. cheers~

Seetoo.9316:

I doubt it would be anywhere as strong as the runes. Just look at the giver set. Each pcs is an “unfair” 1% boon duration.

I think celestials are at their prime when you use it all slots. I have a theory that the stat combination it self can be stacked and the more you got them more unique the build becomes.

In that theory i actually think boon duration (20-30%) is neccessary in order to compensate for the lack of power thru might stacking.

If its just one percent (13% if you are interested in might stacking with 1 handers) it means i jus thave to put in 2*water and can use either orbs or divinity runes in the four other slots.

23% boon duration (5 in virtues)
2900 armor
1700 power
+18k health
approx 105% crit damage
>30% crit chance¨
Unbuffed

And 12 stacks (without staff) of might in 11 s sounds really appealing to me.

The fact is that in a 0/5/30/30/5 this will hit just as a hard a guardian with berserker gear if you can build those 12 stacks. And her comes the nice thing, full celestials has very nice builtin sustain through vitality, toughness and ofc 1k dodge rolls. unlike a berserker that sustain gives you time to build those stacks, in wvw ofc.

Imo 1% boon duration is a valuable addition to such a build, its much better than a straight increase of the other stats, thats for sure.

I have 11 pieces and the theory i had when started to craft have played out better than i hoped, i find celestials to be just great and it becomes even better the more pieces i get.

Yoshikoo.7381:

I run a PVT guard because sometimes my dungeon group just fails too hard or is too squishy. I’ll take my guardian in and tank everything like a boss. If we need dmg i bring my warrior. But if this is your only lvl 80 then go full zerk because it makes dungeon runs faster. I just bring my guardian for fail pug groups that are too squishy and dont know how to dodge.

And so if you know how to dodge yourself, why are you running PVT?

no guardian should run pvt gear, ever

I ran PVT gear around release. I’ve since switched and never looked back. There really is just no reason to wear PVT. Being able to “tank” attacks is SO much less useful than actually being able to kill the enemy.

I might see an argument for Cleric’s gear when you’re PUGing, though, since PUGs are rarely very coordinated and you might as well keep them on their feet while you’re taking your two hours to get through AC.

The bosses hit like a train, and the gravelings when they hit you just spam bleed stacks at you, so you can’t really out-heal it. If you use traited VoR or PoV from honour to remove the conditions … well you can still run full berserker.

My problem with people who want to “tank” is that you’re not even tanking most of the time because of the RNG aggro mechanics.

Oh yeah, there’s that.

jalmari.3906:

no guardian should run pvt gear, ever

You won’t survive a T1 WvW blob encounter.

Saying PVT has ‘no’ place in PVE is wrong, imo.

There are plenty of encounters which require staying alive over raw DPS from the group.

Dredge Fractal – Bomb running.

Colossus Fractal – Double Seal running.

Dungeons – Various. e.g, skipping through mob-filled corridors, keeping mobs kited to protect an NPC, etc.

For these instances, I’m super glad I have my soldier’s runed soldier set to replace my zerker scholar gear. Also, if you ever need to take on an AH anchor role over DPS because there’s another in your group, Soldier’s isn’t bad if you have full ascended zerker trinkets and a knight’s weapon.

I run with a full zerker set, full PVT set, full clerics set (and full MF set ) and switch accordingly. 80% of the time I will be using zerker’s, but there are a few times I will need to switch to PVT for the increased vitality, and a few times I will put clerics on to heal the group.

Using zerker 100% of the time is as stupid as using PVT 100% of the time. Switching armors and skills between fights is always necessary.

Ray.3780:

Saying PVT has ‘no’ place in PVE is wrong, imo.

There are plenty of encounters which require staying alive over raw DPS from the group.

Dredge Fractal – Bomb running.

Colossus Fractal – Double Seal running.

Dungeons – Various. e.g, skipping through mob-filled corridors, keeping mobs kited to protect an NPC, etc.

For these instances, I’m super glad I have my soldier’s runed soldier set to replace my zerker scholar gear. Also, if you ever need to take on an AH anchor role over DPS because there’s another in your group, Soldier’s isn’t bad if you have full ascended zerker trinkets and a knight’s weapon.

I somehow did those encounters with 916 toughness and 966 vitality on lvl 79.

Ray.3780:

Saying PVT has ‘no’ place in PVE is wrong, imo.

There are plenty of encounters which require staying alive over raw DPS from the group.

Dredge Fractal – Bomb running.

Colossus Fractal – Double Seal running.

Dungeons – Various. e.g, skipping through mob-filled corridors, keeping mobs kited to protect an NPC, etc.

For these instances, I’m super glad I have my soldier’s runed soldier set to replace my zerker scholar gear. Also, if you ever need to take on an AH anchor role over DPS because there’s another in your group, Soldier’s isn’t bad if you have full ascended zerker trinkets and a knight’s weapon.

Dredge – literally the only thing you lose from dying is pride, if your team wipes you spawn like 2 seconds away from the bombs so you can go again.

Colossus – I’ve run this in full berserker no problems.

Dungeons – I’d need examples. The only one I can think of off the top of my head is taking Agent Spire through the last icebrood spawn, and there you just pull them away or dodge the OHKO so your armour stat doesn’t even matter.

I do occasionally switch into my old knights set when doing the bombs or going up to the switch on the dredge fractal. Its not needed, but it makes it slightly easier. But for skipping and colossus its really not worth the hassle to switch gear. You can do everything in zerker.

I think the point is that berserker’s is not offering any particular benefits in those cases because having sufficient DPS isn’t a limiter. Though it can be done without switching, optimally many people are already switching weapons and consumables on a case by case basis, switching into another armor set isn’t a big deal, not for me at least, as I carry a full 20 slot bag on all my characters for anything I might need. It’s full because if it’s not it gets filled up with other gunk.

I guess coming from an MMO like FFXI where you would swap between half a dozen gear sets mid-combat for multiple scenarios and spells has me in a different mindset. I’ve no doubt that I could run everything I listed in full berserker. But there’s no arguing that swapping makes it easier, however miniscule that change may be.

I’m fine switching around weapons or even traits, but swapping around 6 pieces (12 if you include trinkets) just for higher armour stats for a short section of a dungeon doesn’t feel worth the hassle for me.

TheMaskedParadigm.3629:

Obtena.7952:

TheMaskedParadigm.3629:

No it doesn’t. If someone wants to wear PVT and slow down a run, they can find a different group.

I’m going to recommend you have a full look at the thread … this has already been debunked as nonsense unless your lost seconds (not minutes) are that valuable to you. A player’s gear has a very small impact on the overall runtime.

In fact, the time you lose being selective about team mates or replacing the guy you kicked with someone else will be much greater than the time you lose running a dungeon with people who are not full zerker. Whatever. No one said logic was a per-requisite for playing MMO’s.

You see, the thing is that those seconds and minutes are very valuable when you are speedrunning and farming rewards. They add up quite fast and you don’t seem to have a concept of this. Being selective beforehand prevents constant wipes and not being able to finish dungeons, so you are eliminating possibility of failure before you start. Letting anyone in that may or may not care about how to play and is most likely going to be bad is a very good way to have a very bad time.

Also, a player’s gear has a very large impact on clear times and is usually a good indicator of how good or bad they are. If you have a bad player using bad gear like PVT, they will slow the run down, pull aggro in certain areas, kite bosses or mobs around and have no idea what they are doing, and slow things down due to terrible DPS. A bad player wearing Berserker’s gear will either learn to adapt or die and let the better players finish the encounter without them. Then they will learn the hard way, and that will help them. A very skilled player using PVT will still slow down encounters because they simply don’t output high damage and the survivability will serve no purpose. A very skilled player using Berserker’s gear will provide strong DPS and not slow the run down. Gear is one side of the equation, player skill is the other side. This is a concept that you need to understand and clearly don’t.

I want an official statement from ANet, not speedclear runners, that non-“zerk” gear is “selfish” and the wrong way to play GW2. People continuously fail to understand that not all players are suited for Berserker’s gear playstyle, and that using anything else has nothing to do with lacking skill or being selfish (or altruistic, for that matter.) All stats gear is there for a reason, giving many different choices for players to gear up in ways that suit better their individual playstyle and builds-it’s not a matter of morality or being “bad.”

So much trolling in this thread-accepting such exclusivist philosophy (“there is only one way to properly gear up for Dungeons”) also means that it should be “OK” to have gear checks, which clearly Anet disagrees with, and for good reason.

JobCreator.1956:

I’ve seen this elitist “my way or the highway” mentality in too many MMO’s, and I’ve seen the inevitable outcome. Perhaps this scenario sounds familiar?

[8:05PM]Player1: lf1m for (dungeon), 5 minute run, MUST HAVE SPECIFIC GEAR OR GTFO!!!
[8:06PM]Player2: hey I want to do that dungeon, but I don’t have that specific gear…
[8:06PM]Player1: GTFO!!!
[8:17PM]Player1: lf1m for (dungeon), 5 minute run, MUST HAVE SPECIFIC GEAR OR GTFO!!!
[8:25PM]Player1: lf1m for (dungeon), 5 minute run, pst
[8:25PM]Player3: I’m down, invite pls
[8:26PM]Player1: do you have specific gear?
[8:26PM]Player3: no, but I know the run and have done it many times
[8:27PM]Player1: GTFO!!!
[8:45PM]Player1: lf2m for (dungeon), 5 minute run, MUST HAVE SPECIFIC GEAR!!!
[9:07PM]Player1: lf1m for (dungeon), 5 minute run, MUST HAVE SPECIFIC GEAR!!!
[9:53PM]Player1: lf3m for (dungeon), 5 minute run, MUST HAVE SPECIFIC GEAR!!!
[10:47PM]Player1: lf1m for (dungeon), 5 minute run, MUST HAVE SPECIFIC GEAR!!!
[11:27PM]Player1: (dungeon) run full, everyone who didn’t come is missing out on our amazing 5 minute run…suckers!

Yep, having specific gear sure saves a lot of time…

that person must’ve traited for “Slow of Mind,” that and who uses in game chat for LFGs anymore?! get with times!

anyways, niche groups are niche, people in zerkers gear can have their fun while other people have theirs, I don’t see why this simple suggestion thread turned into such a kittenstorm. I swear we can’t have one single thread about armor stats without it turning into “zerker people are smelly and mean” and/or “non zerker people are carebears and stupid”

ref.8196:

I run with a full zerker set, full PVT set, full clerics set (and full MF set ) and switch accordingly. 80% of the time I will be using zerker’s, but there are a few times I will need to switch to PVT for the increased vitality, and a few times I will put clerics on to heal the group.

Using zerker 100% of the time is as stupid as using PVT 100% of the time. Switching armors and skills between fights is always necessary.

To be fair, not everybody should be expected to meet this requirement as far as armor sets are concerned especially given time constraints and the possibility of too many alts to gear up. Very few of my characters have alternate exotic sets, and those must be re-skinned differently, which means all of this is theoretically very costly. Skill changing, though, does make sense and is doable for all without cost (unless somehow they still haven’t bought all of their skills.)

jalmari.3906:

no guardian should run pvt gear, ever

I think you meant that you would never, ever run Soldier’s gear with your Guardian, which is totally fine, but the way you play doesn’t necessarily applies to everybody else, however valid it is for you.

Star Ace.5207:

TheMaskedParadigm.3629:

Obtena.7952:

TheMaskedParadigm.3629:

No it doesn’t. If someone wants to wear PVT and slow down a run, they can find a different group.

I’m going to recommend you have a full look at the thread … this has already been debunked as nonsense unless your lost seconds (not minutes) are that valuable to you. A player’s gear has a very small impact on the overall runtime.

In fact, the time you lose being selective about team mates or replacing the guy you kicked with someone else will be much greater than the time you lose running a dungeon with people who are not full zerker. Whatever. No one said logic was a per-requisite for playing MMO’s.

You see, the thing is that those seconds and minutes are very valuable when you are speedrunning and farming rewards. They add up quite fast and you don’t seem to have a concept of this. Being selective beforehand prevents constant wipes and not being able to finish dungeons, so you are eliminating possibility of failure before you start. Letting anyone in that may or may not care about how to play and is most likely going to be bad is a very good way to have a very bad time.

Also, a player’s gear has a very large impact on clear times and is usually a good indicator of how good or bad they are. If you have a bad player using bad gear like PVT, they will slow the run down, pull aggro in certain areas, kite bosses or mobs around and have no idea what they are doing, and slow things down due to terrible DPS. A bad player wearing Berserker’s gear will either learn to adapt or die and let the better players finish the encounter without them. Then they will learn the hard way, and that will help them. A very skilled player using PVT will still slow down encounters because they simply don’t output high damage and the survivability will serve no purpose. A very skilled player using Berserker’s gear will provide strong DPS and not slow the run down. Gear is one side of the equation, player skill is the other side. This is a concept that you need to understand and clearly don’t.

I want an official statement from ANet, not speedclear runners, that non-“zerk” gear is “selfish” and the wrong way to play GW2. People continuously fail to understand that not all players are suited for Berserker’s gear playstyle, and that using anything else has nothing to do with lacking skill or being selfish (or altruistic, for that matter.) All stats gear is there for a reason, giving many different choices for players to gear up in ways that suit better their individual playstyle and builds-it’s not a matter of morality or being “bad.”

So much trolling in this thread-accepting such exclusivist philosophy (“there is only one way to properly gear up for Dungeons”) also means that it should be “OK” to have gear checks, which clearly Anet disagrees with, and for good reason.

An official statement from Anet isn’t going to make people change their mind on it. Anet’s intentions and Anet’s execution are not one and the same, otherwise they wouldn’t be patching things and trying to balance things out.

I also can’t really see the logic of making poor gear and gameplay choices meaning anything other than being “bad”. How can you be bad at the game if being bad at the game isn’t an indicator of being bad at the game?

Until Anet does something to actually design the game differently, their opinion doesn’t really change fact anymore than the average players, unless they start backing up that opinion with like… I dunno, bans or something.

If you don’t like the way “elitists” think… then don’t play with elitists and pay their comments no mind. Afterall, you believe they’re trolling. It really is not hard to avoid people you don’t wanna play with in this game.

Star Ace.5207:

I want an official statement from ANet, not speedclear runners, that non-“zerk” gear is “selfish” and the wrong way to play GW2. People continuously fail to understand that not all players are suited for Berserker’s gear playstyle, and that using anything else has nothing to do with lacking skill or being selfish (or altruistic, for that matter.) All stats gear is there for a reason, giving many different choices for players to gear up in ways that suit better their individual playstyle and builds-it’s not a matter of morality or being “bad.”

So much trolling in this thread-accepting such exclusivist philosophy (“there is only one way to properly gear up for Dungeons”) also means that it should be “OK” to have gear checks, which clearly Anet disagrees with, and for good reason.

@Bold:
Allow me to type down a cool history, bro :
I leveled my ele to 80 2 days ago, and realized… using zerker gear on it is actually dificcult as hell, and not because of the zerk gear itself, but because i still suck at ele. Plain and simple.
I mean, heck, yesterday i got oneshot by alpha with full HP, i had no endurance (due to wasted dodges and lack of timing on my LH skills) and forgot to put my energy dagger on prior the fight, i was like “ok i’ve got protection, it should allow me to facetank this hit” – Ahaha, no. – Thing is, if you can not run in zerker gear on PvE it just means you don’t know and/or play your class well enough, so don’t come to me with “it has nothing to do with skill” mambo jambo, because it actually does in most cases.

And… while i do cry internally everytime i miss a dodge either by timing or lack of endurance on my ele, i’d rather learn my kitten than leech my group (because hiting 7, 7, 14k on alpha with LH and zerk gear for 20 seconds is better than 4, 4, 7k with pvt gear for 30 (and i’m being nice here, assuming it will actually crit 3 times in a row in pvt).

Have a good day and i wish the best of luck on your “i want an official yada yada from anet” that you’ve been posting all over the forums.

Oxxy.7068:

Star Ace.5207:

I want an official statement from ANet, not speedclear runners, that non-“zerk” gear is “selfish” and the wrong way to play GW2. People continuously fail to understand that not all players are suited for Berserker’s gear playstyle, and that using anything else has nothing to do with lacking skill or being selfish (or altruistic, for that matter.) All stats gear is there for a reason, giving many different choices for players to gear up in ways that suit better their individual playstyle and builds-it’s not a matter of morality or being “bad.”

So much trolling in this thread-accepting such exclusivist philosophy (“there is only one way to properly gear up for Dungeons”) also means that it should be “OK” to have gear checks, which clearly Anet disagrees with, and for good reason.

@Bold:
Allow me to type down a cool history, bro :
I leveled my ele to 80 2 days ago, and realized… using zerker gear on it is actually dificcult as hell, and not because of the zerk gear itself, but because i still suck at ele. Plain and simple.
I mean, heck, yesterday i got oneshot by alpha with full HP, i had no endurance (due to wasted dodges and lack of timing on my LH skills) and forgot to put my energy dagger on prior the fight, i was like “ok i’ve got protection, it should allow me to facetank this hit” – Ahaha, no. – Thing is, if you can not run in zerker gear on PvE it just means you don’t know and/or play your class well enough, so don’t come to me with “it has nothing to do with skill” mambo jambo, because it actually does in most cases.

And… while i do cry internally everytime i miss a dodge either by timing or lack of endurance on my ele, i’d rather learn my kitten than leech my group (because hiting 7, 7, 14k on alpha with LH and zerk gear for 20 seconds is better than 4, 4, 7k with pvt gear for 30 (and i’m being nice here, assuming it will actually crit 3 times in a row in pvt).

Have a good day and i wish the best of luck on your “i want an official yada yada from anet” that you’ve been posting all over the forums.

No need to resort to insults (really, I don’t know what’s the point of insulting other players for disagreeing with your views and playstyle?), but it’s clear from your story that you actually agree with the point of Berserker’s playstyle not being a good playstyle for each and every player (they are NOT “baddies” for not doing so-that’s just ego-stroking.)

You wouldn’t have been leeching that group for running out of endurance on a “non-zerk” build, and the whole "anyone that doesn’t play the “optimal” cookie-cutter way is a "leech"is preposterous at best (can’t be logical to expect people to always think our way and do the things that we do, and it will never be-and it doesn’t mean that you are either inferior or superior to them, nor makes them “bad” at all for differing from you.)

Leeching isn’t failing to use Berserker’s gear period. Being a jerk/bully is what happens when you try to force your views on others by claiming so (it’s also a kind of silly “guilt-tripping”: “play my way or else be selfish and bad”-I don’t have to point out how hypocritical that sounds.)

I dont think you read his post.

I’ve got to hand it to you Oxxy, you’re the one person I’ve seen so far who admits to their trouble using full berserker is a skill issue and that it’s still worth learning and using, rather than “I can’t use it so instead I play/leech how I want”.

I still have no idea how I woke up this morning and got slammed with two infractions for posts I made in the middle of this thread though, people must really not like me.

colesy.8490:

I still have no idea how I woke up this morning and got slammed with two infractions for posts I made in the middle of this thread though, people must really not like me.

It’s the SFR tag in signature, believe me.

/joke

Anyway, again: the issue with zerker is just having good players telling bad player that it’s the only thing to use – or something like “if you’re not zerk you’re bad” – and thus creating a tons of bad zerk users.

I have no issue wit zerk players, but you must be able do provide facts for qualify as good enough to use it.
I prefer a thousand times a honest guy saying “i don’t feel like to use zerk, so i’ll go with zerk + knight” and then play properly to a “ima good ima use zerk don’t care what you say” player that spend half of time in the DG as carpet.

Casuals that dont agree are very quick to report posts. I got reported multiple times on the necro forums for telling someone they were wrong politely, after they full on insulted me. I can take an insult so I didnt bother to report them back. I just find it amusing that mods have no issue infracting the player who gets reported but they fail to check the other posts.

AndrewSX.3794:

colesy.8490:

I still have no idea how I woke up this morning and got slammed with two infractions for posts I made in the middle of this thread though, people must really not like me.

It’s the SFR tag in signature, believe me.

/joke

Anyway, again: the issue with zerker is just having good players telling bad player that it’s the only thing to use – or something like “if you’re not zerk you’re bad” – and thus creating a tons of bad zerk users.

I have no issue wit zerk players, but you must be able do provide facts for qualify as good enough to use it.
I prefer a thousand times a honest guy saying “i don’t feel like to use zerk, so i’ll go with zerk + knight” and then play properly to a “ima good ima use zerk don’t care what you say” player that spend half of time in the DG as carpet.

The reason there is “not zerk = bad” stigma is because the learning curve for using berserker basically involves avoiding heavily choreographed OHKO attacks and against mobs just grouping, cleaving and spamming blinds. Of course it’s a lot more forgiving on say a mesmer with our fat 19k HP pool rather than a thief or elementalist.

colesy.8490:

I’ve got to hand it to you Oxxy, you’re the one person I’ve seen so far who admits to their trouble using full berserker is a skill issue and that it’s still worth learning and using, rather than “I can’t use it so instead I play/leech how I want”.

Fixing my dodging issues takes like a day or two of practice in order to fully utilize my gear, so it is much better for me as a player to accept the fact that i indeed suck at ele right now and need to improve than just lie to myself saying it doesn’t suit my playstyle.

@StarAce

I don’t think i insulted you. Re-read my post.
And…using zerk in pve is probably fine for everyone that wants to improve. If i ever want to run healing on my guard i will do it in spvp and/or wvw, where it may actually work.

One reports someone because you don’t want their emotional attachment and lack of reason to infect the rest of the forum. Not because one can’t take an insult.

/reporting is basic forum housekeeping.

Arenanet doesn’t generally tell us who they infract for posts. While we don’t know that the other person was not slapped down as well, you can still /report to bring it to their attention.

“But he started it” does not tend to work well as a defense in any case.

spoj.9672:

Casuals that dont agree are very quick to report posts. I got reported multiple times on the necro forums for telling someone they were wrong politely, after they full on insulted me. I can take an insult so I didnt bother to report them back. I just find it amusing that mods have no issue infracting the player who gets reported but they fail to check the other posts.

That’s just kitten.

colesy.8490:

The reason there is “not zerk = bad” stigma is because the learning curve for using berserker basically involves avoiding heavily choreographed OHKO attacks and against mobs just grouping, cleaving and spamming blinds. Of course it’s a lot more forgiving on say a mesmer with our fat 19k HP pool rather than a thief or elementalist.

It’s also about running in more faceroll-ish team composition with lots of defense which certain classes provide. Zerker is good when there’s no constant pressure. Otherwise you might need sustainability which, again, certain professions grant.

The only fight that ive found that is tricky even with a zerk hammer guardian is laurent in TA. His auto attacks really hurt. :<