Guild Wars 2

I’m just starting GW2, and I can’t decide between a guard and a warrior for my first character. I love them both. Any suggestions?

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/guardian/Just-created-a-Guardian/first

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/guardian/Guardians-Vs-Warriors-2/first

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/guardian/I-feel-bad-for-guards/first

So from those posts, Guardians just aren’t as viable as warriors?

Wow, well there’s a lot of moaning about Guardian lacking vs. Warriors right now. Play what you want. I main a Guardian, and it is true we lack mobility. That is one of our biggest flaws, but honestly nobody does group support like we do.

You can comfortably play any game mode as both, leveling is easy peasy on both, dungeons….Well I’ll say my opinion: Guardians tend to make running dungeons easier due to insakittenup support, Warriors tend to make them faster due to their insane DPS. Both are desired, but Warriors are most desired for “speed runs” if you actually care about that. Just my opinion from personal experience.

Both are perfectly viable, it’s just that had you asked a month or two ago, people would probably have flat out told you to pick Guardian. Warrior got some pretty healthy buffs recently primarily for sPvP / WvW that are just getting realized and picked up into the mainstream. Due to a larger overlap now of Warrior’s abilities into Guardian territory, people are feeling pretty salty about it.

Here is what I do know: Guardians, other than directly after the beta, have changed very little. Most people will say Guardians are among the most balanced, or even THE most balanced class in the game. So you have a much lower chance of getting buffed to the sky and promptly smacked down as we’ve seen with almost every other class.

Thank you J, I feel much better about my guard now :P Can you link a leveling build? I’ve seen a few, but they aren’t explained, or don’t make sense. I put five in the bottom two traits

Also, is there a way to increase my movespeed? like, besides “retreat”
?

Mundo.6481:

Also, is there a way to increase my movespeed? like, besides “retreat”
?

This is from a WvW perspective:

Staff is 100% swiftness with enough boon duration. Save yourselves with boon duration is good too. Sword has a teleport and greatsword has a leap that are 600.

The low cooldown on the warrior greatsword skills (there’s the spin and the charge) and the warrior sword leap is what gives them better mobility.

Guardian brings wards, stability and protection to your group. Warrior brings stuns, more damage, and offensive buffs.

Mundo.6481:

Thank you J, I feel much better about my guard now :P Can you link a leveling build? I’ve seen a few, but they aren’t explained, or don’t make sense. I put five in the bottom two traits

That’s a good start, those two minor traits give you a lot of bang for your buck so to speak.

As for a build, I won’t bother linking you one for now as you don’t need it. Your traits and gear will likely change drastically once you hit 80, then we can help you with a real build. Leveling..It’s pretty hard to go wrong and you can reset any time. Here’s my general rule of thumb:

When you only have single stat gear to equip, focus on Power. With 2 stat gear, make it Power and Vitality. 3 stat gear, it’s up to you at this point, but I would go with Power, Precision, and Crit Damage (aka Berserker’s or Zerker’s gear).

For over-world PvE, there’s really almost no need for toughness, especially at lower levels. Even then, I wouldn’t even consider it until you can get 3-stat gear (level 60 I think??) Then, if you want, invest in some Knight’s gear and mix it with zerker’s.

Utilities are up to you, shouts are simple and effective at any level. Traits…I’ll give you some very important advice here: Don’t trait purely for stats. Pick traits for their purpose FIRST, then consider how the stats affect your build. Stats come primarily via gear, so pick traits based on what works for you and what is most important for you to have first. You DON’T need 30 Zeal w/ 30 Radiance to do damage, in fact that’s a pretty poor option just fyi.

It seems like guardians would have more trouble soloing, without damage(in pve) Is that true?

Mundo.6481:

It seems like guardians would have more trouble soloing, without damage(in pve) Is that true?

Not really, the reason people pump power at low levels is that pretty much every other stat except for Vitality doesn’t scale well at low levels.

Also, at all levels of purely overworld PvE people tend to use more offensive gear while leveling because there’s not too much out there that is dangerous enough to warrant using defensive gear, “so why not just plow through it faster?” is the mentality.

When you actually reach 80, that’s when I’d start settling into, “Do I want my first set of gear to be pure offensive, tanky w/ damage, or pure tank / healing?” I said first set, because if you stick with it, you might find yourself switching between sets of armor depending on the situation.

Mundo.6481:

So from those posts, Guardians just aren’t as viable as warriors?

Guardian is viable, is a great supporter. In sPvP is great bunker. In PVE is great, easy to leveling, but in pve any class is great.

The problem is his versatility in wvw, the lack of real range weapon, the lack of mobility or soft CC to keep enemies in melee range is a problem in wvw. Unless you go to zerg support or support of small roaming group, the group fill your weakness.

The reality is because your lack of mobility you will be kited a lot or just you cant chase or stop someone alone if they are running away from you because you havent soft CC. And you cant escape if someone (or many) is chasing you, is really hard and situational (need a target to blink with sword2 or JI) the mobility of the guardian.

You are too vulnerable to inmobilizes or cripples.

You havent condition damage, only burn, and is a bad condition, dont stack on intensity, only in duration. only one, really easy to clean.

You need to sacrifice a lot of attack to gain health pool, if you are tanky you have no damage. The warrior has FAR better health pool and better base stats damage for his abilities, can be pretty tanky with great damage output.

A lot of healing, a lot of blinds, boons and condition removal are your best tools.

If you wanna support, go for guardian. For anything else go for warrior.

The warrior has a lot of hard CC, soft CC, GREAT mobility (you can engage, chase and disengage to out of combat like a boss), better damage, better range weapon, good condition damage, a lot of heal regeneration (A LOT) a LOT more base heal pool (11k guardian vs 18k warrior). better base damage. Warrior has support abilities too (banners, shouts) and you have a lot of block (by time, not by attack like guardian, you can block MORE attacks) you are almost immune to immobilize effects.

My main is a guardian, full exotic and ascended i enjoy it a LOT, i love my guardian but is pretty frustrating sometimes when you cant chase anyone or you are being kited when you are alone. I have a warrior lvl36, i only play wvw, i am leveling my warrior ONLY in wvw i feel it a lot more versatile.

I have a level 80 Warrior and 80 Guardian, and I have over 500 games with each in PvP.

They are both fun professions, but IMO the warrior can do much more offensively, whereas the Guardian can bunker/support a group much better.

Do you want to be a Team Player?
Guardian

Do you want to be a Tanky Roamer?
Warrior

just because Guardians “tank” and defend DO NOT THINK they are weak. my Guardian his hard betwee GS/1hs and focus. even hammer hits hard. do not be fooled at all, plus Guardian hits everything around him easily so he wipes mobs out

I just want to clarify – Warriors are just as much a team player as Guardians. They have shouts and banners and all sorts of fun stuff in that regard. The primary difference is that Warriors give offensive support in the form of Might, Fury, Swiftness, and statistical bonuses from their 150 Power trait and banners.

Guardians are the other side of that coin. They give defensive support in the form of boons like Protection, Aegis, Regeneration, a 150 Toughness trait, and have a few more sources of group healing than Warriors. But no Guardian ever gave his team Fury unless he was a Charr. And then, only in PvE/WvW.

Guardians are a fine class in PvE. They do things differently from Warriors, but they’re fine. They work. WvW is a different story, especially lately with high usage of conditions saturating even our above average condition cleansing ability. Guardians aren’t in the worst spot ever, but they are definitely hurting. It’s forcing some unpleasant build decisions and narrowing our selection of viable utilities and traits. It can be very frustrating to play, lately. But all that is just a patch away from swinging in the other direction.

At any point up until about last month I would have said roll a Guardian. Right now at this moment I’d say roll a Warrior, because in PvE damage is king and it’s easier (not better, just easier) to run. In WvW hard CC is incredible and Warriors have it in spades. Just understand that balance changes and Guardians might be in a better spot in time.

foofad.5162:

Guardians aren’t in the worst spot ever, but they are definitely hurting. It’s forcing some unpleasant build decisions and narrowing our selection of viable utilities and traits. It can be very frustrating to play, lately.

But all that is just a patch away from swinging in the other direction.

Couldn’t have said it any better.

I know what will builds Variety.

Put Healing Power in the Valor Tree.
Put Boon Duration in the Honor Tree.
Put Critical Damage in the Virtues Tree.

Now your not stuck in 0/0/30/0/0 because you don’t have all your damage/defenses in one nice little tree.

foofad.5162:

Guardians aren’t in the worst spot ever, but they are definitely hurting.

I reckon we are probably in the bottom 3 classes if not the worst class atm. We used to be in the Top 3. The new changes that lead to massive conditions are a direct counter to us in PVP.

Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight. Mesmers and Eles seem to be better too. There was a time I could front any of these classes 1v1 and kill them, player skill being the determinant.

I still play mine as I like the weapon skills and the look. But I admit its not very powerful. I feel have to work insanely hard to do reasonably. The gear never seems to match what I want to do or give me enough health. In SPVP I log in and do the daily and log out. It stopped being fun a while ago.

To the OP: Read the other thread. Roll a warrior. The class balance dev plays one and that is why it is so strong. There is nothing else to consider.

Relentliss.2170:

foofad.5162:

Guardians aren’t in the worst spot ever, but they are definitely hurting.

I reckon we are probably in the bottom 3 classes if not the worst class atm. We used to be in the Top 3. The new changes that lead to massive conditions are a direct counter to us in PVP.

Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight. Mesmers and Eles seem to be better too. There was a time I could front any of these classes 1v1 and kill them, player skill being the determinant.

I still play mine as I like the weapon skills and the look. But I admit its not very powerful. I feel have to work insanely hard to do reasonably. The gear never seems to match what I want to do or give me enough health. In SPVP I log in and do the daily and log out. It stopped being fun a while ago.

To the OP: Read the other thread. Roll a warrior. The class balance dev plays one and that is why it is so strong. There is nothing else to consider.

Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight.
Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight.
Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight.
Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight.

Heals you and nearby allies.
Buffs you and nearby allies.
Burns enemy and nearby foes.

Guardian is a SUPPORT class, it is NOT meant for 1v1. The game is not balanced around 1v1, stop trying to balance the game around 1v1.

Guardians are one of the best classes in the game, they always have a spot due to powerful team support and bunker-ing skills.

Daecollo.9578:

I know what will builds Variety.

Put Healing Power in the Valor Tree.
Put Boon Duration in the Honor Tree.
Put Critical Damage in the Virtues Tree.

Now your not stuck in 0/0/30/0/0 because you don’t have all your damage/defenses in one nice little tree.

And we would have even less useful builds. GJ

Daecollo.9578:

Relentliss.2170:

foofad.5162:

Guardians aren’t in the worst spot ever, but they are definitely hurting.

I reckon we are probably in the bottom 3 classes if not the worst class atm. We used to be in the Top 3. The new changes that lead to massive conditions are a direct counter to us in PVP.

Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight. Mesmers and Eles seem to be better too. There was a time I could front any of these classes 1v1 and kill them, player skill being the determinant.

I still play mine as I like the weapon skills and the look. But I admit its not very powerful. I feel have to work insanely hard to do reasonably. The gear never seems to match what I want to do or give me enough health. In SPVP I log in and do the daily and log out. It stopped being fun a while ago.

To the OP: Read the other thread. Roll a warrior. The class balance dev plays one and that is why it is so strong. There is nothing else to consider.

Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight.
Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight.
Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight.
Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight.

Heals you and nearby allies.
Buffs you and nearby allies.
Burns enemy and nearby foes.

Guardian is a SUPPORT class, it is NOT meant for 1v1. The game is not balanced around 1v1, stop trying to balance the game around 1v1.

Support what? My buffs last like 5 seconds. 5 sec of support, 30 sec of Cd… I can hear the conversation now, “Boy am I glad the guardian was there to support me with a tiny 5 second buff that a simple condition already puts on me. I am really glad he is on my team.”

In pvp I encounter 1v1 fights all the time. The maps are designed around it. I think I should have a chance vs these classes. I used to be able to beat them before they got buffed. I used to be able to beat thieves too but I had to change my build to fight off conditions and now I can’t. The last balance patch really made this the worst class in the game.

Sure you can be the best at dishing out might. Whippy do.

Relentliss.2170:

Daecollo.9578:

Relentliss.2170:

foofad.5162:

Guardians aren’t in the worst spot ever, but they are definitely hurting.

I reckon we are probably in the bottom 3 classes if not the worst class atm. We used to be in the Top 3. The new changes that lead to massive conditions are a direct counter to us in PVP.

Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight. Mesmers and Eles seem to be better too. There was a time I could front any of these classes 1v1 and kill them, player skill being the determinant.

I still play mine as I like the weapon skills and the look. But I admit its not very powerful. I feel have to work insanely hard to do reasonably. The gear never seems to match what I want to do or give me enough health. In SPVP I log in and do the daily and log out. It stopped being fun a while ago.

To the OP: Read the other thread. Roll a warrior. The class balance dev plays one and that is why it is so strong. There is nothing else to consider.

Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight.
Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight.
Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight.
Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight.

Heals you and nearby allies.
Buffs you and nearby allies.
Burns enemy and nearby foes.

Guardian is a SUPPORT class, it is NOT meant for 1v1. The game is not balanced around 1v1, stop trying to balance the game around 1v1.

Support what? My buffs last like 5 seconds. 5 sec of support, 30 sec of Cd… I can hear the conversation now, “Boy am I glad the guardian was there to support me with a tiny 5 second buff that a simple condition already puts on me. I am really glad he is on my team.”

In pvp I encounter 1v1 fights all the time. The maps are designed around it. I think I should have a chance vs these classes. I used to be able to beat them before they got buffed. I used to be able to beat thieves too but I had to change my build to fight off conditions and now I can’t. The last patch really made this the worst class in the game.

Sure you can be the best at dishing out might. Whippy do.

Oh boy… I can list several ways you can help your team. However I am not here to teach you how to play, just to tell you you are wrong.

Please just stop whilst your ahead.

Daecollo.9578:

Relentliss.2170:

Daecollo.9578:

Relentliss.2170:

foofad.5162:

Guardians aren’t in the worst spot ever, but they are definitely hurting.

I reckon we are probably in the bottom 3 classes if not the worst class atm. We used to be in the Top 3. The new changes that lead to massive conditions are a direct counter to us in PVP.

Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight. Mesmers and Eles seem to be better too. There was a time I could front any of these classes 1v1 and kill them, player skill being the determinant.

I still play mine as I like the weapon skills and the look. But I admit its not very powerful. I feel have to work insanely hard to do reasonably. The gear never seems to match what I want to do or give me enough health. In SPVP I log in and do the daily and log out. It stopped being fun a while ago.

To the OP: Read the other thread. Roll a warrior. The class balance dev plays one and that is why it is so strong. There is nothing else to consider.

Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight.
Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight.
Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight.
Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight.

Heals you and nearby allies.
Buffs you and nearby allies.
Burns enemy and nearby foes.

Guardian is a SUPPORT class, it is NOT meant for 1v1. The game is not balanced around 1v1, stop trying to balance the game around 1v1.

Support what? My buffs last like 5 seconds. 5 sec of support, 30 sec of Cd… I can hear the conversation now, “Boy am I glad the guardian was there to support me with a tiny 5 second buff that a simple condition already puts on me. I am really glad he is on my team.”

In pvp I encounter 1v1 fights all the time. The maps are designed around it. I think I should have a chance vs these classes. I used to be able to beat them before they got buffed. I used to be able to beat thieves too but I had to change my build to fight off conditions and now I can’t. The last patch really made this the worst class in the game.

Sure you can be the best at dishing out might. Whippy do.

Oh boy… I can list several ways you can help your team. However I am not here to teach you how to play, just to tell you you are wrong.

Please just stop whilst your ahead.

I would also argue that we used to be good at 1v1 encounters and now are not. The class needs to be examined. If the OP wants to have fun in this game he would be much much better with a warrior.

Relentliss.2170:

Daecollo.9578:

Relentliss.2170:

Daecollo.9578:

Relentliss.2170:

foofad.5162:

Guardians aren’t in the worst spot ever, but they are definitely hurting.

I reckon we are probably in the bottom 3 classes if not the worst class atm. We used to be in the Top 3. The new changes that lead to massive conditions are a direct counter to us in PVP.

Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight. Mesmers and Eles seem to be better too. There was a time I could front any of these classes 1v1 and kill them, player skill being the determinant.

I still play mine as I like the weapon skills and the look. But I admit its not very powerful. I feel have to work insanely hard to do reasonably. The gear never seems to match what I want to do or give me enough health. In SPVP I log in and do the daily and log out. It stopped being fun a while ago.

To the OP: Read the other thread. Roll a warrior. The class balance dev plays one and that is why it is so strong. There is nothing else to consider.

Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight.
Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight.
Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight.
Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight.

Heals you and nearby allies.
Buffs you and nearby allies.
Burns enemy and nearby foes.

Guardian is a SUPPORT class, it is NOT meant for 1v1. The game is not balanced around 1v1, stop trying to balance the game around 1v1.

Support what? My buffs last like 5 seconds. 5 sec of support, 30 sec of Cd… I can hear the conversation now, “Boy am I glad the guardian was there to support me with a tiny 5 second buff that a simple condition already puts on me. I am really glad he is on my team.”

In pvp I encounter 1v1 fights all the time. The maps are designed around it. I think I should have a chance vs these classes. I used to be able to beat them before they got buffed. I used to be able to beat thieves too but I had to change my build to fight off conditions and now I can’t. The last patch really made this the worst class in the game.

Sure you can be the best at dishing out might. Whippy do.

Oh boy… I can list several ways you can help your team. However I am not here to teach you how to play, just to tell you you are wrong.

Please just stop whilst your ahead.

I would also argue that we used to be good at 1v1 encounters and now are not. The class needs to be examined. If the OP wants to have fun in this game he would be much much better with a warrior.

Lets see.

Combo Field: Light, Cures conditions for you and allies when they use their skills, some can spam like Whirling Wrath to constantly cure conditions.

Chains you can pull many foes to you to help your team secure a location and aoe a spot.

AOE Retaliation and Stability to Protect your allies against CC.

Dodge to heal all allies.

Fields to prevent enemies from walking up them stalling there team.

LEARN TO PLAY

Daecollo.9578:

Relentliss.2170:

Daecollo.9578:

Relentliss.2170:

Daecollo.9578:

Relentliss.2170:

foofad.5162:

Guardians aren’t in the worst spot ever, but they are definitely hurting.

I reckon we are probably in the bottom 3 classes if not the worst class atm. We used to be in the Top 3. The new changes that lead to massive conditions are a direct counter to us in PVP.

Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight. Mesmers and Eles seem to be better too. There was a time I could front any of these classes 1v1 and kill them, player skill being the determinant.

I still play mine as I like the weapon skills and the look. But I admit its not very powerful. I feel have to work insanely hard to do reasonably. The gear never seems to match what I want to do or give me enough health. In SPVP I log in and do the daily and log out. It stopped being fun a while ago.

To the OP: Read the other thread. Roll a warrior. The class balance dev plays one and that is why it is so strong. There is nothing else to consider.

Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight.
Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight.
Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight.
Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight.

Heals you and nearby allies.
Buffs you and nearby allies.
Burns enemy and nearby foes.

Guardian is a SUPPORT class, it is NOT meant for 1v1. The game is not balanced around 1v1, stop trying to balance the game around 1v1.

Support what? My buffs last like 5 seconds. 5 sec of support, 30 sec of Cd… I can hear the conversation now, “Boy am I glad the guardian was there to support me with a tiny 5 second buff that a simple condition already puts on me. I am really glad he is on my team.”

In pvp I encounter 1v1 fights all the time. The maps are designed around it. I think I should have a chance vs these classes. I used to be able to beat them before they got buffed. I used to be able to beat thieves too but I had to change my build to fight off conditions and now I can’t. The last patch really made this the worst class in the game.

Sure you can be the best at dishing out might. Whippy do.

Oh boy… I can list several ways you can help your team. However I am not here to teach you how to play, just to tell you you are wrong.

Please just stop whilst your ahead.

I would also argue that we used to be good at 1v1 encounters and now are not. The class needs to be examined. If the OP wants to have fun in this game he would be much much better with a warrior.

Lets see.

Combo Field: Light, Cures conditions for you and allies when they use their skills, some can spam like Whirling Wrath to constantly cure conditions.

Chains you can pull many foes to you to help your team secure a location and aoe a spot.

AOE Retaliation and Stability to Protect your allies against CC.

Dodge to heal all allies.

Fields to prevent enemies from walking up them stalling there team.

LEARN TO PLAY

/facepalm For one Light Field plus Whirling Wrath only cures conditions on your allies, and spamming Whirling Wrath…you can’t spam the combo again since you’d need to wait for a CD on Symbol of Wrath to cleanse again. But the point stands it only removes conditions from your allies. It would be nice though if whirl finisher got changed to that, might help with the very frequent condibombs but at the same time would be OP.

Binding Blade needs to hit things (good damage) in order to pull, and the pull itself can be lessened significantly by dodging forward, or completely nulling it using stability.

Stand Your Ground, correct offer group support by giving up to 5 people stability and retaliation you’re right about that.

Dodge healing is very on the meh side of things unless you run a good amount of healing power, which yet again means we sacrifice some damage/other stat placement some damage.

And I’m going to assume Wardings and/or consecrations. Hammer has the utility but a pretty mediocre cooldown. Staff is more so a support weapon and most people with a brain walk around it if it isn’t setup in narrow spots, or happen to pop stability. Consecrations’s Sanctuary long CD and really just meh.

Please don’t bring the L2P stuff in here.

Daecollo.9578:

Relentliss.2170:

Daecollo.9578:

Relentliss.2170:

Daecollo.9578:

Relentliss.2170:

foofad.5162:

Guardians aren’t in the worst spot ever, but they are definitely hurting.

I reckon we are probably in the bottom 3 classes if not the worst class atm. We used to be in the Top 3. The new changes that lead to massive conditions are a direct counter to us in PVP.

Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight. Mesmers and Eles seem to be better too. There was a time I could front any of these classes 1v1 and kill them, player skill being the determinant.

I still play mine as I like the weapon skills and the look. But I admit its not very powerful. I feel have to work insanely hard to do reasonably. The gear never seems to match what I want to do or give me enough health. In SPVP I log in and do the daily and log out. It stopped being fun a while ago.

To the OP: Read the other thread. Roll a warrior. The class balance dev plays one and that is why it is so strong. There is nothing else to consider.

Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight.
Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight.
Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight.
Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight.

Heals you and nearby allies.
Buffs you and nearby allies.
Burns enemy and nearby foes.

Guardian is a SUPPORT class, it is NOT meant for 1v1. The game is not balanced around 1v1, stop trying to balance the game around 1v1.

Support what? My buffs last like 5 seconds. 5 sec of support, 30 sec of Cd… I can hear the conversation now, “Boy am I glad the guardian was there to support me with a tiny 5 second buff that a simple condition already puts on me. I am really glad he is on my team.”

In pvp I encounter 1v1 fights all the time. The maps are designed around it. I think I should have a chance vs these classes. I used to be able to beat them before they got buffed. I used to be able to beat thieves too but I had to change my build to fight off conditions and now I can’t. The last patch really made this the worst class in the game.

Sure you can be the best at dishing out might. Whippy do.

Oh boy… I can list several ways you can help your team. However I am not here to teach you how to play, just to tell you you are wrong.

Please just stop whilst your ahead.

I would also argue that we used to be good at 1v1 encounters and now are not. The class needs to be examined. If the OP wants to have fun in this game he would be much much better with a warrior.

Lets see.

Combo Field: Light, Cures conditions for you and allies when they use their skills, some can spam like Whirling Wrath to constantly cure conditions.

Chains you can pull many foes to you to help your team secure a location and aoe a spot.

AOE Retaliation and Stability to Protect your allies against CC.

Dodge to heal all allies.

Fields to prevent enemies from walking up them stalling there team.

LEARN TO PLAY

You can’t do any of those things when the 4k/s of conditions strip off your 15k health. Guess those 5 seconds of dodge rolling glory were worth it.

i’ve said this elsewhere, i feel before fixing the Guardian so we can “fit in” the new meta, the new meta itself just has to be looked at and further polished – which will be a continuous process for the life of the game. or maybe that’s not how these games / things work. i don’t know.

what i AM trying to say is, i don’t think it’s the class’ problem currently. at least not in this case. sure it’s gonna be tough when you’re a Guard up against a group of condi bunkers. now tell me what build/what class in that situation would be able to hold off 4 condi bunkers [added: easily? or come out on top?]

going back to 1v1’s for the sake of argument, sure it might be a lot tougher to play against some of these other classes as a Guardian. but is it impossible? not even close. least in the matches and fights i’ve had.

but if one’s just to have a class that is faceroll easy, then sure go with the FotM. is that how people use that term?

i guess i enjoy the Guardian class too much. i want us to be better, but i honestly, honestly don’t feel we’re in that bad of a place right now.

[edit: typo and added a little bit]

Relentliss.2170:

Daecollo.9578:

Relentliss.2170:

Daecollo.9578:

Relentliss.2170:

Daecollo.9578:

Relentliss.2170:

foofad.5162:

Guardians aren’t in the worst spot ever, but they are definitely hurting.

I reckon we are probably in the bottom 3 classes if not the worst class atm. We used to be in the Top 3. The new changes that lead to massive conditions are a direct counter to us in PVP.

Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight. Mesmers and Eles seem to be better too. There was a time I could front any of these classes 1v1 and kill them, player skill being the determinant.

I still play mine as I like the weapon skills and the look. But I admit its not very powerful. I feel have to work insanely hard to do reasonably. The gear never seems to match what I want to do or give me enough health. In SPVP I log in and do the daily and log out. It stopped being fun a while ago.

To the OP: Read the other thread. Roll a warrior. The class balance dev plays one and that is why it is so strong. There is nothing else to consider.

Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight.
Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight.
Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight.
Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight.

Heals you and nearby allies.
Buffs you and nearby allies.
Burns enemy and nearby foes.

Guardian is a SUPPORT class, it is NOT meant for 1v1. The game is not balanced around 1v1, stop trying to balance the game around 1v1.

Support what? My buffs last like 5 seconds. 5 sec of support, 30 sec of Cd… I can hear the conversation now, “Boy am I glad the guardian was there to support me with a tiny 5 second buff that a simple condition already puts on me. I am really glad he is on my team.”

In pvp I encounter 1v1 fights all the time. The maps are designed around it. I think I should have a chance vs these classes. I used to be able to beat them before they got buffed. I used to be able to beat thieves too but I had to change my build to fight off conditions and now I can’t. The last patch really made this the worst class in the game.

Sure you can be the best at dishing out might. Whippy do.

Oh boy… I can list several ways you can help your team. However I am not here to teach you how to play, just to tell you you are wrong.

Please just stop whilst your ahead.

I would also argue that we used to be good at 1v1 encounters and now are not. The class needs to be examined. If the OP wants to have fun in this game he would be much much better with a warrior.

Lets see.

Combo Field: Light, Cures conditions for you and allies when they use their skills, some can spam like Whirling Wrath to constantly cure conditions.

Chains you can pull many foes to you to help your team secure a location and aoe a spot.

AOE Retaliation and Stability to Protect your allies against CC.

Dodge to heal all allies.

Fields to prevent enemies from walking up them stalling there team.

LEARN TO PLAY

You can’t do any of those things when the 4k/s of conditions strip off your 15k health. Guess those 5 seconds of dodge rolling glory were worth it.

http://www.guildhead.com/skill-calc#mcc9omRhgmmRhgmVxaVG9MbV0s
There, now you have lots of condition removal!

*The tools to remove conditions are there… *

This seems to have gotten in another direction, but I suppose the main thing I was looking for is openworld PVE- can Guardians take down veterans easily? what weapons should I use for that- hammer, I assume, and…? Dunno.

Daecollo.9578:

Relentliss.2170:

Daecollo.9578:

Relentliss.2170:

Daecollo.9578:

Relentliss.2170:

Daecollo.9578:

Relentliss.2170:

foofad.5162:

Guardians aren’t in the worst spot ever, but they are definitely hurting.

I reckon we are probably in the bottom 3 classes if not the worst class atm. We used to be in the Top 3. The new changes that lead to massive conditions are a direct counter to us in PVP.

Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight. Mesmers and Eles seem to be better too. There was a time I could front any of these classes 1v1 and kill them, player skill being the determinant.

I still play mine as I like the weapon skills and the look. But I admit its not very powerful. I feel have to work insanely hard to do reasonably. The gear never seems to match what I want to do or give me enough health. In SPVP I log in and do the daily and log out. It stopped being fun a while ago.

To the OP: Read the other thread. Roll a warrior. The class balance dev plays one and that is why it is so strong. There is nothing else to consider.

Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight.
Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight.
Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight.
Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight.

Heals you and nearby allies.
Buffs you and nearby allies.
Burns enemy and nearby foes.

Guardian is a SUPPORT class, it is NOT meant for 1v1. The game is not balanced around 1v1, stop trying to balance the game around 1v1.

Support what? My buffs last like 5 seconds. 5 sec of support, 30 sec of Cd… I can hear the conversation now, “Boy am I glad the guardian was there to support me with a tiny 5 second buff that a simple condition already puts on me. I am really glad he is on my team.”

In pvp I encounter 1v1 fights all the time. The maps are designed around it. I think I should have a chance vs these classes. I used to be able to beat them before they got buffed. I used to be able to beat thieves too but I had to change my build to fight off conditions and now I can’t. The last patch really made this the worst class in the game.

Sure you can be the best at dishing out might. Whippy do.

Oh boy… I can list several ways you can help your team. However I am not here to teach you how to play, just to tell you you are wrong.

Please just stop whilst your ahead.

I would also argue that we used to be good at 1v1 encounters and now are not. The class needs to be examined. If the OP wants to have fun in this game he would be much much better with a warrior.

Lets see.

Combo Field: Light, Cures conditions for you and allies when they use their skills, some can spam like Whirling Wrath to constantly cure conditions.

Chains you can pull many foes to you to help your team secure a location and aoe a spot.

AOE Retaliation and Stability to Protect your allies against CC.

Dodge to heal all allies.

Fields to prevent enemies from walking up them stalling there team.

LEARN TO PLAY

You can’t do any of those things when the 4k/s of conditions strip off your 15k health. Guess those 5 seconds of dodge rolling glory were worth it.

http://www.guildhead.com/skill-calc#mcc9omRhgmmRhgmVxaVG9MbV0s
There, now you have lots of condition removal!

*The tools to remove conditions are there… *

Mate I am running with maximum condition removal and you can’t keep them off. Strings of 7 or 8 conditions get put on you in seconds, you wipe them, they get put back on.

I really think it is an issue with the Meta of the game atm that conditions apply and get reapplied with ease.

It’s sad the only way I can play my Guardian is to run behind a more powerful class and ‘support’ them. It’s really quite sad.

Daecollo.9578:

Relentliss.2170:

Daecollo.9578:

Relentliss.2170:

Daecollo.9578:

Relentliss.2170:

Daecollo.9578:

Relentliss.2170:

foofad.5162:

Guardians aren’t in the worst spot ever, but they are definitely hurting.

I reckon we are probably in the bottom 3 classes if not the worst class atm. We used to be in the Top 3. The new changes that lead to massive conditions are a direct counter to us in PVP.

Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight. Mesmers and Eles seem to be better too. There was a time I could front any of these classes 1v1 and kill them, player skill being the determinant.

I still play mine as I like the weapon skills and the look. But I admit its not very powerful. I feel have to work insanely hard to do reasonably. The gear never seems to match what I want to do or give me enough health. In SPVP I log in and do the daily and log out. It stopped being fun a while ago.

To the OP: Read the other thread. Roll a warrior. The class balance dev plays one and that is why it is so strong. There is nothing else to consider.

Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight.
Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight.
Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight.
Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight.

Heals you and nearby allies.
Buffs you and nearby allies.
Burns enemy and nearby foes.

Guardian is a SUPPORT class, it is NOT meant for 1v1. The game is not balanced around 1v1, stop trying to balance the game around 1v1.

Support what? My buffs last like 5 seconds. 5 sec of support, 30 sec of Cd… I can hear the conversation now, “Boy am I glad the guardian was there to support me with a tiny 5 second buff that a simple condition already puts on me. I am really glad he is on my team.”

In pvp I encounter 1v1 fights all the time. The maps are designed around it. I think I should have a chance vs these classes. I used to be able to beat them before they got buffed. I used to be able to beat thieves too but I had to change my build to fight off conditions and now I can’t. The last patch really made this the worst class in the game.

Sure you can be the best at dishing out might. Whippy do.

Oh boy… I can list several ways you can help your team. However I am not here to teach you how to play, just to tell you you are wrong.

Please just stop whilst your ahead.

I would also argue that we used to be good at 1v1 encounters and now are not. The class needs to be examined. If the OP wants to have fun in this game he would be much much better with a warrior.

Lets see.

Combo Field: Light, Cures conditions for you and allies when they use their skills, some can spam like Whirling Wrath to constantly cure conditions.

Chains you can pull many foes to you to help your team secure a location and aoe a spot.

AOE Retaliation and Stability to Protect your allies against CC.

Dodge to heal all allies.

Fields to prevent enemies from walking up them stalling there team.

LEARN TO PLAY

You can’t do any of those things when the 4k/s of conditions strip off your 15k health. Guess those 5 seconds of dodge rolling glory were worth it.

http://www.guildhead.com/skill-calc#mcc9omRhgmmRhgmVxaVG9MbV0s
There, now you have lots of condition removal!

*The tools to remove conditions are there… *

[off-topic]
Isnt that build kinda far from having lots of condition removal???

Removing 3 condis per shout + 2 each ten seconds, even if could remove that, after “waste” your shouts, that is 6 condtitions removed and 3 trnaformed to boons only with shouts for sure you would have loads of conditions back in 2 or 3 seconds.
I really dont know what WvW people do, unless they play only based to melee damage, wich IMO was the old gameplay of lower tiers, to beat the odds player start to play necro swarms wich showed to be pretty efective due the number of conditions vs conditions removals, canceling stability symbols and boons, massive fear and craploads of wells, this also works on small scale expecially if you have 1 or 2 good thief.

Mundo.6481:

This seems to have gotten in another direction, but I suppose the main thing I was looking for is openworld PVE- can Guardians take down veterans easily? what weapons should I use for that- hammer, I assume, and…? Dunno.

You can build to handle at least 4 orr veterans on your own and you can kill open world champions on your own, it just takes some time.

Dont worry, in open world you pull as many as you can and combine hammer and gs for max aoe dps.

25/25/x/10/5 (5 points to spare or 25/25/0/20/0)) is a nice build for open world pve with gs and hammer. Btw boon duration runes for might and movement.

Relentliss.2170:

Daecollo.9578:

Relentliss.2170:

foofad.5162:

Guardians aren’t in the worst spot ever, but they are definitely hurting.

I reckon we are probably in the bottom 3 classes if not the worst class atm. We used to be in the Top 3. The new changes that lead to massive conditions are a direct counter to us in PVP.

Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight. Mesmers and Eles seem to be better too. There was a time I could front any of these classes 1v1 and kill them, player skill being the determinant.

I still play mine as I like the weapon skills and the look. But I admit its not very powerful. I feel have to work insanely hard to do reasonably. The gear never seems to match what I want to do or give me enough health. In SPVP I log in and do the daily and log out. It stopped being fun a while ago.

To the OP: Read the other thread. Roll a warrior. The class balance dev plays one and that is why it is so strong. There is nothing else to consider.

Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight.
Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight.
Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight.
Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight.

Heals you and nearby allies.
Buffs you and nearby allies.
Burns enemy and nearby foes.

Guardian is a SUPPORT class, it is NOT meant for 1v1. The game is not balanced around 1v1, stop trying to balance the game around 1v1.

Support what? My buffs last like 5 seconds. 5 sec of support, 30 sec of Cd… I can hear the conversation now, “Boy am I glad the guardian was there to support me with a tiny 5 second buff that a simple condition already puts on me. I am really glad he is on my team.”

In pvp I encounter 1v1 fights all the time. The maps are designed around it. I think I should have a chance vs these classes. I used to be able to beat them before they got buffed. I used to be able to beat thieves too but I had to change my build to fight off conditions and now I can’t. The last balance patch really made this the worst class in the game.

Sure you can be the best at dishing out might. Whippy do.

5 seconds of group stability can be a game changer. You keep guardians in the front of any charge to get people through (and that stability stacks with other sources provided by other people). You can get a lot of boon duration too, I’m runnin about 95% right now, which is 1/3rd up time on stability for my 5 man. 1/3rd of the time we’re immune to knockdowns, pushes, pulls, dazes, stuns, what have you.

akamon.2769:

i’ve said this elsewhere, i feel before fixing the Guardian so we can “fit in” the new meta, the new meta itself just has to be looked at and further polished – which will be a continuous process for the life of the game. or maybe that’s not how these games / things work. i don’t know.

what i AM trying to say is, i don’t think it’s the class’ problem currently. at least not in this case. sure it’s gonna be tough when you’re a Guard up against a group of condi bunkers. now tell me what build/what class in that situation would be able to hold off 4 condi bunkers [added: easily? or come out on top?]

going back to 1v1’s for the sake of argument, sure it might be a lot tougher to play against some of these other classes as a Guardian. but is it impossible? not even close. least in the matches and fights i’ve had.

but if one’s just to have a class that is faceroll easy, then sure go with the FotM. is that how people use that term?

i guess i enjoy the Guardian class too much. i want us to be better, but i honestly, honestly don’t feel we’re in that bad of a place right now.

[edit: typo and added a little bit]

We will have problem in any meta unless you play as support. Without mobility/softCC or defense against immobilization as melee class we will have bad times in any meta unless they change the rules of wvw and you need to defend and hold tiny spots like spvp.

Someone said in this post “guardian is in great position because is the best support”

The problem is that, we are only support. Any other class can fit different roles and builds, we are totally limited. We are good at support (a lot of class is good at support too) but almost useless in other roles compared with other classes.

Jericho.4521:

You DON’T need 30 Zeal w/ 30 Radiance to do damage, in fact that’s a pretty poor option just fyi.

Bingo! The problem is, we get PvE pugs coming onto WvW and consistently thinking that their vaunted PvE builds will somehow miraculously work in a WvW environment. A poor option…and rude awakening indeed. But hey, I love those guys cause they drop like wilted paper near instantaneously – helps with my total number of WvW kills, you know. :P ;-)

Aeolus.3615:

Daecollo.9578:

Relentliss.2170:

Daecollo.9578:

Relentliss.2170:

Daecollo.9578:

Relentliss.2170:

Daecollo.9578:

Relentliss.2170:

foofad.5162:

Guardians aren’t in the worst spot ever, but they are definitely hurting.

I reckon we are probably in the bottom 3 classes if not the worst class atm. We used to be in the Top 3. The new changes that lead to massive conditions are a direct counter to us in PVP.

Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight. Mesmers and Eles seem to be better too. There was a time I could front any of these classes 1v1 and kill them, player skill being the determinant.

I still play mine as I like the weapon skills and the look. But I admit its not very powerful. I feel have to work insanely hard to do reasonably. The gear never seems to match what I want to do or give me enough health. In SPVP I log in and do the daily and log out. It stopped being fun a while ago.

To the OP: Read the other thread. Roll a warrior. The class balance dev plays one and that is why it is so strong. There is nothing else to consider.

Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight.
Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight.
Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight.
Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight.

Heals you and nearby allies.
Buffs you and nearby allies.
Burns enemy and nearby foes.

Guardian is a SUPPORT class, it is NOT meant for 1v1. The game is not balanced around 1v1, stop trying to balance the game around 1v1.

Support what? My buffs last like 5 seconds. 5 sec of support, 30 sec of Cd… I can hear the conversation now, “Boy am I glad the guardian was there to support me with a tiny 5 second buff that a simple condition already puts on me. I am really glad he is on my team.”

In pvp I encounter 1v1 fights all the time. The maps are designed around it. I think I should have a chance vs these classes. I used to be able to beat them before they got buffed. I used to be able to beat thieves too but I had to change my build to fight off conditions and now I can’t. The last patch really made this the worst class in the game.

Sure you can be the best at dishing out might. Whippy do.

Oh boy… I can list several ways you can help your team. However I am not here to teach you how to play, just to tell you you are wrong.

Please just stop whilst your ahead.

I would also argue that we used to be good at 1v1 encounters and now are not. The class needs to be examined. If the OP wants to have fun in this game he would be much much better with a warrior.

Lets see.

Combo Field: Light, Cures conditions for you and allies when they use their skills, some can spam like Whirling Wrath to constantly cure conditions.

Chains you can pull many foes to you to help your team secure a location and aoe a spot.

AOE Retaliation and Stability to Protect your allies against CC.

Dodge to heal all allies.

Fields to prevent enemies from walking up them stalling there team.

LEARN TO PLAY

You can’t do any of those things when the 4k/s of conditions strip off your 15k health. Guess those 5 seconds of dodge rolling glory were worth it.

http://www.guildhead.com/skill-calc#mcc9omRhgmmRhgmVxaVG9MbV0s
There, now you have lots of condition removal!

*The tools to remove conditions are there… *

[off-topic]
Isnt that build kinda far from having lots of condition removal???

Removing 3 condis per shout + 2 each ten seconds, even if could remove that, after “waste” your shouts, that is 6 condtitions removed and 3 trnaformed to boons only with shouts for sure you would have loads of conditions back in 2 or 3 seconds.
I really dont know what WvW people do, unless they play only based to melee damage, wich IMO was the old gameplay of lower tiers, to beat the odds player start to play necro swarms wich showed to be pretty efective due the number of conditions vs conditions removals, canceling stability symbols and boons, massive fear and craploads of wells, this also works on small scale expecially if you have 1 or 2 good thief.

I was exaggerating a little.

The truth is I have to spec so much for condition removals in my various pvp I don’t have any points left to really enhance my fun skills.

On the other hand, I can make a pretty tanky warrior and still have points left to throw into a couple damage skills or abilities that you really notice and have fun with.

Relentliss.2170:

Aeolus.3615:

Daecollo.9578:

Relentliss.2170:

Daecollo.9578:

Relentliss.2170:

Daecollo.9578:

Relentliss.2170:

Daecollo.9578:

Relentliss.2170:

foofad.5162:

Guardians aren’t in the worst spot ever, but they are definitely hurting.

I reckon we are probably in the bottom 3 classes if not the worst class atm. We used to be in the Top 3. The new changes that lead to massive conditions are a direct counter to us in PVP.

Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight. Mesmers and Eles seem to be better too. There was a time I could front any of these classes 1v1 and kill them, player skill being the determinant.

I still play mine as I like the weapon skills and the look. But I admit its not very powerful. I feel have to work insanely hard to do reasonably. The gear never seems to match what I want to do or give me enough health. In SPVP I log in and do the daily and log out. It stopped being fun a while ago.

To the OP: Read the other thread. Roll a warrior. The class balance dev plays one and that is why it is so strong. There is nothing else to consider.

Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight.
Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight.
Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight.
Necros, Warriors, Rangers, and Thieves are all much better than us in a 1v1 fight.

Heals you and nearby allies.
Buffs you and nearby allies.
Burns enemy and nearby foes.

Guardian is a SUPPORT class, it is NOT meant for 1v1. The game is not balanced around 1v1, stop trying to balance the game around 1v1.

Support what? My buffs last like 5 seconds. 5 sec of support, 30 sec of Cd… I can hear the conversation now, “Boy am I glad the guardian was there to support me with a tiny 5 second buff that a simple condition already puts on me. I am really glad he is on my team.”

In pvp I encounter 1v1 fights all the time. The maps are designed around it. I think I should have a chance vs these classes. I used to be able to beat them before they got buffed. I used to be able to beat thieves too but I had to change my build to fight off conditions and now I can’t. The last patch really made this the worst class in the game.

Sure you can be the best at dishing out might. Whippy do.

Oh boy… I can list several ways you can help your team. However I am not here to teach you how to play, just to tell you you are wrong.

Please just stop whilst your ahead.

I would also argue that we used to be good at 1v1 encounters and now are not. The class needs to be examined. If the OP wants to have fun in this game he would be much much better with a warrior.

Lets see.

Combo Field: Light, Cures conditions for you and allies when they use their skills, some can spam like Whirling Wrath to constantly cure conditions.

Chains you can pull many foes to you to help your team secure a location and aoe a spot.

AOE Retaliation and Stability to Protect your allies against CC.

Dodge to heal all allies.

Fields to prevent enemies from walking up them stalling there team.

LEARN TO PLAY

You can’t do any of those things when the 4k/s of conditions strip off your 15k health. Guess those 5 seconds of dodge rolling glory were worth it.

http://www.guildhead.com/skill-calc#mcc9omRhgmmRhgmVxaVG9MbV0s
There, now you have lots of condition removal!

*The tools to remove conditions are there… *

[off-topic]
Isnt that build kinda far from having lots of condition removal???

Removing 3 condis per shout + 2 each ten seconds, even if could remove that, after “waste” your shouts, that is 6 condtitions removed and 3 trnaformed to boons only with shouts for sure you would have loads of conditions back in 2 or 3 seconds.
I really dont know what WvW people do, unless they play only based to melee damage, wich IMO was the old gameplay of lower tiers, to beat the odds player start to play necro swarms wich showed to be pretty efective due the number of conditions vs conditions removals, canceling stability symbols and boons, massive fear and craploads of wells, this also works on small scale expecially if you have 1 or 2 good thief.

I was exaggerating a little.

The truth is I have to spec so much for condition removals in my various pvp I don’t have any points left to really enhance my fun skills.

On the other hand, I can make a pretty tanky warrior and still have points left to throw into a couple damage skills or abilities that you really notice and have fun with.

Let me see the spec.

Aeolus.3615:

[off-topic]
Isnt that build kinda far from having lots of condition removal???

DaneccoLOL has forgotten his on the Guardian forum and put together a 5 signet Warrior build for us…

Daecollo.9578:

Combo Field: Light, Cures conditions for you and allies when they use their skills, some can spam like Whirling Wrath to constantly cure conditions.

Honey, do you fact check at all before you post? Or do you just say the first thing that comes to mind regardless? This is the second time I’m correcting you for stating something that is completely, blatantly wrong.

Light fields only cure conditions on Whirl and Projectile finishers. When a Whirl goes off, one projectile is launched in a random direction per second of the Whirl. Not only does the projectile have to, you know, fire in the direction of an ally for them to receive any benefit at all, but the projectile has to hit them and not collide with something on the way. You do not cleanse any conditions on yourself when you Whirl a light field. Only people who happen to be hit by the projectile receive any benefit from it. In the case of Whirling Wrath, it fires two projectiles, so you have two chance of getting completely lucky and hitting someone that actually needs a cleanse.

Projectile finishers work the same way – you have to be in the path of the projectile and have it pass through you on its way to an enemy in order to receive a cleanse, and that’s another one that does absolutely nothing for you if you’re the one firing it.

Please don’t scream for people to learn to play when you don’t even do the most basic of verification of the correctness of your own ranting.

Do you want to support your group with buffs(retal, stability, prot) and heals? If so Guardian, anything else, warrior, no contest.

Daecollo.9578:

Let me see the spec.

I would think running meditations 0/30/30/5/5 – 3 meditations as skills, inscribed signets and purity would be enough condition removal. But its not.

Or even a shout build various iterations of 0/?/30/30/? – pure voice, soldiers runes… either. But its not.

Truth is as soon as the conditions are stripped they are put back on. So after 10 seconds all your abilities are spent and conditions are still working their magic. I tested last night duelling a Necro and he could replace them in 4 or 5 sec pretty easily.

This isn’t a problem on my warrior. Nearly 30k health and the healing signet I can just ignore 3 or 4 depending on the type but with a guardian and 15-18k health its a big issue. I have 6 CC and do more damage on my warrior. Plus I can move at +25% all the time without any special gear or lame staff.

I don’t know what the answer is. Conditions were always guardian’s weakness and now 70% of the people you fight use them. Why? Good damage and you can run a pretty tanky spec across most other classes. I don’t think conditions will be nerfed any time soon. They have already given the candy to the kids, they can’t take it back yet. So the only answer is to review our class and make some adjustments.

So to answer the OP, roll a Warrior.

Guardian really needs some attention regarding hp and avoidance of dmg in general in this spamfest condi meta. We are always in the middle of everyones target area and now that ppl can just rangedump condis at this rate and kite us to death we cant retaliate in any way really. Other classes have amazing mechanics to avoid focus (stealth, clones and so on) we dont really. All our movement is towards the target in your face HEY LOOK AT ME type.

SO why warrior as a choice over guardian? Well warriors got a what 7500 hp buffer to take many stacks and ignore them. Also 8 sec imune to condi spam, numerous blocks of dmg, enormous amount of retaliating through hard and soft cc (hammer, shield mace). Warrior can afford leaving the point for a sec or two to put some serious hurt and cc on the enemy. The longbow is just an amazing condi weapon. Traited longbow is just devastating. Warriors passive regen is always on while Guardians is not so passive (only f2 if u dont touch it and even then its 4 times less than warriors or more) since u have to dodge for it, have allies around for it, meditations wont cut it (2000 hp heal on a 16 sec cd is what 125 per sec and can be interupted) its allot more active regen and its hard to achieve when u get condidumped and ccd all over the place. So sustain and dmg wise warrior is imho in a much better place than guardian now.

Yesterday I wanted to see how long it takes to burn me down while playin guardian if i only care about condis in spvp so i played a 0 30 5 30 0 build. Signet mastery so signet cures 2 every 10 sec and shouts cure condi since its bugged and shouts remove 2. Also 5 in valor for 10 sec condi cure. FOr trinket i went with highest HP knights and coupled with 30 honor, soldier rune this gave me a whoopin 25k hp. So i can u kno chew the conditions. Armor was at 2400 so i was really sqwishy to burst dmg. My attack dmg was bad to solid depending what i hit.
This build cures:
3 condi every 10 sec automaticly
3 condis removed 1 to boon shout Syg every 24 sec
3 condis removed 1 to boon shout Htl every 28 sec
full removal/all to boon every 60 sec
1 condi removed from sigil (60% on crit chance) probably every 10ish sec

Was doin ok in 1v1s really the high hp helpin and with a high uptime on protection i didnt mind the low armor.

And then i went mid skyhammer with another guardian by me. Dunno what he ran for build but he looked higher rank than me so prolly hella more experienced too.

Suddenly skyhammer goes to enemy and he starts rainin on us and then boom 2 necros get on us too and start spammin aoe on point. We got hit once by skyhammer and rest i dodged and avoided the big red circle. Kept trying to keep up with condi spam and cap the point but we got eventualy destroyed down once most of the stuff was on cd. We both died same time even.
So i open up the dmg log. Bleeds 20k+ dmg in 20ish seconds…….skyhammer 5k in 20sec -.-. The condi spam outdamaged a real freakin cannon and got me killed eventualy -.-
I had all the arsenal to try and handle the condi dumps and yet it didnt help me live long enough. It also made my dmg too low to be a threat so no scarefactor. Also i felt really bad for every enemy guardian i killed yesterday lol.

So yah pick warrior at the moment.