Guild Wars 2

I dont even know where to begin with addressing everything thats wrong with guardians…

They are so badly designed. This whole trapper thing is so ridiculous. “Dragon Hunter”, what is the dragon supposed to land on the traps? Or is he supposed to pull a dragon with the rope into the traps? He can pull a dragon?! Why is the “all mighty knight” class a woss class that just hides behind traps like a sissy?

And the gameplay? What do they do? stand and Auto until you walk into their traps.

And their traps deal way to much dmg in pvp! I’ve tanked up my build this season just because Guardians and Thiefs are so ridiculous. But still guards can just delete me. They delete all my friends too. No matter what classes or builds we play. just step on a trap and you loose 80 % of your HP. Just a pixel splash on the screen…

I have just zero respect for the game developers at this point. So weak and weird decisions being made…

Wont spend much more time with GW if this is going to keep up. None of my friends either. This is just something of the worst we ever seen in a game..
Everyone of you who argue differently that this is fine somehow should really try to think and actually look at a Guardian while the abomination is playing.

Rework Guardians!!

Invulnerabilyty, teleports, 0 damage utilities,Damage Inversion, stability,stunbreaks blinds, evades, projectile destruction, Projectile reflection, Movement skills, out LOS, kiting, ranged dps(with the right build), team focus and last and not least. Actual kittening dodging the godkitten kittening traps for kittens sake jesus kittening christ!!!!

Okej cool kids.

FYI prob way better then you at dodging. That is however not the topic. Just you kids acting up with assumptions. Leave that off the table please.

Guardians are, IMO completly wrong designed and stupid. I guess you two both play guardians, you quite fit the profile. Compared to what they do they hurt way to much, they have way to much block, stability, invulnerability and condi cleanse. They dont really do much for the output that they have. Just a class for stoners that are too high to press buttons.

Again, rework it!

Swink.5172:

Okej cool kids.

FYI prob way better then you at dodging. That is however not the topic. Just you kids acting up with assumptions. Leave that off the table please.

Guardians are, IMO completly wrong designed and stupid. I guess you two both play guardians, you quite fit the profile. Compared to what they do they hurt way to much, they have way to much block, stability, invulnerability and condi cleanse. They dont really do much for the output that they have. Just a class for stoners that are too high to press buttons.

Again, rework it!

You probably haven’t touched a guardian before the patch that gave base guard QoL changes. I can’t really trust your opinion or agree with it because your post just says too much of X and everything about Guardian is OP, worse designed class ever. And you don’t offer anything other than the words rework, or how to rework leaving your post pointless, nor are you bringing up any other awfully designed classes? I’m starting to think some people are fortifying their salt levels.

Don’t even try to defend your stupid class lol, yeah you have all your traps on the point so we can easily dodge them, but guess what ! your traps are ready to be used again so after we dodge first lock bam goes second lot, so i dodge out of it, – 2 dodges, all endurance gone. oh no but then i’m pull into it, knocked back out and dead. however, if i manage to successfully get thus far, and land some decent burst, they don’t die. they’ll get to 5% hp then heal all the way.
I have played DH this season to see for myself, it’s easy win win win, I want a fun meta, not an easy path to legend.

Another thread reminding me of Einstein’s great insight about two infinite things.

I would not mind traps to enter in CD after being triggered but game is so overall spammy that DH/guard needs traps like this to be in pair with other classes spam capabilities.
Overall it is the skill design that makes classes a bit messy to play with, to much aoe/cleaves, it is even not good/pleasent to watch in on twitch/youtube videos…

DH/Guard is good a holding points, and DH with guardian active defenses (via active blocks) can be a hell in the power creep trap burst.

But that is not traps beign OP it is the balance stats and u guys from other classes dont have much to choose from being squishy vs dh or being squishy against other classes.

Dont complain only abotu traps every class has its own gimmick mechanic.

Henrik.7560:

Don’t even try to defend your stupid class lol, yeah you have all your traps on the point so we can easily dodge them, but guess what ! your traps are ready to be used again so after we dodge first lock bam goes second lot, so i dodge out of it, – 2 dodges, all endurance gone. oh no but then i’m pull into it, knocked back out and dead. however, if i manage to successfully get thus far, and land some decent burst, they don’t die. they’ll get to 5% hp then heal all the way.
I have played DH this season to see for myself, it’s easy win win win, I want a fun meta, not an easy path to legend.

I and other players have played DH for all 4 seasons and probably longer, where were you during these 3 seasons when it was so easy peasy to legend? Hitching a ride on X meta profession? The only thing that’s changed really is F2 getting a much needed baseline, and symbols on 1 hander weapons, which is pretty much QoL for base guard. , and another amplifying reason is there’s rarely any tempests now. Though it isn’t hard to see the newer symbols might need to be tuned a bit and with the way everyone else is complaining, purification and other traps are probably going to get shaved too.

ok bb , can i have ur stuff ?

Purification doesn’t need a shave. If you compare us to Revs & Druids that is. These three classes self heals are the same. If we get a toned down, they would need one too.

I said that there was very little buffs that we needed to be Meta. We got our F3 changes but I was very surprised with Symbols being inplemented (Thanks Anet!). It just increased our damages. I would tone them down by 5% or 7%.

Then you had nerfs to other classes. In relation to DH, it wasn’t needed. Thanks to Ele no longer being a threat, we haver fewer classes controling DH.

@OP
Mesmer’s moa can kill DH. Cast it when we’re at half health (this isually means we have little cds) and cc+burst us down.
Warriors can do the same. He needs to survive long enough until our Stunbreaks are wasted. If we’re at half health with no cds, he can condi bomb us.
Revs & Rangers counter us. I’m not even going to go there.
Necros have 1 build that may or may not be viable in spvp but they can beat us. Still, DH should never lose to a Necro.

If you can’t find a single class (2 can successfully kitten DH) then i’m sorry… but you and your friends aren’t there, skill wise.

Henrik.7560:

Don’t even try to defend your stupid class lol, yeah you have all your traps on the point so we can easily dodge them, but guess what ! your traps are ready to be used again so after we dodge first lock bam goes second lot, so i dodge out of it, – 2 dodges, all endurance gone. oh no but then i’m pull into it, knocked back out and dead. however, if i manage to successfully get thus far, and land some decent burst, they don’t die. they’ll get to 5% hp then heal all the way.
I have played DH this season to see for myself, it’s easy win win win, I want a fun meta, not an easy path to legend.

If a dh uses more than 1 trap, they have no defensive cooldown or sufficient condi cleanse. This theoretical dh that spams traps and doesn’t die does not exist.

kitten clickers :<

lol

I dont mind the traps etc at all. I do have to admin, the blocks sometimes make my blood pressure rise a bit tho :P

The V.8759:

I dont mind the traps etc at all. I do have to admin, the blocks sometimes make my blood pressure rise a bit tho :P

Watching 5 minutes of 0s flying over a warrior’s head does it for me.

you mean 8 seconds of flying 0s? over the course of 60 seconds?

Swink.5172:

I dont even know where to begin with addressing everything thats wrong with guardians…

They are so badly designed. This whole trapper thing is so ridiculous. “Dragon Hunter”, what is the dragon supposed to land on the traps? Or is he supposed to pull a dragon with the rope into the traps? He can pull a dragon?! Why is the “all mighty knight” class a woss class that just hides behind traps like a sissy?

And the gameplay? What do they do? stand and Auto until you walk into their traps.

And their traps deal way to much dmg in pvp! I’ve tanked up my build this season just because Guardians and Thiefs are so ridiculous. But still guards can just delete me. They delete all my friends too. No matter what classes or builds we play. just step on a trap and you loose 80 % of your HP. Just a pixel splash on the screen…

I have just zero respect for the game developers at this point. So weak and weird decisions being made…

Wont spend much more time with GW if this is going to keep up. None of my friends either. This is just something of the worst we ever seen in a game..
Everyone of you who argue differently that this is fine somehow should really try to think and actually look at a Guardian while the abomination is playing.

Rework Guardians!!

The issue is how the profession interacts in Spvp when stacked/playing with friends.

As a solo q, this system is broken, and unfun. If pro’s are not allowed to stack professions, why are people allowed to queue up with friends and stack teams vs solo q people (and don’t tell me the so called MMR scaling means much in the current balance state when stacked)

Every single game anymore that wants to put solo queue against pre-mades is having this issue- HOTS, LoL, now this. Would devs just please… stop… Solo q makes up a large user base in any online pvp game…

WorldinCrush.6453:

The issue is how the profession interacts in Spvp when stacked/playing with friends.

As a solo q, this system is broken, and unfun. If pro’s are not allowed to stack professions, why are people allowed to queue up with friends and stack teams vs solo q people (and don’t tell me the so called MMR scaling means much in the current balance state when stacked)

Every single game anymore that wants to put solo queue against pre-mades is having this issue- HOTS, LoL, now this. Would devs just please… stop… Solo q makes up a large user base in any online pvp game…

Those games are not limited to 9 classes.

I thank you for your honest opnion, I am definetly considering to switch my main class now. Thank you for this insight.

Swink.5172, u must be new… tell me what class isnt clicker in this game, u still balieve theres alot of player skill in this game?

btw a guardian with that many blokcs wont do damage, a guardian with 3/4 traps looses condi cleanse (still exist via f3 and block, wich is easilly countered/disrupted)… etc, guardian/dh is the easiest classs to defeat, they have a lot of counters, since they cant reset combats and loose mobility.

Aeolus.3615:

Swink.5172, u must be new… tell me what class isnt clicker in this game, u still balieve theres alot of player skill in this game?

btw a guardian with that many blokcs wont do damage, a guardian with 3/4 traps looses condi cleanse (still exist via f3 and block, wich is easilly countered/disrupted)… etc, guardian/dh is the easiest classs to defeat, they have a lot of counters, since they cant reset combats and loose mobility.

Block ? I play unblockable build on Necromanter and eat all guardien every single game.Guardian is really bad class vs player with brain.

I guess DH is getting nerfed again cause kiddos 4Head

Evilek.5690:

Aeolus.3615:

Swink.5172, (…)

Block ? I play unblockable build on Necromanter and eat all guardien every single game. Guardian is really bad class vs player with brain.

^Quote for truth, the thing is that many players want to be carried by their damage output and dont want to outplay DH player.

For the logic of many comments about DH…. heres another expample why people dont want to think:
I fougth a ranger inside SoA, even SW SoA was OP against that ranger cause it just stand still inside the dome… while dome was absorving all bbow skills, now whos fault it is?

offc spirit weapon are op to….

DH… The elite spec that reveals to you your skill cap… In one click!

Xanctus The Dragonslayer.2318:

Invulnerabilyty, teleports, 0 damage utilities,Damage Inversion, stability,stunbreaks blinds, evades, projectile destruction, Projectile reflection, Movement skills, out LOS, kiting, ranged dps(with the right build), team focus and last and not least. Actual kittening dodging the godkitten kittening traps for kittens sake jesus kittening christ!!!!

GW2 PvP is about twitchy gameplay. If you can’t react and formulate a series of moves appropriate to the situation in a very short timespan, you are dead.
How to win PvP;

• Work out a “spike damage rotation”, and learn to do that very quickly (may require binding f6-12 as the keys you need to press),
• Then always move so that you don’t get surprised by enemies,
• Use stealth or [water+blast] combo to reset fight if you do get surprised,
• You will still lose a lot – remember, everbody else is doing the same.

TL;DR GW2PvP is about spike damage.

Swink.5172:

Okej cool kids.

FYI prob way better then you at dodging. That is however not the topic. Just you kids acting up with assumptions. Leave that off the table please.

Guardians are, IMO completly wrong designed and stupid. I guess you two both play guardians, you quite fit the profile. Compared to what they do they hurt way to much, they have way to much block, stability, invulnerability and condi cleanse. They dont really do much for the output that they have. Just a class for stoners that are too high to press buttons.

Again, rework it!

Tbh DHs are only hard to go up against if you have little pvp experience and don’t really have a good idea on how DHs fight. Once you figure it out, DHs are quite easy to counter and frankly, one of the more predictable classes.

For DHs to go ham on dmg, they have to forfeit most of their boon/condi cleanse utilities and go with test of faith, procession of blades, and dragon’s maw. A lot of DHs do not run shelter or renewed focus, so I’m not quite sure where you get the “They have too much invulnerability and blocks.” This makes DHs surprisingly fragile and highly susceptible to condi oriented builds. It also does not help that DHs and guardians in general, have terrible mobility. I pvp on my meditrapper DH every now and then, and viper reapers and chronophantasma mesmers are the bane of my existence.

DH traps are also quite easy to dodge out of. Simply triggering DH traps won’t hurt you that much. But panicking and running through test of faith or sitting in procession of blades will hurt a lot. This is easily avoided by you know… Not running through test of faith or sitting in procession of blades. The daze from triggering traps is short anyways, that you can dodge straight out of them before any meaningful dmg is inflicted. This is actually a reason why I find myself pvping on my DH less and less. Too many seasoned pvpers these days know exactly how to escape out of traps unscathed.

Svarty.8019:

TL;DR GW2PvP is about spike damage.

It’s also about being invulnerable 70% of the time, typically using overpowered utility skills and the like.

Fashion Mage.3712:

Svarty.8019:

TL;DR GW2PvP is about spike damage.

It’s also about being invulnerable 70% of the time, typically using overpowered utility skills and the like.

If there was no invulnerability, everybody would have to have around 50k HPs.

Svarty.8019:

Fashion Mage.3712:

Svarty.8019:

TL;DR GW2PvP is about spike damage.

It’s also about being invulnerable 70% of the time, typically using overpowered utility skills and the like.

If there was no invulnerability, everybody would have to have around 50k HPs.

Blanket statement that is wrong because it is a) based on a wrong assumption and b) draws from that wrong assumption a wrong conclusion.

Take thieves as an example: zero invulnerabilities in the standard builds (and a single block from a utility that is often omitted), yet a very small healthpool. As the opposite of the spectrum, take a necro who can have a large healthpool sitting on marauder. Yet when focus fired upon by say three people the necro WILL go down immidiately no matter what he does. A DH (running the standard meta build) in the same situation will not – at least not before he can deal quite a bit of damage.

In a high burst/low sustain meta that we have right now, the value of both hp and toughness is miniscule compared to that of blocks and invulnerabilities.

Tissitra.4153, guardian/dh have that cause they cant run aways like some classes do, they cant reset combats, all they can do it use blocks well timed or try to and hope players kill themselves on the traps.

Aeolus.3615:

Tissitra.4153, guardian/dh have that cause they cant run aways like some classes do, they cant reset combats, all they can do it use blocks well timed or try to and hope players kill themselves on the traps.

or that they can pull the combatant into the traps, or push them through the traps, or teleport to the enemy and instantly drop a trap on them, or put up a block and hit from range or any other of a number of very sick tricks to take down their opponent.

Look, DH is not over powered in most game modes. It’s only spvp that they are overpowered in. And really, even there you can deal with one. It’s when you have two or more that things get stupid. If the spvp matches restricted players from having more than one of each class, then you would not see so many complaints, but then if they did that, you would have even longer queues.

Pull?
Almost every player i fight they dodge my f1 ….
Need to get them arorund 600 range, and only one trap does a good portion of the damage :\.

(long rage text removed :< )

#skillbalance/design is awfull, that also makes this game horrible to obsever in esports.

Aeolus.3615:

Tissitra.4153, guardian/dh have that cause they cant run aways like some classes do, they cant reset combats, all they can do it use blocks well timed or try to and hope players kill themselves on the traps.

Firstly, the ability to disengage is not even remotely as valuable in conquest as the ability to hold a point. Secondly, since test of faith – in my eyes the main offender and the only offensive trap used in the meta build – is instacast it is very often used simply as a nuke in melee combat with no ‘hoping’ involved and besides, it’s not like guardian’s dps outside of traps is bad. And thirdly, rather than conveniently picking up the example of thieves I gave above, what about my second example – necros? They lack BOTH the ability to disengage and to survive burst while on a point.

Tissitra.4153:

Svarty.8019:

Fashion Mage.3712:

Svarty.8019:

TL;DR GW2PvP is about spike damage.

It’s also about being invulnerable 70% of the time, typically using overpowered utility skills and the like.

If there was no invulnerability, everybody would have to have around 50k HPs.

Blanket statement that is wrong because it is a) based on a wrong assumption and b) draws from that wrong assumption a wrong conclusion.

Take thieves as an example: zero invulnerabilities in the standard builds (and a single block from a utility that is often omitted), yet a very small healthpool. As the opposite of the spectrum, take a necro who can have a large healthpool sitting on marauder. Yet when focus fired upon by say three people the necro WILL go down immidiately no matter what he does. A DH (running the standard meta build) in the same situation will not – at least not before he can deal quite a bit of damage.

In a high burst/low sustain meta that we have right now, the value of both hp and toughness is minuscule compared to that of blocks and invulnerabilities.

There is so much misinformation in this quote.

First, you are trying to fight on point as thief. I do not care what you are fighting that is not possible. The whole concept of thief is to play hit and run.

Necro with Marauder? There is not one meta necro build run marauder. Plus Necro can fight on point. Other classes can do it better, but Necro is no push over.

Lastly high/burst low sustain meta. While the survive-ability of most classes went down from last patch, trust and believe HP and toughness are significantly important. There is a reason why no uses berserk ammy. Also, go fight eng, rev and druids then come back to tells us how HP, toughness and healing are “minuscule.”

Test of faith isn’t even remotely a nuke. The DH has to bounce you through the trap to actually get the real damage out of it, which is something a DH with experience with his class is capable of performing (as opposed to someone who just picked up the class and is stacking traps on a point). The trap should remain as is.

otto.5684:

Tissitra.4153:

Svarty.8019:

Fashion Mage.3712:

Svarty.8019:

TL;DR GW2PvP is about spike damage.

It’s also about being invulnerable 70% of the time, typically using overpowered utility skills and the like.

If there was no invulnerability, everybody would have to have around 50k HPs.

Blanket statement that is wrong because it is a) based on a wrong assumption and b) draws from that wrong assumption a wrong conclusion.

Take thieves as an example: zero invulnerabilities in the standard builds (and a single block from a utility that is often omitted), yet a very small healthpool. As the opposite of the spectrum, take a necro who can have a large healthpool sitting on marauder. Yet when focus fired upon by say three people the necro WILL go down immidiately no matter what he does. A DH (running the standard meta build) in the same situation will not – at least not before he can deal quite a bit of damage.

In a high burst/low sustain meta that we have right now, the value of both hp and toughness is minuscule compared to that of blocks and invulnerabilities.

There is so much misinformation in this quote.

First, you are trying to fight on point as thief. I do not care what you are fighting that is not possible. The whole concept of thief is to play hit and run.

Necro with Marauder? There is not one meta necro build run marauder. Plus Necro can fight on point. Other classes can do it better, but Necro is no push over.

Lastly high/burst low sustain meta. While the survive-ability of most classes went down from last patch, trust and believe HP and toughness are significantly important. There is a reason why no uses berserk ammy. Also, go fight eng, rev and druids then come back to tells us how HP, toughness and healing are “minuscule.”

The fact that there is indeed no meta power necro is PRECISELY the point. Why is that if you CAN actually have 40-50k effective hp with it (if you have full shrroud)? It’s because hp pool has no value compared to having blocks/invulnerabilities. Yet according to what was stated above, power necro should be good since it was claimed that hp pool is an adequate substitute for having these things. It’s not and that’s precisely the point I was making

And yes, the above post was factually wrong. It was claimed that a profession with no invulnerabilities cannot work unless it has a large hp pool. The case of thieves proves that statement to be factually wrong.

And finally, how quickly do you thing a druid or scrapper go down to burst if they don’t use there defensive abilities? VERY quickly. The reason they are still tankier ingame than say a necro (although the latter can have A LOT more effective HP) are that they have active defenses/boons/stealth which the necro all lacks and which are much more valuable. The fact that marauder amulet is usually better than berserker does not somehow disprove this.

Kuya.6495:

Test of faith isn’t even remotely a nuke. The DH has to bounce you through the trap to actually get the real damage out of it, which is something a DH with experience with his class is capable of performing (as opposed to someone who just picked up the class and is stacking traps on a point). The trap should remain as is.

My point was that the claim that poor DHs have to put up test of faith and ‘hope’ that someone walks into it is a rather gross misrepresentation given it’s instacast nature.

BTW I never said they should necessarily change the way test of faith works. What they SHOULD definitely do is to look into the DH’s survivability (block/invln/healing/condi removal) that is currently too much for the kind of damage it can deal.

I’d rather they just shave the damage on dragon’s maw and procession of blades and leave the sustain alone.

Kuya.6495:

I’d rather they just shave the damage on dragon’s maw and procession of blades and leave the sustain alone.

I am sure you are aware that neither one of these two traps is usually used in the current meta DH builds (symbolic/meditrapper) which mostly only take test of faith from the offensive traps . So nerfing these two would change very little in the balance between DH and other professions but simply make the most popular DH builds even more popular. Besides, they have already looked at traps in the last balance patch, so if they agree that DH needs more balancing, then it makes much more sense to look into the defensive stuff. Well, we’’ll see – and since balance patches are rather infrequent it will take a while for ANY changes regardless.

I’d rather they nerf those traps because i don’t care about them.

Kuya.6495:

I’d rather they nerf those traps because i don’t care about them.

Well understandable but it’s kind of disingenuous to say ’I’m fine with nerfs, just as long as they don’t nerf anything that people ACTUALLY USE’. As I said, IF they decide that DH could indeed usr some shaves, then obviously they should start with what the most popular builds are running – otherwise there is very little point.

If anything the most popular builds are used because they are the most viable at higher levels of play. Full trapper is no good at higher skill levels but it can 100-0 a glassy player with little effort. Nerfing the meta builds would simply push DH back out of competitive play. Meanwhile, nerfing the full trapper would simply mean that nobody would get 100-0 by stacked traps anymore, which is one of the loudest complaints.

We all know that one of the things most people in the pvp forum complain about regarding guardian is the full trapper despite the fact that it’s not even a meta build. Recently they’ve also started to complain about the blocks and the healing, but that’s because the average player can’t tell that he’s fighting many different kinds of DH and they think the menders bunker, symbol marauder, and full trapper are all the same thing.

Kuya.6495:

I’d rather they nerf those traps because i don’t care about them.

Fashion Mage.3712:

Kuya.6495:

I’d rather they nerf those traps because i don’t care about them.

^lol pretty much that…. has a DH i vote Nerf traps, or buff shouts!!! >:}

emkelly.2371:

Aeolus.3615:

Tissitra.4153, guardian/dh have that cause they cant run aways like some classes do, they cant reset combats, all they can do it use blocks well timed or try to and hope players kill themselves on the traps.

or that they can pull the combatant into the traps, or push them through the traps, or teleport to the enemy and instantly drop a trap on them, or put up a block and hit from range or any other of a number of very sick tricks to take down their opponent.

Look, DH is not over powered in most game modes. It’s only spvp that they are overpowered in. And really, even there you can deal with one. It’s when you have two or more that things get stupid. If the spvp matches restricted players from having more than one of each class, then you would not see so many complaints, but then if they did that, you would have even longer queues.

It is not OP, it is strong but, do you really think balance team cares about pvp, why do u think pvp team is forced to remove some stats from the game??
DH wonly works with power creep situations and bursts, wich game is all about, fast spamm skills, lots of damage, u burst and get bursted, fleee/run if u can, burst again if defense are in CD u will get bursted instantly, that is how game is on pvp or wvw even.
IT is ugly to watch, has much esl speakers are good game do not help them.
Gw2 should be reverted to a more team effort game like Gw1 was, more steady peace fight, excellent for the speaker comment the skills, what was on effect, the reason of the skill that was used, more team burst instead in character can do it all, etc…

Saddly all they care is to make the game so friendly to new players that they need to play gimmick rotations, all it matters it is classes with high spam aoe skills and the damage output to look good, and atrack more players.
It is the wrong path of a game that want to be esl or decent.

Kuya.6495:

If anything the most popular builds are used because they are the most viable at higher levels of play. Full trapper is no good at higher skill levels but it can 100-0 a glassy player with little effort. Nerfing the meta builds would simply push DH back out of competitive play. Meanwhile, nerfing the full trapper would simply mean that nobody would get 100-0 by stacked traps anymore, which is one of the loudest complaints.

We all know that one of the things most people in the pvp forum complain about regarding guardian is the full trapper despite the fact that it’s not even a meta build. Recently they’ve also started to complain about the blocks and the healing, but that’s because the average player can’t tell that he’s fighting many different kinds of DH and they think the menders bunker, symbol marauder, and full trapper are all the same thing.

It is very simple really: IF you agree that DH is unbalanced compared to other professions, then the only way to solve this is to adjust the things in the DH’s strongest builds. Nerfing builds that are subpar already will do nothing, as far as meta goes. Are pure trap builds annoying and can they be good at low levels of play? I guess – but they also go down very quickly themselves. I for my part (and many others) perceive the DH meta builds as a far bigger problem. The fact by the way that these meta builds only take one offensive trap and the rest is sustain essentially confirms that if the profession is currently too strong, then the problem is NOT the offensive traps. Besides many new players who want to pick up the profession will start with the meta builds – and it’s not like these are weaker at lower levels of play.

You say ‘Nerfing the meta builds would simply push DH back out of competitive play’. This kind of ‘preemtptive’ counterargument has very little credibility – you can’t claim that ANY change, no matter how small, would immidiately result in DH no longer being meta.

Putting it bluntly, what I read in your last posts are iterations of the same statement : ‘I don’t care if you nerf something on DH, just don’t you touch MY build’.

I walked into a trap once. Got hurt. Stopped walking into traps. l2p issue

Saiyan.1704:

Purification doesn’t need a shave. If you compare us to Revs & Druids that is. These three classes self heals are the same. If we get a toned down, they would need one too.

I said that there was very little buffs that we needed to be Meta. We got our F3 changes but I was very surprised with Symbols being inplemented (Thanks Anet!). It just increased our damages. I would tone them down by 5% or 7%.

Then you had nerfs to other classes. In relation to DH, it wasn’t needed. Thanks to Ele no longer being a threat, we haver fewer classes controling DH.

@OP
Mesmer’s moa can kill DH. Cast it when we’re at half health (this isually means we have little cds) and cc+burst us down.
Warriors can do the same. He needs to survive long enough until our Stunbreaks are wasted. If we’re at half health with no cds, he can condi bomb us.
Revs & Rangers counter us. I’m not even going to go there.
Necros have 1 build that may or may not be viable in spvp but they can beat us. Still, DH should never lose to a Necro.

If you can’t find a single class (2 can successfully kitten DH) then i’m sorry… but you and your friends aren’t there, skill wise.

This type of stuff always reminds me of the golden rules of gaming

1. My class is always fine or underpwered. You just need to L2P
2. The class that counters my class is OP and needs nerf.
3. The class(es) my class stomps hard are perfectly balanced and need no touchups at all.

Pretty much always. “If im beating you with X you need to uninstall. Its a L2P issue”.

Its funny.

But lets get to your quote. How about wells get massive damage buffs? Eh? Like on par with guard traps? Go ahead and respond. I’ll see to your hippocratic response.

Cerpin.7839:

I walked into a trap once. Got hurt. Stopped walking into traps. l2p issue

Nothing more to say

Tissitra.4153:

Kuya.6495:

If anything the most popular builds are used because they are the most viable at higher levels of play. Full trapper is no good at higher skill levels but it can 100-0 a glassy player with little effort. Nerfing the meta builds would simply push DH back out of competitive play. Meanwhile, nerfing the full trapper would simply mean that nobody would get 100-0 by stacked traps anymore, which is one of the loudest complaints.

We all know that one of the things most people in the pvp forum complain about regarding guardian is the full trapper despite the fact that it’s not even a meta build. Recently they’ve also started to complain about the blocks and the healing, but that’s because the average player can’t tell that he’s fighting many different kinds of DH and they think the menders bunker, symbol marauder, and full trapper are all the same thing.

It is very simple really: IF you agree that DH is unbalanced compared to other professions, then the only way to solve this is to adjust the things in the DH’s strongest builds. Nerfing builds that are subpar already will do nothing, as far as meta goes. Are pure trap builds annoying and can they be good at low levels of play? I guess – but they also go down very quickly themselves. I for my part (and many others) perceive the DH meta builds as a far bigger problem. The fact by the way that these meta builds only take one offensive trap and the rest is sustain essentially confirms that if the profession is currently too strong, then the problem is NOT the offensive traps. Besides many new players who want to pick up the profession will start with the meta builds – and it’s not like these are weaker at lower levels of play.

You say ‘Nerfing the meta builds would simply push DH back out of competitive play’. This kind of ‘preemtptive’ counterargument has very little credibility – you can’t claim that ANY change, no matter how small, would immidiately result in DH no longer being meta.

Putting it bluntly, what I read in your last posts are iterations of the same statement : ‘I don’t care if you nerf something on DH, just don’t you touch MY build’.

Medi trap guard is meta ….nobody plays full trap .
….DH is now viable in SPVP and all get salty Ö.Ö
It reminds me when Burn guard was meta ….