Guild Wars 2

So I’m going to start off by saying I love my Guardian 100% and I wouldn’t switch but,
I went ahead and compared our Class to Warriors and I can’t help but feel inferior in almost every possible way to a Warrior.

Guardians – Heavy Armor (Highest Def.) – Lowest HP – Deals little to decent Damage (depending on the build)

Warriors – Heavy Armor (Highest Def.) – Highest HP – Deals insane damage even with little power.

Even Warrior shout builds are better than Guardians. They’re shouts heal them for 1,500 base with the trait “Vigorous Shouts”

Also, anyone else who plays Guardian would know that we are slow as hell and we can’t catch Players who run away from us in PvP and we can’t run away when things get rough.

Like I said I love my Guardian and I hope it doesn’t sound like I’m crying but, I believe we need to be buffed even just a little and I hope there’s someone out there who agrees with me.

I don’t know. My guardian is only level 40, but so far, I’m facetanking champions of my level without so much as breaking a sweat. I can even handle a group of those blasted princess dolls without much trouble. Toy golems on the other hand….those things scare me.

I feel like guardians have more ways to mitigate damage than warriors. Multiple sources of aegis and blind, as well as several block skills.

I have both at 80, things fall short compare to warrior:
1. warrior can perm swiftness, perm fury, perm 3~6 stack might very easily with trait and/or rune.

2. warrior can do hit and run far better, most their better boons also don’t require in-combat to apply.

Early pve, warrior will definitely come out on top, because of deep strike trait. But later on, guardian contribute just as much if not more to the party/group event/dungeon.

WvW, bunker guardian is not bad at all, just a bit slow, and very fun when run in groups with warriors or rangers.

ps. guardian also do better underwater, just feel my warrior lost half its power when going down water.(but guess that’s not important, since who in the right mind fight underwater.)

Yeah no. Guardians have better defense and almost equivalent offense. If you think Guardians do little damage, congratulations, you’re another of the 99% of the playerbase that doesn’t realize they’re the second-highest DPS class in the game and are just making assumptions based on the name of the class, of all things.

I’m just going to start linking this post from now because it pretty much explains everything:

http://www.guildwars2guru.com/topic/78121-guardian-too-support-for-me/#entry2129000

That post misses quite alot out…they are comparing to full beserker geared classes. So when we look at health Warrior wins by a mile. As far as I am aware you do no damage when dead. The utilities he said to use have no bonus heals (monks focus) so its not like there is more ways to make up the smaller health pool. As standard warriors have a higher crit and higher power and the standard 1 combo with both is fairly comparable.
Sure warrior may have to dodge roll out of 100 blades, but guardian may have to dodge too so that is kinda a stupid point to make. The warrior in that build didnt utilize his utilities, so yeah guardian makes up the gap, then warrior stretches it again with a knockdown and 100 blades using the charge ability.
The biggest thing to note is sure we can do the same DPS if we spec fully to dps, but warrior matches or beats us and they have more health and same armor.

Never said guardian is low on dps, in fact, I stated “guardian contribute just as much if not more to the party/group event/dungeon”. The only part warrior coming out on top is “early pve”.

As for the post you link, all I can say is the poster is assuming all warrior uses GS and no warrior ever spec for condition dmg, which neither is true for the warrior I am running.

I will agree guardian dodge a lot less, but that’s why warrior is better at “hit and run”.
There are situations where I just don’t want to stick around(not because I can’t tank it), and warrior definitely better at getting out of those situations than guardian.

Full DPS warrior is much, much more fragile than full DPS guardian. HPs mean nothing if you don’t have damage mitigation…
Actually guardian is the most powerful class in the game arguably on par with mesmer, I really can’t see how it needs a buff, more changes are that there will be a nerf…
Sorry to bring the bad news guys

Sometimes I wish I’d rolled a Warrior. I see some down people in literally two seconds. Even on my Guardian with a 96 crit dmg and +3000 attack can’t do that, but the thing is my survivability is great. Jump into a middle of a zerg down some people and still get away. So I can’t really complain.

Both classes have their strength and weakness. It just comes down to your play style more then anything.

JackWest.8974:

Full DPS warrior is much, much more fragile than full DPS guardian. HPs mean nothing if you don’t have damage mitigation…
Actually guardian is the most powerful class in the game arguably on par with mesmer, I really can’t see how it needs a buff, more changes are that there will be a nerf…
Sorry to bring the bad news guys

I am guessing you dont play guardian. I have a almost full dps speced warrior apart from using shouts not sigils. I have a 24k health pool with many heals and a passive regen. On shield I have good mitigation, combined with mace it gives a little more mitigation too. Granted not as much as my Guardian which is also spec towrads dps but not fully. So yes My guard can mitigate better but has a lower dps and has a much smaller health pool (8k)

Barnabus Stinson.1409:

JackWest.8974:

Full DPS warrior is much, much more fragile than full DPS guardian. HPs mean nothing if you don’t have damage mitigation…
Actually guardian is the most powerful class in the game arguably on par with mesmer, I really can’t see how it needs a buff, more changes are that there will be a nerf…
Sorry to bring the bad news guys

I am guessing you dont play guardian. I have a almost full dps speced warrior apart from using shouts not sigils. I have a 24k health pool with many heals and a passive regen. On shield I have good mitigation, combined with mace it gives a little more mitigation too. Granted not as much as my Guardian which is also spec towrads dps but not fully. So yes My guard can mitigate better but has a lower dps and has a much smaller health pool (8k)

Yeah, I play guardian, and warrior to, along with engineer :)
From the description of your warrior I hardly see how it is “full DPS”, you use shouts and have “many heals” hence i guess you use a vigorous shouts build (?) and use mace/shield which is a pretty defensive combo (probably as a secondary set, but still)
In the beta the guardian used to have a bigger health pool but was nerfed cause it was kitten OP
I’m not calling for any nerf on the guardian cause i love it the way it is, but asking for a buff only based on the fact that the warrior has more direct damage (it actually has the best DPS of the game, not just more than guardian) and more health is just blind
The guardian just have more built-in defensive abilities and still retains really good DPS

Warrior is better in every way possible.

Warrior:
Range – Check
Amazing Dps with any weapon selection – Check
Amazing Hp Pool that can be stackable with toughness just like a guardian – Check
Ability to Heal through banners/shouts – Check
Decent Elites – Check

Guardian:
We sound cool – Check

Barnabus Stinson.1409:

JackWest.8974:

Full DPS warrior is much, much more fragile than full DPS guardian. HPs mean nothing if you don’t have damage mitigation…
Actually guardian is the most powerful class in the game arguably on par with mesmer, I really can’t see how it needs a buff, more changes are that there will be a nerf…
Sorry to bring the bad news guys

I am guessing you dont play guardian. I have a almost full dps speced warrior apart from using shouts not sigils. I have a 24k health pool with many heals and a passive regen. On shield I have good mitigation, combined with mace it gives a little more mitigation too. Granted not as much as my Guardian which is also spec towrads dps but not fully. So yes My guard can mitigate better but has a lower dps and has a much smaller health pool (8k)

I dont believe theres a nerf to Guardian class, at the momment seams the more steady class of all in offense/defense(on every build possible), its a pitty some of the consecrations when traited still take more than 1 minute to reload, i would like to see more field bubbles or guardians encouraged to use them more.

I blieve most paragons are warriors in gw2 :P ?

The only thing warriors are better at than Guardians are PVE up to lvl 40 or so. 100B because enemies dont dodge. Other than that, Warriors have nothing on Guardians. Not saying Warriors arent good because they are, but Guardians are perfect (for as perfect a class can be without being OP). Their ranged attacks arent good in pvp/wvw but in pve theyre great (just as good as rifle or longbow, if not better but thats up for debate). Warriors have more HP and the same defense, but they dont have the ability to keep their HP or remove conditions like Guards do. “Guardian” is honestly a really bad name for the class imo. Warriors can build between offense and defense better than guards, but at full DPS or full Bunker, guardian is far better in both. Warrior seems better to some people because they can drop things with 100b instantly, but thats it. Besides that, the damage is equal with Guardian getting more buffs for his hits. sry for bad grammar, super tired.

Guardians are statiscally the top 3 in PvP as said in many posts in PvP forums.

Warriors are not as good as Guardians…at all. Even warriors admit to it. Why?

Survivability.

HP means nothing if you are taking more damage than you can heal. What can a warrior do against hits? Tank, self-heal, spike heal, and condition removal (oh wait…shake it off is all they have?) What can a guardian do against hits? Aegis, protection, block, condition removal, spike heal, self-heal and invulnerability.

The only arguable option for the warrior is one who has a shield, because by no means can you survive a kittenstorm of attacks. If you got hit by a mob of enemies in any hard dungeon you cant survive worth anything without a shield. But if you have a shield…that means an axe/sword/mace which isn’t the dps you need as a warrior. Sure, if you are into weapon switching, you can get shield/something and gs and switch for rifle when needed.

The reason why a warriors defense is no where near on the level of a guard

- Condition removal, you guys simple do not have that convenience and when approached with multiple conditions, you are gonna have to man up and sit there with those conditions for awhile..unless you use shake it off…trait for it…and use runes to make up for it.
- Mitagation makes up for our hp deficiency
- Aegis, free damage absorbers
- Shelter, our 2 second block with a heal, can save you from multi-hits (and we don’t need a specific weapon for it)
- Renewed focus, if you don’t believe it now…it is one of the best self-fish elites in the game. Nothing in the game makes you invulnerable except this move. What makes this good? You aren’t treated it as a real object (has a perk against a boss like jade maw where he can insta kill you with his death ray while warriors who use endure pain or a sheild will die)

But in all honesty, it depends on what your build in. However, in endgame PvE, you’ll see why the guardians rock warriors——because in the end it’s a matter about survivability and not dps. And guardians can still fork over a good amount of dps for the things they offer. And their utilities are better than any of the warriors because of their versatility.

Edit: Just wanted to say that I’m open to be proven wrong in PvE (dont care about PvP), but hey—-get to fotm lvl30+ and tell me why your group likes you.

What’s with the hard on with renewed focus? It suffers from the same problems as other invulnerability skills. It’s not absolute invulnerability, conditions that is ticking will continue to tick. Mist form also makes you invulnerable, and it’s better than renewed focus in multiple ways including being up for longer, gives you a speed boost, and allow you to heal and use utilities while being invulnerable.

There’s also no reason to exclude runes and other buffs in the discussion either. The fact is the min-max players will capitalize on the most effective combos and they will always dominate the top of the meta. You either have it or you don’t.

Heinel.6548:

What’s with the hard on with renewed focus? It suffers from the same problems as other invulnerability skills. It’s not absolute invulnerability, conditions that is ticking will continue to tick. Mist form also makes you invulnerable, and it’s better than renewed focus in multiple ways including being up for longer, gives you a speed boost, and allow you to heal and use utilities while being invulnerable.

There’s also no reason to exclude runes and other buffs in the discussion either. The fact is the min-max players will capitalize on the most effective combos and they will always dominate the top of the meta. You either have it or you don’t.

Ah, never played ele. So cool, but still overrules endure pain imo. And I agree with the latter part. I don’t exclude runes. But I’m saying that you have to invest in so much to just get something guardians already have.

Wow you guys. Okay look:

- Full DPS guardian is equivalent damage as a full DPS warrior (if not more) with better survivability.
- Full defense guardian is better defense than a full defense warrior with better DPS.

You clowns are trying to argue that a DPS-specced warrior is more damage than a defensive guardian and a defensive warrior is better tanking than a DPS guardian so therefore warriors must be better at both DPS and tanking. I hope you can see the problem here. If not this has all been a waste of time.

After playing a warrior for a little bit in sPvP and zone PvE, I’ll say that guardians are definitely better than warriors in their current state. Although on paper warriors have a lot of ways to do a lot of damage, that doesn’t pan out in practice. Warriors need to be able to apply constant pressure in order to stay on the offensive and keep the damage rolling. If you kite or stun them, they lose their momentum and they crumble.

Warrior abilities are often very narrow or weaker than similar guardian abilities. For example, Balanced Stance breaks stuns and gives the warrior stability on a 40sec CD. The guardian’s “Stand Your Ground!” gives up to 5 people stability (5sec vs 8sec for warrior) and retaliation with a stun break on a 30sec CD. Bull’s Charge and Judge’s Intervention are both gap closers. Judge’s Intervention breaks stuns and is instant. Bull’s Charge takes time to close the gap with half the range and gets stuck on terrain. It does have a knockdown, but it’s also much easier to avoid.

Guardian weapons also tend to lend themselves to combos far better than a warrior. Greatsword for guardian has CC and burst damage and a gap closer all built in. Warrior doesn’t have the CC component on greatsword.

Guardians having low HP is a poor assessment by inexperienced players. Guardians have very high effective HP because of the passive Virtue of Resolve and Virtue of Courage. Warriors have high base HP because they have little to nothing to increase their effective HP.

Guardians having poor damage is also a poor assessment by inexperienced players. This is partly due to the Radiance and especially Zeal trait lines being sub-par. To build a guardian for damage, you often pick the Honor and Valor trait lines and then use damage gear. The end result is equal damage to Zeal or Radiance with more survivability and versatility.

I guess I failed to mention I’m a WvW player if that matters at all.
I mean I have over 2100 toughness and I still get one shot by “Kill Shot” I know you can argue that you can dodge it but, that’s only if you see it. In a big fight or your running you definitely won’t see a bullet coming.

I’ll leave this here too : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yLTzyn6CGHw

Getting killed by anything in a WvW zerg is not indicative of anything. Even rangers and necromancers can kill people under those circumstances.

I’m leveling both and like them both. My guardian doesn’t seem particularly survivable though so I’m not sure where that comes from pre-80.

Yaki.9563:

I’m leveling both and like them both. My guardian doesn’t seem particularly survivable though so I’m not sure where that comes from pre-80.

Altruistic Healing.

let me put this into perspective

Warriors have roughly 20k more HP then a Guardian.

A thief does a burst combo on both classes with a 4 hit combo that does around 20k damage

Warrior absorbs the damage with its vitality and left with 15K health with no way to fully heal back up to 35K hp

Guardians block the first hit with aegis, blocked the second hit with another aegis, third attack missed with VoJ traited for blind, blocks last hit with a shield or focus or mace. If not block the last hit, the guardian can heal it back by just passive regen and symbol as well as AH giving health for using Virtues.

Damage mitigation is hugely powerful. Warriors are under powered. This is why they have been buffed recently.

Im sad to say, its another issue of L2P

I’m talking Guards vs Warriors bro in terms overall DPS/Survivability/CC/and other things. I can care less about thieves because I’ve only met one in WvW that basically 1 hit me or combed or whatever. A Warrior Shout build can heal them for 2.1k for every shout. So basic math 2.1k * 3 = a 6.3k Heal and that doesn’t include their Main heal skill.
The base cool downs are 25-30 sec assuming they would also use “Lung capacity” it would decrease the cool down by 20%. So they would get two 2.1k Heals every 20 seconds and another Heal every 24 Seconds while getting buffed at the same time or putting Vulnerability on enemy.

Out of say 100 1v1 with warriors in spvp and WvW. Ive lost about 6 times in total.

Guardians sustained damage and mitigation destroys warriors.

If you can survive a warriors burst for 10 seconds it an auto win.

Also to note, guardians out heal them with 1 skill. Then constantly heal with every other skill. Warrior healing is obselete compared to a guardian and you loose damage if you spec to heal as a warrior. Guardians can go hybrid very easily doing good damage and bunker when they have to.

Retaliation+burn+symbol+melee/skill. Thats a lot of damage to out heal with laughable healing lol

Zelcova.4173:

I’m talking Guards vs Warriors bro in terms overall DPS/Survivability/CC/and other things. I can care less about thieves because I’ve only met one in WvW that basically 1 hit me or combed or whatever. A Warrior Shout build can heal them for 2.1k for every shout. So basic math 2.1k * 3 = a 6.3k Heal and that doesn’t include their Main heal skill.
The base cool downs are 25-30 sec assuming they would also use “Lung capacity” it would decrease the cool down by 20%. So they would get two 2.1k Heals every 20 seconds and another Heal every 24 Seconds while getting buffed at the same time or putting Vulnerability on enemy.

Uh Vigorous Shouts only heals about 1k. That’s only 3k per 30s which is only 100/s, which is pretty much what Guardian has on passive Resolve without having to trait anything.

By comparison guardians get either Monk’s Focus or AH. Monk’s Focus is 2k per 20s from just Smite Condition alone, which means ONE meditation heals an equivalent amount as THREE shouts on a warrior. AH is about 70 per tick, so PER PERSON you get 70/sec from Empowering Might, 350 per symbol, and 140 per shout. Multiply that by 5 and you’re getting 350/sec from Empower, 1750 per symbol, and 700 per shout.

Also, guardians have more blocks and blinds, so they won’t be taking as much damage to begin with.

If you look at both of the classes in a vacuum, purely numbers speculation, the warrior seems like the obvious choice. At one point I had added up all the numbers and I really wish I could remember them, but it’s been several months since then. Just goes to show that this question has been at hand since the game came out.

I do however remember that based on gear and play style a guardian can pump out ridiculous amounts of self and group healing, along with boons that reduce damage taken while still dishing out the punishing damage. I’m not downplaying the warrior class, they are in their own right an awesome class and i’m always happy to group up with them for instances, pvp, events, etc… but i would never trade in my guardian for a warrior judging by how often i’ve had to revive them in the thick of things. Their high hp and armor is only a buffer for their lack of effective hp- even with a shout build. They’re a berserker class at best, imo. If you want something dead, and it has to be dead now, a warrior is a great class. If you’re willing to take an extra few seconds to kill something and come out in pristine condition, i would advise the guardian for you.

ArcTheFallen.7682:

condition removal (oh wait…shake it off is all they have?)

No, it’s not. Warriors have above average active condition removal. They do lack the passive removal like Signet of Resolve though.

I really like the guardian leap abilities. Its the main reason I have stuck with my guardian.

blurps.2340:

ArcTheFallen.7682:

condition removal (oh wait…shake it off is all they have?)

No, it’s not. Warriors have above average active condition removal. They do lack the passive removal like Signet of Resolve though.

Warriors do have signet of stamina though. Cleansing all conditions every 45 seconds (36 traited) is pretty good.

Of course, guardians get contemplation of purity, purging flames, smite condition, and purity (the trait).

Literally the only thing Warriors have over Guardians is 100b and Signet of Rage. Other than that, Guardian trumps them very hard.

Xyvius.1679:

Literally the only thing Warriors have over Guardians is 100b and Signet of Rage. Other than that, Guardian trumps them very hard.

They also have viable ranged options. Which is a pretty huge advantage.

Signet of Stamina removes conditions on activation only though, which was kinda my point.

Removing all conditions on a long(ish) cooldown isn’t all that useful imo anyway, usually you don’t have more than two or max three on you but they will be reapplied very quickly. In theory there are some group makeups that could put a lot of conditions on a lot of targets ( involving classes putting the actual conditions on people and a Necro to Epidemic ), but I’ve never actually seen them used in game.

Removing one or two conditions on a very short cooldown is more important and a Warrior shout build with Rune of the Soldier and Warhorn with the appropriate trait ( Quick Breathing ) is the very best at that.

Guanglai Kangyi.4318:

Yaki.9563:

I’m leveling both and like them both. My guardian doesn’t seem particularly survivable though so I’m not sure where that comes from pre-80.

Altruistic Healing.

Have it, not impressed. It’s really only very good when in a group and since I’m talking about pre-80 that’s rarely the case.

Guanglai Kangyi.4318:

Zelcova.4173:

I’m talking Guards vs Warriors bro in terms overall DPS/Survivability/CC/and other things. I can care less about thieves because I’ve only met one in WvW that basically 1 hit me or combed or whatever. A Warrior Shout build can heal them for 2.1k for every shout. So basic math 2.1k * 3 = a 6.3k Heal and that doesn’t include their Main heal skill.
The base cool downs are 25-30 sec assuming they would also use “Lung capacity” it would decrease the cool down by 20%. So they would get two 2.1k Heals every 20 seconds and another Heal every 24 Seconds while getting buffed at the same time or putting Vulnerability on enemy.

Uh Vigorous Shouts only heals about 1k. That’s only 3k per 30s which is only 100/s, which is pretty much what Guardian has on passive Resolve without having to trait anything.

By comparison guardians get either Monk’s Focus or AH. Monk’s Focus is 2k per 20s from just Smite Condition alone, which means ONE meditation heals an equivalent amount as THREE shouts on a warrior. AH is about 70 per tick, so PER PERSON you get 70/sec from Empowering Might, 350 per symbol, and 140 per shout. Multiply that by 5 and you’re getting 350/sec from Empower, 1750 per symbol, and 700 per shout.

Also, guardians have more blocks and blinds, so they won’t be taking as much damage to begin with.

This isn’t 1 warrior vs. 5 guardians.

Also, nice job rounding up guardian heal values and rounding down warrior heal values while ignoring the two warrior passive regens as well as banner regen.

Yaki.9563:

Guanglai Kangyi.4318:

Zelcova.4173:

I’m talking Guards vs Warriors bro in terms overall DPS/Survivability/CC/and other things. I can care less about thieves because I’ve only met one in WvW that basically 1 hit me or combed or whatever. A Warrior Shout build can heal them for 2.1k for every shout. So basic math 2.1k * 3 = a 6.3k Heal and that doesn’t include their Main heal skill.
The base cool downs are 25-30 sec assuming they would also use “Lung capacity” it would decrease the cool down by 20%. So they would get two 2.1k Heals every 20 seconds and another Heal every 24 Seconds while getting buffed at the same time or putting Vulnerability on enemy.

Uh Vigorous Shouts only heals about 1k. That’s only 3k per 30s which is only 100/s, which is pretty much what Guardian has on passive Resolve without having to trait anything.

By comparison guardians get either Monk’s Focus or AH. Monk’s Focus is 2k per 20s from just Smite Condition alone, which means ONE meditation heals an equivalent amount as THREE shouts on a warrior. AH is about 70 per tick, so PER PERSON you get 70/sec from Empowering Might, 350 per symbol, and 140 per shout. Multiply that by 5 and you’re getting 350/sec from Empower, 1750 per symbol, and 700 per shout.

Also, guardians have more blocks and blinds, so they won’t be taking as much damage to begin with.

This isn’t 1 warrior vs. 5 guardians.

Also, nice job rounding up guardian heal values and rounding down warrior heal values while ignoring the two warrior passive regens as well as banner regen.

I’m not the one talking about DPS warriors while using heal numbers from a spread reliant on full cleric’s gear and healing power runes. If you want to compare raw healing a guardian in full cleric/magi and heal runes gets 1.6k on a roll every 5s and I don’t even have to invest 30 trait points and 3 utilities to do it, but if I wanted to I’d be stacking symbol heals, AH/Monk’s Focus, rollheals, and passive Resolve plus regen from mace.

The funny thing is ele is still a better healer.

Guys i’ll ask a question here since i and don’t really know much about guardian or warriors at level 80.
I got both to level 20 right now and i can’t decide which one i should choose (mainly for wvw skirmishing and small group fights)
From the thread i could learn that warriors are more fit in the hit n run role so it would be the right choice, yet i like guardian spells much more and i wanted to know if it’s possible to do that on a guardian aswell.
In short, i need to know if it’s possible to build the guardian as a very mobile unit that hit n runs decently, worse than warriors or thieves ofc, but still fairly playable.
I couldn’t find any build/thread/video of a bursty roamer guardian so i’m asking it here cuz i don’t want to find out at level 80 that guardian can only be a support tank or a fairly damaging but not mobile prof, i need mobility to be the priority for what i want to do.

Guardians don’t really make good roamers, we are fairly slow compared to all the other classes, with next to no escape mechanics.

Yeah we have a couple of good utilities like Judges Intervention, but 90% of the time if someone wants to get away from you they can, and visa versa if you stumble into a zerg.

Iddiozzia.3489:

Guys i’ll ask a question here since i and don’t really know much about guardian or warriors at level 80.
I got both to level 20 right now and i can’t decide which one i should choose (mainly for wvw skirmishing and small group fights)
From the thread i could learn that warriors are more fit in the hit n run role so it would be the right choice, yet i like guardian spells much more and i wanted to know if it’s possible to do that on a guardian aswell.
In short, i need to know if it’s possible to build the guardian as a very mobile unit that hit n runs decently, worse than warriors or thieves ofc, but still fairly playable.
I couldn’t find any build/thread/video of a bursty roamer guardian so i’m asking it here cuz i don’t want to find out at level 80 that guardian can only be a support tank or a fairly damaging but not mobile prof, i need mobility to be the priority for what i want to do.

You will want Warrior then. Guardian has no roaming capabilities what so ever. Swiftness =/= mobility as I argue. Warrior can be burst + tanky, where a guardian cannot.

But really, it sounds like you want to play a thief. They have the burst and mobility you’re looking for.

Warriors have nowhere near the same group support potential that Guardians have. Guards can provide excellent healing / boons that a Warrior just can’t even come close to. They also have some very nice situational utilities that can provide excellent group support.

I also think Guards can soak up much more damage than Warriors. The healing output of a Guardian is so high they can easily replenish what little health they have to begin with, plus some other key defensive abilities and utilities.

For damage though, I’d say Warrior takes the cake. They have much higher burst, and catching someone off-guard in pvp with the right build is pretty much a guaranteed insta-kill.

Iddiozzia.3489:

Guys i’ll ask a question here since i and don’t really know much about guardian or warriors at level 80.
I got both to level 20 right now and i can’t decide which one i should choose (mainly for wvw skirmishing and small group fights)
From the thread i could learn that warriors are more fit in the hit n run role so it would be the right choice, yet i like guardian spells much more and i wanted to know if it’s possible to do that on a guardian aswell.
In short, i need to know if it’s possible to build the guardian as a very mobile unit that hit n runs decently, worse than warriors or thieves ofc, but still fairly playable.
I couldn’t find any build/thread/video of a bursty roamer guardian so i’m asking it here cuz i don’t want to find out at level 80 that guardian can only be a support tank or a fairly damaging but not mobile prof, i need mobility to be the priority for what i want to do.

It’s not like guardians are slow, it’s just that they have bad burst. A warrior can literally jump on a squishy and kill it instantly with HB burst, guardians don’t have that option. They are good as roamers since they will almost always win 1v1s but not in the “hit and run” sense.

Roaming is different on a Guardian then other classes. To say we cannot roam is NOT correct. i do it all the time.

You need to be more situationally aware of your surroundings and understand just how far you can get when you have multiple people attacking you.

I roam around places where I can escape into or where I can get more help from NPC’s (which benefits from AH).

Group support for each is different. Guardians will focus on defensive (protection, retaliation, regen) support while Warriors focus on Mobility / Crit / Endurance. support. Both provide Might.

They both provide support. Just different. So chose which side of the coin you want to be on.

Warriors do not have ‘much higher burst’. I can pump out 8-13k quite easily.

Mighty Blow can do 4k-7k.
WW can do upwards of 8k
Not taking into account auto attacks hit from 1.1k-2k

And that’s w/ only 3.1k attk pwr, 44% crit & 75% crit dmg.

So get off the ‘we can’t burst’. It’s a lame arguement.

They are different playstles. You need to figure out which one suits your playstle. Both are melee.
Both support (just different)
Both have Burst.
Both can spec for damage soaking.
Warriors have better overall mobility. <- herein lies the difference.

[Edit] They have better mobility because thier mobility is tied to thier weapons whereas ours are in 2 of our weapons (GS / Sword) & Utlities.

Example: see the video I posted 15/0/30/20/5 – go to 3:45 to 3:53. I put out 11,096 dmg on a very Tanky Guardian in 8s. Only reason it wasn’t more was because I was on cooldown on weapon swap so no Mighty Blow.

It’s not a very class cannon spec either.

Tbh i don’t really need insane burst, i don’t want to jump on target and one hit them like thieves do, i already got my engi & ele for that.
What i really want is to roam the map looking for good 1vX or small group fights.
My greatest fear is that opponents run away from me easily, so i can’t get the kill, or that i can’t even engage em since they move faster.
Ofc i don’t pretend to catch a running thief, but i’d like to be able to chase running people and to get out of trouble if i see the enemy zerg in sight.
And in doing that, warrior looks a lot better.

I roam the map all the time. I don’t mind if I’m slow. Anything that gets in my way will just die. Those that get away are lucky

I have my view distance switched on full so I can see a zerg coming towards me before they can see me. This is the only thing that will make me change my course.

I enjoy 1vX situations. It actually tests me against multiple enemies. 1v1 with full cooldowns, I very rarely ever lose. Even if I do, it would only be about 1-2k between us.

A guardian is like a juggernaut. Once it gets going, you can’t stop it

11k in 8s isn’t a burst lol. Burst is taking down the target before he has time to unload his defensive options, like his heal skill. 8s is practically enough time to use your heal skill, pop any defensive stuff you have, attack a few times, take a short nap, and heal again.

Amins.3710:

Roaming is different on a Guardian then other classes. To say we cannot roam is NOT correct. i do it all the time.

You need to be more situationally aware of your surroundings and understand just how far you can get when you have multiple people attacking you.

I roam around places where I can escape into or where I can get more help from NPC’s (which benefits from AH).

So we can roam, its just more difficult. That’s the argument thats being presented

Amins.3710:

Group support for each is different. Guardians will focus on defensive (protection, retaliation, regen) support while Warriors focus on Mobility / Crit / Endurance. support. Both provide Might.

They both provide support. Just different. So chose which side of the coin you want to be on.

Guardian’s team-wide boons = might, swiftness, protection, stability, regen, retaliation, aegis. Most of these on relatively short CDs. Can pretty much keep protection, regen, and at least 12 stacks of might up constantly.

Warrior’s team-wide boons = might, fury, swiftness, regen. A banner Warrior can provide some decent buffs as well as long as you can keep everyone in range of the banners.

Now take into account the amount of healing a Guardian can dish out….A “support” Warrior just doesn’t even compare to a “support” Guardian.

Amins.3710:

Warriors do not have ‘much higher burst’. I can pump out 8-13k quite easily.

Mighty Blow can do 4k-7k.
WW can do upwards of 8k
Not taking into account auto attacks hit from 1.1k-2k

And that’s w/ only 3.1k attk pwr, 44% crit & 75% crit dmg.

So get off the ‘we can’t burst’. It’s a lame arguement.

[Edit] They have better mobility because thier mobility is tied to thier weapons whereas ours are in 2 of our weapons (GS / Sword) & Utlities.

Example: see the video I posted 15/0/30/20/5 – go to 3:45 to 3:53. I put out 11,096 dmg on a very Tanky Guardian in 8s. Only reason it wasn’t more was because I was on cooldown on weapon swap so no Mighty Blow.

It’s not a very class cannon spec either.

I’ve seen Warriors drop nearly 20k damage in sPvP in only 4-5 secs. Yes, clearly demonstrated by your video, guards can do some very nice damage, especially sustained damage, but a Warrior just has more burst. As in they can knock a player down, and kill them before they can get back up. No Guardian build can do that.

Guanglai Kangyi.4318:

Yeah no. Guardians have better defense and almost equivalent offense. If you think Guardians do little damage, congratulations, you’re another of the 99% of the playerbase that doesn’t realize they’re the second-highest DPS class in the game and are just making assumptions based on the name of the class, of all things.

I’m just going to start linking this post from now because it pretty much explains everything:

http://www.guildwars2guru.com/topic/78121-guardian-too-support-for-me/#entry2129000

the post you linked to is horribly biased and inaccurate. if this is what you’re using as a basis to your belief that guard deals better damage than warrior, i think you need to stop believing everyone that random jackoffs on the internet spew out.

whenever someone is claiming that warrior rifle is a condition weapon, that’s pretty much an “okay” to go ahead and tune them out, because they have no idea what they’re talking about.

guard’s damage output is extremely unreliable. symbols can be walked out of, and whirlwind is random as all hell.

It’s kind of an older video. Dates back to August, but other than player skill levels I don’t think much has changed for Warriors since then.

Just shows what “burst” is.

I play both, warrior is dps gs/hammer rifle swap weapons / tactics as needed between rifle/gs. I run a ton of cc, and play it like you would a pure dps class not a tanky warrior.

Guardian is just a beast, and and can do solid damage and group support. In your face brutalizer.

Warriors ability to group support / tanky type role is too limited currently.

If you are all about dps go rogue or warrior, if you want a tank/support type role go guardian.

Here’s a good example of some1 who hasn’t studied his guardian. Yes. STUDYING. Don’t like studying? Then you can’t be truly effective and bring out your classes full potential. The biggest mistake guardians in general do is trying to build themselves for damage trough TRAITS. You can do that with your gear. We have incredibly good traits and many of them have even better synergy with each other. Let’s take altruistic healing and empowering might for example. Altruistic healing=heal for each boon you provide to your allies. Empowering might= all your critical hits grant might to you and your allies. Not only do you heal yourself at almost ridiculous speed but you will also provide constant 10+ stacks of might.

Also remember that pve, WvW and pvp builds are completely different. Guardians have abilities that grant us way more survivability than warriors even tho we have lower health pool. Also, hammers son. Use them.
GS>Hammer is not a fact carved in stone. It’s completely opposite. Greatsword is great for taking on alot of mobs and it has some control as well BUT hammer has MB that has half the cooldown of WW plus awesome control skills that are just screaming for the right moments to stop, bind and knock back your enemies.

In PvP or WvW I never lose to a warrior because I have all dem buttons to keep them at bay and all the ranged classes just HATE wall of reflection. It’s a skill that changes the flow of battle in WvW and forces enemy lines to retreat.

Love your class and it will love you back. <3