Guild Wars 2

Just wondering, it’s been what feels like half a year of not playing GW2 and just checking up on the subreddit and forums to see whats up but I’m always still out of the loop. Have spirit weapons been changed (majorly) or completely removed from the game and replaced yet?

If not then that would be a shame and I will most likely not be returning to the game if that is so.

They are still in game and haven’t been changed since 2015.

Lahmia.2193:

They are still in game and haven’t been changed since 2015.

thanks for the info, such a kitten shame really. Hearing things like this makes me remember why I stopped playing in the 1st place. A complete lack of communication in regards to balance updates and such.

Always thought spirit weapons were the most interesting concept for the guardian, it’s too bad that Anet refused to listen to the general consensus that SW are bad and need to be removed or changed drastically for over 2+ years

Looks like i won’t be returning any time soon then, rip my sylvari guardian

I know Anet has said they want to fix spirit weapons, but who knows when that will happen. In my opinion to make them viable, all Anet would have to do is make them minions and last until killed.

Honnestly, I’d rather see them remove the whole minion thingy and give us the active skill instead. Though it would suck to lose the shield but it could also be a perfect way to actually change shield #5 into a relevant skill.

Since they ate spirits i say make them untargetable and unable to be hit or cc at all for while they are up. Also make them faster on moving much faster they need to be spirits that can warp to targets.

I agree with Dadnir. Though the way I’d redesign them is make it so each skill gives you a chance on hit effect (and have the weapons appear by your side in smaller forms). So like sword could have 50% chance to inflict burning on hit, Hammer could do KD etc etc.

Lahmia.2193:

I agree with Dadnir. Though the way I’d redesign them is make it so each skill gives you a chance on hit effect (and have the weapons appear by your side in smaller forms). So like sword could have 50% chance to inflict burning on hit, Hammer could do KD etc etc.

Hammer of Wisdom used to KB target every 3rd atack, dont know even if that was removed.

Aeolus.3615:

Lahmia.2193:

I agree with Dadnir. Though the way I’d redesign them is make it so each skill gives you a chance on hit effect (and have the weapons appear by your side in smaller forms). So like sword could have 50% chance to inflict burning on hit, Hammer could do KD etc etc.

Hammer of Wisdom used to KB target every 3rd atack, dont know even if that was removed.

It still knocks back every 3rd attack. Though the trait that gives burning to spirit weapons (2s per hit), doesn’t actually give full duration for each hammer hit.

Azoqu.8917:

Aeolus.3615:

Lahmia.2193:

I agree with Dadnir. Though the way I’d redesign them is make it so each skill gives you a chance on hit effect (and have the weapons appear by your side in smaller forms). So like sword could have 50% chance to inflict burning on hit, Hammer could do KD etc etc.

Hammer of Wisdom used to KB target every 3rd atack, dont know even if that was removed.

It still knocks back every 3rd attack. Though the trait that gives burning to spirit weapons (2s per hit), doesn’t actually give full duration for each hammer hit.

It doesnt matter a cleave on player that hits the SW will kill it so it will never hit or even it its its just one time

IF it was working Anet add to care about balance since it doesnt… they dont need to care lol… @Anet at balance not much to expect.

Abe Kleine.3568:

Lahmia.2193:

They are still in game and haven’t been changed since 2015.

thanks for the info, such a kitten shame really. Hearing things like this makes me remember why I stopped playing in the 1st place. A complete lack of communication in regards to balance updates and such.

Always thought spirit weapons were the most interesting concept for the guardian, it’s too bad that Anet refused to listen to the general consensus that SW are bad and need to be removed or changed drastically for over 2+ years

Looks like i won’t be returning any time soon then, rip my sylvari guardian

There was no lack of communication with balance updates here. Anet told us they were changing them and they did that. I get you don’t like certain things about the game, but don’t make up some BS to justify you not playing it.

This is truly one of the most odd reasons not to play a game.

Lahmia.2193:

This is truly one of the most odd reasons not to play a game.

I have to say that when i see people not play for such shallow reasons, that even if shallow reason #1 was fixed, they are just the next shallow reason away from leaving. I mean, Anet doesn’t communicate balance changes? Um, they have communicated EVERY single balance change they have ever made to us. Not sure what the OP is looking for.

Yea, I nearly quit the game because they haven’t given Guardians sai or kunai weapons yet…
/kappa

Quitting because of spirit weapons? Even I find this shallow and tomes and SW was the only reason I made and mained a guardian (and still do).

Anyway, during the last pvp Dev AMA, they said SW are one of the 4-5 skill types they want to improve, along with mantras, and a couple more I can’t remember.

How I would like to see, Spirit Weapons, changed.
1. Make them into Minions, last until killed.
2. Have them give buffs to you/group (Max 5 people.) while in the area of them (300 range.)
3. Shorter cooldowns on skills they have, or make the skills they have more effective.

Since the creation of Guardian the Spirit Weapons have been something I REALLY wanted to make use of, but can’t due to how they are now.

PLEASE ANet, throw us a bone on this.

RabbitUp.8294:

Quitting because of spirit weapons? Even I find this shallow and tomes and SW was the only reason I made and mained a guardian (and still do).

Anyway, during the last pvp Dev AMA, they said SW are one of the 4-5 skill types they want to improve, along with mantras, and a couple more I can’t remember.

That is astounding, and it only took them what, 3-4 years to figure it out after people had been telling them for years that those utilities were utterly worthless and that we needed something else.

It was mathematically proven that SW were bad, and they just… Said nothing.. For years.. Why would I want to continue playing when I know that it will take them forever to fix these commonly talked about issues?

Yea even this information won’t make me go back to the game. I’d guess that it will probably take another.. 6 months for any progress to be made what they said about SW

I suppose I’m shallow for thinking that when a gaming companies fans let them know that something doesn’t work, or is actually statistically bad for 4 years and they do nothing that I’m supposed to just go along with that

Abe Kleine.3568:

RabbitUp.8294:

Quitting because of spirit weapons? Even I find this shallow and tomes and SW was the only reason I made and mained a guardian (and still do).

Anyway, during the last pvp Dev AMA, they said SW are one of the 4-5 skill types they want to improve, along with mantras, and a couple more I can’t remember.

That is astounding, and it only took them what, 3-4 years to figure it out after people had been telling them for years that those utilities were utterly worthless and that we needed something else.

It was mathematically proven that SW were bad, and they just… Said nothing.. For years.. Why would I want to continue playing when I know that it will take them forever to fix these commonly talked about issues?

Yea even this information won’t make me go back to the game. I’d guess that it will probably take another.. 6 months for any progress to be made what they said about SW

I suppose I’m shallow for thinking that when a gaming companies fans let them know that something doesn’t work, or is actually statistically bad for 4 years and they do nothing that I’m supposed to just go along with that

Actually, what you describe isn’t exceptional at all. It’s not statistically bad for something like this to exist for 4 years. It’s not statistically bad for something like this to exist for an entire game lifetime. It’s simply actually; SW’s aren’t a priority to adjust, just because they aren’t the optimal set of skills. I think that’s a pretty garbage reason to look at them considering we have lots of other good skills we can rely upon.

Anyways, I’m not sure where your expectations come from but if you think that somehow Anet devs are unique in how they handle this stuff, it would be incorrect.

No, it’s pretty bad actually, especially compared to a lot of other games. Build diversity is always a good reason to fix things. Fortunately, if recent balance patches are any indication, it seems like build diversity is at least somewhat one of their priorities.

RabbitUp.8294:

Anyway, during the last pvp Dev AMA, they said SW are one of the 4-5 skill types they want to improve, along with mantras, and a couple more I can’t remember.

Do you have the source for that?

Fashion Mage.3712:

RabbitUp.8294:

Anyway, during the last pvp Dev AMA, they said SW are one of the 4-5 skill types they want to improve, along with mantras, and a couple more I can’t remember.

Do you have the source for that?

Source.

RabbitUp.8294:

Source.

Thanks. It’s so nice to see a dev saying that. Looks like underused skills really are one of their priorities then.

Fashion Mage.3712:

No, it’s pretty bad actually, especially compared to a lot of other games. Build diversity is always a good reason to fix things. Fortunately, if recent balance patches are any indication, it seems like build diversity is at least somewhat one of their priorities.

RabbitUp.8294:

Anyway, during the last pvp Dev AMA, they said SW are one of the 4-5 skill types they want to improve, along with mantras, and a couple more I can’t remember.

Do you have the source for that?

WE have lots of build diversity so that makes no sense.

Obtena.7952:

WE have lots of build diversity so that makes no sense.

I was referring to the fact that it’s bad that they’d let something remain in such a broken and unviable state for about 5 years straight. The fact that a class has “enough” decent skills does not excuse poorly balancing other skills. Of course, as I already mentioned, it seems like they also realize that’s bad, if that dev’s post is any indication (as well as the buffs to underused utilities like signets/consecrations).

Anet has lots of priorities when it comes to skill balance.

Look for Abuses and exploits
Develop a fix
Test the fix
Look at the current meta.
Check performance of “tier 1” skills.
Check performance of “tier 2” skills.
Determine changes if any
Test changes
Develop new skills
Test new skills
Check performance of “tier 3” skills
Develop changes if any
Test changes
Determine changes for “tier 4” skills
Test changes

Anet only has so many people who are involved in skill balance, and they need to go through at least these steps (likely more) for not only each of the 9 professions, but for every enemy (mobs, champions, raids, dungeons, fractals, open world, unique variations, etc), environmental, and machine (siege, generic “Press ‘F’ to use”, etc). All of these things take time, especially when you try to look at the wide game changing effects skills can have and the multiple iterations of testing needed. Just look at the Frost Gun. It wasn’t until long after Deathly Chill had been changed to add 3 stacks of bleeding per chill that the Frost Gun went from forgotten to abused. In fact, Spirit Weapons have been changed a few times, so while they might not be meta or meta supporting skills, they certainly had more attention over the years than many other skills. Its good that Spirit Weapons are likely to get an overhaul, but we can’t expect every skill to get 100% of the attention 100% of the time, especially when you have so much to constantly monitor. You can’t spend as much time developing when you have to keep the game running smoothly.

SW was a build I used first back at launch, simply because it was easy and annoying to go up against (anything invulnerable is annoying). Darn near every build has AI but I don’t think AI should ever carry the player.

1 spirit weapon build I knew of PreHoT utilized Staff + sHammer/sSword/sBow and that build was hard to use. It was difficult because you had to micro manage your spirit’s Commands as well as micro manage your staff skills for survival/cc purposes.

A Spirit build with with high risk and high reward is what we should get; something we need to micro manage to make effective.

For one I don’t think anet should be looking to improve Spirit weapons because they are AI. No meta should ever rely on AI creatures (flashbacks to cancer turret spam).

Lahmia.2193:

For one I don’t think anet should be looking to improve Spirit weapons because they are AI. No meta should ever rely on AI creatures (flashbacks to cancer turret spam).

Then they should redesign the spiritual weapons… and let players place them with the flags like we controlled the enchies or make them fully acompany the caster.

1 minute CD is way to much, they barelly live more than 1 hit…
the time it takes to use them on combat against another player its eneight to get from full health zero due how the game is based on power creep.

Lahmia.2193:

For one I don’t think anet should be looking to improve Spirit weapons because they are AI.

You know what, you’re right. They should just delete spirit weapons, and rangers too while they’re at it. /s

Since when has anything been balanced based on how easy it is to use.

Fashion Mage.3712:

Lahmia.2193:

For one I don’t think anet should be looking to improve Spirit weapons because they are AI.

You know what, you’re right. They should just delete spirit weapons, and rangers too while they’re at it. /s

Since when has anything been balanced based on how easy it is to use.

I guess you didn’t live through the pvp Turret tank Engi meta? It’s a stark reminder of why AI skills should never be top tier or even meta.
Talk about a drama queen though. I never said delete them. If people want to use them they can. But at the end of the day, AI takes no skill to use and does the work for you. That’s never a healthy thing for a game.
As for Rangers, well that’s something a lot of players have been wanting to be removed or revamped. Hell the the biggest speculation about Druid was whether or not they’d implement it. But it is just the 1 AI minion, so it isn’t something that can carry you through the game. So I have no qualms with it.
edit: also look at the 2 current farms going on in Lake Doric and Bitterfrost Frontier. Afk farmers using Engi turrets or Necro minions to kill stuff for them.

Necros have AI that they bring to pvp, so if that’s acceptable, then Spirit Weapons should be as well.

Keeping a whole skill type at a sorry state because it’s against your sensibilities is stupid, those skills exist and they shouldn’t awful to use.

RabbitUp.8294:

Necros have AI that they bring to pvp, so if that’s acceptable, then Spirit Weapons should be as well.

Keeping a whole skill type at a sorry state because it’s against your sensibilities is stupid, those skills exist and they shouldn’t awful to use.

Who says you can’t bring Spirit Weapons to pvp? I mean you’ll get laughed at for sure, but no less than necros who bring a full set of minions.

RabbitUp.8294:

Necros have AI that they bring to pvp, so if that’s acceptable, then Spirit Weapons should be as well.

Keeping a whole skill type at a sorry state because it’s against your sensibilities is stupid, those skills exist and they shouldn’t awful to use.

^

Lahmia.2193:

I guess you didn’t live through the pvp Turret tank Engi meta? It’s a stark reminder of why AI skills should never be top tier or even meta.

You bet I did. It got hard-countered by anyone who had enough of a brain to use a ranged build like a glass staff ele. Unfortunately, most players don’t have that quality so they just brainlessly gravitate towards the current month’s meta builds regardless of their actual effectiveness, so ANet had to nerf turrets to compensate. I don’t expect to win against a warrior (who are coincidentally fairly easy to play) with a support guardian, and I wouldn’t expect to win against a turret engi with a melee build. Sometimes using one’s brain and thinking things through is more important than raw skill. Of course the big difference between turret engis and spirit weapons is that spirit weapons have the counterplay of being focused down fairly easily, and they function a lot more like ranged weapons rather than point defense.

Lahmia.2193:

Talk about a drama queen though. I never said delete them. If people want to use them they can. But at the end of the day, AI takes no skill to use and does the work for you. That’s never a healthy thing for a game.

“I never said delete them. I just think that if you use them people should laugh at you and flame you.”

Fashion Mage.3712:

Lahmia.2193:

Talk about a drama queen though. I never said delete them. If people want to use them they can. But at the end of the day, AI takes no skill to use and does the work for you. That’s never a healthy thing for a game.

“I never said delete them. I just think that if you use them people should laugh at you and flame you.”

There’s a big difference between knowing someone will laugh at you and wanting someone to laugh at you. But I’m sure a wise and intelligent person such as yourself should see the difference.

RabbitUp.8294:

Necros have AI that they bring to pvp, so if that’s acceptable, then Spirit Weapons should be as well.

Keeping a whole skill type at a sorry state because it’s against your sensibilities is stupid, those skills exist and they shouldn’t awful to use.

well that is the problem shield SW tends to go out of combat and get close to something that is red cause the A.I thinks it is a actacking weapon, same happens with the bow, they should just stick close to the caster, or return to the caster after command.

sword and hammer are okish they are offensive so the offensive a.i is rigth still any one with passive speed outruns them, and theydie with 1-2 hits.

Minor changes could make them more playable.

If I were to change spirit weapons it would be to make them into conjured weapons similar to elementalist ones but with different effects more closely resembling guardian skills. Relying more on control and defensive skills rather than just damage.

I would like them to work like Ranger spirits, they grant on-hit effects to allies but don’t attack, then you can use the second skill to animate them, where they perform a special skill and then autoattack your target for a few seconds.

If they stay as minions,then they should last indefinitely like Necro minions. At least then I could use ranger runes for open pve.

The easiest solution is for Spirit Weapons to act like regular Necro minions. Then Shield and Bow need a damaging auto attack so they can interact with Expeditious Spirit. If Shield swapped its command and auto, that would work perfectly. Bow just needs to have its arrows bounce between enemy and ally and that would suffice.

Just those changes would give Spirit Weapons a niche. Weapon stats could then be adjusted until they hit their sweet spot.

Note:
-spirit weapons, shield and hammer on command go trough gates.
-SW weapons casted under water, dont share land skills CD, so u can have all the 4 SW plus traps or shouts.

Tough i could use this thread for some info.