Guild Wars 2

preface:
This is thinking in the context of pve/raids.
There is a lot of potential, but it is falling just a bit short compared to taking an ele healer, which can in a pinch cover heals for an entire raid squad, just like a druid. Obviously both fall short of druid, but they should be able to fill a niche where greater support is favoured over raw dps buffs.

Guardian as healer is an interesting playstyle, heavily using aegis with Pure of Heart

proposed improvements

Signet of Courage
Increase passive radius to 600, in line with soothing mist and virtue of resolve

Increase the tick frequency to 3 seconds ( from 10),
Reduce base healing to 1/3 266 ( from 808), reduce hp scale to 0.15 ( from 0.5).

Virtue of resolve

Increase the duration of the buff provided by Battle Presence from 3s to 5/9/10 seconds, in line with either: banners ,buffs, or Soothing mist.

Possibly:
A slight raise in healing power scale, to 0.1 ( from 0.06)in line with Soothing mist
OR
A slight buff to Absolute Resolution to 33/50% healing raise ( from 25%). Comparing to Soothing Power, while considering the addition of condi cleanse, and lower tier trait.

Reasoning:
The changes to the elite signet is mostly QoL, the range making it much easier to distribute the heal ticks to allies, while making them smaller and more frequent also makes it less likely to be wasted by overhealing.

The change in duration to virtue of resolve/battle presence is simply to bring it more into like with other healer capabilities in raids – to in a pinch heal the entire raid. Watching soothing mist uptime in bgdm – uptime is typically more than 75% on average amongst all 10 squad members. Obviously subject to some fluctuations.

Comparing
Ele: which has to be attuned to water, with soothing power traited
Guard: which has to occupy it’s elite skill slot, and two traits.

Guard should be able to compete at raid-wide heal ticks – though with slightly lower heal ticks due to also providing 15% endurance regen via Purity of Body.

I’m unsure if resolve needs a boost to heal output, given the endurance gain, and option to use the elite signet. Though it would be nice.

I’d make it auto-target the ally with the lowest health in a 1200 radius personally, since I can’t really stand seeing any more 600-range point blank support abilities.

maybe also making the elite signet castable while moving?

Even if you make those changes. No one will take a guardian over a Druid.

Mostly because of these two skills right here:

[&BwkIAAA=]

[&Bl57AAA=]

20% damage boost from that alone almost merely from existing. One of them being raid-wide.

You want healer guardian to be a thing? We need to have the rest of them normalized first.

Sure, A-Net could do the dumbest thing ever and give Guardian healer something similar, but guess what? That creates a new problem of creating a system where half the raid might be taking up these weird %damage boosting classes that would cause the whole game balance to disappear entirely.

These changes would be fine/fair but I have to agree with this guy,

Fashion Mage.3712:

I’d make it auto-target the ally with the lowest health in a 1200 radius personally, since I can’t really stand seeing any more 600-range point blank support abilities.

There is a lot of free pbaoe support ingame atm. The guardian has a lot themselves.

Just want to point out that you have a few numbers confused. Especially when comparing to Soothing Mist which has a 1.0 (not 0.1) scale on HP. That’s before the trait is taken into account as well.

TexZero.7910:

Just want to point out that you have a few numbers confused. Especially when comparing to Soothing Mist which has a 1.0 (not 0.1) scale on HP. That’s before the trait is taken into account as well.

Somewhat incorrect.

The soothing mist scale of 1.0 is over the 10 second duration of the buff, not per second.

edit: I’m wondering if the scale on resolve is over the 3s duration, or per second now though. I didn’t check that. Which may further justify a slight raise in that scale. Particularly at least to keep the hp scale/sec the same with a duration increase from BP.

Artemis Thuras.8795:

TexZero.7910:

Just want to point out that you have a few numbers confused. Especially when comparing to Soothing Mist which has a 1.0 (not 0.1) scale on HP. That’s before the trait is taken into account as well.

Somewhat incorrect.

The soothing mist scale of 1.0 is over the 10 second duration of the buff, not per second.

edit: I’m wondering if the scale on resolve is over the 3s duration, or per second now though. I didn’t check that. Which may further justify a slight raise in that scale. Particularly at least to keep the hp scale/sec the same with a duration increase from BP.

I’d have to math it, but i’m pretty sure the scale is not based on time but on how much it increases per point of healing power.

IE soothing mist takes 100% value from healing power, while Resolve takes .06 or 6% of your total healing power into account.

TexZero.7910:

Artemis Thuras.8795:

TexZero.7910:

Just want to point out that you have a few numbers confused. Especially when comparing to Soothing Mist which has a 1.0 (not 0.1) scale on HP. That’s before the trait is taken into account as well.

Somewhat incorrect.

The soothing mist scale of 1.0 is over the 10 second duration of the buff, not per second.

edit: I’m wondering if the scale on resolve is over the 3s duration, or per second now though. I didn’t check that. Which may further justify a slight raise in that scale. Particularly at least to keep the hp scale/sec the same with a duration increase from BP.

I’d have to math it, but i’m pretty sure the scale is not based on time but on how much it increases per point of healing power.

IE soothing mist takes 100% value from healing power, while Resolve takes .06 or 6% of your total healing power into account.

Yes, soothing mist heal is increase by 1.0 * healing power.. over the full 10 second duration of the buff. Which is 0.1 coeff/second.

If it was raised by 1.0 on each tick, soothing mist alone could heal for more than 1.5k/s, just from healing power alone ( not counting base healing, or any other outgoing buffs). Which it does not.

As I said.. I didn’t think to check if virtue of resolve is scaling in the same way ( I suspect it is). Though I still wouldn’t justify much above say 0.06 (coeffs/second) vs soothing mists 0.1/s due to other effects available with the virtue. However that might actually be a coeff ( with the current 3s buff) of 0.18 (up from 0.06).

If the duration were to be raised, the coeff would have to rise in line- to maintain the same heal/tick.

Artemis Thuras.8795:

TexZero.7910:

Artemis Thuras.8795:

TexZero.7910:

Just want to point out that you have a few numbers confused. Especially when comparing to Soothing Mist which has a 1.0 (not 0.1) scale on HP. That’s before the trait is taken into account as well.

Somewhat incorrect.

The soothing mist scale of 1.0 is over the 10 second duration of the buff, not per second.

edit: I’m wondering if the scale on resolve is over the 3s duration, or per second now though. I didn’t check that. Which may further justify a slight raise in that scale. Particularly at least to keep the hp scale/sec the same with a duration increase from BP.

I’d have to math it, but i’m pretty sure the scale is not based on time but on how much it increases per point of healing power.

IE soothing mist takes 100% value from healing power, while Resolve takes .06 or 6% of your total healing power into account.

Yes, soothing mist heal is increase by 1.0 * healing power.. over the full 10 second duration of the buff. Which is 0.1 coeff/second.

If it was raised by 1.0 on each tick, soothing mist alone could heal for more than 1.5k/s, just from healing power alone ( not counting base healing, or any other outgoing buffs). Which it does not.

As I said.. I didn’t think to check if virtue of resolve is scaling in the same way ( I suspect it is). Though I still wouldn’t justify much above say 0.06 (coeffs/second) vs soothing mists 0.1/s due to other effects available with the virtue. However that might actually be a coeff ( with the current 3s buff) of 0.18 (up from 0.06).

If the duration were to be raised, the coeff would have to rise in line- to maintain the same heal/tick.

Again though Soothing mist tick isn’t 1 per 10. The duration of the buff is 10 seconds if you swap. It ticks once every 3 seconds. So even using your version here its a .33 coeff not a .1

TexZero.7910:

Artemis Thuras.8795:

TexZero.7910:

Artemis Thuras.8795:

TexZero.7910:

Just want to point out that you have a few numbers confused. Especially when comparing to Soothing Mist which has a 1.0 (not 0.1) scale on HP. That’s before the trait is taken into account as well.

Somewhat incorrect.

The soothing mist scale of 1.0 is over the 10 second duration of the buff, not per second.

edit: I’m wondering if the scale on resolve is over the 3s duration, or per second now though. I didn’t check that. Which may further justify a slight raise in that scale. Particularly at least to keep the hp scale/sec the same with a duration increase from BP.

I’d have to math it, but i’m pretty sure the scale is not based on time but on how much it increases per point of healing power.

IE soothing mist takes 100% value from healing power, while Resolve takes .06 or 6% of your total healing power into account.

Yes, soothing mist heal is increase by 1.0 * healing power.. over the full 10 second duration of the buff. Which is 0.1 coeff/second.

If it was raised by 1.0 on each tick, soothing mist alone could heal for more than 1.5k/s, just from healing power alone ( not counting base healing, or any other outgoing buffs). Which it does not.

As I said.. I didn’t think to check if virtue of resolve is scaling in the same way ( I suspect it is). Though I still wouldn’t justify much above say 0.06 (coeffs/second) vs soothing mists 0.1/s due to other effects available with the virtue. However that might actually be a coeff ( with the current 3s buff) of 0.18 (up from 0.06).

If the duration were to be raised, the coeff would have to rise in line- to maintain the same heal/tick.

Again though Soothing mist tick isn’t 1 per 10. The duration of the buff is 10 seconds if you swap. It ticks once every 3 seconds. So even using your version here its a .33 coeff not a .1

Soothing mist heals once per second, for 10 seconds. The total heal over that 10 seconds has a coefficient of 1.0. Coefficients per second is 0.1.

It’s ok, math is hard.

edit: just realised, I (probably incorrectly) assumed virtue of resolve would scale the same way regen does.
That is recalculated each second, how much to heal for. With its coefficient being per second ( if it wasn’t, long stacks would be trash, while short stacks would be brokenly OP).
Which no doubt muddys the puddle even further.

In my opinion – no, no, and no.

Why fix what isn’t broken? (that is, the current state of healers at the moment)

Yobculture.5786:

In my opinion – no, no, and no.

Why fix what isn’t broken? (that is, the current state of healers at the moment)

Each to their own.

In my opinion, the descendant of the gw1 monk ( The healer class of the game) not being at least viable ( competitive with others) is silly.
Also, there’s a good chance you will be disappointed when we get new elite specs. With 9 of them, there’s a good chance at least one will be a healer spec.

Druid healer: heals you, boosts your dps
Guardian healer: heals you, screws over your dps (light field bonanza)

I’d say lets start repairs there.

ZeftheWicked.3076:

Druid healer: heals you, boosts your dps
Guardian healer: heals you, screws over your dps (light field bonanza)

I’d say lets start repairs there.

and u need to get close range most of time :\ its a dammn potato with slow mace healing , slow mace symbol.

guardian to be effective defender needs more vit and healign power quoficients, or power creep needs to be reduced on most gimmicks.

A guardian generally has a lot more range than a druid when healing, except when using a mace. Not that the mace is a good healing weapon.

The biggest issue with guardian healing is druid. Guardians can heal just fine, but there really is no reason to take anything other than druid, ever.
Grace of the land has to go, or it needs to be made a non-unique buff available to all healers. I’m in favor of the 1st option.

Ozzrel.9825:

The biggest issue with guardian healing is druid. Guardians can heal just fine, but there really is no reason to take anything other than druid, ever.
Grace of the land has to go, or it needs to be made a non-unique buff available to all healers. I’m in favor of the 1st option.

I’d nerf it into just providing might stacks. This means future healing builds can be considered as an alternative to druid.

Alongside this, normalize might generating abilities to compete well with Phalanx Strength so PS Warriors aren’t locked solely as PS/Condi-PS or Pure Condi Berzerker in their builds.

What keeps me away from trying Guardian Healer again are:

Mace #2 and last hit of #1 are too slow. The mace #2 should be reduced to ~0.75s cast time and the last hit of chain of #1 should be reduced to 0.5~0.75s but reduce the damage to keep the same of the current DPS. Mace now is the worst weapon that Guardian have, it could have some small changes like the cast time.

As you pointed out, the Signet of Courage is useless – both passive and active. It really needs some changes/buffs. The active Should have 2~2.5s of cast time or allow to cast while moving. Your suggestions for the passive seems good.

I never bothered to use Battle Presence because this trait does too little (even with high healing power), ever more if compared to Indomitable Courage. It should at least be able to work even when the Virtue of Resolve is on cooldown or at least other change/buff.

Mikau.6920:

What keeps me away from trying Guardian Healer again are:

Mace #2 and last hit of #1 are too slow. The mace #2 should be reduced to ~0.75s cast time and the last hit of chain of #1 should be reduced to 0.5~0.75s but reduce the damage to keep the same of the current DPS. Mace now is the worst weapon that Guardian have, it could have some small changes like the cast time.

As you pointed out, the Signet of Courage is useless – both passive and active. It really needs some changes/buffs. The active Should have 2~2.5s of cast time or allow to cast while moving. Your suggestions for the passive seems good.

I never bothered to use Battle Presence because this trait does too little (even with high healing power), ever more if compared to Indomitable Courage. It should at least be able to work even when the Virtue of Resolve is on cooldown or at least other change/buff.

Battle presence does work while virtue of resolve is on cd.
I still want the duration change ( and coeff tweaked to at least maintain current hp/s).

Artemis Thuras.8795:

Mikau.6920:

What keeps me away from trying Guardian Healer again are:

Mace #2 and last hit of #1 are too slow. The mace #2 should be reduced to ~0.75s cast time and the last hit of chain of #1 should be reduced to 0.5~0.75s but reduce the damage to keep the same of the current DPS. Mace now is the worst weapon that Guardian have, it could have some small changes like the cast time.

As you pointed out, the Signet of Courage is useless – both passive and active. It really needs some changes/buffs. The active Should have 2~2.5s of cast time or allow to cast while moving. Your suggestions for the passive seems good.

I never bothered to use Battle Presence because this trait does too little (even with high healing power), ever more if compared to Indomitable Courage. It should at least be able to work even when the Virtue of Resolve is on cooldown or at least other change/buff.

Battle presence does work while virtue of resolve is on cd.
I still want the duration change ( and coeff tweaked to at least maintain current hp/s).

I just tested. the Battle Presence does not work when Virtue is on cooldown. Test by yourself. I tested both core Guard and DH, none work when the virtue is on cooldown.

Mikau.6920:

Artemis Thuras.8795:

Mikau.6920:

What keeps me away from trying Guardian Healer again are:

Mace #2 and last hit of #1 are too slow. The mace #2 should be reduced to ~0.75s cast time and the last hit of chain of #1 should be reduced to 0.5~0.75s but reduce the damage to keep the same of the current DPS. Mace now is the worst weapon that Guardian have, it could have some small changes like the cast time.

As you pointed out, the Signet of Courage is useless – both passive and active. It really needs some changes/buffs. The active Should have 2~2.5s of cast time or allow to cast while moving. Your suggestions for the passive seems good.

I never bothered to use Battle Presence because this trait does too little (even with high healing power), ever more if compared to Indomitable Courage. It should at least be able to work even when the Virtue of Resolve is on cooldown or at least other change/buff.

Battle presence does work while virtue of resolve is on cd.
I still want the duration change ( and coeff tweaked to at least maintain current hp/s).

I just tested. the Battle Presence does not work when Virtue is on cooldown. Test by yourself. I tested both core Guard and DH, none work when the virtue is on cooldown.

Battle presence doesn’t apply to yourself. Go test again. With an ally this time.

Tested it on some random person in DR, it doesn’t work. Thanks for wasting 10 seconds of my life.

Ozzrel.9825:

Tested it on some random person in DR, it doesn’t work. Thanks for wasting 10 seconds of my life.

[s]Did you remember target cap?
Did you try with someone in party so they get priority?

If it genuinely doesn’t work, then it’s only recently changed.[/s]
Never mind, it’s not that either. Not sure if it’s a bug ( or bug fix), or if anet is messing with guardian stuff in preparation for something.

Also, sarcasm isn’t helpful.

Artemis Thuras.8795:

Ozzrel.9825:

Tested it on some random person in DR, it doesn’t work. Thanks for wasting 10 seconds of my life.

[s]Did you remember target cap?
Did you try with someone in party so they get priority?

If it genuinely doesn’t work, then it’s only recently changed.[/s]
Never mind, it’s not that either. Not sure if it’s a bug ( or bug fix), or if anet is messing with guardian stuff in preparation for something.

Also, sarcasm isn’t helpful.

I remember they changed to not work on cooldown in some patch ago, I don’t remember which one, I believe they even mentioned in the patch notes, I’m not sure.

They only made the useless even more useless.