Guild Wars 2

Post here if you disagree with this.

skill #1 literally couldn’t hit a fish in a barrel in pvp
skill #3 can’t be fired behind you and is about as practical as trying to stop a gunman by shooting his bullets with your own bullets in actual application.
skill #4 can’t be fired behind you and takes entirely too long to land.
skill #5 has way too long of a root for the ward effect to take effect in the last shot.

not to mention all the under 500 range “obstructed” errors with all the skills.

I really want to know where Anet is getting these “well received” feedbacks from, happy go lucky PvE streamers that only roleplay and farm silverwastes?

This is probably one of the most out of touch statements Anet has ever made. I haven’t seen a single post that thought Longbow was a solid weapon.

Doesn’t matter. Proof will be in the changes and ultimately what is implemented in HoT release. I doubt much of the good feedback was from PVE streamers … the DH spec, LBow and traps have little to offer for PVE.

I was, and I posted about it right after the bwe was over.

Was it perfect? no, but aside from several tweaks that were echoed in a lot of other players posts, most of the other players I saw were also mostly happy with the bow.

I saw much much much more negative feedback concerning LB than I did positive. It’s slow, clunky, and roots. Just FYI to anyone reviewing: Those aren’t positive things.

Darknicrofia.2604:

Post here if you disagree with this.

skill #1 literally couldn’t hit a fish in a barrel in pvp
skill #3 can’t be fired behind you and is about as practical as trying to stop a gunman by shooting his bullets with your own bullets in actual application.
skill #4 can’t be fired behind you and takes entirely too long to land.
skill #5 has way too long of a root for the ward effect to take effect in the last shot.

not to mention all the under 500 range “obstructed” errors with all the skills.

I really want to know where Anet is getting these “well received” feedbacks from, happy go lucky PvE streamers that only roleplay and farm silverwastes?

So, basically we were looking at a slightly buggy beta-test weapon and plenty of folks could see the intent through the minutia.

The auto-facing will get fixed. That’s like 1/50 the magnitude of change that was giving Revenants weapon swap this late in the development cycle. The obstructed messages were obviously a bug. The damage is undertuned — likely deliberately — so they could make adjustments up, rather than down depending on if somebody surprised them with an unexpectedly powerful build/rotation.

So I can agree with your list and still “receive the weapon well” because the design of the weapon shines through and when it’s been debuged and some numbers tweaked the actual effects will still be the same and they will offer some very interesting gameplay.

Nike.2631:

Darknicrofia.2604:

Post here if you disagree with this.

skill #1 literally couldn’t hit a fish in a barrel in pvp
skill #3 can’t be fired behind you and is about as practical as trying to stop a gunman by shooting his bullets with your own bullets in actual application.
skill #4 can’t be fired behind you and takes entirely too long to land.
skill #5 has way too long of a root for the ward effect to take effect in the last shot.

not to mention all the under 500 range “obstructed” errors with all the skills.

I really want to know where Anet is getting these “well received” feedbacks from, happy go lucky PvE streamers that only roleplay and farm silverwastes?

So, basically we were looking at a slightly buggy beta-test weapon and plenty of folks could see the intent through the minutia.

The auto-facing will get fixed. That’s like 1/50 the magnitude of change that was giving Revenants weapon swap this late in the development cycle. The obstructed messages were obviously a bug. The damage is undertuned — likely deliberately — so they could make adjustments up, rather than down depending on if somebody surprised them with an unexpectedly powerful build/rotation.

So I can agree with your list and still “receive the weapon well” because the design of the weapon shines through and when it’s been debuged and some numbers tweaked the actual effects will still be the same and they will offer some very interesting gameplay.

Incredibly optimistic post that I hope reigns true. Sure the auto facing will likely change but i’m uncertain about a difference in the bow’s damage.

No issues with the bow’s overall design. Huge issues with their idea of how traps are suppose to work with it.

Darknicrofia.2604:

skill #3 can’t be fired behind you and is about as practical as trying to stop a gunman by shooting his bullets with your own bullets in actual application.

Your comparison made me lol. Agreed though.

Imo this skill requires far too much skill and luck to be used as intended by the devs. Would be great if the skill straight up reflected projectiles. I doubt we’re gonna get this skill firing behind us though. Mechanically speaking this is a forward firing skill.

That’s the thing, deflecting shot on paper sounds like a skill shot but in practicality is merely a woefully low damage blind luck shot (that also requires 2 clicks instead of 2).

Other than stopping the occasional rapid fire, deflecting shot has no place in GW2’s fast paced combat.

It being used to purposely stop anything useful besides firing randomly in the direction of a WvW zerg has about as much chance as happening as a GW1 ranger distracting shooting another ranger’s distracting shot.

They used the same “well received” bs on the ele forum. “The concepts behind overloading an element were pretty well received”

Westwater.1095:

This is probably one of the most out of touch statements Anet has ever made. I haven’t seen a single post that thought Longbow was a solid weapon.

I don’t know if they’re just pretending to think this, or if they actually don’t know. They must be pretty blind if it’s the latter.

I wish they would’ve stuck to the leaked longbow.

Cmon guys be realistic LONGBOW IS OP ON GUARDIANS !!

Just hope they can be better and hope is a kitten sometimes

I honestly couldnt find anything enjoyable about DH the casted/broken virtues killed it for me. The traps except fragments of faith felt wrong since they take away from guardian support. Traits were mostly poorly designed and dont synergize with other lines. As a result I deleted my DH and played my weak reaper and revenant the rest of the beta. Despite being incredibly weak in pve they felt fun. They felt undertuned and not broken unlike DH.

Well received by whom, anyway? It could very well be true that “the concepts behind overloading an element” were well received because 1) they just mention the concept, not the implementation and 2) they don’t have to be talking about people who dissect game mechanics or even post much on forums.

Darknicrofia.2604:

Post here if you disagree with this.

skill #1 literally couldn’t hit a fish in a barrel in pvp
skill #3 can’t be fired behind you and is about as practical as trying to stop a gunman by shooting his bullets with your own bullets in actual application.
skill #4 can’t be fired behind you and takes entirely too long to land.
skill #5 has way too long of a root for the ward effect to take effect in the last shot.

not to mention all the under 500 range “obstructed” errors with all the skills.

I really want to know where Anet is getting these “well received” feedbacks from, happy go lucky PvE streamers that only roleplay and farm silverwastes?

think u also forgot #2 roots u

Come on Anet, “well received” ?? Unless you are blind or just selectively read more friendly topics, which I couldn’t even find. Pretty much pure outrage and where do you get “well received” ? See folks, this is why the Guardian class don’t get any meaningful fixes on things that aren’t working. The derv practically look at a sick man and decides he needs a cookie to feel better. They take swears and in-the-face criticism for compliments. Seems like we don’t even speak the same language. Honestly, what can we do anymore to get things in their head. Please let Roy take charge of Guardian too.

Jaxom.7310:

Darknicrofia.2604:

Post here if you disagree with this.

skill #1 literally couldn’t hit a fish in a barrel in pvp
skill #3 can’t be fired behind you and is about as practical as trying to stop a gunman by shooting his bullets with your own bullets in actual application.
skill #4 can’t be fired behind you and takes entirely too long to land.
skill #5 has way too long of a root for the ward effect to take effect in the last shot.

not to mention all the under 500 range “obstructed” errors with all the skills.

I really want to know where Anet is getting these “well received” feedbacks from, happy go lucky PvE streamers that only roleplay and farm silverwastes?

think u also forgot #2 roots u

I’m of the opinion that the root on #2 is just fine. it is currently the guardian’s hardest hitting skill, capable of doing more burst damage than even focus 5 or hammer 2.

I’d rather it keep the burst aspect than removing the root at the cost of like a 20% damage nerf.

Darknicrofia.2604:

Jaxom.7310:

Darknicrofia.2604:

Post here if you disagree with this.

skill #1 literally couldn’t hit a fish in a barrel in pvp
skill #3 can’t be fired behind you and is about as practical as trying to stop a gunman by shooting his bullets with your own bullets in actual application.
skill #4 can’t be fired behind you and takes entirely too long to land.
skill #5 has way too long of a root for the ward effect to take effect in the last shot.

not to mention all the under 500 range “obstructed” errors with all the skills.

I really want to know where Anet is getting these “well received” feedbacks from, happy go lucky PvE streamers that only roleplay and farm silverwastes?

think u also forgot #2 roots u

I’m of the opinion that the root on #2 is just fine. it is currently the guardian’s hardest hitting skill, capable of doing more burst damage than even focus 5 or hammer 2.

I’d rather it keep the burst aspect than removing the root at the cost of like a 20% damage nerf.

shhh, don’t give them ideas for guard nerfs, those have a better chance to be read/implemented than actual fixes axed for

Darknicrofia.2604:

Post here if you disagree with this.

skill #1 literally couldn’t hit a fish in a barrel in pvp
skill #3 can’t be fired behind you and is about as practical as trying to stop a gunman by shooting his bullets with your own bullets in actual application.
skill #4 can’t be fired behind you and takes entirely too long to land.
skill #5 has way too long of a root for the ward effect to take effect in the last shot.

not to mention all the under 500 range “obstructed” errors with all the skills.

I really want to know where Anet is getting these “well received” feedbacks from, happy go lucky PvE streamers that only roleplay and farm silverwastes?

Remember the Developers are not using the same build we played. Their inhouse testers are using a different build of Dragon Huntet. All Elite specialization were nerfed in the public beta to not be too OP in Vanilla Content. All Elite specialization are built and balanced around HoT Group Content.

so no telling what the inhouse testers feel about the Dragon Hunter Long Bow in the HoT Group content.

our job is to let them know the LB isnt good in Vanilla content and PvP.

Ragnarox.9601:

Cmon guys be realistic LONGBOW IS OP ON GUARDIANS !!

Just hope they can be better and hope is a kitten sometimes

That was an awesome video. Kind of like giving someone a bow without any arrows.

Darknicrofia.2604:

That’s the thing, deflecting shot on paper sounds like a skill shot but in practicality is merely a woefully low damage blind luck shot (that also requires 2 clicks instead of 2).

Other than stopping the occasional rapid fire, deflecting shot has no place in GW2’s fast paced combat.

It being used to purposely stop anything useful besides firing randomly in the direction of a WvW zerg has about as much chance as happening as a GW1 ranger distracting shooting another ranger’s distracting shot.

I’ve done that before though…at least twice…

Honestly after I read the part about “Longbow being well received” & other things being good I came to the conclusion that 1 of the following is going on.

1: They just dont give a F#$%

2: The people that convey what the community thinks to the devs are lying through their teeth for some reason.

or

3: They are in complete denial and think they can do no wrong.

Michaeas Magister.1589:

Ragnarox.9601:

Cmon guys be realistic LONGBOW IS OP ON GUARDIANS !!

Just hope they can be better and hope is a kitten sometimes

That was an awesome video. Kind of like giving someone a bow without any arrows.

The guardian would basically be better off using a stack of consumable rocks if they were allowed in PvP.
Sure it would cost allot but at least they would likely hit something and travel fast.

Is what it is. Outside of being slow the big issue I had with it is skill 5.

It reminded me of hunting birds in that you need to lead the target and shoot. It was slow and bulky for lack of a better word. By the end of the night the enemy caught on what it was and timed their dodges better.

Knighthonor.4061:

All Elite specialization were nerfed in the public beta to not be too OP in Vanilla Content. All Elite specialization are built and balanced around HoT Group Content.

Source?

Drennon.7190:

They used the same “well received” bs on the ele forum. “The concepts behind overloading an element were pretty well received”

I blame myself for this. I spent all my time hammering out base damage and activation times on other specializations. I never really got to dragonhunter or tempest.

make it more similar to EVERY OTHER CLASSES bow and less like our kittened focus ray of judgement skill and it improves by 10x

Skill 3 waste of a button
Skill 1 too slow
Skill 2 needs more damage if rooted
Skill 4 good with Condi build needs to be able to shoot behind
Skill 5 backwards should trap first then do damage, with small dodge delay at beginning totally backwards

Puncture Shot projectile and Spear of Justice need a velocity increase if they are gonna hit moving targets at around 1200 range.

Puncture Shot and Deflecting Shot need to auto-face the target when used while the player is standing still.

Symbol of Energy needs to be able to be used behind the player, this precedent has already been set with the Warrior Longbow and Thief Shortbow.

The immobilize on True Shot is still a little out of place when Rangers have a 100% velocity increased 1500 range piercing Rapid Fire that they can use while moving and pursuing targets.
Either increase the damage multiplier or remove the need to be stationary when casting.

I post to state I disagree, LB and DH are awful, needs to be rethinked and redesigned.

i agree about the spear of justice being too slow, though that is not technically a longbow skill.
The biggest issues i have with longbow is that
skill 3 seems very unlikely to be used as intended, because it feels impractical (you have to first see a projectile, then decide to stop it, aim it and fire, then wait for your projectile to travel in that direction).
skill 5’s immobilize seems to come way too late. It would make sense to immobilize the enemies and then having them stand in the rain of arrows. It does not make sense to chase everyone away with a rain of arrows and drop an immobilize on the area you just made sure is empty. This even goes for pve because enemies in the jungle don’t stand still that long (which is great btw).

Apart from these issues it is just a matter of getting the numbers right imho. Overall I would say I like the longbow, the slow but hard hitting flavour of it. It just needs a few changes to make it actually useful.

bananenkip.6317:

i agree about the spear of justice being too slow, though that is not technically a longbow skill.
The biggest issues i have with longbow is that
skill 3 seems very unlikely to be used as intended, because it feels impractical (you have to first see a projectile, then decide to stop it, aim it and fire, then wait for your projectile to travel in that direction).
skill 5’s immobilize seems to come way too late. It would make sense to immobilize the enemies and then having them stand in the rain of arrows. It does not make sense to chase everyone away with a rain of arrows and drop an immobilize on the area you just made sure is empty. This even goes for pve because enemies in the jungle don’t stand still that long (which is great btw).

Apart from these issues it is just a matter of getting the numbers right imho. Overall I would say I like the longbow, the slow but hard hitting flavour of it. It just needs a few changes to make it actually useful.

i’ll agree w/ 3 an 5. but also 3 might work better if it moved as slow as arcing shot or something.that way its nice and slow and can actually protect u

Why do I feel like a lot of posts have been deleted out of here?

Anyways, come next BWE, you bet there’s going to be a mass influx of posts about how garbage LB and traps are if they don’t do anything to them.

@phokus ~

Next bwe I can imagine there wont be as much feedback. We really have nothing to test seeing as damage wasn’t the issue in the first place.

Not to be a downer but I’d rather focus on testing Warrior. It looks like it’s going to be a blast to test. Some of the concepts sound like soooo much fun!

phokus.8934:

Why do I feel like a lot of posts have been deleted out of here?

.

They don’t take criticism very well and easily get personal. If something that hits the bullseyes, it’s best not to let alot of people see it. This is a deserted forum from the derv perspective. If they got the guts to say “LB skills were generally well-received” despite waves of protests, you know they are the type of people who remove opposition posts.

CandyHearts.6025:

@phokus ~

Next bwe I can imagine there wont be as much feedback. We really have nothing to test seeing as damage wasn’t the issue in the first place.

Not to be a downer but I’d rather focus on testing Warrior. It looks like it’s going to be a blast to test. Some of the concepts sound like soooo much fun!

Same! I haven’t used my Warrior much since the specialization patch, but Berserker sounds amazing. Sadly, I think Warrior got the design A team, and Guardian got the D team.

How it’s possible to completely misunderstand why instant cast Virtues are a staple of the class is completely beyond me.

Ark Bladesteele.2943:

How it’s possible to completely misunderstand why instant cast Virtues are a staple of the class is completely beyond me.

Ok, really its not THAT hard to figure out: Right now Renewed Focus is our absolute staple Elite choice. In no small part because you can dump all your virtues mid-channel and have them refresh at the end. Making the virtues have cast time makes RF less appealing and is a direct attempt to wean us off of the one-and-only and make the other Guardian Elite skills more desirable/relevant.

Its not gonna work for many, because like every complaint about traps not giving sustain/cleanses/teleports people don’t want to try something new, they want all their old advantages plus a little more. Horizontal progression is about trade-offs and people already in a good place don’t want to move sideways, they just want to move up.

Nike.2631:

Ark Bladesteele.2943:

How it’s possible to completely misunderstand why instant cast Virtues are a staple of the class is completely beyond me.

Ok, really its not THAT hard to figure out: Right now Renewed Focus is our absolute staple Elite choice. In no small part because you can dump all your virtues mid-channel and have them refresh at the end. Making the virtues have cast time makes RF less appealing and is a direct attempt to wean us off of the one-and-only and make the other Guardian Elite skills more desirable/relevant.

Its not gonna work for many, because like every complaint about traps not giving sustain/cleanses/teleports people don’t want to try something new, they want all their old advantages plus a little more. Horizontal progression is about trade-offs and people already in a good place don’t want to move sideways, they just want to move up.

I agree. I like having a completely different playstyle assuming the new playstyle isn’t underperforming. Heck, put a 2s cast time on all the virtues as long as a single activation will kill everyone around me (ok bad example).

Ark Bladesteele.2943:

CandyHearts.6025:

@phokus ~

Next bwe I can imagine there wont be as much feedback. We really have nothing to test seeing as damage wasn’t the issue in the first place.

Not to be a downer but I’d rather focus on testing Warrior. It looks like it’s going to be a blast to test. Some of the concepts sound like soooo much fun!

Guardian got the D team.

I see what you did there. xD

But I agree. DH was litterally my obsession since I heard about it and saw the reveal. Then I got my hands on it and I wondered why not LB ranger. At least they have traits that enhance how their LB performs. x.x’’

Yesterday I made my first warrior! My hype is unreaaaal. \o/

Nike.2631:

Ark Bladesteele.2943:

How it’s possible to completely misunderstand why instant cast Virtues are a staple of the class is completely beyond me.

Ok, really its not THAT hard to figure out: Right now Renewed Focus is our absolute staple Elite choice. In no small part because you can dump all your virtues mid-channel and have them refresh at the end. Making the virtues have cast time makes RF less appealing and is a direct attempt to wean us off of the one-and-only and make the other Guardian Elite skills more desirable/relevant.

Its not gonna work for many, because like every complaint about traps not giving sustain/cleanses/teleports people don’t want to try something new, they want all their old advantages plus a little more. Horizontal progression is about trade-offs and people already in a good place don’t want to move sideways, they just want to move up.

That would be fine, if it was actually horizontal! But I think many people agree that it’s a downgrade. How many of us said, “yeah, we really need another 1200 slow-fire weapon. And while you’re at it, make it root us!” Also, I don’t use RF. I haven’t since they introduced FMW. So that’s a progression step that I’ve already made without going DH.

Now, if the virtues were all worth actually having those cast times, there would be something to say for it. But a 600 range leap on a ~40 second cooldown? Who wants that? The shield isn’t a bad idea, but why isn’t that instant cast to begin with? The spear… again, 600 range, and if they get outside of it, the skill is over. It’s not particularly hard to move out of a 600 range on a class that isn’t very mobile to begin with, and it’s not really that powerful of an ability. Three strikes, you’re out. Now, if we could choose if we wanted to go, say, 1/3 or 1/2 on the Virtues, like how Revenant can change legends at will, that would be something! I like the shield, I’d probably use it, but I don’t want the spear or leap. They’re not worth it.

It’s also telling that in an attempt to make it seem like horizontal progression, they nerfed all Virtues by 600 range. If they truly thought the new Virtues could compete on a horizontal level with the old, they would have been able to stand on their own.

Ragnarox.9601:

Cmon guys be realistic LONGBOW IS OP ON GUARDIANS !!

Just hope they can be better and hope is a kitten sometimes

Basically, this was what ranger was like pre-RtW. There’s a reason the trait was made and then why it was made baseline, because it was a non-option since every build absolutely required it.

I’m surprised they didn’t give the DH this.