Leveling 2nd Set Mace+Focus Vs Scepter+Focus
Been doing some testing in game and :
1) Scepter + Focus > Mace+Focus
2) Torch is complete and utter garbage, I mean its worthless beyond any value what so ever I can’t believe it even made it to live the way it is…yes it IS that bad.
Though Mace has a place in the meta game, while leveling I am pretty sure Scepter+Focus is far a better option as a 2nd weapon. Actually I will change what I said, Mace is AMAZING in any form of group play like a Champion for example.
It depends.
Scepter+Focus survivability exists through limited kiting. It is a nice weapon for leveling as a weapon swap, though. Scepter—even if it seems counterintuitive—is a great midrange and point blank weapon, and using Smite in melee before swapping to a melee weapon racks up a lot of damage. In the first ~30 levels or so, I’d say Scepter is probably one of your highest damage weapons, and arguably your highest damage weapon for killing solo mobs.
Mace is great for leveling too, depending on your weapon swap. I leveled primarily with Sword+Torch and Mace+Shield. Mace actually hits pretty hard, but the hits come slow. And the personal mitigation from Mace+Focus is categorically superior to the mitigation from Scepter+Focus provided you’re in melee. Mace has a heal, a symbol and a potent block mechanic which, coupled with Focus’s blind+regen and shield offers a huge amount of defense.
Torch is a bit weird with Mace. You’re wrong that it’s a garbage weapon. It’s an excellent weapon, but you need to use it correctly. Here are a few pointers on Torch:
- Zealot’s Flame is a LOT of burning damage. Your first trigger of Zealot’s Flame burns everyone around you for 6s. This is especially big if you have Fiery Wrath and Radiant Power. Then, you can let it run its duration and have it stack another 3s of burning at the end for a grand total of 9s. Or you can toss the flame for…
- A pretty big spike of damage from Zealot’s Fire. This has a 1,200 range and deals solid damage.
- Cleansing Flame is a nice ability that deals solid point blank cone damage, but remember that it does have a 4.5 second cast time. Damage is roughly equivalent to a full 3-swing chain of Mace, but takes twice as long. However, if you have Virtue of Justice on Passive, it’ll trigger VoJ’s Burn effect twice on every target it hits for an additional 2 seconds of burning. Long Story Short: This is great damage if you catch 2+ enemies in its cone (which is pretty easy), and it’s great condition removal for your allies too.
Torch actually does work well with Mace for leveling. The burn effect from Torch works exceptionally well with Mace’s playstyle of keeping a couple of enemies in melee range and covers Mace’s lower damage rate and lower burn rate due to Mace’s slow weapon speed. It comes with a 1200 range spike ability too, should you ever need it.
(edited by Eveningstar.6940)
2) Torch is complete and utter garbage, I mean its worthless beyond any value what so ever I can’t believe it even made it to live the way it is…yes it IS that bad.
Are you looking for advice, or just stating your preference? I don’t think you’re convincing anyone with that statement. It sounds like you’re having trouble adjusting to the different styles of each weapon in your testing, rather than one weapon being better than another. Provide more details.
What I did was split the weapons into two categorizes:
Defensive: Mace / Focus
Offensive: Scepter / Torch
I then assumed that they should go together and assumed that was by design.
My error: Never considered Mace+Torch.
My conclusion regarding Scepter+Torch Vs Scepter+Focus asks what do I gain and what do I lose? Calculate kill time and down time on same kind of mob and try both sets on range/melee/vets/single target and multiple targets.
I realized that the question of multiple targets was easy: Melee Weapon was far superior and my choice is GS.
Mace appears to increase in value during group play and especially against ‘bigger’ bosses and though the 1 condition removal might appeal I can not see it doing better than Focus even then. That is why I assumed it being a DPS weapon, and in that case it still does not add any thing a GS would or a Focus would in the aggregate.
The only way Torch would have some ground to stand on is if it counted as ‘setting the Guardian on Fire’ which would in that event proc: Radiance IV (when you are set on Fire, you gain Fury).
For solo leveling and for the player who is bent on using Mace then YES I see a place for Torch.
(edited by Cempa.3645)
It depends what you like more. Both are very different if you choose Scepter you will be able to actually kite your target and attack from a range, you will also have an immobilize. Mace you have to stand and attack to do damage and will be taking more hits the mace healing ability is not that good you have to have atleast 1000 healing for it to be very effective, I dont like it that much. Truthfully I would just run Great sword and Scepter Torch for leveling, the torch has good burst with the 4 skill and will adds a little damage.
What I did was split the weapons into two categorizes:
Defensive: Mace / Focus
Offensive: Scepter / TorchI then assumed that they should go together and assumed that was by design.
My error: Never considered Mace+Torch.
My conclusion regarding Scepter+Torch Vs Scepter+Focus asks what do I gain and what do I lose? Calculate kill time and down time on same kind of mob and try both sets on range/melee/vets/single target and multiple targets.
I realized that the question of multiple targets was easy: Melee Weapon was far superior and my choice is GS.
Mace appears to increase in value during group play and especially against ‘bigger’ bosses and though the 1 condition removal might appeal I can not see it doing better than Focus even then. That is why I assumed it being a DPS weapon, and in that case it still does not add any thing a GS would or a Focus would in the aggregate.
The only way Torch would have some ground to stand on is if it counted as ‘setting the Guardian on Fire’ which would in that event proc: Radiance IV (when you are set on Fire, you gain Fury).
For solo leveling and for the player who is bent on using Mace then YES I see a place for Torch.
Your pre-conceptions about the weapons are affecting your results. Anet designed the weapons to be used in whatever combination we wish, and with weapon swapping in mind. You also have to take into account our stats and traits and how they affect each weapon. The scepter belongs with the torch no more than it does with a shield. The argument of does the mace & focus beat the scepter & torch in whatever context is pointless since you can have both sets equipped at the same time, and can tailor each for specific situations.
What’s your interpretation of survivability? In general, my interpretation of survivability has meant staying alive, which doesn’t necessarily mean defeating the enemy. Damage does play a role in survivability, especially in PvP, but it doesn’t just revolve around killing enemies as fast as possible.
The torch shines in group combat. With it we’re able to deal significant damage from a safe distance, while also removing conditions from allies in melee range. It also has our hardest hitting long range attack in Zealot’s Fire. When combined with a decent critical hit rate, Empowering Might, and Altruistic Healing you have a great group off-hand. As for solo play it’s great for using through consecrations such as our Wall of Reflection and Sanctuary. In addition, it’s one of our hardest hitting weapons with the bonus of having some range. It’s also has unique uses in WvW as well.
In solo PvE, I generally use the focus for damage. Timing Shield of Wrath and Ray of Judgment to hit at the same time as main-hand and slot skill can generate good burst damage. It’s also worth noting that Shield of Wrath’s blast finisher can be used in our combo fields for might and retaliation. When used defensively with a mace, Might of the Protector is a must have.
The mace is one of our best survivability weapons. Referring back to my interpretation of survivability, when you find yourself surrounded by too many enemies, the mace is one of the guardian’s go to weapons to beat the odds. By itself, the mace can provide you with regeneration & healing, and a block or protection. If you boost your power and invest in symbol traits, you can deal good area damage with Symbol of Faith and Protector’s Strike while still gaining the defensive benefits as well. Although not often used, the mace & focus combo works well with the Zeal trait line with it boosting power (the mace doesn’t gain much from precision), and its focus and symbol traits. I agree with you about its group support. It’s pretty obvious how the mace is beneficial to groups, but ironically I rarely use it that manner.
Lastly, I have to ask why you haven’t mentioned the sword at all since you began discussing the torch. The torch and sword work extremely well together. They both can benefit from the Radiance trait line and higher precision, and they make applying burning trivial.
(edited by Kasei.8726)
I set out looking to answer one question:
With a GS what is my best chocie to go with Scepter for solo questing and defined best as shortest kill time with the least down time. It came down to Focus and Torch and when tested against single target, multi target and Vets Focus takes a noticeable lead. I could easily keep one in the bag, but that was not an option I cared for.
Simply put for solo game play questing with a GS and Scepter and on the aggregate Focus is a far better choice.