Guild Wars 2

Just letting you all know that the pvp forum is crawling with trolls trying to get our new elite spec nerfed to the ground. So unless you want to wake up to a useless elite spec, i suggest you get your kitten over there and start defending what we spent months trying to fix since beta 1.

For example, check out these rangers rage all over the trolls in this thread trying to get their elite spec nerfed (again): https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/pvp/Something-needs-to-be-done-with-Ancient-Seeds/first#post5689267

About time we descended on the trolls like that.

Some of it is justified, most isn’t. Silly amounts of damage and long range CC that’s near impossible to avoid could stand to be nerfed.

Oh man I just read a few posts….This is very sad. DH literally went from one of the most hated Elite specs to an alright one and now since its at an ‘okay’ place everyone wants it nerfed. I just can’t understand how some of these guys think when they make their QQ threads.

Im happy with Dh now they fixed the issues with Test of faith being able to trigger on the pass through instantly just like the old Eles ring of fire did.

the only thing that could do with a tell is the Hard light trait quite Unpredictable that one.

we are Defending for good Reasons on the druid , Ancient seeds is the only other form of Hard CC a druid can take though the ancient seeds needs to hit a Dazed target and that requires ether a greatsword daze / pet Moa daze or a shortbow daze , but the longest wait would be getting into Celestial form to use the Luna impact to trigger ancient seeds after charging AF and using the skill its more like one Ancient seeds trigger every 15-20seconds and its not that strong ether its 5 bleeds and 5stack immobilse for 1second (which some classes can just walk out of) and if getting hit by a Big beam of light falling from the sky dazes the player they Deserve to be immobilsed.

we are trying to avoid Over nurfs just like they did with Most dangerous game , heal as one and now lingering light is over nurfed the amount it heals is not worth its 12seconds icd if it was 6 to 8seconds we could live with that.

and if we give into the pvp trolls we are going to loose our only Viable Druid damage, as taking a druid spec basicly means giving up onther 30% damage for sustain and staff so playing a druid is already a low damage spec let alone people asking for a Ancient seeds nurf when they don’t even know it Requires hitting a Dazed foe.

Zenos Osgorma.2936:

Im happy with Dh now they fixed the issues with Test of faith being able to trigger on the pass through instantly just like the old Eles ring of fire did.

the only thing that could do with a tell is the Hard light trait quite Unpredictable that one.

we are Defending for good Reasons on the druid , Ancient seeds is the only other form of Hard CC a druid can take though the ancient seeds needs to hit a Dazed target and that requires ether a greatsword daze / pet Moa daze or a shortbow daze , but the longest wait would be getting into Celestial form to use the Luna impact to trigger ancient seeds after charging AF and using the skill its more like one Ancient seeds trigger every 15-20seconds and its not that strong ether its 5 bleeds and 5stack immobilse for 1second (which some classes can just walk out of) and if getting hit by a Big beam of light falling from the sky dazes the player they Deserve to be immobilsed.

we are trying to avoid Over nurfs just like they did with Most dangerous game , heal as one and now lingering light is over nurfed the amount it heals is not worth its 12seconds icd if it was 6 to 8seconds we could live with that.

and if we give into the pvp trolls we are going to loose our only Viable Druid damage, as taking a druid spec basicly means giving up onther 30% damage for sustain and staff so playing a druid is already a low damage spec let alone people asking for a Ancient seeds nurf when they don’t even know it Requires hitting a Dazed foe.

Heavy light really should just be tied to deflecting shot.

Deflecting shot already has a 10 second Cd and moves kinda slow.

The trade off would be deflecting shot can pass through enemies & thus it could effect multiple enemies.

To many whiners and too many scrub players who don’t even dodge. Skillrate of pvp is bad because of unranked. Wait until rated comes. Nerfing classes untill that would be unreasonable because they might ended up buffing them again.

Someone there is asking to put an ICD on our traps so we can only set one down at a time…

5 different threads asking to nerf DH in pvp forum now

When does the pvp forum not ever want to nerf things, especially things not tried out beyond "testing it out in on dummies and many games when stacking teams?

And then the changes are not split across game modes in order to continue to pretend we have MLG esportscrap.

Kuya.6495:

5 different threads asking to nerf DH in pvp forum now

What comes around goes around, I still remembered the trait update patch earlier this year for Mesmers after years of being bad and it finally got good, people want to nerf it. I am enjoying the flow of tears.

Since ya’ll seem so set on “Dragon Hunter is completely balanced”, give me some tips on how to 1v1 them on points, trying to play Reaper vs a Dragon Hunter starting from 0 lifeforce on a point and basically what happens is they stab my fear, and I can’t engage into them or I’d risk death. Building up lifeforce with marks would take too long, and wouldn’t yield the best results as I’d prob just get forced out of it. So yeah as it is now, I LOS them till they leave so I could get the point

Dragon HUNTER is BALANCED!
Played it hard today, i couldnt carry double thief in team. Other games were easy, so easy it just made my day… All this tryhards trying to play thief warrior engi etc, they dont undestand true balance… Since i run hammer with longbow i can aoe cc enemy so hard that i could burn every stability, then knock and 9k trueshot. Its rly fun! Ppl can’t come near me nor they cant fight vs me in range all i do is use 1 trap- Test of faith then knock with longbow, then pull in with f1 then banish with hammer and JUDGE into Ring of warding. After passing test 3x enemy should be dead or low enough to be 1/2 hitted with hammer. 100% FUN. Whats funnier i dont even need to care. Game wont punish me if i miss my spells as long as trap is under me and 1 in 3 trueshots lands. You cant rly play around trait that knocks cuz IF THIS TRAIT doesnt knock u 1 hit then it will do it next one.

I fought vs daredevil 1v1 he had staff… AND I MUST SAY staff on DD is op! IT Reflected my trueshot almost killing me, thank god i had trap up so i could instantly kill him before he kills me.

Mefiq.7039:

Dragon HUNTER is BALANCED!
Played it hard today, i couldnt carry double thief in team. Other games were easy, so easy it just made my day… All this tryhards trying to play thief warrior engi etc, they dont undestand true balance… Since i run hammer with longbow i can aoe cc enemy so hard that i could burn every stability, then knock and 9k trueshot. Its rly fun! Ppl can’t come near me nor they cant fight vs me in range all i do is use 1 trap- Test of faith then knock with longbow, then pull in with f1 then banish with hammer and JUDGE into Ring of warding. After passing test 3x enemy should be dead or low enough to be 1/2 hitted with hammer. 100% FUN. Whats funnier i dont even need to care. Game wont punish me if i miss my spells as long as trap is under me and 1 in 3 trueshots lands. You cant rly play around trait that knocks cuz IF THIS TRAIT doesnt knock u 1 hit then it will do it next one.

I fought vs daredevil 1v1 he had staff… AND I MUST SAY staff on DD is op! IT Reflected my trueshot almost killing me, thank god i had trap up so i could instantly kill him before he kills me.

Nice try buddy, nice try.

This spec needs to get nerfed or remade badly they’re a better ranger then rangers are…I was on my necro on skyhammer and had a DH camping skyhammer the entire game with all his traps up there…the second you tp up you get 1 shot absolutly nothing you can do about it. and nerf the perma knock down from the wall in ability.
oh and on a side note- https://dviw3bl0enbyw.cloudfront.net/uploads/forum_attachment/file/208459/xZ2VRTd.jpg (40k trueshot) should NOT be a thing…at all

Traps are L2P issue, nuff said
After a week of playing traps people started to dodge out of it, Dmaw is pretty obvious and easy to spot if you look closely. Now while playing decent players who know their drill, traps are only a save choice in melee once you and your enemy are tangled in combat and it gets hard to spot the traps or if opponents are out of endurance.
Even with my poor frame rate (if not on points) It’s easy to lure out DH as he hopelessly drops traps thinking that you will come to him, then melee him as his traps are on CD.

I think we could use some fixes on spear because it doesn’t seem to always connect to opponents. It just flies, goes on full cooldown and you can’t pull or even tether your enemy. Yes, without immunity, invulnerability, stab and block SoJ doesn’t seem to always tether on boon-free hostiles.

jassking.7934:

Give me some tips on how to 1v1 them on points, trying to play Reaper vs a Dragon Hunter starting from 0 lifeforce on a point

Swap one of your utilities for Summon Bone Minions and send them in first to set off the traps…

PVP has always been a detriment to this game because it’s an additional layer of complexity when balancing is concerned. There’s zero chance this game will be an e-sports game ever anyway because the market is so saturated already with far better mobas. They should either completely split the abilities between pvp and pve/wvw or just remove pvp completely and be done with it. Let’s face it pvp is not the draw of this game for a majority of the players anyway. If I wanted a structured pvp 3d game with interesting strategies I’d go play Smite.

Zombie Fury.5804:

This spec needs to get nerfed or remade badly they’re a better ranger then rangers are…I was on my necro on skyhammer and had a DH camping skyhammer the entire game with all his traps up there…the second you tp up you get 1 shot absolutly nothing you can do about it. and nerf the perma knock down from the wall in ability.
oh and on a side note- https://dviw3bl0enbyw.cloudfront.net/uploads/forum_attachment/file/208459/xZ2VRTd.jpg (40k trueshot) should NOT be a thing…at all

I think I was there also, he caught me off guard first time with my Ele.

2nd time I entered with Earth/Focus 5 invul and putting mag aura to reflect true shot and rekt him

Zombie Fury.5804:

This spec needs to get nerfed or remade badly they’re a better ranger then rangers are..

And ranger is a better healer than guard ever was ^^
LB ranger still deals more dmg than DH but misses the guard utilities/boons.

jassking.7934:

Since ya’ll seem so set on “Dragon Hunter is completely balanced”, give me some tips on how to 1v1 them on points

I don’t think balance means what you think it means in GW2…

“Everyone keeps telling me this needs to be nerfed so instead of listening and having a reasonable discussion I’M JUST GOING TO MAKE A STAND. DRAGON HUNTERS UNITE. DON’T NERF OUR TOTALLY OVERPOWERED SPEC. WHAT ELSE WILL WE PLAY? MEDIGUARD?! HAHAHA NO WAY!”

Sure, some people want it nerfed into the ground but you can’t honestly say this is balanced. Doubling up on traps? Free instagibs? Come on guys that’s not balance.

The spec needs to be looked at because right now it’s game breaking and that’s coming from someone who’s now maining a Revenant.

mexay.3902:

“Everyone keeps telling me this needs to be nerfed so instead of listening and having a reasonable discussion I’M JUST GOING TO MAKE A STAND. DRAGON HUNTERS UNITE. DON’T NERF OUR TOTALLY OVERPOWERED SPEC. WHAT ELSE WILL WE PLAY? MEDIGUARD?! HAHAHA NO WAY!”

Sure, some people want it nerfed into the ground but you can’t honestly say this is balanced. Doubling up on traps? Free instagibs? Come on guys that’s not balance.

The spec needs to be looked at because right now it’s game breaking and that’s coming from someone who’s now maining a Revenant.

Rofl a freakin revenant asking for a spec to be nerfed, kid just gtfo, with your insane alount of evades and op hammer 2 and sword 3

Zombie Fury.5804:

This spec needs to get nerfed or remade badly they’re a better ranger then rangers are…I was on my necro on skyhammer and had a DH camping skyhammer the entire game with all his traps up there…the second you tp up you get 1 shot absolutly nothing you can do about it. and nerf the perma knock down from the wall in ability.
oh and on a side note- https://dviw3bl0enbyw.cloudfront.net/uploads/forum_attachment/file/208459/xZ2VRTd.jpg (40k trueshot) should NOT be a thing…at all

Hmm sounds like me. I played a couple of Skyhammer games on Saturday night and decided to camp skyhammer with my traps. I gotta say it was very effectice 1v1. if the enemy team had sent more than one it would have been more difficult but no one could budge me 1v1 on skyhammer.

It wasnt 1 shot though. Lets not exagerate here. I was running full DPS spec (pack runes, marauder amulet) and no one was getting one shotted.

Playing DH and I must say it’s extremely fun and very powerful. Traps are huge damage dealers. Long bow is an extremely great addition to the class that can easily (in my experience) can be kited. DH can be hard to stand up to.

That being said, that doesn’t mean it needs to be nerfed. I have friends who play thief, ranger, and necro who can easily stand up to me in a 1v1 and who I’ve lost to many times. I’ve been destroyed by a warrior, and Mesmer’s are an absolute pain for me. I’ve lost to a Herald Revenant miserably. Knowing that people can stand up to me even with the high damage makes this spec even more exciting and fun to play. People make DH out to be an unstoppable force when they’re really not. Yes we deal huge amount of damage but it’s easily avoidable in my opinion. As soon as I have to chase someone I know they’ve about got me beat even with 2 distance closing abilities.

If this spec gives you a hard time, it’s not because it needs a nerf. Just understand what we can do and counter it. (DODGE TRAPS!)

My point here is that I’ve won and lost enough battles against other tough classes to feel that this class is fine where it’s at.

It’s rather interesting because even though we all understand how to avoid traps(daze notification), there maybe people unable to react fast enough. Not to be rude to those players but that’s how this game works, understanding what’s in front of you and acting accordingly.

If we were to talk about ranged pressure, i’d like to point out Revenant’s Hammer is far superior in terms of both damage output and defensive mechanics. It’s very surprising to see players harp on a weapon that has no defense attached to it(baseline).

Edit: Not to mention, most DH builds have very little-to-no condition clears. Wings of Resolve has to be the most obviously animated skill in the game with a long wind-up before landing, very easy to disrupt.

mexay.3902:

Sure, some people want it nerfed into the ground but you can’t honestly say this is balanced. Doubling up on traps? Free instagibs? Come on guys that’s not balance.

Instagibs don’t exist and doubling up on traps are a mechanic of Traps themselves and not unique to Dragonhunter. In fact, a Thief can technically quad up on Needle Trap. That’s a whole lotta Immobilize, Bleeding, vuln, and poison.

People need to calm down first of all, because good decisions don’t come from getting worked up. This is something new people will have to learn to deal with. Every profession has some crazy stuff they can pull out now, and people need some time to learn what it is.

Now they’re making threads about daze too. Soon they’ll complain about our cripple traits and puncture shot.

Makes me not want to play DH now… purely because with all the vitriol and hate aimed towards it it’s going to get nerfed. Hard.

I don’t want to get used to something that is so fun to play only to have it utterly destroyed by Anets heavy handed “cater to the whiners” balance policy – see historic patches involving Warrior, Ranger, etc

All a bit depressing really.

Sandzibar.5134:

Makes me not want to play DH now… purely because with all the vitriol and hate aimed towards it it’s going to get nerfed. Hard.

So untrue. It’ll get nerfed some because it needs to get nerfed some.

Dragonhunters will get another shave or two because the Devs went overboard with the last minute tweaks giving traps huge boon-surge because a bunch of people who didn’t know squat about how easy it is to place traps kept complaining that all traps were categorical “useless”.

You’ll notice those people finally shut the hell up.

So brace up. Fortunately the pattern we’re seeing is they like the burst threat of traps (they went after the tempo, not the magnitude of trap gameplay). We’ll get dinged one more time and then the good, skillful Dragonhunters will continue to kick butt and take names and the flavor of the month crowd will move on. Which is good for both groups.

Except that shouldn’t be the case. It was explained, in GREAT detail how to deal with dh’s and yet many refuse to learn. Revenants, Scrappers and to a lesser degree Tempests and Reapers are more formidable than DH’s.

You know DH is going to get nerfed more though right? You can’t honestly think its good for the game that all the best Guardian builds for pvp involve DH? I admit I missed in beta how strong certain things were but really DH is going to nerfed more as are all the Elites pretty much so be prepared for it because its 100% going to happen.

brannigan.9831:

You can’t honestly think its good for the game that all the best Guardian builds for pvp involve DH?

Not sure how this is different than the meta before (every PvP build involved Valor) or any other class. There will always be builds that are better than others, and people are largely going to gravitate towards the best. This is a much better outcome than no one using the elite spec at all.

Well im enjoying DH while i can because the QQ wont stop till DH gets nerfed. Meantime i logged on my level 2 Revenant and level 2 Scrapper last night and started to get a feel for how to play them (and against them).

I have no doubt that “when” DH inevitably gets more nerfs people will realise how good Scrapper and Revenants are.

If traps get nerfed I certainly hope they roll some of that damage back into the longbow abilities or else there will simply be no point in playing DH over a standard guardian build.

I main Engineer/Scrapper, and I can tell you that 1 on 1, I can beat a Dragon Hunter. It’s about an even fight. That said, Scrapper has the advantage that it has a lot of blocks and mobility. So with a little bit of knowledge of how Dragon Hunters work, I can avoid trap bursts.

That said I have been dabbling in Dragon Hunter, and it probably is the highest damaging burst class at the moment. I can down chieftain / svanir in under 10 seconds if I really try. And to an unsuspecting squishy, if you lay traps on a point, they can pretty much instantly die just by activating your traps. In fact, I once killed 4 people simultaneously when I set up 3 traps on the orb in spirit watch, immobilized them with lb 5, and pierced them with lb 2.

I think it would probably be sufficient to nerf Dragon Hunter’s burst damage by ~5-10%. The class doesn’t really need anything changed. It can be beaten if you simply know how to play against it (watch where you walk).

From the current state of the game, I think that Thieves and Warriors could use some buffing. It doesn’t matter if I am on DH or on Scrapper, those two classes do not threaten me at all. You can ignore their contribution to a fight.

Ging.6485:

I main Engineer/Scrapper, and I can tell you that 1 on 1, I can beat a Dragon Hunter. It’s about an even fight. That said, Scrapper has the advantage that it has a lot of blocks and mobility. So with a little bit of knowledge of how Dragon Hunters work, I can avoid trap bursts.

That said I have been dabbling in Dragon Hunter, and it probably is the highest damaging burst class at the moment. I can down chieftain / svanir in under 10 seconds if I really try. And to an unsuspecting squishy, if you lay traps on a point, they can pretty much instantly die just by activating your traps. In fact, I once killed 4 people simultaneously when I set up 3 traps on the orb in spirit watch, immobilized them with lb 5, and pierced them with lb 2.

I think it would probably be sufficient to nerf Dragon Hunter’s burst damage by ~5-10%. The class doesn’t really need anything changed. It can be beaten if you simply know how to play against it (watch where you walk).

From the current state of the game, I think that Thieves and Warriors could use some buffing. It doesn’t matter if I am on DH or on Scrapper, those two classes do not threaten me at all. You can ignore their contribution to a fight.

Good points there.

I have a warrior and guard and i have to say i agree with you. You can basically ignore a warrior. Most warriors are melee and they cant survive the trap damage. Especially if the DH is using a focus or shield on the other weapon set to knock the warrior back through the swords.

Ging.6485:

I main Engineer/Scrapper, and I can tell you that 1 on 1, I can beat a Dragon Hunter. It’s about an even fight. That said, Scrapper has the advantage that it has a lot of blocks and mobility. So with a little bit of knowledge of how Dragon Hunters work, I can avoid trap bursts.

That said I have been dabbling in Dragon Hunter, and it probably is the highest damaging burst class at the moment. I can down chieftain / svanir in under 10 seconds if I really try. And to an unsuspecting squishy, if you lay traps on a point, they can pretty much instantly die just by activating your traps. In fact, I once killed 4 people simultaneously when I set up 3 traps on the orb in spirit watch, immobilized them with lb 5, and pierced them with lb 2.

I think it would probably be sufficient to nerf Dragon Hunter’s burst damage by ~5-10%. The class doesn’t really need anything changed. It can be beaten if you simply know how to play against it (watch where you walk).

From the current state of the game, I think that Thieves and Warriors could use some buffing. It doesn’t matter if I am on DH or on Scrapper, those two classes do not threaten me at all. You can ignore their contribution to a fight.

Even fight? Scrapper absolutely ruins DH. Their sustain combined with might-stacking abilities wreck DH’s. It’s not even close to an even fight unless the Scrapper is dumb enough to run in and out of Test of Faith.

Ging.6485:

That said I have been dabbling in Dragon Hunter, and it probably is the highest damaging burst class at the moment. I can down chieftain / svanir in under 10 seconds if I really try. And to an unsuspecting squishy, if you lay traps on a point, they can pretty much instantly die just by activating your traps. In fact, I once killed 4 people simultaneously when I set up 3 traps on the orb in spirit watch, immobilized them with lb 5, and pierced them with lb 2.

I think it would probably be sufficient to nerf Dragon Hunter’s burst damage by ~5-10%. The class doesn’t really need anything changed. It can be beaten if you simply know how to play against it (watch where you walk).

Part of me wonders if the most of the complaints come from those who have been JI’d with 5-trap drop. It’s really a cheese tactic that’s getting under the skin of a lot of players who don’t know how to properly mitigate or counter it. For those who do, it seems to be less than a problem; scrappers, Mesmer’s using F4, Ele’s invuln, etc. all provide easy mitigation to the trap drop. This also leaves the DH vulenrable until the cooldowns come back up.

I’d honestly be cool with a small baseline nerf to damage. I don’t want them touching trap mechanics anymore than they need to. I started off hating the DH, and conceptually I still think it’s lackluster, but after the tweaks and some hindsight I’d have to say it is massively more entertaining that I could have hoped for. The DH has come a long way from what may have been perceived as the worst specialization, to one that is viable.

Conversely, how about slightly modifying the damage or trap mechanics in PvP only, Anet? There’s no shame in separate stats for separate game modes.

anking.6245:

Ging.6485:

That said I have been dabbling in Dragon Hunter, and it probably is the highest damaging burst class at the moment. I can down chieftain / svanir in under 10 seconds if I really try. And to an unsuspecting squishy, if you lay traps on a point, they can pretty much instantly die just by activating your traps. In fact, I once killed 4 people simultaneously when I set up 3 traps on the orb in spirit watch, immobilized them with lb 5, and pierced them with lb 2.

I think it would probably be sufficient to nerf Dragon Hunter’s burst damage by ~5-10%. The class doesn’t really need anything changed. It can be beaten if you simply know how to play against it (watch where you walk).

Part of me wonders if the most of the complaints come from those who have been JI’d with 5-trap drop. It’s really a cheese tactic that’s getting under the skin of a lot of players who don’t know how to properly mitigate or counter it. For those who do, it seems to be less than a problem; scrappers, Mesmer’s using F4, Ele’s invuln, etc. all provide easy mitigation to the trap drop. This also leaves the DH vulenrable until the cooldowns come back up.

I’d honestly be cool with a small baseline nerf to damage. I don’t want them touching trap mechanics anymore than they need to. I started off hating the DH, and conceptually I still think it’s lackluster, but after the tweaks and some hindsight I’d have to say it is massively more entertaining that I could have hoped for. The DH has come a long way from what may have been perceived as the worst specialization, to one that is viable.

Conversely, how about slightly modifying the damage or trap mechanics in PvP only, Anet? There’s no shame in separate stats for separate game modes.

Really? Conceptually I think that Dragon Hunter is my favorite class. I love Engineer/Scrapper, but the idea of setting traps, leading a dragon into them, disabling him, tethering him. Going 1 on 1 with a giant monster basically. I love the idea of a class based around that. It just feels so cool.

Scrappers: Had any decent fights against DH medi guards? Playing DH medi I haven’t had too much trouble against scrappers. A good one the other day fought me to a draw, and I reckon had he been full zerk that he would have won. Scrapper sustain is pretty strong.

Honestly I’m worried they are going to completely neuter this elite spec simply because everyone is crying wolf in PvP.

As background I play PvE and PvP pretty heavily. I enjoy my guard in both. What’s happening now is exactly what lead guard to “be in a good spot” for the last 3 years. We were really good at launch, and everyone complained and we got nerfed into the “nice to bring but never great” class.

I don’t understand why if they refuse to balance PvP and PvE separately they won’t take both into consideration when they nerf. Right now DH is good in PvE, but if they nerf traps a second time it will be back to its BWE 1+2 uselessness. In PvP it is strong WHEN you combine it with trapper runes, and the fact that people haven’t learned how to counterplay it yet (notice not saying there isn’t counterplay, just that people aren’t used to it).

I really wish they would just take trapper runes out of PvP and call it a day. Nerfing traps again will just destroy the elite spec. LB is nice, but the tells on it are super obvious, and the rooting all over the place makes it very inflexible. So if that’s all we have to gain from the DH spec after they nerf traps again, there really isn’t a point in bringing it.

Also for those who keep asking how to counter: DODGE. Here’s a video showing you just how possible it is to dodge the entire burst of traps.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xf-feSKGKXA&feature=youtu.be