Guild Wars 2

Hello everyone, I had a question about shield and community preferences, and wanted to strike up a discussion. I’m mostly speaking about Shield #5. I’ve seen some say they’d prefer if it had a personal block element attached to it (be it for improving bunker guardian, giving Guardians better escapes, or what have you as the meta has shifted and abilities have generally gotten stronger). So my questions are:

1. As a Guardian/DH, do you think Shield 5 should also sport a personal block in addition to the team-projectile absorb?

2a. If No, why specifically?

2b. If Yes, in what ways would you change it to be “fair”?

Considerations:
- Shield Stance and Crystal Hibernation are 25 second cooldowns and 3 second blocks. Currently Absorption has a 24 second base cooldown and lasts 4 seconds.

- Shield stance is mobile with no other benefits and Crystal Hibernation has a heal component similar to the flip skill, but is immobile. Neither has a push-back, but Warrior’s can be traited for Reflection, which is pretty strong.

- Having a personal block on this ability would benefit the dying Bunker Guardian, make it more viable to spend the time to support allies (rather than getting melee’d down and having to cancel it), and aids in our questionable ability to escape and/or weave from fights, especially when running directly away.

- What sets this apart from Focus remains the blind/condition removal, as well as the non-channeled instant activation of Focus 5, which is used for revivals/stomps/channels, which Shield 5 would not be able to do.

Personal thoughts:
I do personally feel like it would be nice to have an element of personal block with it, without removing the vital parts that make the skill unique.

How I would do it, personally:
Increase the cooldown base to 30-32 seconds (since it’d be a stronger skill with a block), and remove the light field, while reducing the total channel time to 2 1/2 – 3 seconds. Now would knock-back enemies on use, and still absorb projectiles for team mates, but provide a personal block as well.

This way, its on a longer cooldown than most other blocks, but still sports the AOE knockback and team absorption.

Notes: May be slightly over-budget in this iteration, I’m not sure, cooldown increases can go a long way, though.

Feel free to openly discuss, but keep it peaceful. I’m here to discuss pros and cons and general thoughts. I don’t think we have to worry about anything changing too soon.

Personally I think we have more then enough blocks. Shield #5 for me is fine as is .. I rather have the low cool down on the push back since it is more relevant for pvp and it aligns better with test of faith and purging flames.

If shield #5 gets a buff I would rather see the heal reworked to provide 3 secs of of resistance or have the detonate act as a shout which would be affected by pure of voice. the heal alone is nothing worthwhile.

I might be in the minority on this, but when I use the shield, I never use the #5 for the projectile block.

I use it mostly for the extra heal. It’s not great on its own for that heal, like Asmodal above mentioned… but like all healing in this game, good healing is about stacking it from multiple sources… and #5 is a good little extra burst to have if you’re decked out to heal.

The other thing I use it for is the push-back interrupt. I think the heal and push back together make it worthwhile to keep as-is. It doesn’t need to add more block, thematic though it may be.

~EW

Edit: and if you think about it, that one #5 skill provides 3 distinct uses. It makes sense that they’d seem a little lackluster to some, because what you’re getting in return is versatility.

By personal block do you mean ~3s of almost invulnerability, or are you referring to a single aegis proc?

Indure.5410:

By personal block do you mean ~3s of almost invulnerability, or are you referring to a single aegis proc?

The idea here would be to have it a longer cooldown block, but an actual block for sustaining itself on point or a non-niche block for leaving a fight (unlike courage which has a back-side weakness and isn’t exactly for running away).

two thoughts go into this, specifically on the bunker side of the discussion, which has been discussed before:
1. We have a lot of up-front defense, but once we’re out of cooldowns we tend to lose effectiveness compared to Eles and Druid.
2. The problem may not be sustainable defense at all, and be a factor of outdated support mechanics and lack of overall healing (another aspect of Druid/Tempest).

I know it may be controversial, and some think shield is more “okay” that it was, but from my perspective, Guardians in the meta have limited escapes compared to other high-tier builds, especially due to the nature of our main blocks we currently run (one is exploitable from behind, the other breaks in a limited amount of hits and doesn’t help against focus fire).

Secondly, our support and defensive builds have fallen by the wayside because our prolonged sustain outside of very long cooldowns doesn’t keep up running. Granted our heal is pretty good (the trap), we can clutch from death but have less to sustain ourself under focus.

The other thing is, in order to take advantage of the extra courage block and Invuln (which is t bad, don’t get me wrong) you also give up Maw which reduces your overall pressure for team fights fairly significantly.

Maybe this isn’t the right change, I’m just trying to get a feel for what other Guardians think, but I just felt this would be one way to address the issue of the general lack of Shield usage outside of niche builds, help with team fight weaving and sustainability under focus fire.

ronpierce.2760:

Hello everyone, I had a question about shield and community preferences, and wanted to strike up a discussion. I’m mostly speaking about Shield #5. I’ve seen some say they’d prefer if it had a personal block element attached to it (be it for improving bunker guardian, giving Guardians better escapes, or what have you as the meta has shifted and abilities have generally gotten stronger). So my questions are:

1. As a Guardian/DH, do you think Shield 5 should also sport a personal block in addition to the team-projectile absorb?

2a. If No, why specifically?

2b. If Yes, in what ways would you change it to be “fair”?

1. No, shield is in a good spot for now.

2a. While I do like your proposed change quite a bit, our “block” for shield is given through shield 4. True, it doesn’t block nearly as much as other shield skills out there, but it is a team-oriented weapon (and team oriented skill) whereas most other shields are not. Additionally, I like that our shield block is given through aegis which is very symbolic of the guardian, and synergizes with traits. For personal defence, we already have focus.

I think a better change would be for us to change the master-tier trait for shield. Instead of adding toughness (which is redundant), the trait should improve the functionality of our shield 5. Since our shield is designed to be a team-support weapon, I think there should be more benefit to keeping the dome up. So the trait could be something like this:

Allies affected by Shield of Absorption have the damage dealt to them and the duration of conditions applied to them reduced:
-Damage reduction: 25%
-Condition duration reduction: -66% (does not affect conditions already on you)
Shield Recharges reduced by 20%

I feel like this change would just make shield 5 an alternative version of Shield of Courage and add a 3s time-to-live to Guardian, but otherwise not really add the long term survivability you mentioned. The projectile absorption on shield 5 already adds the running away potential you spoke of.

It’s not going to happen, but a ground targeted Flashing Blade or Judge’s Intervention would be a better way to achieve the escape you are looking for.

I don’t know how it would work exactly, but I think it would be cool if Light’s Judgment was replaced with a teleporting decoy trap similar to Necro’s Flesh Worm.

Indure.5410:

I feel like this change would just make shield 5 an alternative version of Shield of Courage and add a 3s time-to-live to Guardian, but otherwise not really add the long term survivability you mentioned. The projectile absorption on shield 5 already adds the running away potential you spoke of.

It’s not going to happen, but a ground targeted Flashing Blade or Judge’s Intervention would be a better way to achieve the escape you are looking for.

I don’t know how it would work exactly, but I think it would be cool if Light’s Judgment was replaced with a teleporting decoy trap similar to Necro’s Flesh Worm.

That’s another consideration I had, actually. I’m not sure if I posted it on the forums or just when discussing with other Guardian pvp friends of mine, but seeing as how Sword is in a bit of a pinch, another consideration might be Sword #2 being a “forward Phase Retreat” of you will, in terms of forward mobility without a target. This means it could go up hills (as it already can) but without a target. I’d actually probably prefer that, but that would require them to lose. Their grip on the “low mobility” stance that they seem to have taken with Guardians.

Arcaedus.7290:

ronpierce.2760:

Hello everyone, I had a question about shield and community preferences, and wanted to strike up a discussion. I’m mostly speaking about Shield #5. I’ve seen some say they’d prefer if it had a personal block element attached to it (be it for improving bunker guardian, giving Guardians better escapes, or what have you as the meta has shifted and abilities have generally gotten stronger). So my questions are:

1. As a Guardian/DH, do you think Shield 5 should also sport a personal block in addition to the team-projectile absorb?

2a. If No, why specifically?

2b. If Yes, in what ways would you change it to be “fair”?

1. No, shield is in a good spot for now.

2a. While I do like your proposed change quite a bit, our “block” for shield is given through shield 4. True, it doesn’t block nearly as much as other shield skills out there, but it is a team-oriented weapon (and team oriented skill) whereas most other shields are not. Additionally, I like that our shield block is given through aegis which is very symbolic of the guardian, and synergizes with traits. For personal defence, we already have focus.

I think a better change would be for us to change the master-tier trait for shield. Instead of adding toughness (which is redundant), the trait should improve the functionality of our shield 5. Since our shield is designed to be a team-support weapon, I think there should be more benefit to keeping the dome up. So the trait could be something like this:

Allies affected by Shield of Absorption have the damage dealt to them and the duration of conditions applied to them reduced:
-Damage reduction: 25%
-Condition duration reduction: -66% (does not affect conditions already on you)
Shield Recharges reduced by 20%

And good suggestion. The change to make SoA a team wide damage dampener would certainly be an interesting take. I like that a lot, actually.

I believe that the shield is meant to be a support weapon to Guardain class. Right now, I feel this weapon is ok how it is.

The real problem is the trait, it is awful. The buff was meaningless, just look at all shield traits (warrior, engie and revenant) and you’ll know how bad it is. The revenant trait is GM, but engie and warrior are adept, so no reason to be that bad. They should add 2 seconds of resistence (or other boon) to you and allies when you cast an shield ability intead of the extra toughness (this weapon is meant to be supportive, not selfish).

Mikau.6920:

I believe that the shield is meant to be a support weapon to Guardain class. Right now, I feel this weapon is ok how it is.

The real problem is the trait, it is awful. The buff was meaningless, just look at all shield traits (warrior, engie and revenant) and you’ll know how bad it is. The revenant trait is GM, but engie and warrior are adept, so no reason to be that bad. They should add 2 seconds of resistence (or other boon) to you and allies when you cast an shield ability intead of the extra toughness (this weapon is meant to be supportive, not selfish).

I agree. Though because it is a channel, I liked the suggestion above, maybe altered a bit.
Such as:
Shield abilities gain additional benefits.

Shield 4: also grants a single stability to allies in addition to the protection and aegis. (Maybe make the base boobs 5 seconds instead of 4, nothing to do with the trait).

Shield 5: While channeling allies within the bubble recieve 33% reduced damage and reduced duration of conditions applied to them.

Very supporty, and not just basic boons and encourages holding up the shield Absorption. It’s strong enough to be impactful and only a 20% uptime if you hold the channel.

i run with a shield in my guard build and i use it more like an AOE party heal with a bonus that takes a chunk of break bar away.

I also use shield and love it but if we still think it’s worse than focus and needs a buff I think what needs the buff most would be the channel. Everyone just uses it for the instant knockback and then a little bit of healing when popping it. The projectile absorb is nice but if I could ask for anything it would be pulsing 1s resistance every 1s to everyone within the bubble’s area, maybe starting after the first tick of the shield once it’s actually up (Giving 3s of resistance). Would be a really nice way to protect allies that get focused and would finally give guard access to resistance (discounting CoP)

Would be really happy with that kind of change but shield is in a pretty decent spot for now.

Edit: I might also add that this is why anet shouldn’t have just lowered the cooldown when trying to fix shield, because it’s impossible to ask for better utility out of it and being able to justify the cd. I’d put a 28s cd on what I described above, giving is 22s? with the trait.

I think that the shield trait could use some tweaks instead of adding block to shield 5. Shield 4 is already a block (via aegis).

Shield 5 ought to mitigate damage from conditions (burn/bleed/torment/confusion/poison) by 15-30% or something while up, resistance is just another boon to get corrupted. Blocking projectiles is only going to help stop incoming damage that isn’t conditions applied so rather than as a condi clear it can be a brief respite from condi damage too.

Having it act as a personal block turns it from projectile/ranged damage avoidance to melee hate as well.

1) Yes, shield5 could be buff with 1 aegis when used.

Since all these unblockable skills are flying around on these patch, it would be only fair for Shield5 to be unblockable as well =D
On top of that, just merge Stalwart Defender and Strength in Numbers together xD

I think Shield is fine, imo. I’ve been using it for awhile now in TPvP.

• Absorbs reaper attacks and rev’s knockback ability
• Shield#4 deals a 1500+ front wave damage (depending on crit and might stacks)
• Bubble knockback in clutch stomp/rez situations
• Shield#4 team aegis block

Any more buffs and no one would use a Focus or Torch. Granted, since hot Torch’s effectiveness lowered due to burn guard’s performamce lowered, but all the same.