Guild Wars 2

TL;DR: Make this trait viable or replace it and make Reatliation viable as boon

Why is this trait still in the game? I tested, it now work properly, but makes no diference at all. And not only that, ITS A GM TRAIT! It is just a wasted slot. It should increase the damage by a greater amount or (what all of us want) a new trait, it can even be related to condition damage, now that condition guardian finally works.

Aside from this problem, Retaliation should be reworked like Confusion was. It should reflect a % damage back (maybe ~5% base), scaling with power (maybe +1% every 200 of power), so it is not a bomb aganist multi hits and does something aganist single hits. (In these numbers, you would reflect 2k damage as 300 retal dmg with 2k power)

Also, could be balanced aganist multiple targets with Retaliation by sum all damage and divide by the number of targets and a increasing factor accoding by the number of targets, something like:
Retaliation_Damage = Sum_of_All_Retal_Dmg / Number_of_targets * Number_of_targets / (10~20)
(Would have and increased damage aganist multiple hits, but it won’t be the full damage)

So it is not a bomb aganist multiple targets with retaliation. And in this way, Retal would be finally a vible boon. And wouldn’t be required to be balanced between PvE and WvW/PvP. Also, it could even be reduced by armor.

Now it is the weakest boon in the game. It only purpose is to bomb aganist AoE (must be applied to all nearby allies) or multi hit skills (which does not make sense for me).

Retaliation already does 300 damage with 2k power, and is already affected by armor. I’m happy with retaliation being strong against multi hit skills, because I don’t have enough blocks for all those hits.

That said, I would like to see it reworked, or have better traits that aren’t boring % damage modifiers. It would be cool if retaliation healed you for portion of it’s damage, or if each tick of retaliation reduced the damage of the next attack you take, or if retaliation did double damage when blocking.

Radiant retal is meant to be used for condi only specs, which don’t really exist, I was playing around with the idea of a WvW build that focused on AoE burns and radiant retaliation, and got the retal damage to over 500 when fully buffed, the issue is that in WvW it is scaled down horribly, and only was doing 300 damage against regular mobs. If they removed the nerf to it between game modes, it would honestly be pretty nice. but as it stands it doesnt work because of that.

Radiant Retaliation

• Allows pure Condi Guardians (Rabid/Dire/Settler/Shaman) to have good Retaliation Damage instead of pitiful 180 damage.
• Allows the highest Retaliation damage in the game.
• Can hit for over 430 damage in WvW with a full condi build.
• Rewards every single point of Condition Damage you have. The more you have, the better it works.

If you are running Hybrid, you will not see a huge improvement: Going from 239 to 261 isn’t a big deal. 10%+
If you are running full Condi: this trait can take you from 180 to 360 or more. 100%+

Oh man. Keep retal as it is and replace the trait. Down with passive crap >:U.

Reflect incoming damage back to its source

^ Retaliation doesn’t do that and never has. I just wish they would update the tooltip.

It technically does do that, only a portion of it though.

SlayerSixx.5763:

It technically does do that, only a portion of it though.

Not in the true terms of reflect, because that would imply you didnt take that damage at all. It should be “inflicts damage when hit by attacks.”

SlayerSixx.5763:

It technically does do that, only a portion of it though.

• The target takes full damage of the incoming attack – there is no reflection even of a portion.
• Retaliation damage is not a portion or percentage of the incoming attack – it is based solely on Power of the character who cast the boon.

The description is completely inaccurate.

Those numbers were only examples. It could be tweaked to be more viable.

Rabid/Dire/Settler/Shaman will never fit in the class, even if they make new conditions to the class, unless they add a lot of traits on crit conditons that other classes have, then Rabid would be a thing. They just need to remove this trait and put something else then because there is already a condition based trait on the same tier. It should be defensive, power based or utility.

Also, they should merge the extinct condition removal trait on Perfect Inscriptions. The class Signets already are weak. This limits too much the options when the other traits in same tier are so weak.

I believe, somewhere on their drawing board, they had prot and retal as one boon, but split it up for reasons unknown. Oh well. I’m down for them updating the tooltip though.

Retaliation is aleady weak on warriors and a total joke for a class with 10k base HP that uses aegis and blocks not to take damage.

All the Radiance GM traits needs complete rework, except the amplified wrath I guess but it could be better like gain 2 stack of might whenever you burn a foe.

The signets: light aura is just terrible and doesn’t even trigger on elite and heal signet neither on the wrath of justice) and radiant retaliation is trash to say it nicely.

The simplest way to fix RR would be to fix the retaliation dmg % so that it can actually have a tactical impact when being bursted.

SlayerSixx.5763:

I believe, somewhere on their drawing board, they had prot and retal as one boon, but split it up for reasons unknown. Oh well. I’m down for them updating the tooltip though.

Not really. They syngerize well, but they were definitely separate.

Retaliation is based on a Monk skill http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Retribution
Protection is based on the function of http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Protective_Spirit

Protective spirit is pretty powerful against big hits, but unless against rapid attacks. And for the most part there isn’t anything that mitigates rapid attacks other then Time based blocks (which worked on everything), as Regen filled that role perfectly fine.

In the case of GW2, Protective spirit’s mechanics posed a problem of complexity and scalability. So we ended up with a 33% flat damage reduction because it not only encompasses more, but is simple enough to account for with the active defense style of combat.

They should have removed the trait entirely and gave us some form of crit effect. Heck, I would even take a trait that gave out 3 hits per crit on 1s icd. I wouldn’t care if these hits did 1 damage each.. it would still be a better option than Radiant Retaliation :/

Send that trait to the grave already

Retaliation from Power
Base counter for Retaliation: 198 + 0,075 * Power
Average Power*: above 2000
Retaliation damage: 348 +/-

Retaliation from Condition Damage
Radiant Retaliation counter: 198 + 0,15 * Condition Damage
Average Condition Damage in condi builds*: 1300
Retaliation damage: 393 +/-

*Stats from PvP environment.

So the usual difference is lesser than 50 dmg. That’s not much. At least the base 198 could be increased, while using Radiant Retaliation.

To sum it up… right now Confusion from Mesmer’s scepter skills deals more damage even if enemy won’t use any abilities, than Retaliation. Balance gone wrong :P

#EDIT Further calculations
Damage based on base proffesion HP (%):

• 18472HP – Warrior, Necromancer
  Retaliation damage (Power): 1 hit – 1,88% of HP
  Retaliation damage (Condition Damage): 1 hit – 2,13% of HP
  Difference: +0,25% of HP

• 15182HP – Engineer, Ranger, Mesmer
  Retaliation damage (Power): 1 hit – 2,29% of HP
  Retaliation damage (Condition Damage): 1 hit – 2,59% of HP
  Difference: +0,30% of HP

• 10905HP – Guardian, Elementalist
  Retaliation damage (Power): 1 hit – 3,19% of HP
  Retaliation damage (Condition Damage): 1 hit – 3,60% of HP
  Difference: +0,41% of HP

• For every health pool scaling from condition damage improves the health loss per 1 hit by ~12% (example: 1,88/2,13*100%). In theory it’s equal, but in practice when we look at health pools there will be a difference in %.

WOW! It looks like Retaliation is more effective vs enemies with lower health pool.
I guess it’s nothing new :P.

Critical Retribution – Retaliation can now critically hit enemies that attack you, based on your Precision and Ferocity. You have a (33%) chance on critical hit to gain Retaliation for 5 seconds (15s ICD).

agreed Radiant Retaliation should be removed from the game…..And Retaliation is so passive and low hitting i dont even bother to think about it. Description is wrong its not a reflect. (ANET pls look at warrior shield reflect for an example of a true reflect)

Change the tooltip/descrip and preferably change the mechanics