Guild Wars 2

Cat Has Ducks.1982:

Ludus Rex.1562:

With 1200 healing power the update to the GS trait now adds 24hp per swing, for a whopping total of 49HPS each time you connect with your weapon. If you divide this by the Greatswords attack time, we can increase it to 59HPS. The healing portion of this is still super lackluster, it’s just now less lackluster.

Yeah a good analogy. It was like dying of AIDS. And now its like dying of AIDS, while winning a 10 dollar raffle.

You’re right it does horrible healing if you are auto attacking a single target, so you won’t notice it if you’re dueling 1v1. However, it really shines when applying AoE in a 1vX situation and combined with LitanyOW. It also gives yet another way of applying healing in addition to AH which was already powerful in a team fight.

Focus, can we remove it?

Shield, should be the primary blocker.

Torch. Burning should come from using said weapon so make it a main hand allowing use of focus/shield (preferably shield). Maybe this will allow some revamp of traits. Also can we change our condition type so it isn’t over written or is maybe actual useful?

Of course I’m looking at this from a WvW meta point of view. I do not focus or play much, if any, PvE content so not sure what this would do to those formats of play. I do apologize. More so if I over simplify moving torch to main hand.

Love how this got derailed. Thought we might actually have an organized place in the forums. lol

Dynnen.6405:

Love how this got derailed. Thought we might actually have an organized place in the forums. lol

It got derailed when you decided to make a bunch of identical posts expecting them to not get merged. Once the merge happened, this post was doomed. People like being able to follow a train of posts, but it got all messed up. No reason to be all mad, and blame the forum goers for it.

Dynnen.6405:

Love how this got derailed. Thought we might actually have an organized place in the forums. lol

Just need to reorganize and maybe start a new thread or edit the original post for better presentation?

It was a good thing you started, would be a shame to let it disappear.

Hammer #4 is amazing where it is at the moment. Its only a troll ability if you want it to be. It is extremely powerful if used correctly and if you spend the time practicing it. If it was AoE it would remove alot of the plays you can make and nerfing the knockback range would do the same.

At the moment I feel Banish has a fairly high skill cap. It shouldn’t be changed just because of that.

There are literally hundreds of ideas on how to restructure the trait lines. Yes some of them might be OP and but there were some real gems. I see no need for further discussion.

I won’t be playing or buying gems till there is a real dialogue about this class in this forum. If the Dev’s don’t take an interest in guardian why should I?

modDW.4187:

Hammer #4 is amazing where it is at the moment. Its only a troll ability if you want it to be. It is extremely powerful if used correctly and if you spend the time practicing it. If it was AoE it would remove alot of the plays you can make and nerfing the knockback range would do the same.

At the moment I feel Banish has a fairly high skill cap. It shouldn’t be changed just because of that.

I use banish to stop stomps, secure stomps, move enemy downed players to better stomp locations, stop a person from reviving, knock people off cliffs for fast stomps, interrupt heals, and ofc…troll. What I can’t do: stop more than 1 person stomping, prevent more than 1 person from reviving, etc, etc.

I would love to see it changed to what I suggested because we need CC and that would be a perfect place to put some into hammer.

Dynnen.6405:

modDW.4187:

Hammer #4 is amazing where it is at the moment. Its only a troll ability if you want it to be. It is extremely powerful if used correctly and if you spend the time practicing it. If it was AoE it would remove alot of the plays you can make and nerfing the knockback range would do the same.

At the moment I feel Banish has a fairly high skill cap. It shouldn’t be changed just because of that.

I use banish to stop stomps, secure stomps, move enemy downed players to better stomp locations, stop a person from reviving, knock people off cliffs for fast stomps, interrupt heals, and ofc…troll. What I can’t do: stop more than 1 person stomping, prevent more than 1 person from reviving, etc, etc.

I would love to see it changed to what I suggested because we need CC and that would be a perfect place to put some into hammer.

GS 5 and staff 5 can do both those things. Honestly I think adding anymore CC to guard will make it unbalanced. Co-coordinating CC with team-mates is what people should be trying to do, not trying to lower the skill cap of an already low skill cap game.

Fixing things like how leap skills interact with terrain is a great idea though.

Just my 2 cents.

modDW.4187:

Dynnen.6405:

modDW.4187:

Hammer #4 is amazing where it is at the moment. Its only a troll ability if you want it to be. It is extremely powerful if used correctly and if you spend the time practicing it. If it was AoE it would remove alot of the plays you can make and nerfing the knockback range would do the same.

At the moment I feel Banish has a fairly high skill cap. It shouldn’t be changed just because of that.

I use banish to stop stomps, secure stomps, move enemy downed players to better stomp locations, stop a person from reviving, knock people off cliffs for fast stomps, interrupt heals, and ofc…troll. What I can’t do: stop more than 1 person stomping, prevent more than 1 person from reviving, etc, etc.

I would love to see it changed to what I suggested because we need CC and that would be a perfect place to put some into hammer.

GS 5 and staff 5 can do both those things. Honestly I think adding anymore CC to guard will make it unbalanced. Co-coordinating CC with team-mates is what people should be trying to do, not trying to lower the skill cap of an already low skill cap game.

Fixing things like how leap skills interact with terrain is a great idea though.

Just my 2 cents.

GS 5/Staff 5 have extremely long CDs, when traited they are just long CDs. Staff 5 is more of a area denial ability instead of a CC (unless they run into the wall ofc). The problem is we have next to no direct CC, IE a stun or a daze. In literally every other MMO where there is a tank class that has low damage they have had lots of soft CC to keep people from running…we dont have any soft CC and very mediocre hard CC.

Its pretty funny how you mention skill cap, but I don’t even see you combo hammer with JI in your vids. JI + hammer raises the ‘skill cap’ a lot. It wouldn’t lower this skill cap you keep mentioning to make it a meaningful CC on an aoe melee weapon.

kekuso.5837:

Cat Has Ducks.1982:

Ludus Rex.1562:

With 1200 healing power the update to the GS trait now adds 24hp per swing, for a whopping total of 49HPS each time you connect with your weapon. If you divide this by the Greatswords attack time, we can increase it to 59HPS. The healing portion of this is still super lackluster, it’s just now less lackluster.

Yeah a good analogy. It was like dying of AIDS. And now its like dying of AIDS, while winning a 10 dollar raffle.

You’re right it does horrible healing if you are auto attacking a single target, so you won’t notice it if you’re dueling 1v1. However, it really shines when applying AoE in a 1vX situation and combined with LitanyOW. It also gives yet another way of applying healing in addition to AH which was already powerful in a team fight.

If you’re 1vX’ing people of somewhat equal or better skill than you, the heal from this still isn’t going to amount to jack squat, where which jack already left town.

The only time this will shine is if you’re facing upgraded opponents of bad player skill, and at that point it still won’t matter because you wouldn’t need it.

The heal needs more upgrading imo.

So, Guardian needs to be reworked?
In the other classes i play i find that what Guardian does other classes do it better, about CC other classes are so efective they almost dont need it.

Aeolus.3615:

So, Guardian needs to be reworked?
In the other classes i play i find that what Guardian does other classes do it better, about CC other classes are so efective they almost dont need it.

Yes it does. The trait lines are a mess, and the weapons…well just read the posts on the first page about problems with the weapons. Spirit weapons/symbols are bland and nearly useless; and our health pool is unacceptable. These things need to be addressed, asap.

Traited – GS #5 has a 24sec cooldown. That’s 4 seconds longer than a Traited Banish. Staff 5 has great area of denial, yes. But if you cast it on top of all those people ressing they all get knocked down. The same can be done with Hammer #5, but requires alot of practice and good positioning in fights.

At the moment banish is all about having perfect positioning and timing. I check to see if the target has stability or similar, check to see my cooldowns, then I start casting and running towards my target, positioning myself for where I want them hit and which target will be hit, if they are close together. Just before the hit goes off I double check to see if I’m blinded and if so, I condi clear before the hit. If I arrive too late to the target and banish is not in range, I waste my cooldown. If I’m too early and run slightly through the target, the Banish misses – Great! I’ve been punished for making a mistake. If my teammate gets stomped etc, its completely my fault.

This to me is balanced. If I use a really powerful and game changing ability correctly, I’m rewarded for it. If I use it incorrectly, I’m punished for it and my enemy can capitalise on it if they are smart enough to and should be rewarded with a stomp or making my team blow more cd’s to make up for it.

Making it a cone effect would increase the hit box, which would simply make it a ‘Push #4’ ability. And people would go flying in any which direction, like Mesmer GS #5. Making things like Punt Stomps and isolating targets from their groups completely RNG based or no longer possible at all.

Guardian CC only lacks if you’re trying to chase someone. In a fight or while kiting they have some of the strongest CC in the game. THE strongest defensive CC in the game, if used correctly IMO.

Guardian thrives in group play. So lets assume you have a group with you. Nearly any of your DPS teammates can gap close and lockdown a target long enough for you to arrive and get some CC off. Great! – You were rewarded for using teamwork.

I play with 300-400ms latency, and have no trouble landing my cc for the most part. I know my Hammer #5 is going to lock me in place so I position myself accordingly or call for a target to be locked down or crippled so I can position myself. If people cant land their Ring of Warding it’s because they didn’t have good positioning, they didn’t use their other cooldowns or teammates effectively or because the target dodged the other cooldowns to lock him down and he was rewarded for it.

Thanks for the ‘1st week of release’ tip. The reason I don’t use JI is I feel it’s a complete waste of a cooldown in the groups I run in. Why would I want to waste a stun breaker, and a slot with a huge cooldown, for a 1200 range CC (~2000 range if using hammer #3), If the thief or ele in my group can do double that plus delete the target in 2 seconds? The only reason I would want it mid fight is if I was 1200 range away from one of my allies and I needed to peel/heal for them. In which case something is going very wrong if we are that far from each other in a fight and we should be punished for it accordingly.

Instead, I use ‘Hold The Line’. Which I can use twice per one JI. Which totals at 6k regen for my whole team, 14seconds of protection (-33% damage) for my whole team, and two condi’s not only cleared but converted into boons for more survivability and can save the life of someone caught in an immobilise or act as a stun breaker for someone caught in a fear. The only thing JI is good for mid fight is correcting bad positioning, which is great, but I can already do that with my GS which has 1/3 the cooldown.

I’d give you some of my tips in return, but I haven’t seen any of your vids.

Different playstyles. JI allows more for clutch plays and quick reactions to an unpredictable battlefield while Hold the Line allows for more of a conservative sustain and outlast playstyle.

JI opens up a lot of utility and versatility to make clutch plays in unpredictable situations. If you see a bunch of people grouped up together at range, you can JI/Ring them so your groupmates can dump AoE on them. Running up to them slowly to place the ring won’t work. JI is all about awareness of surroundings and taking advantage of a situation instantly.

JI/root allows you to catch up to people who are beyond 1200 range. You can also JI/banish someone stomping a team-mate if you are out of range to get to them by running. Got a guy downed in a crowd with enemies trying to revive him? Banish while starting your stomp channel and JI to finish him off. Of course, there is also JI stomping a thief on port and you can use JI to close the gap to an elementalist after he has misted to secure a stomp.

It’s not all about hammer, of course. JI/SoA is huge for clutch plays. Got some guys stomping a friend at long range? JI to them, knock them off and revive. Got an enemy downed deep behind the lines and he is getting rezzed? JI to them, knock them off and stability stomp.

And, of course… JI/SoA to knock back some suckas standing too close to a cliff.

It can also be used to kite and escape focus trains by JIing to a distant target

JI isn’t a wasted cooldown if you use it to make clutch plays particularly when dealing with downed state situations.

@modDW: So you’re running a sustain bunker condi clear build. Thats completely different from how I play my Guard. I’m the initiator for my group, how I do this is by utilizing JI with RoW. This creates chaos in the ranks of the people I’m attacking which usually causes them to try and get out of the ring as fast as possible. During this time I’m dropping aoe and root while they are bouncing off the wall, and if I have time I banish one into the ring for double CC. For any of our CC to work the people have to walk into it. Also I’ve never been able to zombie walk at a group of people and cast RoW without getting CCed to death, it can happen mid combat; but never at the start.

Anyway, yes you can put down lines on top of someone with staff and yes you can pull them with greatsword. Unless they are stacked or in a direct line away from you, the closer person will eat the binding blades. I’ve had 1 person eat 4 of them before, he took around 4500 damage, but my CC was garbage. To initiate well with hammer you need JI, and since I don’t run PoV I don’t spam shouts. So what is happening is both of us are looking at this from how we play and saying: “well thats not right”.

I can honestly say that banish is a good CC and I have been using it well since beta. The only problem is its single target, and if there are two people trying to stomp a person, or two people trying to revive…it won’t save the person. Thats why I run shield. For the extra bit of healing, the knock back, and protection to assist in getting stomps and revives. My problem is that its not great CC. All of the Guardian’s 4/5 abilities have insane cooldowns, so they should be great.

In terms of cooldowns, you could compare it to staggering blow. Banish has a 25 sec cooldown and staggering blow has a 20 sec cooldown. One is single target and the other is AoE. It would make sense for the single target to have a shorter cooldown.

Banish has a longer knockback, but that is actually detrimental in many cases. The only time I can think of where that is beneficial is for knocking people off of cliffs.

The other advantage that banish had over staggering blow is that it didn’t root you to cast it, but that advantage no longer exists.

When Dynnen is saying that the guardian’s CC isn’t that good, he is comparing it to the other frontliner, the warrior. And he is right. The warrior has CC setups that far surpass what a guardian can do in both hard and soft CC. That is probably appropriate in terms of balance since the guardian brings more group support, but the question is how much better should the warrior be?