Guild Wars 2

This isn’t a balance thing, so don’t shoot me, I know people get really attached to their weapons. I was just thinking today while playing on my guardian, doesn’t focus 5 and Shield 5 seem backwards?

I could see focus being a mystical tool used to create a forcefield/bubble.
While it makes more sense for a shield to trigger “Shield of Wrath” as an active block.

Anyone else find these to be seemingly backwards in regards to what you’d expect the weapons’ functionalities to be?

I’m not asking for them to be changed, just an obvservation!!!

Yeah, it is kind of backwards. Frankly guardian Shield is pretty lackluster – don’t get me wrong, it CAN be good in certain situations, a couple of fractals/dungeons, and in sPvP. But Focus is better, between the blind, burst damage, blast finisher, and potential mitigation from blocking hits outright.

I see Focus as an offensive/defensive weapon, while shield as an defensive/support weapon. That’s why I think they aren’t reversed. 3 blocks are easily depleted in zerg fight.

They do seem reversed. But you know what would make the shield one good?

If we ourself blocked all ranged and melee attacks directed at us while we stand channel the shield 5 skill.

Also skill number 4 needs a buff or a cd reduction.

Shield needs lower cooldowns, is all I have to say

The cooldowns of shield abilities are far too long for what they bring. I wouldn’t even call the shield defensive/support. The reason for this is that the huge cooldown makes the abilities so insignificant in most situations, that it’s basically useless.

Many see it as one of our icon weapons, and so do I, but generally there are far better options than using it. It’s almost as bad as the torch.

How about change shield 4 to this:

3 seconds of block. At the end of the block gain 1 second of protection to you and your party for every blocked attack (max 6 seconds of protection, 30 second cooldown).

The “logic” behind shield is seen when you compare the cooldowns and abilities to other shield skills.

Engineer has projectile blocks, pushback, stuns
Warrior has physical blocks, and stuns
Guardian has a mix of both with lesser effectivness (jack of all trades).

Protection will reduce damage by 33% for the next 3 seconds give or take.
Block would stop 3 attacks, no matter the scale of damage, so it could block a 1 damage ability and then you get hit by the 500 damage ability.

So protection works longer for the “duration” of the fight, while block works better for the instance of attack.

shield of absorption is our “stun/knockback” that all shields have, with the added flare of mixing in engineer projectile blocking as well. and a minor burst heal to boot.

It is not what i had in mind for a shield, but it fulfills the requirements when you take a step back and think about it.

Oh and every guardian ever since the beginning of this game has wondered the same thing…why does my shield not block, swap it with focus…but as noted above they have a rhyme for the reason.

TBH, if you want to get niddy-griddy with details, I always wished shield 4 would act the way it does now but have a slightly longer protection, and daze in a cone (be more like WoW’s prot warrior Shock wave, but daze instead of stun), that’d be really kitten cool. Then, make shield provide the blocks and the focus have the knockback. And tbh a slightly lower cd on either might be okay. 3 blocks for a long CD or infinite blocks for 3 full seconds on a shorter cooldown for warriors? I feel like our block is a little lack-luster in general, even with the potential damage.

I think 5 seconds protection is enough.

Yes 5 second(3SPvP) protection is as good, as good as 3 second unlimited block.
We should acctualy totaly nerf that op kitten to give like 1 second protection(0.5 in SPvP)

Cause god forgive Guardian got something equally or even stronger than Warrior.

xFireize.6318:

I think 5 seconds protection is enough.

Sadly it is nerfed to 3 seconds in spvp.

Thanks for correcting me, I haven’t played sPvP in a long time.

I kinda like that other professions’ shield abilities are about protecting themselves while the Guardian’s shield can also protect others.
While it does make sense that a shield blocks and we’re missing out on a little trait synergy by our shield not blocking, Guardian shield is still quite capable of stopping a lot of damage, I don’t want focus #5 swapped with shield #5.

I don’t want them swapped either and the skill 5 would be fine even with its current cooldown. If we blocked all attacks(not unblockable ofc) ourself that are direct to us while sitting down.

Skill 4 need alot of work however. It is really good if you run boon duration, but here is a kicker. Not every Guardian do.

I’d be less annoyed at Shield if the cooldowns were lower. Warrior shield is arguably more powerful than ours (due to the leap/stun as well as full blocking) but has lower cooldowns. wat.

Its all part of what hurts guardian skills in general. With great support, comes great cool downs. Guard skills tend to be weak 1 on 1. We only really shine when in a group where our skills are much stronger, even if most of the time it feels we are leaning on others to succeed.

I’d like shield a lot better if the cooldowns were a bit lower. Am I the only one thinking they’re a bit too high? I’m not asking for them to be cut so low I could spam it, that would be OP. But a slight reduction would be nice. The high cooldowns make it a bit too situational so I mainly use it to mess with people in wvw and knock them off of cliffs.

I really like the idea of focus projecting a magical shield to block. This kinda shows that guardian is not a physical brute like warrior who just uses shield to block stuff, but rather a fighter with magical powers who uses magick to block.

^^^ this is what i think as well. : )) it’s kind of nice that the Guardian shield doesn’t do just what any old shield would do. adds a little more flavor to the class itself. i know it’s hard to fathom and embrace a shield that doesn’t block. but the shield on the Guardian, though does not block physical melee attacks, it’s a group support mechanic and protects the entire group of people from projectiles, which i kind of enjoy as well (though i really only use it for pushing or insta knock back lol)

akamon.2769:

^^^ this is what i think as well. : )) it’s kind of nice that the Guardian shield doesn’t do just what any old shield would do. adds a little more flavor to the class itself. i know it’s hard to fathom and embrace a shield that doesn’t block. but the shield on the Guardian, though does not block physical melee attacks, it’s a group support mechanic and protects the entire group of people from projectiles, which i kind of enjoy as well (though i really only use it for pushing or insta knock back lol)

Aaaah the young and there ideas, i guess you never used it in WvWvW. For if you did, you would know that standing still in the middle of a zerg and activating it and letting it run its course will only end with one conclusion. You my good sir, is dead. So dead you would wish we had defensive block on it.

As it is now, the 40 second cooldown is way to high, to not allow yourself to block attacks directec towards yourself.

Warrior Shield 5 with 10 points into defense reflects projectiles for 3 seconds. Also, if you stand opposite a projectile with a warrior blocking in the middle, the warrior blocks the projectile.

Of course this isn’t nearly as large as the shield bubble from the guardian shield, but warriors can deflect the projectiles and are immune to pretty much everything else while moving.

I would like to see shield tweaked for guardian to be on par with warrior shield at least when traited.

Perikittenor.1892:

akamon.2769:

^^^ this is what i think as well. : )) it’s kind of nice that the Guardian shield doesn’t do just what any old shield would do. adds a little more flavor to the class itself. i know it’s hard to fathom and embrace a shield that doesn’t block. but the shield on the Guardian, though does not block physical melee attacks, it’s a group support mechanic and protects the entire group of people from projectiles, which i kind of enjoy as well (though i really only use it for pushing or insta knock back lol)

Aaaah the young and there ideas, i guess you never used it in WvWvW. For if you did, you would know that standing still in the middle of a zerg and activating it and letting it run its course will only end with one conclusion. You my good sir, is dead. So dead you would wish we had defensive block on it.

As it is now, the 40 second cooldown is way to high, to not allow yourself to block attacks directec towards yourself.

just a little thing that I know isn’t going to suddenly make it worthwhile, but you do know that if you tap a movement key right when you cast shield 5 you can move around and attack but the bubble will stay their for the duration. I use to buy me time against ranged so I can heal, or try to bait them into melee. worked great against an engi the other day.

It may seem odd that Guardian Sword doesn’t simply block, like a shield would. But look at Mesmer Greatsword. Occasionally ANet likes to get clever and uses weapons for something other than their intended purpose.

rajule.8054:

Perikittenor.1892:

akamon.2769:

^^^ this is what i think as well. : )) it’s kind of nice that the Guardian shield doesn’t do just what any old shield would do. adds a little more flavor to the class itself. i know it’s hard to fathom and embrace a shield that doesn’t block. but the shield on the Guardian, though does not block physical melee attacks, it’s a group support mechanic and protects the entire group of people from projectiles, which i kind of enjoy as well (though i really only use it for pushing or insta knock back lol)

Aaaah the young and there ideas, i guess you never used it in WvWvW. For if you did, you would know that standing still in the middle of a zerg and activating it and letting it run its course will only end with one conclusion. You my good sir, is dead. So dead you would wish we had defensive block on it.

As it is now, the 40 second cooldown is way to high, to not allow yourself to block attacks directec towards yourself.

just a little thing that I know isn’t going to suddenly make it worthwhile, but you do know that if you tap a movement key right when you cast shield 5 you can move around and attack but the bubble will stay their for the duration. I use to buy me time against ranged so I can heal, or try to bait them into melee. worked great against an engi the other day.

Graphical glitch. The bubble doesn’t really persist, just the effect. You gain no advantage by doing that.

foofad.5162:

rajule.8054:

Perikittenor.1892:

akamon.2769:

^^^ this is what i think as well. : )) it’s kind of nice that the Guardian shield doesn’t do just what any old shield would do. adds a little more flavor to the class itself. i know it’s hard to fathom and embrace a shield that doesn’t block. but the shield on the Guardian, though does not block physical melee attacks, it’s a group support mechanic and protects the entire group of people from projectiles, which i kind of enjoy as well (though i really only use it for pushing or insta knock back lol)

Aaaah the young and there ideas, i guess you never used it in WvWvW. For if you did, you would know that standing still in the middle of a zerg and activating it and letting it run its course will only end with one conclusion. You my good sir, is dead. So dead you would wish we had defensive block on it.

As it is now, the 40 second cooldown is way to high, to not allow yourself to block attacks directec towards yourself.

just a little thing that I know isn’t going to suddenly make it worthwhile, but you do know that if you tap a movement key right when you cast shield 5 you can move around and attack but the bubble will stay their for the duration. I use to buy me time against ranged so I can heal, or try to bait them into melee. worked great against an engi the other day.

Graphical glitch. The bubble doesn’t really persist, just the effect. You gain no advantage by doing that.

Uh no, it still blocks projectiles and you take no damage from them. I use it constantly.

Interesting! I just checked and you’re right. Sometime last year, there was a bug where when you disengaged the shield prematurely the graphic of the bubble would remain, but Anet fixed it around April. The bubble was nonfunctional though. It would sometimes even persist indefinitely on your screen. This is definitely “worse.”

Sir Alymer.3406:

Warrior Shield 5 with 10 points into defense reflects projectiles for 3 seconds.

Don’t even dare to say that you lack projectile reflection as a guardian. Just don’t.

No we are not. But our shield is totaly bullshait as it is right now, either add stuff or lower cd.

Perikittenor.1892:

No we are not. But our shield is totaly bullshait as it is right now, either add stuff or lower cd.

As a mace guardian i would totally apreciate it!

Isslair.4908:

Sir Alymer.3406:

Warrior Shield 5 with 10 points into defense reflects projectiles for 3 seconds.

Don’t even dare to say that you lack projectile reflection as a guardian. Just don’t.

I wasn’t. I was simply comparing the shield skills of a warrior to the shield skills of the guardian. The guardian doesn’t get to block melee attacks and projectiles with their shield while the warrior does block both types of attacks with minor investments in defense.

Perikittenor.1892:

akamon.2769:

^^^ this is what i think as well. : )) it’s kind of nice that the Guardian shield doesn’t do just what any old shield would do. adds a little more flavor to the class itself. i know it’s hard to fathom and embrace a shield that doesn’t block. but the shield on the Guardian, though does not block physical melee attacks, it’s a group support mechanic and protects the entire group of people from projectiles, which i kind of enjoy as well (though i really only use it for pushing or insta knock back lol)

Aaaah the young and there ideas, i guess you never used it in WvWvW. For if you did, you would know that standing still in the middle of a zerg and activating it and letting it run its course will only end with one conclusion. You my good sir, is dead. So dead you would wish we had defensive block on it.

As it is now, the 40 second cooldown is way to high, to not allow yourself to block attacks directec towards yourself.

ops. sorry for the late reply.

i do use it in WvW. and i do use it differerntly than iw ould in PvE…. but i guess i wasn’t being clear so you didn’t notice. i was referring mainly to PvE mechanics (projectile blocking).. while in WvW, you know it’s most useful as an AoE insta-knockback. see the aprt where i said i mainly use it for the knockback in my original message? you can double tap to heal if you need. but more often than not, i cancel it and you can start moving around again. a neat little trick, in case you didn’t know….

moreover, i too do agree that the CDs on shields are too high. my comment you quoted, i was merely reflecting on the idea of the Guardian shield vs warr/engi shield vs real life shield use and i liked that it was different. nothing more, nothing less. to be honest though, the projectile blocking could be toned up or tweaked a LOT more. never said if it was effective or not. just commenting on the overall “idea”.

if i want defensive blocks, i take focus. or shelter. and oh hey, renewed focus. you know the shield doesn’t do what you want, so why would you expect it to do what you want?

plus, when i am in a zerg, i don’t bring a shield. but smallg roup play? if you use it well, it can be pretty amazing. again, not for projectile blocking. pushback. and heal. mainly pushback.

I’d really only change this, and that’s only based on the long cooldowns:

Shield 4 – Should be 5 seconds everywhere, should either deal more damage or interrupt (daze probably)

Shield 5 – Should explode at end of duration automagically (you can still prematurely explode it and move on). Could probably heal for more, seems to heal about as much as a dodge roll, which requires very little investment…..

For Akamon.2769

One knockback every 40 sec on up to five enemies is not that good. It is on demand but it is not that big radius and the cd for a knockback itself is terrible. For WvWvW it would be aswesome and a few aspect of it is during a zerg.

Blocking all blockable ranged attacks for give or take 4 seconds on the melee train, is rather good for the group, but it will leave you out in the open in exchange. But if we also blocked attacks while “chanelling the skill”, it would synergies alot bether with our on block traits and justify the 40 second cd.

@Perikittenor – i do agree. one of the largest complaints for the shield as of now, assuming no changes can be made to the skills themselves, is that the CDs are way too long (a lot of Guardian CDs are way too long tbh).

i did mention we have a way “around the root”, but of course, that doesn’t mean it’s not a problem. blocking attacks would be a nice change. i even thought of being able to move, with the bubble following (just absorbing projectiles), but that might be OP. :// maybe shorter duration could work.

again, i like the idea of it. a shield with mystical elements attached to it and not being used as a typical shield.. though, seeing as it as almost little to no uses in PvE does say something about the skills.

Perikittenor.1892:

Blocking all blockable ranged attacks for give or take 4 seconds on the melee train, is rather good for the group

Well, tbh, what ranged attacks do you actually have in a melee train scenario?
It won’t stop wells, mesmer lasers, guard staff spam. Rangers are unviable for zerg warfare, warriors don’t run longbows, eles spam aoes.
Does it block engi nades?
Feels kinda unneeded there.

I do not know what type it blocks, what i do know is that when i use it. It reminds me of the new year firework from all the triggered effects shimmering on the dome.