Guild Wars 2

Recently I started thinking about “Spirit Weapons” & their overall unused state. I started asking questions:

• What is their purpose?
• What is their theme?
• Why are they unused?
• What should they look like?
• How should they act?

To start I wasn’t sure other then this was the Guardian’s Summon/Pet build options but I wanted more, a better understanding. So I started to look for lore, video clips & art works & one piece of art work became the central image for my rework of spirit weapons, Judgement. From the name & the image my concept for Spirit Weapons solidified into one of Smiting.

“Unstoppable Justice”
This is an idea similar to the Reaper & the Berserker were I also wanted to differentiate slightly from other pet builds. First some concepts:

• Smiting
• Melee focused build
• Break Bar
• Heavily control resistant
• A window of vulnerability if control resistance breached.
• Counter play to pets through break bar, kiting & non damaging condition effects
• Some benefit when pets on cooldown.
• Weaknesses conditions, breaking through the Break bar.

Spirit Weapon:

• Summons “Spirit Weapon” when equipped to smite your foes. Unsheathed spirit weapon grants a Break bar that protects you from control effects.
• Each consecutive spirit weapon equipped increase the Break bar’s strength.
• Apply 1/4 sec Daze & 5 sec of 5 stacks of vulnerability when Break bar broken each unsheathed spirit weapon increases the vulnerability stack by 5.
• All unsheathed spirit weapon is are placed on cooldown if Foes Break through the Break.
• Spirit weapons cooldowns don’t start until after 5 sec if Foes Break through the Break.
• Entering combat unsheathe spirit weapons equipped.
• Spirit weapons can not be damaged but are effected by boons & non damaging condition effects.
• Spirit weapons Chained to the Guardian, limiting movement & AA attack range.
• Spirit weapons attack foes in range but primary attack the foe the Guardian’s attacking & stop attacking foes out of range.
• Activating command ability sheaths the spirit weapon placing it on cooldown.
• Sheathed spirit weapons provide a secondary effect.

Behavioural & Visual Changes – Spirit Weapons

Spirit Weapons are now Chained to the Guardian like in the Judgement image. This will greatly limiting spirit weapon movement & attack range centred around the Guardian. This means no more spirit weapon running off on their own, also while in combat but not engaged spirit weapons travel close to the Guardian slightly to the side & behind. Also after the target leaves the attack radius unless there is another foe within range to attack spirit weapons will return to there travelling position.

One spirit located MH side.
Two spirits one each MH & OH.
Three Spirits one each side & one behind.

While not is combat each of the spirit weapons equipped will Sheaths on the back of the Guardian (Example image below). With regards to equipped weapons that match equipped spirit weapons it would be nice if real weapons were displayed sheathed while out of combat with a blue glow surrounding it to indicate the present of the matching spirit weapon.

There are also two other conditions that will sheath spirit weapons.

1. Activating the command ability will sheath the spirit weapon placing it on cooldown.
2. Foes that break through the Guardian’s Break bar force all unsheathed spirit weapons to fade away causing the connecting chains to the Guardian to shatter creating a 5 sec window of vulnerability before sheathing the spirit weapons placing them all on cooldown.

Still working on exact function for each spirit weapon which I’m looking to post once completed. But could this be a viable option for spirit weapons & what sheathed effects interest players?

New Spirit Weapons
In designing these I thought it was better to create them stronger then having them feel to weak.

Sword of Justice (Cooldown 25 sec)
Spirit Weapon: Summons an mystical greatsword when equipped to smite your foes.

• When unsheathed grants a tier 1 break bar. (Break bar tiers are additive)
• Damage: 246 (Power coefficient: 0.246)
• Number of Targets: 3
• Spirit Radius: 300

“Sheathed Sword of Justice”

• Virtue of Justice’s active boon or condition applies a second stack (eg VoJ now applies 2 stack of burning when activated).

“Justice’s Judgement” (Cast time: 3/4 sec, Cooldown: 10 sec)
Command the Sword of Justice to strike its location damaging nearby foes, Sword is sheathed after command.

• Damage: 473 (Power coefficient: 0.473)
• Applies Vulnerability (5 sec, 5 Stacks), vulnerability stack increase by 1 per foes hit (max 10 stacks).
• Number of Targets: 5
• Radius: 180

Hammer of Wisdom (Cooldown 30 sec)
Spirit Weapon: Summons an mystical hammer when equipped to smite your foes.

• When unsheathed grants a tier 1 break bar. (Break bar tiers are additive)
• Damage: 174 (Power coefficient: 0.174)
• Number of Targets: 3
• Spirit Radius: 300

“Sheathed Hammer of Wisdom”

• Grants a lesser symbol of protection every few attacks (on tenth attack).
  “Lesser Symbol of Protection”
• Damage: 93 (Power coefficient: 0.093)
• Applies Protection (1 sec) -33% Incoming Damage
• Number of Targets: 5
• Symbol Duration: 2 sec
• Symbol Radius: 180
• Combo Field: Light

“Wisdom’s Verdict” (Cast time: 3/4 sec, Cooldown: 15 sec)
Command the Hammer of Wisdom to knock down your foes, Hammer is sheathed after command.

• Damage: 788 (Power coefficient: 0.788)
• Knockdown: 3 sec
• Number of Targets: 1
• Range: 1200

Bow of Truth (Cooldown 25 sec)
Spirit Weapon: Summons an mystical longbow when equipped to smite your foes.

• When unsheathed grants a tier 1 break bar. (Break bar tiers are additive)
• Projectile
• Damage: 293 (Power coefficient: 0.293)
• Targets per Arrow 5
• Pierces
• Range: 600
• Spirit Radius: 300

“Sheathed Bow of Truth”

• Virtue of Resolve’s Healing increased: 15% (effects both passive & active)

“Truth’s Mercy” (Cast time: 3/4 sec, Cooldown: 20)
Command the Bow of Truth to barrage its location with healing arrows.

• Projectile
• Arrows Healing: 66 (Healing coefficient: 0.085)
• Number of Impacts: 40
• Impact Radius: 20
• Number of Targets: 5
• Duration: 9 sec
• Radius: 180

Shield of the Avenger (Cooldown 40 sec)
Spirit Weapon: Summons an mystical shield when equipped to defend you.

• When unsheathed grants a tier 1 break bar. (Break bar tiers are additive)
• Periodical creates a shield wall at shields location perpendicular to you, blocking all attacks.
• Spirit Radius: 300

“Shield Wall” (Cooldown 20 sec)
Shield of the Avenger expands in size defending from all attacks that hit the wall.

• Health: 5000
• Duration: 4 sec
• Avenger’s Pain Damage Increases: 25% of Shield Wall damge received

“Sheathed Shield of the Avenger”

• Grants Aegis (5 sec) when sheathed
• Grants Swiftness (10 sec) when sheathed

“Avenger’s Pain” (Cast time: 3/4 sec, Cooldown: 20 sec)
Command the Shield of the Avenger to fly out your foes, Shield is sheathed after command.

• Projectile
• Damage: 631 (Power coefficient: 0.631)
• Applies Weakness (6 sec)
• Number of Bounces: 3
• Range: 1200

“Wrathful Spirits” – Grandmaster Trait (Zeal)
Spirit weapons can now be commanded twice & burn foes they strike. Spirit weapons recharge is reduced when activating a virtue.

• Spirit weapons can now be commanded twice before sheathing.
• Applies Burning (2 sec)
• Virtue activation: 5 sec reduction to cooldown.

Now some thoughts with regarding gameplay. I’m looking at spirit weapon sheathing & cooldowns as the method of refreshing the breakbar. Give players different options in managing their summons & break bar.

This should also provide opportunities of different strength bars to break through & maybe none at all as well as appropriate windows to damage the bar without it healing too fast for foes.

Lastly I wanted foes to feel rewarded for breaking through the break bar.

With the sheathed aspect I was looking at providing the method of survivability & hard choices. Do you want the sustain damage & command skill or do you need the sheathed bonus.

Weakness involve conditions, kiting & breaking through break bar.

Other then this rework could a bonus while spirit weapons are on cooldown similar to the sheathed effects help the existing spirit weapons?

I didnt read everything but reading some of it made me think of using spirit weapons as a mix between minions and kits. while theyre on your utility bar they follow you around and provide support through damage and healing, then if you ‘activate the kit’ by pressing the skill you can then physically equip the spirit weapon and gain a new set of skills to play around with.

This might sound overpowered in that they would be active at all times but i’m sure there could be some sort of solution or change that could enable it to work. I dont know, seems like a cool way to keep the idea of spirit weapons aiding you independently while also using them actively.

merchantchuck.4875:

I didnt read everything but reading some of it made me think of using spirit weapons as a mix between minions and kits. while theyre on your utility bar they follow you around and provide support through damage and healing, then if you ‘activate the kit’ by pressing the skill you can then physically equip the spirit weapon and gain a new set of skills to play around with.

This might sound overpowered in that they would be active at all times but i’m sure there could be some sort of solution or change that could enable it to work. I dont know, seems like a cool way to keep the idea of spirit weapons aiding you independently while also using them actively.

That would make them more controllable, but add more spells like toolkits, might take longer also time to fix them, and that would make very similar to how ele’s use their summon weapons.

We could have a similar way how we controlled heroes on GW1 (via flag pole, wich is already on the game engine since this is a fork, i guess) to control the SW with some command skills on SW bar with 2-3 command skills (2 commands and 1 detonation).

It would be like instead of having those SW taking our weapons place we could still use them controlling their position and effects.

It would be a cool idea & rework of spirit weapons but not to sure if spirit weapons should become kits. I lean towards keeping them more into the minion category & a kit like utility set was mentioned as a possibility of an elite when Guardian Tome’s were redesigned.

To differentiate from Necromancer minions which are what spirit weapons are basically but with at time limit I was looking at making them permanent & removing their health. Their health was replaced with the break bar & I bought back the de-summoning on command.

I added the sheathed effects for two reasons:
1. Provide the survivability for a spirit weapon build
2. This conflicting element of decisions

• Smiting gamplay – spirit weapons active.
• Survivability – spirit weapons sheathed.
• Break bar maintenance – cycling cooldowns to renew break bar to prevent break throughs.

The main problem I have with current spirit weapons is if I want to play a minion(s) / pet(s) builds if I can summon more then one minion I prefer to have all of them out & in play. The problem being with current spirit weapons is if played this way is the massive down time. Another issue is only having one spirit weapon summoned feels lacking, underpowered & very limiting in fights.

If we keep spirit weapons functional as they are, Timed Summons I would prefer a more disposable minion type gameplay with shorter cooldowns.

Bezagron.7352:

I(…)
If we keep spirit weapons functional as they are, Timed Summons I would prefer a more disposable minion type gameplay with shorter cooldowns.

Even with the short cooldown they are useless.

Any player that has more speed movement , SW wont touch them, basicly almost all players..
Their attack is slow, their cast time is enough to get you in trouble or downed, can be kited easily w/o much movement, i even tried a condi build for guardian using them, having 3 imobs in build, still did not worked.

(edit) it is like Anet is doying class control, they cant tune up the Guardian becouse class is so awesome that every one would play one.
Yet is class less played for sure by Anet.

Just wondering could the bounded nature (spirit radius) in my idea be apply. Could this enable more reliability with spirit weapons attacking foes within this range:

• Can only attack foes within this range (reduces travel time for spirits)
• Increased attack frequency due to reduced travel time.

personally I dont see how they could fix spirit weapons in the current state ithout going a complete new way like you suggested.

However I am pretty sure anets gonna leave them as is until a specialisation that centers around them. Then you can tie them to the Virtues and replace the existing wards with utilites that boosts them and yourself (spirit wards or something).

At the moment the case ist lost.

To quote myself:

Another idea I’m wondering about that’s actual could be minor change but I’m interested in how it would change the gameplay is to change them to Bounded Minions

What I mean is keep spirit weapons as they are but limit their roaming range, a Spirit Radius as such. This would reduce travel time to target, which with the loss of travel time could increase attack frequency.

Then some further changes could be:

• Make them permanent summons until killed (Differentiated by Guardians – Bounded Summons).
• Visual / Function addition: Chained to Guardian / contact with chains cause Damage over Time &/or an Effect (condition, boon, etc).
• Change cooldown reduction to: When a spirit weapon is de-summon or destroyed (death) all spirit weapons on cooldown have their cooldowns reduced by 5-10 sec (some fixed duration).

Could changing the concept from Timed Summon to Bounded Summon work?

• Greatly reduced travel time.
• No more lonely wandering spirit weapons.
• Difficult to kite within this Spirit Radius.
• High frequency of attacks due to reduction in travel time.

Still has weaknesses (counter play):

• Kiting.- abit easy as stay out to spirit radius but a fix as well as a function of keeping the spirit weapons with you with regards to leaps & teleports. Spirit weapons leap or teleport when the guardian leaps or teleports.
• Focused AoE (new stronger weakness) – maybe a fix could be spirit weapons evade when you evade or spirit weapons block when you block.
• Kill the spirit weapons.

Asmodal.6489:

personally I dont see how they could fix spirit weapons in the current state ithout going a complete new way like you suggested.

However I am pretty sure anets gonna leave them as is until a specialisation that centers around them. Then you can tie them to the Virtues and replace the existing wards with utilites that boosts them and yourself (spirit wards or something).

At the moment the case ist lost.

It would be nice, as they are fun when 2 or more up but a big frustration & massive loss of survivability when on cooldown. But I can’t see them removing a core utility set just to turn it into part of an elite which fixes the current issues.

well they did it with tomes…

Asmodal.6489:

well they did it with tomes…

True, but do spirit weapons also highlight an issues of guardian’s base survivability. Which I have started to wonder more about due to the ongoing discussion in Dragonhunter-Changes-for-Next-BWE (Thanks to Brutaly).

I believe if like Brutaly’s idea with shifting some of Monk’s Focus’s healing into the the base RoV. And xinkspillx’s idea of including a single condi cleanse into base RoV were used as well as maybe a reduction to VoC cooldown we wouldn’t be so reliant on utilities for much of our survivability.

I really like this idea for spirit weapons. They behave like pets when active and signets when stowed, and the balance for keeping them going or recharging them faster is nice with the virtues.

How about activation time? Would they work like meditations and be usable during / between other skills? Could you activate and sheathe all 3 at once if you had a full load out? I could see some situations where having them stowed would be more beneficial, especially traited with virtues and renewed focus.

Wow. This is good. Like reaaally good. I haven’t seen Anet pull off a rework half as beneficial and effective as these changes would be. Keep the dream alive OP, here’s hoping the right person takes a look at this thread.

roachsrealm.9284:

I really like this idea for spirit weapons. They behave like pets when active and signets when stowed, and the balance for keeping them going or recharging them faster is nice with the virtues.

Thanks, I’m still focused on spirit weapons as mainly summons / minions that you want unsheathed (active) & also wanted to add abit more micro-ing typically associated with minion / pet classes through this break bar maintenance of sheathing & unsheathing.

The sheathed (signet) & break bar maintenance aspects came about in three ways;

First a visual concept: How amazing would it feel to have your spirit weapons sheathed on your characters back. You would have this in game visual displaying not only are you a guardian but you a “Spirit Guardian”.

When travelling out of combat they would travel on your back but when entering combat (spirit weapons off cooldown) you’ll have the moment were not only are unsheathing your personal weapons but you have this great intimidating effect of also unsheathing your spirit weapons. This provided the sheathing.

Second break bar: For spirit weapons I decided on a “Smiting / Control Resistance” concept that led me to the idea of using a break bar. I started to think about how a player could maintain their break bar & also provide foes knowledge about break bar status.

The idea was to simple use cooldowns & the auto re-summoning to refresh the break bar. This also provided a fluctuating break bar strength to break through or use a control effect when down.

Visually players could tell the overall strength just by the number of spirits unsheathed & also when they would be coming off cooldown as they would transitioned from a white colouring back to their standard blue before unsheathing. This provided the micro-ing.

Third options & survivability: The hardest time to survive with spirit weapons is when their on cooldown & I was also looking a commands sheathing (de-summoning) the spirit weapons.

I saw three reasons for commanding a spirit weapon:

1. Use the command skill
2. Use to receive the sheathed effect
3. Use to refresh the break bar (place on cooldown so unsheathing would add 1 tier back to the break bar).

roachsrealm.9284:

How about activation time? Would they work like meditations and be usable during / between other skills? Could you activate and sheathe all 3 at once if you had a full load out? I could see some situations where having them stowed would be more beneficial, especially traited with virtues and renewed focus.

Regarding activation, it abit complex & not something I thought deeply when first designing.

Problem being I want foes to have the ability to interact with the spirit weapon through use of non damaging conditions & control effects. Then I also wanted players to be able to activate individual spirit weapon sheathing to gain the sheath effects straight away (eg. shield of avenger’s instantly for aegis effect) or place them on cooldown for refreshing the break bar.

Other points to remember are players have no control over the summoning of the spirit weapons (they auto summon) & the only loss of benefit for the player is when a foe breaks through the break bar & that’s only for a small window.

What I’m thinking is sheath effects don’t occur until the spirit weapon is back on your back sheathed. How this will work depend on if the command skill requires a target.

• Requires No Target – sheathing doesn’t happen until after command skill completed.
• Requires A Target – foe targeted command skill completed before sheathing. no targeted selected sheathing occurs after spirit weapons travels back to you.

Another option could be:

• Command skills are small channels were if pressed a second time while channelling sheaths the spirit weapon.

Spirit dazed (For 10 seconds spirit weapons sheath effects have no effect) a new ideas for counter play against sheath effects that could be added;

• Break through break bar: Now also applies Spirit dazed .
• Give back health: Allowing foes to kill spirit weapons, killing a spirit weapon applies Spirit dazed.
• Interrupt command skills: Applies Spirit dazed (10 sec).

Make them a Conjured skill type with charges and call it good. Make sure their abilities fit their theme.

Conjured skills is an option that could be taken but work require a totally rework of the current spirit weapons. But I’m one that more prefers the current minion / pet feel to them & believe they are options that can still keep similarities to current gameplay, improve on it & also provide a different taken to minions, summons & pets provided by the other professions.

I believe changing them to a bounded summon with limit movement & attack range that travels with the guardian could help with many of the problems. I think alot of it is the needs to start going back for alot of our unused utilities is:

• What is the themed gameplay with this utility?
• What does the guardian need to preform & be viable with this gameplay?

Over all another question I’ve had is what is the point of mixing the current utilities? As on a whole you place yourself at more of a disadvantage if mixing (3 or more), as there are no traits or sync that enhance mixed utilities gameplay. With most benefit provided if you stick to only one utility type.

Back on spirit weapons, the bounded aspect & thinking about spirit weapon / guardian movement & I started to look at leaps & teleports. Now at the moment all you do is leave your spirit weapons behind you getting frustrated as you wait for them to respond. What if:

• Leaps & Spirit Weapons: Spirit Weapons now leap when the guardian leaps. Functional what this could do is provide a means of re-focusing your spirit weapons. At landing spirit weapons are relocated to their default unsheathing / travelling position around the guardian. Another benefit as this would allow spirit weapons to access leap combo effects.
• Teleport & Spirit Weapons: Similar to leap movement spirit weapons now teleport with the guardian appearing at they default unsheathing / travelling position around the guardian.