Guild Wars 2

…isn’t as bad as you though.
But seriously, I tried it with 6/2/6/0/0 and carrion and it was quite powerful. I find it hard to compare to DPS, because they are so different, but IMO they are both viable… in their own ways…

I managed to rack up some condi guard footage and edit it into…. this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q72GAGtIDbw

I think condi guardian needs to be taken seriously, who knows, maybe in a few months…

Why did you speed it up that much?!

I can’t see kitten all!

If guardians has access to at least one more damaging condition… Any I mean… I would give it a try. You can constantly apply burning but many prof can constantly remove a single condition. And this is my problem.

Sure it can work in PvP but I’m more of a WvW lad and this won’t really work there.

Anyway Holl: sorry for my criticism and thumbs up! Keep trying out non-meta builds and keep posting them… Possibly more player joins you (and forming a new meta)

Happy Guardin’!

in wvw as roamer or small havoc squad it works
in zerg it wont (like every condi build) as group tend to cleanse constantly with shout etc..

and hall
i did compare the dmg between zerkmed and condi guard. in average they are almost the same in favor for condi in real fight (non golem testing) as zerkmed need to hit to proc dmg while in condi guard the burning ticking even after the hit
if 70% of the attacks are crit then zerkmed proc more dmg

Aggrostemma.1703:

Why did you speed it up that much?!

I can’t see kitten all!

If guardians has access to at least one more damaging condition… Any I mean… I would give it a try. You can constantly apply burning but many prof can constantly remove a single condition. And this is my problem.

Sure it can work in PvP but I’m more of a WvW lad and this won’t really work there.

Anyway Holl: sorry for my criticism and thumbs up! Keep trying out non-meta builds and keep posting them… Possibly more player joins you (and forming a new meta)

Happy Guardin’!

Try 20606 with permeating wrath and supreme justice. The aoe burns hit for 600 a tick to every single person. Let them waste a shout to cleanse something that will proc at every hit.
Also for a zerg that’s already half way finished, people have already used their shouts and bigger cleanses especially if your necro teamate is there. They have little to no cleanse left for your longer duration burns like JI.
#outplayed

If you do hybrid Meds, then havok and other small scale will work just like it does in pvp.

Saiyan has the right idea for Zergs though. with permeating wrath (and supreme justice if you’re ballsy) you can pretty much guarantee everyone will be on fire. Let them waste their cleanses while you just auto attack and do your thing.

Ghotistyx.6942:

If you do hybrid Meds, then havok and other small scale will work just like it does in pvp.

Saiyan has the right idea for Zergs though. with permeating wrath (and supreme justice if you’re ballsy) you can pretty much guarantee everyone will be on fire. Let them waste their cleanses while you just auto attack and do your thing.

The problem im finding is to trait permeating wrath and supreme justice and fight real T1 sized (easily 40+ zergs), i dont think you can get enough toughness/sustain to survive inside the zerg in order for permeating wrath to do its thing.

Ive used supreme justice with GS Scepter/Torch medi hybrid build and that works totally fine against huge zergs because you can use the Scepter from range (3 attacks proc passive VoJ burn) and then just pick your target switch to GS and leap in to finish them off. But with Permeating wrath you need to be up close and personal the whole time for the AOE burn to be of any use in which case you will get 5-10 enemies immediately focus on you.

How i wish Permeating Wrath procced at target location and not around me.

You don’t use Meds – you use AH, Staff/Hammer & Consecrations. You will burn everyone around you with your Staff Auto.

Build

Basically 2200 condi damage for 883 Perma AoE Burning.

Can also switch into Honor for larger field = more AH healiing on Hammer / Staff Symbol.s

Fight Analysis for the first half of video, so we have numbers not flashy songs and videos:

1v1 Guardian (Total Damage – 13,874 / Condition Damage – 6,762 / Duration 8 seconds)

1v1 Ranger (Total Damage – 21,656 / Condition Damage – 11,161 / Duration 22 seconds)

2v1 Engineer (Total Damage – 12,015 / Condition Damage – 5,299 / Duration approximately 20 seconds)

2v1 Mesmer (Total Damage – 18,959 / Condition Damage – 9,487 / Duration 30 seconds)

Could do the rest, but tedious. I hope this lets people better evaluate the performance though.

Edited to show total condition damage done.

Spartacus.3192:

Ghotistyx.6942:

If you do hybrid Meds, then havok and other small scale will work just like it does in pvp.

Saiyan has the right idea for Zergs though. with permeating wrath (and supreme justice if you’re ballsy) you can pretty much guarantee everyone will be on fire. Let them waste their cleanses while you just auto attack and do your thing.

The problem im finding is to trait permeating wrath and supreme justice and fight real T1 sized (easily 40+ zergs), i dont think you can get enough toughness/sustain to survive inside the zerg in order for permeating wrath to do its thing.

Ive used supreme justice with GS Scepter/Torch medi hybrid build and that works totally fine against huge zergs because you can use the Scepter from range (3 attacks proc passive VoJ burn) and then just pick your target switch to GS and leap in to finish them off. But with Permeating wrath you need to be up close and personal the whole time for the AOE burn to be of any use in which case you will get 5-10 enemies immediately focus on you.

How i wish Permeating Wrath procced at target location and not around me.

I don’t think I’d want to be in any 40+zerg lol. But what you can do is teleport your gs #4 symbol+JI, pop Shelter and elite, then run away if you can
maybe weapon switch and flashing blade to a target further away. Either ways, gl!

i dont like Permeating Wrath as it can be blocked/evade etc if not hit
i use torch if i want ppl around me to get burn and its hit for 4 sec each so much much better and if traited with radiant fire its spammable for constant burning around me

OK so i tested 2,0,6,0,6 Supreme Justice/Permeating Wrath build last night in WvW and Silverwastes using GS and Scepter/Torch . It was pretty effective in Silverwastes when running around solo. Perma burn on every mob around me. Good fun

In WvW T1 Zerg battles (again it was easily 30+ in the enemy zerg). I was definitely squishier than my AH/EM GS/Hammer build that i normally like to use. And way squishier than an AH/EM Staff/Hammer build. I felt it was extremely selfish (like all medi builds). So much so that i didnt even bother to join a party because i felt i was taking up a guardian slot while providing no support).

Look at the self sustain difference. All you get is Meditation heals. With AH/EM GS/Hammer, (i have over 40% crit chance). My EM procs every second (1 sec internal cd) and running a shout/inspired virtues build im throwing boons around like candy so healing always. Plus dodge roll heals of around 600hp (on my gear setip) plus higher passive regen from VoR. So much better for Zerg battles.

However I definitely felt more comfortable running hybrid when solo (running from spawn to join zerg)

I think i will test some more because i like the concept of Hybrid. If only Amplified Wrath was not a grandmaster trait and Permeating Wrath not targeted around yourself and instead around the target. Then we would start to have a lot of fun.

Amins.3710:

You don’t use Meds – you use AH, Staff/Hammer & Consecrations. You will burn everyone around you with your Staff Auto.

Build

Basically 2200 condi damage for 883 Perma AoE Burning.

Can also switch into Honor for larger field = more AH healiing on Hammer / Staff Symbol.s

---

your build doesnt have 2200 condi damage? Am i missing something?

with 25 might stack it does so i guess he talking in group fight when both guardian using empower

I was thinking that a 2/5/6/0/1 Hybrid build using Radiant Fire and GS, Scepter/Torch could be interesting which really boosts your direct damage. With Fiery Wrath and Radiant Power you get 20% extra damage constantly. Radiant Fire gives 20% more burn duration plus Torch skills CD. You can also spam VoJ due to renewed justice.

I might test it out tonight to compare against the 2/0/6/0/6 build i ran last night.

Any thoughts from you experienced Hybrid guards?

Spartacus.3192:

I was thinking that a 2/5/6/0/1 Hybrid build using Radiant Fire and GS, Scepter/Torch could be interesting which really boosts your direct damage. With Fiery Wrath and Radiant Power you get 20% extra damage constantly. Radiant Fire gives 20% more burn duration plus Torch skills CD. You can also spam VoJ due to renewed justice.

I might test it out tonight to compare against the 2/0/6/0/6 build i ran last night.

Any thoughts from you experienced Hybrid guards?

go with 2,6,6,0,0 sword/torch+scepter/focus
you will have 52% bonus dmg if you use blind correctly with flame legion rune and with torch you will have perma burning
its more 1v1 as you dont have nice aoe symbol to pressure enemies around you
i use it mainly in Battle of Kyhlo as sword2 can teleport you into the tower

skill rotations
start with scepter focus to kite a bit and get vulnerability 9 stacks ji+switch weapon to proc weapon swap sigils and blind you enemy and use torch#4 so burning around you and get the kill

good weapon set versus thief, ele, ranger, warrior as blind in the right moment ruin their day
engi, necro just kite with scepter till they use heal skill and burst them with sword

messiah.1908:

go with 2,6,6,0,0 sword/torch+scepter/focus
you will have 52% bonus dmg if you use blind correctly with flame legion rune and with torch you will have perma burning
its more 1v1 as you dont have nice aoe symbol to pressure enemies around you
i use it mainly in Battle of Kyhlo as sword2 can teleport you into the tower

skill rotations
start with scepter focus to kite a bit and get vulnerability 9 stacks ji+switch weapon to proc weapon swap sigils and blind you enemy and use torch#4 so burning around you and get the kill

good weapon set versus thief, ele, ranger, warrior as blind in the right moment ruin their day
engi, necro just kite with scepter till they use heal skill and burst them with sword

So you take Right Hand Strength as the grand master trait?

Spartacus.3192:

messiah.1908:

go with 2,6,6,0,0 sword/torch+scepter/focus
you will have 52% bonus dmg if you use blind correctly with flame legion rune and with torch you will have perma burning
its more 1v1 as you dont have nice aoe symbol to pressure enemies around you
i use it mainly in Battle of Kyhlo as sword2 can teleport you into the tower

skill rotations
start with scepter focus to kite a bit and get vulnerability 9 stacks ji+switch weapon to proc weapon swap sigils and blind you enemy and use torch#4 so burning around you and get the kill

good weapon set versus thief, ele, ranger, warrior as blind in the right moment ruin their day
engi, necro just kite with scepter till they use heal skill and burst them with sword

So you take Right Hand Strength as the grand master trait?

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fVAQRAsf7dlsApcoVDxbI8DNR8QY93bbVBX/PnD-TJRHwAf2fIwDBAZZAAnBAA
no take powerful blades for more 10% dmg with sword

burning 10%+7%
sword +10%
condition 10%
blind rotation with focus #4 sword #2 +scepter #3 =9-12% more dmg
f1 blind +3%
total 52% dmg with perma burn

Wow thanks everyone for the input in this thread! Not expecting this many replies :P
Anywho, to the responses:

@Aggrostemma.1703: No need to apologize, I can take some criticism :P And I sped up all the parts that were me running around, 2v1’s, irrelevant stuffs etc.
And I pretty much only do PvP, except for wvw with my necro or engi.

@messiah.1908: Thanks for the testing mate! so condi did more damage? Just curious, what build were you running? There are many different ones :/ And I only do PvP with this build, no WvW guarding for me :P

@Amins.3710: There are many different build out there man! Sure, staff can proc a lot but I prefer a different kind of play :/

@CMF.5461: THANK YOU SO MUCH for the time you put into that! must have taken a while. Surprised direct damage still came out on top O-o, and that bleeding did so little damage :/ Might switch the build around knowing this…

@Spartacus.3192: Sounds very interesting, I think I’m gonna try that build out

Thanks everyone for your input!

messiah.1908:

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fVAQRAsf7dlsApcoVDxbI8DNR8QY93bbVBX/PnD-TJRHwAf2fIwDBAZZAAnBAA
no take powerful blades for more 10% dmg with sword

burning 10%+7%
sword +10%
condition 10%
blind rotation with focus #4 sword #2 +scepter #3 =9-12% more dmg
f1 blind +3%
total 52% dmg with perma burn

Thanks!

here are the builds i am running
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/guardian/hybrid-time-builds-compilation/first#post4637991

Holl.3109:

@CMF.5461: THANK YOU SO MUCH for the time you put into that! must have taken a while. Surprised direct damage still came out on top O-o, and that bleeding did so little damage :/ Might switch the build around knowing this…

The thing is, in all your fights it was primarily burning and direct damage, but on your fight against the mesmer at mid point, the bleeding ended up being good pressure and one of the reasons you kept him low on life.

Also your second fight with the ranger, conditions came out on top, and direct damage became supplemental.

I am reluctant to call these condi builds a success, “yet”, but one thing to take note is that pretty much half your damage done is via conditions.

So the question is, would a pure direct damage build make up in raw damage what your build does with condition damage?

Are the two styles of fighting equivalent, or is one “better” than the other. The biggest advantage I did see was that, while being kited or evaded, your conditions continued to do damage (the second half of your damage). This kind of alleviates the low mobility issue that gets guards killed.

Spartacus.3192:

Amins.3710:

You don’t use Meds – you use AH, Staff/Hammer & Consecrations. You will burn everyone around you with your Staff Auto.

Build

Basically 2200 condi damage for 883 Perma AoE Burning.

Can also switch into Honor for larger field = more AH healiing on Hammer / Staff Symbol.s

---

your build doesnt have 2200 condi damage? Am i missing something?

Might Stacks & Sigil – Look at the boon duration.

My post, Holl, was in response to using Burning in Zergs – Drop the med and pick up AH.

CMF.5461:

Holl.3109:

@CMF.5461: THANK YOU SO MUCH for the time you put into that! must have taken a while. Surprised direct damage still came out on top O-o, and that bleeding did so little damage :/ Might switch the build around knowing this…

The thing is, in all your fights it was primarily burning and direct damage, but on your fight against the mesmer at mid point, the bleeding ended up being good pressure and one of the reasons you kept him low on life.

Also your second fight with the ranger, conditions came out on top, and direct damage became supplemental.

I am reluctant to call these condi builds a success, “yet”, but one thing to take note is that pretty much half your damage done is via conditions.

So the question is, would a pure direct damage build make up in raw damage what your build does with condition damage?

Are the two styles of fighting equivalent, or is one “better” than the other. The biggest advantage I did see was that, while being kited or evaded, your conditions continued to do damage (the second half of your damage). This kind of alleviates the low mobility issue that gets guards killed.

you are right, half the dmg is pretty much done by condition which are armor ignoring , still ticking while your enemy evade,block,dodge,rune away.
so if you just power guard some of your direct dmg can be negated thus lowering your overall dps

its pretty much the same gamestyle but you want to pressure more with blocks and some combos which proc conditions like fire aura, light aura, vulnerability etc

I have to try one of these builds tonight!

My commander going to kick my kitten but I don’t care…

I will take something like 20606 with Judge’s Intervention, Smite and StandYourGround… I want to take Purging Flames too but if I run without SYG my staff-ele-playing fianceé going to kick my kitten with high heel steel-toe boots… And I don want this. At all!

I really feel rune of krait is not optimal.

25% chance to bleed on being hit only stacks 1 bleed for 10 seconds (every 15), so you are only getting 1 extra proc.

the on elite effect provides torment and one bleed again, as well as poison. Torment was shown to not be highly effective, but bleed and poison were good contributors, so I would suggest on swap sigils: doom and geomancy

those would provide the bleeding and poison needed. (poison only being single target, but that is fine because you are focus firing to prevent heals)

As far as what rune to use instead of geomancy, something that increases bleed duration while still being hybrid/power based.

Rune of the Mad King seems interesting.

power: 25/50/100
Condition Duration: 5%
Bleeding Duration 15/20% (total of 40% bleeding duration increase)

On elite use: summon ravens to attack enemies nearby. This does about 17 strikes doing about 70-90 damage and can crit. The bonus is it can proc burning from VoJ and is based on your stats power and precision stats (does hunters call skill). Large range too, about 600+.

Combine that with permeating wrath and you have a good aoe burn on elite…downside is you have to drop either amplified wrath or monk’s focus….probably amplified wrath at that rate.

This may be gimicky, but it seems interesting.

runes ideas
1. flame legion – power based, 30% burning duration, proc burn 25%, +7% dmg while enemy burning
2. balthazar – condi base. 45% burning duration, healing skill cause aoe burning for 4-5 sec
3. elementalist – power base and semi condi base +20% burning duration
4. Privateer- power base and give +105 condi and power with 3 might and also parrot which does direct dmg
5. guardian – toughness base semi healing power and give burning when block which is the most important as you burn twice or can free trait point for you
6. adventurer – condi base and semi power with endurance refill when you heal
7. traveler – mainly for speed buff

any other runes which give other condi buff like bleeding poison etc are useless as you just need other condi to cover up your burning

Biggest draw back of mad king.
Each attack counts as your hit. Having multiple hits on three people with retaliation = half of your health lost.
It can be dodged and blocked.
Highly unreliable and is likely to kill you than help.

Balthazar
Mainly useful for bigger burn duration skills like JI and VoJ. Of which will likely get cleansed off, unless you’re playing with baddies. It would be incredible if VoJ’s passive would be a full two ticks (hence my thread about supreme justice) but that’s currently not possible without sacrificing traits.
As for its burn on heal, I can’t save it for a finisher like rune of krait. It’s also dodgeable making it unreliable but still better than Mad king.

I use Rune of the krait mainly for its 4k burst effect. It literally makes a difference between winning or losing against a d/d celes ele when they are at 40% health. It does just enough damage (mainly poison, -33% heals, and torment) to be able to burst them down before they renter water attune. 6/1/6/0/1 is still a cele ele killer.

Of course krait is always cleansable. Use it as a finisher when they have 30% health and it wont matter.

Saiyan.1704:

Biggest draw back of mad king.
Each attack counts as your hit. Having multiple hits on three people with retaliation = half of your health lost.
It can be dodged and blocked.
Highly unreliable and is likely to kill you than help.

Balthazar
Mainly useful for bigger burn duration skills like JI and VoJ. Of which will likely get cleansed off, unless you’re playing with baddies. It would be incredible if VoJ’s passive would be a full two ticks (hence my thread about supreme justice) but that’s currently not possible without sacrificing traits.
As for its burn on heal, I can’t save it for a finisher like rune of krait. It’s also dodgeable making it unreliable but still better than Mad king.

I use Rune of the krait mainly for its 4k burst effect. It literally makes a difference between winning or losing against a d/d celes ele when they are at 40% health. It does just enough damage (mainly poison, -33% heals, and torment) to be able to burst them down before they renter water attune. 6/1/6/0/1 is still a cele ele killer.

Of course krait is always cleansable. Use it as a finisher when they have 30% health and it wont matter.

for 1v1 maybe but just take doom and geomancy sigils which give you every 10 sec swap poison and 3 stack of bleed for 10 seconds which is 5k dmg and you dont sacrifice your elite unless you need it for escape matter
krait gives you also bleed duration which is not useful with guardian burning

thus flame legion is much better as it give 30% burning duration, +7% dmg and power based
balthazar is also useful even 1v1 as it gives you aoe burning so usually when the enemy burst on me i use heal and burn him for 4-6 sec as they never dodge when i use heal skill (and you can get 100% duration with 4,4,6,0,0 and sigil)

4k burst in 8 seconds on a 72 second cooldown feels really ineffective to me.

True point on mad king vs retaliation though. I have been running it all last night and I haven’t been wrecked by retal…yet…but it is a plausible scenario and may steer me away from it now. The AoE burning was really nice though.

Without mad king, I will now move away from virtues, as it was the only thing that had good synergy with permeating wrath.

I have had a good deal of success (even in team fights) with geomancy and doom for swap sigils. So the elite usage is not pinnacle to the play style, but I feel poison/bleed in ties with burning is.

I personally have been running medi zerker with mace/fc (or torch) and GS. had 2/0/6/0/6 with permeating wrath and supreme justice, but I will consider moving that now.

Biggest change from meta meditation build and this is honestly just the weapon sigils allowing for some anti kiting and reduction in enemy healing with poison.

Also I was running a symbol burst build utilizing overlapping symbols from mace and gs, 5/0/4/5/0. This would do about 13-18k burst on targets in the symbol….downside, the good players would avoid the symbol and just range you or kite you. It would randomly burst unaware people down in group fights though.

So I am continuing to do that with a medi build, but seeing if this condition hybrid can integrate in to fill the gap I have with symbols being ignored.

Back to the point, I feel krait is not as effective as you say it is, and we can find something better. Maybe not mad king though, because retal “is” a threat. Burning duration is not as critical, but something power based or something that provides a gap in defense.

I have to say, go with flame legion, power + burn duration + extra damage to burning targets, you really can’t get much better.

I normally use a 6/x/6/x/x build in spvp and its fairly fun, doom/geo sigils

However I will say that I recently started trying out a 6/5/2/1/0 build and find it pretty fun for burst. Obviously not as good with survival, but I end up getting a ton of extra damage on sword if I decide to use it (10% fiery wrath, 10% radiant power, 10% powerful blades, 7% flame legion runes) I also use torch instead of focus, for the extra aoe burning, and the fun 4k torch toss. It does obviously require a bit more tactful play though, as you really have no defenses compared to a 6 valor build.

Also, using inner fire really helps with damage as well since your getting free fury each time you get burned, which in most cases, happens ALOT now… except versus thieves… but they shouldn’t be an issue anyways.

messiah.1908:

for 1v1 maybe but just take doom and geomancy sigils which give you every 10 sec swap poison and 3 stack of bleed for 10 seconds which is 5k dmg and you dont sacrifice your elite unless you need it for escape matter
krait gives you also bleed duration which is not useful with guardian burning

thus flame legion is much better as it give 30% burning duration, +7% dmg and power based
balthazar is also useful even 1v1 as it gives you aoe burning so usually when the enemy burst on me i use heal and burn him for 4-6 sec as they never dodge when i use heal skill (and you can get 100% duration with 4,4,6,0,0 and sigil)

What I meant already took geo and doom sigils into account. In otherwords, the extra sigil damage and poison from Krait is still barely enough ‘oomph’ against cele ele’s. But you’re right this is all 1v1 situational stuff.

With my build I used shattered aegis because of the possible extra aoe hit it gives, procing aoe permeating wrath. I’ll probably still use shattered over fiery wrath for the sake of the build.

Interesting fact:
Whirling Wrath hits 14 times. 7 from sword and 7 from those flying projectiles. With 3 people that’s 28 hits.(projectiles hit only 1 person while sword hits all 3)
At burning being capped at 9 stacks you’ll only get 9 seconds worth of burns maximum (assuming 1 burn is 1 second) unless you increase burn duration. Legion turns 9 stacks of 9s into 9 stacks of 12.6s. Theoretically almost 3k more aoe burn dmg in a group of 3 people using whirling wrath.

Needless to say I’m going to start using Flame Legion and compare. I personally like krait over Bal rune but maybe that’s a personal attachment I have to the rune :P

against cele ele its not harder but longer fight as poison will do the trick and pull from GS bb skill when they heal their rotation with fire match your utilities med skill and they dont have much conditions to push you

What ive noticed (for WvW anyway) is that you have to be very careful what stats you give up in order to take condition damage. Hybrid means power/condi so you need power and condition damage. Now Vitality is also important to a certain degree so that you can handle the condition damage and burst done to you. So it would seem the only stats you can readily give up are ferocity and precision and to a somewhat lesser degree Toughness too.

Going full Carrrion i think causes you to lose way too much toughness which means you “take” much more enemy damage while not really boosting overall DPS that much. A mix of Soldiers/Carrion gear gives a combination of Power/Vitality/Condition Damage/Toughness. Optimizing that combo should give good direct damage combined with steady burn ticks, while still giving a measure of protection via Armor.

Some of the builds ive seen have less than 2500 Armor which i feel doesnt do well in a larger group setting. Gearing for 2700+ armor effectively reduces incoming direct damage by over 8% while reducing burn ticks by approx 50hp/sec.

Any thoughts on this?

I used to run a 4/6/0/0/4 condi guard but for awhile now Radiant Retaliation has been completely broken (does nothing)… so that build doesn’t work anymore. Reported the bug in-game and in the bug forum, so hopefully our condi retal trait will eventually get fixed.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/support/bugs/Radiant-Retaliation-completely-broken/4639252

misterdevious.6482:

I used to run a 4/6/0/0/4 condi guard but for awhile now Radiant Retaliation has been completely broken (does nothing)… so that build doesn’t work anymore. Reported the bug in-game and in the bug forum, so hopefully our condi retal trait will eventually get fixed.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/support/bugs/Radiant-Retaliation-completely-broken/4639252

Funny, I made a similiar post about radiant retaliation doing mediocre damage compared to Power. But was later told the damage difference was there so idk. Regardless, Radiant Retaliation doesn’t make a huge difference for it to be a grand master trait. Gs #4 and radiant retaliation should be a sought after combo but no condi guard will touch it.

Spartacus.3192:

What ive noticed (for WvW anyway) is that you have to be very careful what stats you give up in order to take condition damage. Hybrid means power/condi so you need power and condition damage. Now Vitality is also important to a certain degree so that you can handle the condition damage and burst done to you. So it would seem the only stats you can readily give up are ferocity and precision and to a somewhat lesser degree Toughness too.

Going full Carrrion i think causes you to lose way too much toughness which means you “take” much more enemy damage while not really boosting overall DPS that much. A mix of Soldiers/Carrion gear gives a combination of Power/Vitality/Condition Damage/Toughness. Optimizing that combo should give good direct damage combined with steady burn ticks, while still giving a measure of protection via Armor.

Some of the builds ive seen have less than 2500 Armor which i feel doesnt do well in a larger group setting. Gearing for 2700+ armor effectively reduces incoming direct damage by over 8% while reducing burn ticks by approx 50hp/sec.

Any thoughts on this?

Between our blinds and blocks, we have little to no issues against other raw damage classes. It comes down to timing and being outplayed in that aspect.

If you have more sustain, then you will have less damage per sec. I’m curious how much you take away from power, vita, or condi to optimize your hybrid build.

I don’t really play condition builds or spirit weapons on guardian, so even if I tested this I probably wouldn’t be able to judge it properly. I thought it was interesting enough so I thought I’d share it.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fVAQRApf7dl0ApMo1BxVI8DNh8QlZdsiWWCtQ1TQA0oA-TZBHwAW2fAwDAQwBBIZZgAnBAATJRHwAV2fIwDBAZZAAnBAA

It utilizes every trait point available. Going deep into zeal for amplified wrath opens up the adept and master spirit weapon traits. Same goes for virtues with supreme justice and adept spirit weapon. The burning output of every third strike for 2.5s seems like it’s enough pressure any class, along with doom/geomancy sigils.

Now, I’m a shelter guy myself and never use SoR. I thought in this build it fit though with access to signet mastery under radiant fire and the lack of MF/AH. Don’t butcher me over it as it’s just a whim.

As for the spirit weapons, they’re there just for sustain. Keep in mind, I don’t use spirit weapons so I really couldn’t say whether they make a positive impact or not. They do take advantage of the traits available though, main traits being amplified wrath and supreme justice. The weakness from the shield is a bonus.

To help with sustain, mace is chosen over sword. To take advantage of the power from the carrion amulet, an intelligence sigil is used to proc a crit on heavy hitting skills. Something like SoW > swap > Zealot’s Fire/Flame > Protector’s Strike to make full use of it. Sacrifice a geomancy sigil but I think it would pay off.

Third utility slot is a tossup. I plugged SYG in because the stability/retal is always nice. It could just as easily be swapped out for CoP for a full cleanse/stun break or signet of judgement for more weakness/stun break. I think it’s important though for it to be a stun breaker though for when spirit shield is down, but like I said it’s a tossup.

Would be interesting if anyone familiar with burning/spirit weapon guardians wanted to test it. I had fun theory crafting it but it’s just not my play style. Not to mention I’ve completely avoided pvp since the patch.

edit: Ah. Balthazar runes could be considered overkill, so traveler runes can be swapped in to compensate for zero swiftness. Still maintains a 2s burn on every three attacks so it’s not too much of a loss.

I have a friend who uses spirit weapons in my tpvp and I would take him over most guardian for the sheer fact that he’s good. Although, I would still argue that my burn build is just as good and more reliable, spirit weapon builds are good in their own way.

i tried spirit weapons and fail with it
they die to fast while doing low dmg and have long cd

Saiyan.1704:

Between our blinds and blocks, we have little to no issues against other raw damage classes. It comes down to timing and being outplayed in that aspect.

If you have more sustain, then you will have less damage per sec. I’m curious how much you take away from power, vita, or condi to optimize your hybrid build.

Im still fine tuning the build….i was buying some carrion gear last night from TP and some new armor runes to experiment with. One problem (for me anyway) is that i LOVE traveler runes. I cant live without them for WvW. When going solo or pug zergs swiftness efficency from Warriors or other Guards isnt very good or available. So that prevents me from really getting into Flame Legion or Balthazar runes.

messiah.1908:

i tried spirit weapons and fail with it
they die to fast while doing low dmg and have long cd

Hah, that’s what I figured. I never liked them in the first place but I figured someone might. Too bad because the traits line up really well with the build.

Thanks for your time.

Shanks.2907:

messiah.1908:

i tried spirit weapons and fail with it
they die to fast while doing low dmg and have long cd

Hah, that’s what I figured. I never liked them in the first place but I figured someone might. Too bad because the traits line up really well with the build.

Thanks for your time.

I fought one of this builds yesterday, against heavy regen classes with easy cleanse conditions is easy to kite it somight be hard even with rotations since i could get my health up w/o healing, but i did find interesting that build against other classes, if u guys could use SoR dont forget that it block progectiles, nade spam, bombs(sacntuary), since SoR mobility is a litle bit better u can command it to target and then blink dps while shield is already at the spot, hammer for command KD before blink.

Spirits are especially useful against melee or stationary classes like turret engis. Mainly because of the higher burn uptime along with the spirit weapons base damage. They pack a punch with a little cc when they’re on you. The weaknesses are them being easily kited, killed easily in zergs and their cooldowns. You’re only half as good without them.

If I couldn’t beat spirits with my usual burn build I would suggest them. They’re not bad per se, but they can be outplayed easily.

yesterday in some spvp i fought a spirit guardian while i was on my power ranger
i was so glad to see it
bad thing when he killd me while it was 1v3 he jump on my corps and miniute after on 1v1 on a point he was dead in 10 sec (i never jump)

anyhow i noticed few things
1. he “burns” all his blocks/immunitiy/blind/heal to early as he couldnt handle my pew pew pressure from 1500-1200 range
2. his spirits hardly touched me or even do significant dmg (i was zerker)
3. as he used spirits he hasnt had any defensive utilities like meditations to help him

i did some 1v1 with friend while i run spirit build and yes it hard to play with it
even if i put my defensive weapon mace shiled scepter so my spirits will be free to do dmg – so against every class i was killed .and if i were more offensive i asked why to use spirits at all

messiah.1908:

yesterday in some spvp i fought a spirit guardian while i was on my power ranger
i was so glad to see it
bad thing when he killd me while it was 1v3 he jump on my corps and miniute after on 1v1 on a point he was dead in 10 sec (i never jump)

anyhow i noticed few things
1. he “burns” all his blocks/immunitiy/blind/heal to early as he couldnt handle my pew pew pressure from 1500-1200 range
2. his spirits hardly touched me or even do significant dmg (i was zerker)
3. as he used spirits he hasnt had any defensive utilities like meditations to help him

i did some 1v1 with friend while i run spirit build and yes it hard to play with it
even if i put my defensive weapon mace shiled scepter so my spirits will be free to do dmg – so against every class i was killed .and if i were more offensive i asked why to use spirits at all

Mate. Let me tell ya if he made those three mistakes he was a kitten fool. He should used the shield to weaken or block your burst and give himself aegis. Then he should have used a sword teleport to get into your face and swap for a hydromancy chill. Then use either gs5 or the hammer command skill to lock you in place so he could hit you with whichever he didnt do first. At that point a Symbol+ VoJ for vuln procs sword command for more vuln whirl to win all in about 3-4 seconds SHOULD have killed you or atleast forced you to burn a cooldown to survive.

If he popped his virtues early….I have no idea what he was thinkin >.< we need those oh kitten buttons.

lol maybe so so you say theoraticaly sword comand is just for vulnerability and burning ?!
instead of med or shout which are much much better?!

he try to contest the point so i kept the range most of the fight till i saw him pop all his skills and burst him with my GS
i AA first so he used his shiled after 3 attacks and when i came close he use GS for aoe and blind but in between my pressure with haste put him below 30% hp so he needed heal and vurtues i guess or he panicced

Why are ppl still trying to make Condi Guard a thing? Wanna play Condi? Go Engi, Necro, Ranger, whatever, all these are better than Guardian for condi play and any team, ANY team in their right mind will pick this to any Condi Guard out there. Condi Guard to have damage comparable to Zerk Medi will lose all team utility. Zerk Medi already has few, but will still have some because of the boon destribution and group condi clear. Condi Guard loses all that in orther to stay up with the damage of the standart Zerk Medi. Well then I will use the Burst Medi, and I want to see you do similiar damage after that ….

Zerk Medi isn’t already part of the meta, Condi Guard will never be there

mPascoal.4258:

Why are ppl still trying to make Condi Guard a thing? Wanna play Condi? Go Engi, Necro, Ranger, whatever, all these are better than Guardian for condi play and any team, ANY team in their right mind will pick this to any Condi Guard out there. Condi Guard to have damage comparable to Zerk Medi will lose all team utility. Zerk Medi already has few, but will still have some because of the boon destribution and group condi clear. Condi Guard loses all that in orther to stay up with the damage of the standart Zerk Medi. Well then I will use the Burst Medi, and I want to see you do similiar damage after that ….

Zerk Medi isn’t already part of the meta, Condi Guard will never be there

sry to discourage you but regarding dmg – hybrid will do better dps solo or aoe
while your medizerk will get blind dodge evade the hybrid will continue to dmg by its conditions ticking
sure you can burst nicely but after the burst you pretty much w8ing for your next burst

regarding f2 aoe cleanse you right . hybrid will lack it but will do better dmg and can take pf which is also aoe cleanse (medi taking cop)

the problem is not enough ppl trying it in tpvp and show it off

mPascoal.4258:

Why are ppl still trying to make Condi Guard a thing? Wanna play Condi? Go Engi, Necro, Ranger, whatever, all these are better than Guardian for condi play and any team, ANY team in their right mind will pick this to any Condi Guard out there. Condi Guard to have damage comparable to Zerk Medi will lose all team utility. Zerk Medi already has few, but will still have some because of the boon destribution and group condi clear. Condi Guard loses all that in orther to stay up with the damage of the standart Zerk Medi. Well then I will use the Burst Medi, and I want to see you do similiar damage after that ….

Zerk Medi isn’t already part of the meta, Condi Guard will never be there

The only thing you got right is the fact condi isn’t meta.
My 20606 build alone does exceptionally more aoe damage in zergs than meta zerks, with the exception of Absolute Resolution (how much team utility do zerk meds bring??)
Zerk meds do “very little” against a team with Two celes ele’s, a turret engi, thief and >insert sustain class here<.

You have nothing to justify your claims other than “Not meta, doesn’t work.”

messiah.1908:

lol maybe so so you say theoraticaly sword comand is just for vulnerability and burning ?!
instead of med or shout which are much much better?!

he try to contest the point so i kept the range most of the fight till i saw him pop all his skills and burst him with my GS
i AA first so he used his shiled after 3 attacks and when i came close he use GS for aoe and blind but in between my pressure with haste put him below 30% hp so he needed heal and vurtues i guess or he panicced

Oh im flat out admitting hes was an idiot. He could EASILY have left the poitn and nuetralized you to take you out. Especially if you were the only one there. That he didn’t shows hes inexperienced with the build and isn’t comfortable with 1v1s yet.

As for sword command. Its a short cooldown AOE attack with a couple thousand raw damage as well as atleast a thousand damage in burning as well kitten long lasting stacks of vuln. Heck yeah you use it for its effect. Especially when your trying to burst someone down before they can get out of the wall the hammers knocked him into.

Saiyan.1704:

mPascoal.4258:

Why are ppl still trying to make Condi Guard a thing? Wanna play Condi? Go Engi, Necro, Ranger, whatever, all these are better than Guardian for condi play and any team, ANY team in their right mind will pick this to any Condi Guard out there. Condi Guard to have damage comparable to Zerk Medi will lose all team utility. Zerk Medi already has few, but will still have some because of the boon destribution and group condi clear. Condi Guard loses all that in orther to stay up with the damage of the standart Zerk Medi. Well then I will use the Burst Medi, and I want to see you do similiar damage after that ….

Zerk Medi isn’t already part of the meta, Condi Guard will never be there

The only thing you got right is the fact condi isn’t meta.
My 20606 build alone does exceptionally more aoe damage in zergs than meta zerks, with the exception of Absolute Resolution (how much team utility do zerk meds bring??)
Zerk meds do “very little” against a team with Two celes ele’s, a turret engi, thief and >insert sustain class here<.

You have nothing to justify your claims other than “Not meta, doesn’t work.”

ON ZERGS?
Wtf are you talking about? CONDI FOW WVW ZERGING!? LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL Best joke of 2014, and Condi Guard for zergs