Guild Wars 2

bit about myself:
play thief, mesmer, necro
love conditions builds and love theorycrafting
wvw mainly
never played guardian but want to start (already lvl 45)

after playing bit as mesmer and thief with burning condition i just couldnt help myself to create a guardian also (i got ele but got bored with it)

my idea is the guardian running in into the enemy group burning the hell of them while can hold his position long enough and help his team in some other ways.
even though we know conditions are easily cleanse in wvw group fight with null, well fields and shouts i notice that with guardian you can reapply the burning really fast
also after playing with thief and mesmer in group fight i noticed my conditions ticks for 5-10 seconds on 3-15 enemies as i w8 for the enemies to use their cleanse abilities

burning: 0.25*condition power +328
so even with 0 condition power you will do 328 dmg every seconds which is like 3 stacks of bleeding

condition duration: always deal dmg on each FULL seconds and max at 100%
so basicly 90% condition duration is waste of 10% as it will not give you another full second.
also consider some ppl will go with -25% to -40% decrease on conditions duration (especially the warrior and guardian frontline )
so after fast calculation the best duration you want with burning is 80%
zealot’s flame 3->5
JI 3->5
PF 5->9
VOJ 4->7

so here is the build (havent test it yet in wvw only in spvp)

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fUAQRApf7dlYgiD3GyMEf4ESmCR6AtUIQI01DFCiaIA-jUCBYNBC1J00CwkABi8AMTqIasFTFRjVJjIqWpETKAYmDA-w

notes:
basic condition duration is 50%
burning condition is 80%
VOJ is 105% -> so 100%

armor – 3k
hp – 18.6k (with guard buff its 21k)
condition dmg 1390-1640-1815 (no sigil and might-with sigil – with sigil and 5 stack of might with block trait or voj)
burning dmg than 675-738-782 dps
also 25% speed with runes

weapon choice:

mace/torch
mace AA will heal nearby allies
also put symbol which is light field and put regeneration so when warrior blast it also while cause retaliation every 8 seconds
protector strike will block and proc burning for 1 seconds
and with torch you burn enemies around you while removing 1 boon every seconds as burning reapply and can cleanse conditions from allies

scepter/focus
smite is nice burning applier on foes with 1200 range and 16 number of impacts it 5 burning impact to foes inside it
also chain of light is nice cc to ensure at least 1 foe will take 5 seconds of burning
focus again blind and gain regeneration to allies and cure one condition
and shield will block the area around you proc burning on foes and is a blast finisher to smite (retaliation to allies for 3 seconds)

trait choices:
0,20,30,0,20
radiance line is great supporter with blind when ROJ active, as burning is always proc enemies we lose their boons, and burning duration increase by 20%
valor is using meditation for more healing and burning when block so as we got 2 skills which block and VOC burning will applied constantly
virtues line for more retaliation and burning with ROJ and also 20% cd on PF which burn like hell and cure 3 conditions on allies

elite:
TOW is just too amazing as it burn 3 seconds enemies, buff you allies with might and swiftness during battle, give quickness and fury to allies and KD
as it only 20 sec duration use it wisely
or take RF
or if you charr also charrzooka can be nice burning applier with 2 hard CC

in spvp testing area it was nice as enemies just couldnt stand near me but when i got focused by 3 of them it was hard to survive (like any other class)
the burning was always proc even against PU mesmer and d/p thieves so they just used their null field or SR to cleanse the burning which really hurts
but 1v1 its not to good build as you dont have much conditions cover so you cant pressure much

when i get to lvl80 i will build it and test it in wvw
meanwhile hope you can advise me or comment

thanks

The build looks interesting but I am always apprehensive about condition builds for the Guardian. The fact that you can’t stack burning and us not really having access to other conditions coupled with most people having usually quite efficient condition removal (especially in WvW) means that its hard to deal lots of damage, especially compared to some of the other builds out there. I do appreciate that this build is coupled with support skills but honestly it seems a little lack-luster to rely on the burning mechanic. Still I guess its something to try if thats your play style.
In terms of suggestions, I would always bring Shelter instead of SoR because the block is always useful, especially in WvW (for both large scale AoE/DPS as well as an escape mechanic). I often use Aegis/RF/Shelter if I need escape time and that grants a good t seconds of invulnerability and 2 blocks on top of that (if used before/after RF).

You’re never going to recover the amount of damage that you lose from trading all of your Power for Condition Damage through Burning and whatever runes and sigils you can shoehorn in to give you additional conditions. It’s just not going to happen. If you’re okay with that, and you think that the tactics you employ make that an adequate trade then great. You might be able to swing it. In my own experience, it’s a terrible idea.

People have tried this before, and failed. Burning is a supplement to your Power damage, not a replacement.

I do like the term “Pyroguard,” though. =]

thanks guys for the input
i will keep testing it though, who knows (i remember ppl said to me venoms are awful in wvw and when i came up with panicond build i see so many venom builds in wvw).
also i noticed that ppl dont rush to cleanse the burning as its 1 condition only so or they are w8ing for more conditions to activate their precious cleanse utility or they think it wont hurt much as i am guardian ….
i fought thieves in spvp and its funny to see 20 seconds of burning (even if they SS and stealth) 20*650 = 13000 dmg + direct dmg 400-500 per hit
as i havent played power guardian yet i dont know its sdps. but from other classes i can tell that there is not much different between power and condition dmg but the way it proc. power hit you for short moments and conditions hit you for longer period
after testing in a bit in spvp i can stack burning as many skills can proc it so even if enemy use his cleanse the burning will be up again
1v1 aspect it wont hurt much although i manage to take in spvp thief, mesmer, necro, warrior, guardian. still learning this class, and thinking of combos who can proc it effectively to counter the cleanse

i will try to compare it to power build like 0,0,30,30,10 GS+Staff with 3.2k armor 3k attack and 17k hp

meanwhile here is a hybrid build which looks interesting i may say.
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fUAQRApf7dnQEFHabIqhwHaCxqAAV9IeqHP86BEpQNEA-jECBoLDimgAmEIikHAZSFRjtYqIasKmYKYER1SBAzEA-w
(add 250 power sigil )
it has much more power and crit chance, while doing 130 less burning dps , might stack can be reach to 4 stack after 1 min with blocks so more 140 power and condition dmg. also you apply vulnerability with blind (may change to sword) and also with 2 symbols so 5%-7% more dmg (with sword you can reach 10%).
it has 300 less armor and 2.5k less health but 2 meditations skills gives 3800 health when activate.
still preserve the 80% burning duration but proc burning bit less (1 every 5 attacks and not 3)
the off hand weapon are powerful with 5k-6k dmg if hits and crit
scepter too powerful with immobilize and smite

messiah.1908:

from other classes i can tell that there is not much different between power and condition dmg but the way it proc.

Unfortunately, Guardians aren’t like other classes. Classes with real condition builds like Necromancers, Engineers, and Warriors have the benefit of multiple damaging conditions that they can stack. Burning, Bleeding, Poison, Confusion, all at once. All you get as a Guardian is Burning, which is a fixed amount of damage. And it’s only worth about seven stacks of Bleeding. Which is nice, but it’s hardly anything to write home about. Real condition builds can sustain conditions and spike them when needed to score kills. Guardians don’t have anything to spike.

And because other classes can stack multiple damaging conditions at once, they get much more benefit from Condition Damage. It’s one thing to burn, bleed, and poison someone at the same time – you might actually deal as much damage as a Power build. Maybe. But it’s another matter entirely when all you can do is use Burning. Burning doesn’t scale that well.

Condition damage builds with guardians are meant to be played much differently than other classes.

Other classes increase condition dmg and stack multiple conditions, guardians stack burn duration and use skills that augment our dmg due to conditions on the enemy.

Skills such as Fiery Wrath, Radiant Power, rune of the flame legion and so on

I’m currently having fun with a build similar to this using my left over knights armor
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fUAQJAsPoQyeUgHoCazQgQoqCxDuAA-jAyAYrASWAICgJwioxW8KiGrmBTdSEV7PKiWdQALC-e

You can also try not going into radiance and completely going into honor, elusive power replaces radiant power and the shout skills help with power of the virtuous.

Permeating wrath is something I’m still trying out(we can’t stack burn but inflicting burn on 5 different enemies is as close as we can get), its not bad in zergs and sigil of fire is thrown in to give more AOE dmg since the build has decent crit chance you can get it to activate fairly often.

The problem of the condition guardian is that you can only give Burn to the enemy.
Condition damagers class can use poison, bleeding and burning at the same time.
Ranger, engi and necro can give all that conditions at the same time (whit traits and skills). Burn can deal the same damage of Bleeding whit 5 stack. But the necro only whit the staff can mantain you always at 6-8 stack of bleeding, the thief at 8-10. The warrior can obtain a permanent 5-8 stack of bleeding whitout the elite skill.

But they use Poison, that is the really problem if you fight a condition dealer, because tour healing power is greatly reduced (33%) and the damage is almost 50% of burning.
Then they give you burning.

A guardian can be a CD+Sup class, but is better to use normal attacks than condition damage.

Your guardian deal 700 dmg at second (example).
A ranger/necro/engi can deal 700(burn)250(poison)800(bleeding) at second = 1750 at second.

You can Increase your condition power and your ability to give out burning, but you can’t reach the damage of a common condition damage class.

You can only help your dps a little by using condition damage, but no more.

I’ve tried to build a burning guardian a few times since release and my biggest complaint is that they couple condition damage with precision……

and noticing that Zeal has a lot of major scepter traits BUT the minor traits are for SYMBOLS and as we all know scepter has no symbols

the traits are just all wonky.

BUT since I’m hard headed I still try to do something with burning and came up with this

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fUAQNArfWlYgqCHHyMEgIFSmCR6AtZAQIUli4RfuFA-jUCBoOCik0Ak3QUHgZSFRjtaqIasKZER16FYeEYCB4bNA-w

playing with it a few days and the biggest thing I have fun with is burning people with the short duration stuff then hit em the longer duration stuff after they do all their condi-cleanse.

can’t get away from the Condi-food they eat, but that makes em spend more money hehe.

I don’t mean to hijack the thread, just throwing more ideas out there for brainstorming.

Zepher.7803:

I’ve tried to build a burning guardian a few times since release and my biggest complaint is that they couple condition damage with precision……

I understand part of this sentiment. My biggest wish is to see the Duration and Damage stats swapped on Zeal/Radiance.

I also can’t advise any stats in Cond. Damage on gear though I have been toying with Celestial in WvW with the 2 second Passive VoJ duration … happy times.

i agree that only burning wont do much to any profession but it help to put pressure when they see the burning ticks. i think that my seconds hybrid build is much better and also can reach 3.1k attack and the burning dmg added when fighting is 220 dps (base is 328)
i switch to GS for more burst direct dmg and burning is basically always proc so even when enemies run away burning will do dmg

while other professions can proc more conditions they have cd beside bleeding so after their condition burst they can do for 10-20 seconds only bleeding usually 5-8 stacks. also their burning condition is rather short one and proc in long cd.
as burning alone is equal to 5-8 stacks of bleeding guardian can proc burning permanently almost. thus guardian wont have the burst of 1700-2000 dps from conditions alone for 5 seconds but will have 600 dps for 20 seconds (and more) and with higher direct dmg so can be much more than 2000 dps. and dont forget most burning skills guardian have are aoe so you do aoe dmg over time (usually 600 dps for 5-8 seconds on 5 foes so its 3k-4.8k per enemy)
also dont forget its not build for roaming and 1vx rather than group play small or big

my guardian reach today 80 and now fully exotic so i will try it on in wvw and put some video soon i hope

Here’s my condition build; http://en.gw2skills.net/editor/?fUAQNAsdRlUgKDnEyKEf4EiVhBq6x8UPe4NDFyhA-TsAgyCuIGTNmbMzYyxsjN6Y5x8AA

I feel it’s the highest damaging condition build for the guardian but survivability is lacking .