Guild Wars 2

Am I the only one who thinks the torch is probably the worst offhand of the entire game?

It’s the most damaging offhand for the guardian. I can get 4k hits with it for a few hits towrards the end of the #5 skill. So the only real use for it is boosting the sucky ranged dps of scepter. So, all in all, I use it only when I must range and don’t need a knockback/reflect.

It takes so long to channel though, you do much more dps with auto attack and it has a lot of trouble with missing and moving while attacking.

Cleansing Flame is a PvE skill.

How do you do more dps with the auto attack? It misses moving targets and only does like 400-600 a hit. I usually drop the aoe on a stationary target, then cleansing flame, he’ll be hit by both for a decent amount of ranged damage. My cleansing flame starts hitting for 700 then climbs to 4k at the end for several hits. It also hits several targets. you just need a bit of practice at aiming it. However, I stay away from ranged as a guardian because it just sucks most of the time.

I think guardians off hands need to be looked at. Focus received a small buff this last patch, but the ray is still finicky in my opinion. Shield is pretty appropriate, but very situational.

Torch is the DPS offhand for Guardians.

Don’t complain until you’ve fully explored something.

Worst off-hand? I guess not =)

For the use of torch you’ll need the Zeal 10, II Fiery Wrath (10% more damage to burning foes) or its near useless to have.

Also Cleansing flames removes conditions on allies, however not yourself.
For PvE I love the torch for dps/support.

Brangien.7462:

For the use of torch you’ll need the Zeal 10, II Fiery Wrath (10% more damage to burning foes) or its near useless to have.

this is not true…
however since fiery wrath is mendatory in 90% of guardian builds most people will never know

wookalar.8952:

How do you do more dps with the auto attack? It misses moving targets and only does like 400-600 a hit. I usually drop the aoe on a stationary target, then cleansing flame, he’ll be hit by both for a decent amount of ranged damage. My cleansing flame starts hitting for 700 then climbs to 4k at the end for several hits. It also hits several targets. you just need a bit of practice at aiming it.

Channeled attacks show the added amount of the damage you’ve done, not the damage of each hit.
So you’re not hitting for 4k something during the last hits but for e.g. 4.8k-4.4k = 400.

wookalar.8952:

It’s the most damaging offhand for the guardian. I can get 4k hits with it for a few hits towrards the end of the #5 skill. So the only real use for it is boosting the sucky ranged dps of scepter. So, all in all, I use it only when I must range and don’t need a knockback/reflect.

I think you are confused about how multi-hit abilities work. When you see a bunch of numbers pop up from one ability that get larger and larger, that is the cumulative damage for the entire skill. You aren’t doing 4k damage multiple times at the end, the whole skill is doing 4k damage over the duration of the channel.

Brangien.7462:

Also Cleansing flames removes conditions on allies, however not yourself.
For PvE I love the torch for dps/support.

Really…? I could have sworn I’ve seen it clear my conditions before.

Yeah, it’s pretty bad. Zealot’s flame throw does a lot of damage, but has a hefty CD. Cleansing flames are bad; the range is mediocre, it takes FOREVER to channel, and it doesn’t remove conditions from yourself. Auto attacking for that 4-5 second duration of CF will usually do more damage, so there’s no real reason to use a torch offhand.

I do love the torch concept, just wish they could do something better with the functionality

Yeah I only use torch for double tapping #4 with a scepter for an additional ranged attack, which saddens me. Also, if you have an ele, trap ranger, or other class with burning in your party torch tends to be worthless for adding burning because there’s already enough burning on the enemy. Plus f1 active in a party killing a boss already gives pretty good uptime on burning even when you’re the only one in the party that can do burning.

The really sad part is how little they’d have to do to make torch outstanding.

1. Make the “fury when on fire” trait work with the self-immolation of torch 4.
2. Add 1s burning to torch 5 and 3s burning to torch 4(2nd).
3. Make the first tick of torch 5 clear one condition from you.
4. Don’t nerf the heck out of the existing damage while doing this.

Prestochango! A weapon that competes with the other offhands!

It strips conditions off your mates. Maybe I am the only one that misses this. In a game with tons of conditions, this can prove very valuable.

My friend and I levelled with 2 sword and torch guardians. I wasn’t even aware there were conditions in this game till I started running solo.

To make it do any real damage, you have a Zerker set on… that’s horrible. If there’s any use for a torch it should be for support purposes, eg. rem condis.

I would not recommend using a torch, there are better weapon sets at your disposal at this point in time.

Its awful in the way that its just…completely boring. Other than that it does great damage.

mamourrir.9641:

Am I the only one who thinks the torch is probably the worst offhand of the entire game?

Yes.

Na torch is not the worst, I’ve hit for 6k on zealots flame, skill five is interesting too as it cures conditions on allies.

Torch skill 4 does not actually burn you (you don’t take damage) so why would Inner Fire give you fury? You basically get magical fire for a few seconds that you can inflict burning with to nearby foes. I usually double tap torch 4 for the projectile it has great range and decent damage. You can activate the skill wait about 2 seconds to inflict burning then launch it as well. Over all it’s a good skill

Torch 5 is just great in everything it does, good mobile AOE cone of damage and condition removal. From what I have seen it doesn’t remove conditions on the caster which I am ok with. The only changes I would like to see for the torch is that torch 5 actually inflicts burning on the last tick of damage. All that fire and no burning, really?

I often pair the torch with the sword and get great results (works well with scepter also) to say it’s the worst offhand is simply a matter of opinion.

I was running Scepter/Torch for WvW. I don’t mind it at all.

I run scepter/torch too and I use the torch as close combat protection.

I hit most mobs at range with the scepter and once they close in with me, torch #4 gives them a good roast, if they’re not dead by then, torch #5 will finish them off. If they decide to stay ranged, I’ll use torch #4 second ability and set them on fire.

I’m a massive Torch fan. The AoE on the #5 combined with the solid damage and versatility to remove conditions makes it pretty awesome.

Torch gives the most dmg as offhands.
Torch skill 5 and Scepter skill 2 fully utilised Empowering Might,
Clear condition of teammate, constant chance of crits gives Vigor Precision on the last patch, tho doesnt need it in this new patch.

Whats more you want? =p

Speaking from a PvP perspective, Torch is definitely a specialized offhand, and I was initially skeptical of its worth, but actually testing it has led me to believe it does have its uses. It’s not going to find its way into nearly as many builds as the Focus or Shield, but if you’re running an aggressive Guardian, it’ll pump your numbers for sure. If I’m not mistaken, one of the Guardian builds on the Team PZ forums includes a Torch as an offhand, so it’s not necessarily restricted to casual play, either.

Zealot’s Flame is an excellent pressure skill for close-quarters combat. Besides the damage you get from AoE burning, builds running Fiery Wrath and Radiant power will get a +20% damage bonus on all nearby enemies for 6-10 seconds (less if they cleanse, of course), which is huge. With Virtue of Justice, ZFlame makes it easy to keep opponents on fire for a large percentage of the time, so that 20% bonus sticks around. Activating Zealot’s Fire will trade the last 3 seconds of burning and normal cooldown for a big damage spike, which, as others have said, can crit for 4-6k at range. Considering the Guardian’s low access to spike damage and ranged damage, this is a very nice complement to an offensive build’s skill set. If you’re using this to end a fight, the increased cooldown isn’t that big of a concern, though if not, it’s best used with discretion.

Cleansing Flame is also a much better skill than most people seem to give it credit for. I imagine its bad reputation comes mostly from those trying to use it as a single-target DPS move in close combat, which is the worst possible way to use it. Cleansing Flame excels in three situations: team fights, chasing weakened opponents, and mauling CC’d targets.

In team fight situations, Cleansing Flame can hit multiple allies and opponents, cleaning conditions off of allies (fantastic support) and dealing considerable damage to multiple foes. Against a single target, CF won’t offer better DPS than the 1h Sword’s autoattack, but when you’ve got a lot of bunched up enemies, it does much better than the 1h Sword.

Outside of team fights, CF is an excellent chasing tool for when you’ve got a weakened opponent kiting you. Getting within 400 range isn’t hard when you’ve got the Sword’s Flashing Blade or the Scepter’s Chains of Light to help narrow the gap, and CF’s steady stream of damage will often put low-health foes over the edge more quickly and easily than the Sword or Scepter could.

Lastly, if you pair the Torch with the Scepter, you can use it to absolutely destroy opponents who you catch with CoL or who are otherwise immobile. ZFlame>CoL>Smite>ZFire>CF is the basic rotation, and it can put out a lot of damage in a very short time frame (ZFire and CF alone can sometimes reach 10k, and the burning/Smite damage is just icing on the cake. Mix in Virtue of Justice if you’re feeling mean).

Overall, Torch is not for all builds, but if your build can handle less defense than the Shield or Focus would offer, it’s very nice for offensive utility and some spike damage.

Torch is great. But I’m always confused about the consistency of the two skills.

If by using #5 we cleanse others’ conditions with our flames, then
why don’t we cure our own (or at least one) with #4 when we set ourselves a light?

Very strange…

There’s also an apparent bug with it (skill #4) not applying fury when you light yourself on fire and have the appropriate trait (Radiance line) active.

I strongly suggest sir that you have no idea how set up your stats. My torch makes mincemeat of pretty much everything.

I dont leave home without it.