Guild Wars 2

Just a thought. Since we don’t have much in the way of conditions (burn, and maybe freeze if traited), do you think being able to inflict torment would help guardians any?

I’m just curious, I think it could make sense for guardians to be able to inflict torment as well. What are your thoughts?

A. I don’t really feel like it fits Guardians so much.
B. I’d rather them move further away from Condi bombing, not make it worse.
C. If any condi at all, I’d rather see cripple or chill on GS. Not a fan of a melee dps with low mobility to also have no snares.

Something like 5 additional conditions have been datamined, so it’s entirely possible we’ll receive a new one at some point. I’m personally an advocate of adding a new condition to our current non-damaging or low damage attacks, like Flashing Blade and Chains of Light.

foofad.5162:

Something like 5 additional conditions have been datamined, so it’s entirely possible we’ll receive a new one at some point. I’m personally an advocate of adding a new condition to our current non-damaging or low damage attacks, like Flashing Blade and Chains of Light.

Source on datamines?

I’m trying to find it for you, it was on reddit a while back. I must be searching for the wrong thing. I believe it was just icons though, but they may have had names too.

Torment would absolutely fit Guardians. Theres that whole wracked by the light of judgement thing to play it off of. Don’t know if I ever put it on the forums, but once they introduced Torment I though it’d be a perfect fit for Warriors and Guardians, and now Warriors have it.

Not to mention, with the advent of new traits and skills (soon enough), and if foo is right in seeing 5 new conditions, its very likely condition builds, and hopefully in some respect Kindled Zeal will have some usefulness.

I don’t feel that Torment fits Guardians or any other melee class at all. I don’t see what problem torment addresses for a Guardian. If people have to choose torment damage over getting facepounded by a slow moving melee class, I’m pretty sure I know what one they will take.

@Obtena how Tormenting evil creatures would not fit Holy Guardians of light?
Spanish Inquisition – do it seems familiar?
little more conditions (damaging one) would be great for guardians – since I’m specing in burning/support giving additional conditions that would have some use from my condi damage is always welcome

Its just another way to plink away at an enemies health, which is what conditions normally do in general. I mean, it might not be a mainstay for a GS/Sw meditaion build jumping around everywhere, but some other forms could make it work.

If we’re just talking about having and not having Torment, then it works. Once its implimented, and we can see the degree to which we have Torment, then we can see if it’s worthwhile or not.

@ronpierce yeah, we don’t want the game to become a condi race…

I think something along the lines of condi cleanse causes damage would be great… sort of like a sister to Halting Strike. Or a buff to Smite Condition.

If only you could share % of damage of all condi on you… that would be great. Sort of like a reduced condi transfer.

Lord Trejgon.2809:

@Obtena how Tormenting evil creatures would not fit Holy Guardians of light?
Spanish Inquisition – do it seems familiar?
little more conditions (damaging one) would be great for guardians – since I’m specing in burning/support giving additional conditions that would have some use from my condi damage is always welcome

I think of ‘torment’ as something that would be more applicable to necro/mesmer. If I had to ‘invent’ a new condition for Guardian, it would be ‘Wrath’. I don’t try to conceptually associate Guardians to Holiness or Light … For me Guardian is more neutral … it’s about tapping into divine or supernatural powers related to ‘knightly virtues’.

Don’t think I disagree with you though. I do think it would be super neat (and a little OP) to give Guardians access to another condition that does some kind of damage but whoever develops that would have to be very aware.

there have too many light combo fields to not being associated with light
with those “wrath” – as for me name is more likely for boon not condition…
If I had to “invent” new condition that would be special to the guardian…. I have no Idea what it would be – really I was thinking on that and there is nothing (as for now) I could “invent”
Why it would be OP to give us new damaging condition… aactually there are more than enough players that are discrediting condition guardian just because the only damaging condi we have is burning…
new condition that would be introduced in way that You really need want it to have it (for example application would be in traited-version of some skill type – maybe symbols?) could be nice thing for condition guardians… but only when It could be achieveable in way that would not break existing burning builds…

Lord Trejgon.2809:

Why it would be OP to give us new damaging condition… aactually there are more than enough players that are discrediting condition guardian just because the only damaging condi we have is burning…

I don’t feel it’s that black and white. I know Foofad is doing alot of work to quantify condition damage on Guardian. That’s good and I’m sure it’s going to show that IF someone were to make a tradeoff from a certain build to a condition damage stat build, there would be an overall net loss of X (X will be damage, defense, whatever etc…) I don’t doubt it … I actually USE the build that people think sucks that makes all those uneven sacrifices.

For me, the most valuable takeaway from his work will be to be able to make a claim that adding a second damaging condition within a certain damage range would balance this uneven sacrifice. Now, the following is just speculation but I don’t actually think that the damage range needed to balance is very high. ln otherwords, I don’t believe that the sacrifices are so uneven that a second condition is actually warranted. I might have to eat those words when the numbers come out but then again, numbers don’t always reflect other aspects that are advantageous by focusing on a CDamage build.

Sword is as much a defensive weapon as it is offensive. I think taking off the short CD, AoE, teleport blind would be a very bad idea for the weapon…

Conditions are just annoying anyway. Why would you even want more when we already have the strongest condition in game? It’s just Guild Wars 1 Hexes/conditions all over again. They’re either too good or terrible and thus classes based around them get hammered by Anet’s inability to balance them…

Yeah, need to be careful what you wish for…

As a guardian, I vote against it. Like poison, it doesn’t suit guardians and it would be really hard to balance.

I didn’t say that I want new damaging condition, but that additional one to my burning-support build would be always welcome
@Pleurodesed Torment still suit us more than poison :P
actually that could be some way of balancing some things if tha slowest class will be given something that punish enemy for mobility :P

But guardians are meant to be slow and easy to be kited.

Yes, we guardians lack range, mobility and powerful magics; but that’s for the sake of balance.

@foofad @ronpiece – was this what you were tallking about, foo? i remember reading that too so went and searched for it:

http://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/1i6ef9/new_conditions/

read the top comments for some insight, but of course, there was never any confirmation re: these. and ANet did previously mention that don’t count on the .dat sring son being hard facts. often it’s old stuff that gets left in there. i.e. outdated.

though at the same time, could be potential, new stuff.

i still prefer chill for Guardians. or cripples. but ideally chills. : ))
i haven’t been in PvP too much lately.. but the times i have been under the effect of Torment, tbh, i sort of just “tank” through it and keep moving to be where i need to be, unless if i’m on the verge of dying, which by then probs doesn’t matter anyways. so if there’s no reliable way for Guardians stacking torment, and fast? i’d rather us stay as in.

or get more access to chills and cripples – which hard slow your oppoents down and not have your opponents choose to slow down. i think that’d be more beneficial if what we’re saying is we have trouble keeping up with people in combat.

If Glacial Heart proc’ed on all weapon crits, it would be kinda amazing. Imagine Smite landing most of it’s damage, with the chill covered by the eventual burning…

Change Kindled Zeal to Flames of Condemnation – every time you apply burn, you also apply 2stacks of agony and 2stacks of bleed for 3s.

I’d prefer that guardians were the anti-condition spec. The current meta is all about conditions. I’d like to see guards easily clear whatever any class can put on them.

roamzero.9486:

Change Kindled Zeal to Flames of Condemnation – every time you apply burn, you also apply 2stacks of agony and 2stacks of bleed for 3s.

Well, applying agony would definitely be overpowered in PvP :P

As for torment, wouldn’t mind having access to it, maybe that would make condition builds worth considering.

Personally I don’t find guardians needing more conditions. I think we need more interrupts.

Wukunlin.8461:

Personally I don’t find guardians needing more conditions. I think we need more interrupts.

Bane Signet, GS5, Hammer4, Shield5, and Staff5/Hammer5 for area denial/potential interrupt. Guardians have a pretty solid selection of abilities for interrupts. Most might be melee range but they also come with a good bonus effect.

Bryker.5719:

Wukunlin.8461:

Personally I don’t find guardians needing more conditions. I think we need more interrupts.

Bane Signet, GS5, Hammer4, Shield5, and Staff5/Hammer5 for area denial/potential interrupt. Guardians have a pretty solid selection of abilities for interrupts. Most might be melee range but they also come with a good bonus effect.

Hammer of Wisdom every 3rd atack + on demand with “command” skill

I noticed that Warrior’s off hand sword (Impale) inflicts Torment now instead of Bleed. With even Warriors getting it, I think it might be possible for all the classes to inflict it in some way or another eventually. And I think it could help guardians, since all we’ve got is burn.

Nuts to torment, I say. What we need is chill. There aren’t a zillion sources of it, outside of Elementalist and Ranger, and melee DPS guardians could use a little something for staying on target.

Besides, if they gave me chill, then I’d have a sword that shoots fire, lightning (sigil of air) and ice. I need that. I need it now.

Guardians do have very low access to conditions.

Personally, I’d like to see everyone else’s access to conditions be leveled out with the guard, but since that probably isn’t going to happen, he needs more condi application.

Torment would be a good fit for many things.

• Shield of Judgement – Damages and applies Torment to foes; applies Protection to allies
• Permeating Wrath – Your Virtue of Justice now applies both Burning and Torment
• Hallowed Ground – Provide Stability for allies and apply Torment to foes

Just to name a few.

Would love a trait that applied Chill to enemies that impacted or crossed wards.

Chill through wards actually sounds like a nice dynamic – a counter to the stability counter

Torment is fine for Guards…you’ve never been harassed by bible thumpers? Now imagine bible thumpers with hammers and swords…come on it fits perfectly

from a lore standpoint torment makes no sense to put on a divine figure such a guardian, but in game we do need t least just 1 more condition or buff the chill amount we can apply even if just a small buff, so that we can make up for our poor mobility by slowing enemies down if traited, because ppl forget that we CAN apply small amounts of chill XD. If all of this sounds to OP to add then at least do one of the following with the shield 5 skill. 1 Either give us a melee blocking shield like the warr/engi or 2. At least make our 5 skill a blast finisher

edit: scrap that first one a melee blocking shield would be OP tremendously in a utility line up that already contains “Shelter” and “Renewed Focus”