Zeal trait line

Zeal trait line

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Posted by: azizul.8469

azizul.8469

dear anet ,

why are the minor traits all specific to Symbol ? what if i equip weapons that do not have symbol skill like sword/torch etc ? i’ll be deprived of the minor traits benefits. why can’t the minor trait be more generic, not tight to weapon specific skills ?

Cutie Phantasmer/Farinas [HAX] – CD Casual
Archeage = Farmville with PK

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Posted by: Jerus.4350

Jerus.4350

Because it’s “the symbol line?”

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Posted by: Thaddeus.4891

Thaddeus.4891

Like Jerus said. Zeal is the symbol line. The real question is :

Anet Why did you put a sceptre trait in the Symbol line?

Thaddeauz [xQCx]- QC GUILD

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Posted by: CMF.5461

CMF.5461

Apparently Guardian, Necromancer, and Mesmer are the only classes that have class mechanics embedded in their weapon skills. Symbols, Marks, Clones/Phantasms.

So the question is do Necros and Mesmers feel the same traitline restrictions as Guardians when selecting traits and weapons?

I feel that Mesmers mostly are unaffected because every weapon set has a Phantasm and/or Clone attached to it.

Necromancers and Guardians have had very similar class mechanic issues on sustain/mobility and the want of effective build diversity (necros wanted a power build for a while but condi was always better and guard wanted a condi build but power was better).

I feel that the Zeal line solution could be in allowing more proliferation of symbol usage across the weapon spread….but I would hate to see SO MANY light fields just strewn everywhere.

Symbols tend to be boring mechanics, that the Guardians are “known” for and expected to use as they are found on every weapon except for sword and scepter. Yet they are only efficient on hammer and mace.

Marks are a very minor part of Necromancers and are only found on one weapon, so they probably don’t care all too much about them. Wells are the known mechanic for Necromancers, I feel, and are easily obtained on any build because they are utility skills.

So the other solution would be to transfer symbols into utility skills…maybe drop spirit weapons and move them into very short duration procs on weapon skills, in a way sort of like clones and phantasms?

End of the day, symbols could use a buff or alteration to mechanics…even after the mayhem of the symbol stacking bug abuse, it shows how linear and limited they are. Best usage is on a stationary target that will soak up the full extent of damage.

(edited by CMF.5461)

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Posted by: Ragnar the Rock.3174

Ragnar the Rock.3174

Sadly it is considered the “Symbol Line”

Sadly thanks to this the minors & some of the majors are greatly diminished or even made useless if you use anything other then a mace or hammer.

Over all the line just feels very sad and like it forces you to use a specific weapon unlike other lines that have the choice of boosting weapons but don’t feel like they make them mandatory.

Frankly I think they should re arrange some of the traits and take a good look over all of them and adjust the power of each accordingly.

For instance they could
1: just get rid of symbolic exposure. The vulnerability it applies is laughably low and short lived.
Or they could swap it around with wrathful spirit and change wrathful spirit to grant might stacks instead of retaliation (which the guardian has tons of anyway)

They could also just merge symbolic power and symbolic avenger into a single grand master.
Then they could make shattered AEGIS, fiery wrath or kindled zeal the last minor in the line.

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Posted by: Assic.2746

Assic.2746

Like Jerus said. Zeal is the symbol line. The real question is :

Anet Why did you put a sceptre trait in the Symbol line?

Scepter trait has been always in Zeal trait line – “10% more dmg with scepter” now it’s “gain might when Justice passive triggers”.

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Posted by: Thaddeus.4891

Thaddeus.4891

Like Jerus said. Zeal is the symbol line. The real question is :

Anet Why did you put a sceptre trait in the Symbol line?

Scepter trait has been always in Zeal trait line – “10% more dmg with scepter” now it’s “gain might when Justice passive triggers”.

I know. But it doesn’t make sense that a major trait push toward scepter, while the minor boost symbol. The scepter is one of the few main-hand weapon that don’t use symbol.

Thaddeauz [xQCx]- QC GUILD

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Posted by: Michaeas Magister.1589

Michaeas Magister.1589

So the other solution would be to transfer symbols into utility skills…maybe drop spirit weapons and move them into very short duration procs on weapon skills, in a way sort of like clones and phantasms?

End of the day, symbols could use a buff or alteration to mechanics…even after the mayhem of the symbol stacking bug abuse, it shows how linear and limited they are. Best usage is on a stationary target that will soak up the full extent of damage.

Really GREAT idea here in my opinion. Spirit weapons could just be generated from the weapon being used and symbols could be a new utility line.

I LIKE IT!!

Now, how do we get it into the hands (and heads) of the Arenanet Devs?

It’s as I have always said,
“You can get more results with a kind word and a big stick,
than you can with merely a kind word.”

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Posted by: Thaddeus.4891

Thaddeus.4891

Symbols as utility skills? Way too similar to traps.

Thaddeauz [xQCx]- QC GUILD

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Posted by: CMF.5461

CMF.5461

Yeah…you’re right….traps are a dumb idea

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Posted by: Black Box.9312

Black Box.9312

If you ask me, I think that Fiery Wrath, Kindled Zeal, and Shattered Aegis would all make for better minor traits that would have more universal application than forcing symbol traits into minor slots. Fiery Wrath is already taken in pretty much every build that goes Zeal, so they might as well put it in the minor slot so that we can have more build diversity.

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Posted by: Aedrion.6483

Aedrion.6483

Like Jerus said. Zeal is the symbol line. The real question is :

Anet Why did you put a sceptre trait in the Symbol line?

I love the trait line. But this is such a good question.

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Posted by: Mikau.6920

Mikau.6920

If you ask me, I think that Fiery Wrath, Kindled Zeal, and Shattered Aegis would all make for better minor traits that would have more universal application than forcing symbol traits into minor slots. Fiery Wrath is already taken in pretty much every build that goes Zeal, so they might as well put it in the minor slot so that we can have more build diversity.

Agreed.

There is no sense to symbol traits be in minor. They already merged minions traits from minor into other minon related traits in death magic to open options for necros. They should do the same. Not everyone that was goind in death magic would use minions and not everyone that goes into zeal will use symbols.

Sorry for my english.

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Posted by: SaXiar.2198

SaXiar.2198

I prefer Rad. over Zeal. It looks far stronger than zeal.. ?!
Don’t feel that zeal is worth to use as GS (weapon).

Server: Far Shiverpeaks [EU]
Main profession: Thief & Guardian
Focus on: WvW , PvP

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Posted by: CMF.5461

CMF.5461

If you are trying to maximize damage modifiers and reach higher burst/dps then you need Zeal, Radiance, and either Virtues or Valor (Retributive Armor provides more Ferocity, but Virtues will probably be better with Unscathed Contender).

This is probably best seen in PvE where you don’t need as many survival traits and targets stay still in symbols to maximize damage.

Traits alone you would achieve:
7% on Burning
5% with Greatsword
10% to Symbols
10% to target in Symbols
10% with Retribution
20% with Aegis
~5% with Boons

Bringing in gear you will probably have:
10% Scholar Runes
5% Force
10% Night

Multiply all those together to gain:

1.07 * 1.05 * 1.1 * 1.1 * 1.1 * 1.2 * 1.05 * 1.05 * 1.1 = 2.18 damage modifier

On crits with somewhere around 225% crit damage in zerker gear it would turn into a 4.9 damage modifier, or 490% more damage, if I did that all right.

That takes a 3k Whirling Wrath up into a 14k Whirling Wrath.

That was all in a vacuum and honestly not all modifiers will apply at the same time depending on which weapon is active and so on, but its just to showcase stacking damage modifiers.

So zeal, is useful? But the game isn’t “just” about damage, and utility and support are needed, which is what the meta build meshes in along with maximizing damage.