Guild Wars 2

hey

i think to make hammer viable again we need to see Glacial Heart back into valor. To make place (master tier valor) i would suggest to combine “strenght of the fallen” and “stalwart defender” into one adept tier trait with
“lose conditions at a set time interval (1 condi 10sicd). Shield ability recharge is reduced (20%)”.
The downstate part could be moved into mastertier virtues (not like anybody wanna use this trait and any trait in master virtues is not worth it anyway bc of absolute resolution.

this way hammer could be viable again for dps guard, while shield could compete better with focus on bunker guard. I know it has been said many times when the changes for spezialisation came out. but i feel like it has to be said again. its such a simple change and it would help guardian in a great way to make mutltiple weapons viabel without buffing them too much. with that change i could see all weapons used on guard (hammer,gs,scepter,focus on dps + sword,torch,scepter,focus on condi +staff, mace shield/focus on bunker)

I don’t get all the hate for the change to Virtues on this trait. It’s actually in a trait line I use now. Before, it was in … Valour.

Glacial heart fits better in the Honor adept not in Valor… It’s a symbol based, and support based .. therfore Honor line fit’s it much much better .. The valor line has no synergy with hammer whatsoever .

If anything, it fits more so in Zeal if you want to go the symbol route because well…yeah.

so short why i think it should be in valor:

valor master got no dmg/dps orientated trait (unless you go with shatterd zeal+ communal defense). all guard builds go into virtues+valor right now. so putting it into valor master would give us a dps trait there and also still allowing us to pick between radiance,zeal or honor if we go dps with hammer. (my choice would prolly be honor. for me zeal is for gs, radiance for sword and honor for hammer)

Arken.3725:

If anything, it fits more so in Zeal if you want to go the symbol route because well…yeah.

Should Write of Persistance move to Zeal somewhere then yes.. I think there needs to be a single Symbol line but unfortunately they split all the symbol based things over 2 lines where of them is just a singular anamoly that shouldn’t be in the line.

Zeal or Honor would fit .. my concern in zeal is that there are other very good choices that it would be competing with .. However, in Honor Adept there aren’t really any good choices outside of bunkering.

They could move hammer to honour and merge it with protector’s impact (the fall trait). They should also replace Empowering might with Writ of persistence and make a new grandmaster.

Considering that the hammer and Valor both have very defensive natures to them, I’d say it would fit well in Valor. Just because it has a symbol doesn’t mean it’d fit in Zeal (a line associated with damage) or Honor (a line associated with healing/support).

Obtena.7952:

I don’t get all the hate for the change to Virtues on this trait. It’s actually in a trait line I use now. Before, it was in … Valour.

It competes with Absolute Resolution, which basically means it’s never going to be used until it gets moved elsewhere.

By far the best position for Glacial Hearts is a Master in Valor. Since that trait is mostly for a sPvP Medi guardian Hammer build.

Glacial Hearts doesn’t have a symbol.

Hammer being one of the weapons that synergize best with AH, valor would be my choice.

Zeal, if thet moved all symbol traits into that line..

As it is now i pretty much make hammer pvp/wvw builds obsolete since it compete with one of the bestpvp/wvw traits we have.

And the trait is an absolute necessity if you want to play your hammer as an offensive tool.

Fashion Mage.3712:

Considering that the hammer and Valor both have very defensive natures to them, I’d say it would fit well in Valor. Just because it has a symbol doesn’t mean it’d fit in Zeal (a line associated with damage) or Honor (a line associated with healing/support).

Like staff, hammer is more of a group support weapon in both pve & pvp so honour makes the most sense. There are already 2 weapons in valour anymore would be too much. Even if you more shield of focus to virtues it would make no sense.

Lyger.5429:

Fashion Mage.3712:

Considering that the hammer and Valor both have very defensive natures to them, I’d say it would fit well in Valor. Just because it has a symbol doesn’t mean it’d fit in Zeal (a line associated with damage) or Honor (a line associated with healing/support).

Like staff, hammer is more of a group support weapon in both pve & pvp so honour makes the most sense. There are already 2 weapons in valour anymore would be too much. Even if you more shield of focus to virtues it would make no sense.

They also already got 2 weapons in Honor.

What about switching Glacial Heart with Honorable Staff? Virtues is a lot about Boons so it would fit quite well.

Xaylin.1860:

Lyger.5429:

Fashion Mage.3712:

Considering that the hammer and Valor both have very defensive natures to them, I’d say it would fit well in Valor. Just because it has a symbol doesn’t mean it’d fit in Zeal (a line associated with damage) or Honor (a line associated with healing/support).

Like staff, hammer is more of a group support weapon in both pve & pvp so honour makes the most sense. There are already 2 weapons in valour anymore would be too much. Even if you more shield of focus to virtues it would make no sense.

They also already got 2 weapons in Honor.

What about switching Glacial Heart with Honorable Staff? Virtues is a lot about Boons so it would fit quite well.

Yea I forgot about mace…I think that switch would work seeing as you can cleanse with shouts if you wanna play cleric staff so missing the condi cleanse on resolve wouldn’t be too bad.

Not taking Absolute Resolution is disastrous and the only thing that should compete with it is something equally as strong. Moving the staff trait there would probably be an overall nerf to support guardians and would result in the staff trait never (or very rarely) being used.

Lyger.5429:

Like staff, hammer is more of a group support weapon in both pve & pvp so honour makes the most sense. There are already 2 weapons in valour anymore would be too much. Even if you more shield of focus to virtues it would make no sense.

The hammer isn’t a group support weapon, it’s a control weapon. The staff is a group support weapon, hence why it fits in Honor. There are also already two weapon traits in Honor, so that logic doesn’t fly either.

Fashion Mage.3712:

There are also already two weapon traits in Honor, so that logic doesn’t fly either.

I’ve already addressed this in the above post. Also hammer could potentially be support, protection & blast finishers say hello :p

Lyger.5429:

Fashion Mage.3712:

There are also already two weapon traits in Honor, so that logic doesn’t fly either.

I’ve already addressed this in the above post. Also hammer could potentially be support, protection & blast finishers say hello :p

and what if you decide to use consecrations instead of shouts? >v>
The hammer’s support capabilities even with the blast finisher aren’t very significant, at least not compared to the staff.

Fashion Mage.3712:

Not taking Absolute Resolution is disastrous and the only thing that should compete with it is something equally as strong. Moving the staff trait there would probably be an overall nerf to support guardians and would result in the staff trait never (or very rarely) being used.

It’s totally doable to slightly rework Virtues and move Honorable Staff into the Adept tier. Since – let’s be honest – those traits aren’t that great to begin with unless you are taking Consecrations. They could merge Retaliatory Subconsciousness and Unscathed Contender or buff one of those two and move it up a slot.

Even if it was not there talking about a nerf to support Guardians is pretty dramatic since the impact wouldn’t be that big after all. If you feel that AR is too important to let it go, you will most likely still be fine without the cooldown reduction on Staff. Empowering Might or Pure of Heart will easily make up for the loss supportwise.

Fashion Mage.3712:

The hammer isn’t a group support weapon, it’s a control weapon. The staff is a group support weapon, hence why it fits in Honor. There are also already two weapon traits in Honor, so that logic doesn’t fly either.

The Symbol on AA pretty much makes Hammer a support weapon as well. Don’t be so black and white. The Symbol also makes it fit into Honor perfectly.

Even if you disagree: Considering that Guardians don’t really have a traitline for crowd control, where would you put it? It could go into Zeal or Honor because of the Symbol. But most certainly not Virtues. People wanting it in Valor most likely desire it for their Mediation build but conceptually it doesn’t make any sense at all. Even Radiance would be a better pick since it at least deals with critical hits (which also is the case for Honor…).

Staff is perfectly fine in Honor. Although it doesn’t even synergize that well with other traits besides being a supportive weapon to begin with. But Staff would be perfectly fine in Virtues as well. Hammer is not.

Having two weapon skill CDR traits in one tier isn´t the best idea imo. It cripples build diversity (giving incentive for not using both of the weapons in one build). Considering this, that´s what I came up with:

Glacial Heart: Move to Valor master tier. (2h CDR should be master)
Stalwart Defender: Move to Virtues adept tier. (offhand CDR in adept tier)
Master of Consecrations: Move to master tier. Make the cooldown reduction baseline so moving this isn´t a big nerf to consecrations and make this trait buff consecrations in some fun way. Although I´m not sure what could be added to it

what do you think?

Xaylin.1860:

Staff is perfectly fine in Honor. Although it doesn’t even synergize that well with other traits besides being a supportive weapon to begin with. But Staff would be perfectly fine in Virtues as well. Hammer is not.

I agree.

mixxed.5862:

Glacial Heart: Move to Valor master tier. (2h CDR should be master)
Stalwart Defender: Move to Virtues adept tier. (offhand CDR in adept tier)
Master of Consecrations: Move to master tier. Make the cooldown reduction baseline so moving this isn´t a big nerf to consecrations and make this trait buff consecrations in some fun way. Although I´m not sure what could be added to it

what do you think?

Shield doesn’t fit virtues much in my opinion. Consecrations should also stay where they are, they too important for group support. Lastly I still think honour is a better place for hammer, it has zero synergy with valour.

TDLR; guard traits are a mess competing to much with each other :P, we need trait merge and more new traits :P

Since dev’s only know fire medi builds they dont care about the rest of the class…

Lyger.5429:

Shield doesn’t fit virtues much in my opinion. Consecrations should also stay where they are, they too important for group support. Lastly I still think honour is a better place for hammer, it has zero synergy with valour.

I think shield fits Virtues decently, well or at least hammer doesn´t fit any better :P
That´s why I think the CDR of the consecrations trait should be made baseline.
It´s true hammer would be great in honour. But having mace, staff and shouts in there, that just belong there, there´s no reasonable way fitting it in imo.

I just thought about what to add to a master tier Master of Consecrations and had some ideas, maybe it´s a bit over the top, but whatever, Absolute Resolution really is a strong contender As the consecrations have a huge span of diffrent cooldowns, it would be best to improve them respectively.

Purging Flames: When it ends it applies its passive (-33% Condition duration) to all allies standing within for 5 sec. Maybe some extra burning to foes on expire as well…
Wall of Reflection: Removes conditions from allies passing through. Cooldown per ally 4 sec.
Hallowed Ground: After conjuring, you can command it to move to a new location. Just like the Ventari Tablet on Revenant, but moving much slower.
Sanctuary: Not sure, pulses protection or resistance or whatever.

mixxed.5862:

But having mace, staff and shouts in there, that just belong there, there´s no reasonable way fitting it in imo.

I agree that’s why staff & hammer should switch places.

They wont move GlacialHearth into a new traitline… It would mean Hammer is a very effective PvP weapon… and the don’t want to do this….

They could move this trait to Zeal in place of Wrathful Spirit. Makes more sense to be in a Symbol based line.