Guild Wars 2

Edit Thanks to AresFyra.3570 for finding the stats, updated mantra, scepter ambush skill, and utilities.
Edit 2 Thanks to Dethl.2875 for finding the range on the elite!
Edit 3 Mirage Wiki is up! thanks everyone for finding the initial stuff on Mirage!
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Mirage

“Power 1000 Condi Dmg 1225 Condi Duration 52.33% and Master of Misdirection."

Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FOr-LO38Mts
From 2:07:03-2:14:20 for Mesmer.
Second Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nqj-yOPEudA
Starting at 54:31-56:30

Ctrl+F for the known ambush skills. Word body limit prevents them from being added to this post.

Axe Auto:
1. Lacerating Chop (.5s cast)
Inflict bleeding on your target.
• Dmg:178
• Bleed (1 stack, 3s): 291 Dmg
• Number of Targets: 3
• Range:130
2. Ethereal Chop (.5s cast)
Inflict Torment on your target.
• Dmg:178
• Torment (1 stack, 3s): 217 Dmg, 433 if Moving
• Number of Targets: 3
• Range: 130
3. Mirror Strikes (.5s cast)
Inflict Bleeding and torment on your target.
• Dmg (2x):356
• Bleeding (1 stack, 9.25s):873 Dmg
• Torment (1 stack, 9.25s): 650 Dmg, 1299 if Moving
• Number of Targets: 3
• Range 130

Axe 2: Lingering Thoughts (.5s cd)
Spin forward and strike multiple times, inflicting conditions and leaving a mirage at
your starting position. If an enemy is near the mirage when it expires, a clone is
summoned.
• Dmg (3x): 426
• Cripple (3 stacks): 1.5s
• Torment(3 stacks): 6s. 1299 Dmg, 2597 if moving
• Number of targets: 3
• Count Recharge: 8s
• Combo Finisher: Whirl
• Range: 130

Axe 3: Axes of Symmetry (.75s cast, 10s cd)
You and all your axe clones shadowstep to a random location around your target
and apply confusion. This attack breaks enemy targeting and your illusions change
focus to the targeted foe.
• Dmg: 533
• Player confusion (5 stacks, 7.5s): 631 Dmg on Skill Use, 1960 Dmg
• Clone confusion (1 stack, 7.5s): 127 Dmg on Skill Use, 392 Dmg
• Evade: .75s
• Combo Finisher: Leap
• Range: 600

Specialization Trait:
Mirage Cloak
Gain Mirage Cloak instead of dodge rolling. Ambush skills become available for a
short time whenever you gain Mirage Cloak. Gains access to Deception skills.
• Mirage Cloak (.75s): Evade incoming attacks.
• Ambush Attack Window: 1.25s

First Traits
1. Self Deception: Using a deception skill will summon a clone if you have exactly 2 illusions active.
2. Renewing Oasis: Gain regeneration when Mirage Cloak is active. The duration of damaging conditions is reduced while you are regenerating.
• Regen (4s).
• Condi duration reduction: 20%.
3. Riddle of Sand: When entering combat, your first Ambush attack applies confusion. This ability refreshes when you use a Shatter skill.
• Confusion (2 stacks, 7.5s)

Minor Trait: Nomad’s Endurance
Shatter skills give vigor, which grants condition dmg.
• Vigor (3 sec): Grants 150 condi dmg and 50% endurance regeneration.
• Attribute Adjust: 150

Second Traits
1. Shards of Glass: Shattered Illusions have a chance of becoming Mirage Mirrors (33%).
Reformed Mirage Mirror (20s cd): Your shattered illusion reforms into a mirror.
Touching the mirror shatters it, granting Mirage Cloak to you and weakening foes.
• Dmg: 80
• Weakness: 6s
• Mirage Cloak: 1s, evade.
• Number of Targets: 5
• Radius: 180
2. Mirage Mantle:
Gain Protection when Mirage Cloak Ends.
• Protection (1.5s)
3.Mirrored Axes:
Reduces recharge of Axe skills. Axe skills generate an additional phantasmal axe.
Recharge reduction 20%.
Phantasmal Seeking Axe: Release a phantasmal axe that seeks out a target after a
delay, inflicting conditions.
• Dmg:107
• Seek Range: 400
• Torment: kitten
• Range: 200

Minor Trait: Speed of Sand:
Gain Superspeed (.75s) when you gain Mirage Cloak.

Third Traits
1. Infinite Horizon
When you gain Mirage Cloak, the trait is also applied to all of your illusions.
2. Elusive Mind
Dodging breaks stun and removes conditions.
• Conditions removed: 1
• Breaks Stun
3. Dune Cloak
Use Sand Shards when you gain Mirage Cloak. Conditions applied to bleeding foes
have increased duration (20%).
Sand Shards- Strike nearby foes, inflicting bleeding.
• Dmg: 133
• Bleeding (2 stacks, 9.25s): 1746 Dmg
• Number of Targets: 5
• Radius: 180

Utilities
False Oasis (.75s cast, 30s cd)
Deception. Create a mirage at your current location and heal over time. When the mirage expires, it spawns a mirage mirror.
• Healing:1620
• Vigor: 5s, 150 condi dmg, 50% end regen
• Pulses: 5
• Mirage Duration: 3s
• Interval: 1s
Sand Through Glass (30s cd)
Deception. Evade backward and leave behind a mirage mirror.
• Distance: 300
• Evade: 0.5s
• Breaks Stun
Crystal Sands (.25s cast, 20s cd)
Deception. Draw in shards of crystal sand that confuse foes they pass through on their way to your targeted location. The shards form a Mirage Mirror upon reaching their destination. (Typo)
• Dmg (6x): 636
• Confusion (1 stack, 7.5s): 127 Dmg on skill use, 392 Dmg
• Range: 900
Elite Skill: Jaunt (.5s cd)
Deception. Shadowstep to a target location and confuse nearby foes.
• Dmg: 266
• Confusion: 3 stacks, 7.5s
• Conditions Removed: 1
• Maximum Count: 3
• Count Recharge: 20s
• Radius: 180
• Combo Finisher: Leap
• Range: 400

Thanks a lot for this. Very helpful!

thank you for compiling this

I gotta say i’m disappointed that this build is heavily focused on conditions. It should be viable for power also. As a matter of fact, condition mesmer has already been the only viable dps build for mesmers, even if it’s on just a few fights, for the last 2 years. Power mesmer had no viable dps build at all. I so hype over this and look forward to it. But now I’m just disappointed after reading the traits. If I want to run power, then I should just give up any notion of being a dps? I guess until the next expansion, so 6 years with no viable dps build for power mesmer. C’mon anet.

@Hot Boy: I guess if you want to force it you can still run Mirage on Power. In every trait tier there’s at least one option that doesn’t shout “CONDIEE!”.

Look at this staff ambush skill. With 3 clones+yourself that skill provides 12 stacks of might for your allies. Sounds interesting.

Me Games Ma.8426:

@Hot Boy: I guess if you want to force it you can still run Mirage on Power. In every trait tier there’s at least one option that doesn’t shout “CONDIEE!”.

---

Look at this staff ambush skill. With 3 clones+yourself that skill provides 12 stacks of might for your allies. Sounds interesting.

But there aren’t any damage modifiers that would increase sword damage. I was thinking it might be possible for the sword clones to use blurred frenzy with the mirage cloak skill, 3 regular clones hitting blurred frenzy at the same time would be strong. But sword clones are easily kited also, and it would just be another burst build with no real sustained dps, same as now. And then sword clones are slow and easily killed. I don’t know man. Also, i’m just making a kittenumption of sword clones doing blurred frenzy. they haven’t shown what their special skill will be. The minors at least should be changed to benefit both power or condition builds. For example, the minor that grants +150 condition damage, should grant either power or condition damage, based on which trait is highest. This is intentional design though. feelsbadman

I hope when we can actually play it the pro players will find a way to play it as a power spec.Even if that means not using axe.But i am not really optimistic.

You just know the Greatsword ambush skill is going to be a big Hyperbeam.

Thanks for this!
Has anyone seen any of the utility skills?
I’ve found 1 of them so far but no time to search them all or post em right now.

Hot Boy.7138:

I gotta say i’m disappointed that this build is heavily focused on conditions. It should be viable for power also. As a matter of fact, condition mesmer has already been the only viable dps build for mesmers, even if it’s on just a few fights, for the last 2 years.

Honestly I find that if I take a step back, the only big difference between the two is how the numbers above your enemies’ head are formatted. You’re a DPS spec, doesn’t matter how the numbers are printed, what matters are “burst” and “sustained” output capabilities.

In fact, most MMORPGs use DoTs vs DD as a facet of class theme, instead of something players can actively decide between. And much as options are nice, after 5 years of GW2 I think what other games do is the smarter choice. :<

Kind of sad that it seems like it’s more of a condition spec as well. Love the playstyle of sword/sword and was really hoping for axe/axe power based spec.

But given how little we’ve seen I imagine there will be a power-variation of it, and at the very least there’s the new Grieving stat combo that will give a little taste of both. Certainly prefer it over the viper condi duration meta we have right now.

Honestly, it kind of seems like a lot of the new specs are pretty condition heavy, at least from what little I’ve seen. Was really hoping the condi meta would die down a little bit but it seems like it might be getting stronger.

At the very least though, the new stat combo should make condi a little more fun for those of us that don’t like to sacrifice larger numbers for damage over time. Even if precision and ferocity are still the minor stats.

And I am definitely looking forward to trying out greatsword with this new spec during the trial weekend.

Yeah nothing about the trait really screams condition spec, it’s just the weapon. Can probably just use it with Sword/Sword or something.

Thank you for typing all this.

Difficult choice of GM majors – stun break plus condi clear on dodge or give all illusions mirage cloak… ? Obviously the former will be more useful in pvp but the latter would be more fun for mind games.

Aluren.1896:

Minor Trait: Speed of Sand:
Gain Superspeed (3/4 second) when you gain Mirage Cloak.

kittenty band aid fix to the kittenty gimmick they are forcing with this kittenty spec.

Aluren.1896:

Third Column of Major Traits-

1. Infinite Horizon
When you gain Mirage Cloak, the trait is also applied to all of your illusions.

Wait so to use the kittenty gimmick that they are trying to sell this kitten spec with you need to chose a specific GM trait that competes with the only dps focused trait in the line?

From PvP perspective:

Dueling/Illusion/Mirage might be an interesting choice. I really hope we can finally play w/o inspiration due to the new GM trait that breaks stun and remove conditions.

Infinite Horizon might be the more flavorful trait but is probably too gimicky to see real use.

Levetty.1279:

Aluren.1896:

Minor Trait: Speed of Sand:
Gain Superspeed (3/4 second) when you gain Mirage Cloak.

kittenty band aid fix to the kittenty gimmick they are forcing with this kittenty spec.

Aluren.1896:

Third Column of Major Traits-

1. Infinite Horizon
When you gain Mirage Cloak, the trait is also applied to all of your illusions.

Wait so to use the kittenty gimmick that they are trying to sell this kitten spec with you need to chose a specific GM trait that competes with the only dps focused trait in the line?

It looks like the Infinite Horizon just adds the evadeframes from hitting dodge to your clones, not that they don’t ambush, but I’m not sure…

I’d prefer Speed of Sand to be worked into our elite spec trait. Because the elite spec trait kind of takes away that small movement speed bonus anyway. Might as well give it back in a diffirent form in the same trait.

Infinite Horizon should be the minor. It seems too core for Mirage for it to be a choice you have to make. Both Dune Cloak & Infinite Horizon seem fine for damage though. Which trait that gets chosen will just depend on which one does most damage in the end.
At least thats how it feels like to me.

“2. Elusive Mind
Dodging breaks stun and removes conditions.
• Conditions removed: 1
• Breaks Stun”

Holy kitten that’s OP. That’s honestly more powerful than Daredevil’s Bounding Dodger.

Incoming Inspiration, Illusion, Mirages. High regen uptime, constant stunbreaks, incredible mobility, powerful against conditions, applies massive amounts confusion and torment on top of plenty of bleeding and other conditions. GG anet. You manage to make the next elite spec more powerful than the current specs.

Zintrothen.1056:

“2. Elusive Mind
Dodging breaks stun and removes conditions.
• Conditions removed: 1
• Breaks Stun”

Holy kitten that’s OP. That’s honestly more powerful than Daredevil’s Bounding Dodger.

Incoming Inspiration, Illusion, Mirages. High regen uptime, constant stunbreaks, incredible mobility, powerful against conditions, applies massive amounts confusion and torment on top of plenty of bleeding and other conditions. GG anet. You manage to make the next elite spec more powerful than the current specs.

In a vacuum, the trait looks OP.

However, you compare to chronomancer. You lose out chronophantasm and illusionary reversion. Mesmer shatter, especially shatter for conditions rely heavily on illusion generation rather than shatter CD. You will lose out a lot of condition pressure by not picking chronomancer.

Also not being able to shatter as often will make shatter on cleanse, shatter for phantasm recharge(also the loss of double phantasm by shield) less powerful as well.

Just by looking at everything mirage offers. I don’t see inspiration/illusion/mirage stronger than inspiration/illusion/chrono.

However, I do see potential in dueling/illusion/mirage as it will offer crazy damage potential. Dueling offers dodge for clones which has great synergy with mirage which heavily emphasizes on dodging. That way, you will lose the crazy good condition cleansing from inspiration. So it remains to be seen if the trade off is worth it.

Exciton.8942:

Zintrothen.1056:

“2. Elusive Mind
Dodging breaks stun and removes conditions.
• Conditions removed: 1
• Breaks Stun”

Holy kitten that’s OP. That’s honestly more powerful than Daredevil’s Bounding Dodger.

Incoming Inspiration, Illusion, Mirages. High regen uptime, constant stunbreaks, incredible mobility, powerful against conditions, applies massive amounts confusion and torment on top of plenty of bleeding and other conditions. GG anet. You manage to make the next elite spec more powerful than the current specs.

In a vacuum, the trait looks OP.

However, you compare to chronomancer. You lose out chronophantasm and illusionary reversion. Mesmer shatter, especially shatter for conditions rely heavily on illusion generation rather than shatter CD. You will lose out a lot of condition pressure by not picking chronomancer.

Also not being able to shatter as often will make shatter on cleanse, shatter for phantasm recharge(also the loss of double phantasm by shield) less powerful as well.

Just by looking at everything mirage offers. I don’t see inspiration/illusion/mirage stronger than inspiration/illusion/chrono.

However, I do see potential in dueling/illusion/mirage as it will offer crazy damage potential. Dueling offers dodge for clones which has great synergy with mirage which heavily emphasizes on dodging. That way, you will lose the crazy good condition cleansing from inspiration. So it remains to be seen if the trade off is worth it.

Good points. The nature of clone bursts with Mirage almost demands bleed on crits (many rapid attacks from many sources), so you are sacrificing a lot of potential damage by not going dueling.

On top of that, when you lose chrono you are losing the double down on critical skills at critical times. I have a few ideas to test once I get my hands on it but I can see chrono outperforming in some ways, and Mirage outperforming in other ways.

I’m particularly interested in trying out the new dodge mechanic as it sounds on paper to be far superior to any other dodge.

Exciton.8942:

Zintrothen.1056:

“2. Elusive Mind
Dodging breaks stun and removes conditions.
• Conditions removed: 1
• Breaks Stun”

Holy kitten that’s OP. That’s honestly more powerful than Daredevil’s Bounding Dodger.

Incoming Inspiration, Illusion, Mirages. High regen uptime, constant stunbreaks, incredible mobility, powerful against conditions, applies massive amounts confusion and torment on top of plenty of bleeding and other conditions. GG anet. You manage to make the next elite spec more powerful than the current specs.

In a vacuum, the trait looks OP.

However, you compare to chronomancer. You lose out chronophantasm and illusionary reversion. Mesmer shatter, especially shatter for conditions rely heavily on illusion generation rather than shatter CD. You will lose out a lot of condition pressure by not picking chronomancer.

Also not being able to shatter as often will make shatter on cleanse, shatter for phantasm recharge(also the loss of double phantasm by shield) less powerful as well.

Just by looking at everything mirage offers. I don’t see inspiration/illusion/mirage stronger than inspiration/illusion/chrono.

However, I do see potential in dueling/illusion/mirage as it will offer crazy damage potential. Dueling offers dodge for clones which has great synergy with mirage which heavily emphasizes on dodging. That way, you will lose the crazy good condition cleansing from inspiration. So it remains to be seen if the trade off is worth it.

Yeah I agree with all of this.

Restorative Illusions won’t be as crazy with Mirage because of losing alacrity (so longer shatter cooldowns) as well as losing fast illusion generation (again supplemented by alacrity plus chronophantasma) so you really won’t want to be spamming shatters like you do on Chrono, or even wasting them for heals and cleanse, but rather timing them appropriately after initiating an ambush for burst condi application and damage.

Duelling/Illusions/Mirage definitely looks like the way to go due to DE synergy among other things

Maybe the stunbreak on dodge will be nerfed as I can see it being annoying. But the condi cleanse on dodge should be perfectly fine as there won’t be much access to cleanse outside of Inspiration.

I’m definitely going to be using Energy/Cleansing sigils for Mirage.

Drop axe, take Self Deception, Mirage Mantle, Elusive Mind. Sword Ambush for high (25?) vuln stacks if “spam first AA” is the trend of Ambushes. Use the new shadowstep instead of Blink probably(I didn’t catch the range/cd on it), but otherwise play classic Power.

End result, burn dodges for superspeed through a map, or to break stuns.

I couldn’t care less whether this is condi focused or not… my disappointment is in that once again there’s almost no interesting things to actually play with, and it doesn’t really shake our builds up. There’s no new playstyle, no new positions to occupy, and we’re still going to be running chrono in group content. This is a pvp+solo pve spec and nothing more.

Watching the WP video again, I didn’t initially notice that Axe 2 has the charge mechanic of what should be the new Mantras – seems to have 2 charges that recharge over time which is nice.

I compiled this info myself last night, didn’t have time to post before work though. Using the same source as OP, plus another source. Which provides further details on key skills, needed to get anywhere near a full picture of the Mirage spec. I’ll add my share, and then the OP might copy it & edit the original post for a neat overview.

FYI, Path of Fire introduces Grieving stats: Power, Condi, precision, ferocity.

CHANGES TO OP:

Major Adept, Renewing Oasis. It specifically mentions “Bleeding, Burning, Confusion, Torment”, so not -20% from all conditions. There’s no mention if -20% procs from all Regen boon applications, or just the skill’s application of it with Mirage Cloak.

Axe Chain 3, Mirror Strikes.
Damage: (2x) 356

Ambush Staff, Chaos Vortex.
Damage: 216

ADDITIONS:
Both sources use the same gear setup, only very minor changes in the videos:
Power 1000 Toughness 1000 Vitality 1560 Precision 2050 Ferocity 0 Condition Damage 1225 Expertise 560 Concentration 0 Agony Resist 0 Mirage Elite 18% Armor 1888 Health 21522 Crit Chance 54,00% Crit Damage 150% Healing Power 0 Condition Duration 52,33% Boon Duration 0%

Without the power coefficient of the new skills it might be hard to calculate the final power dmg value. The final value is most likely to change until release anyway. Both sources use exotic weapons. (For calculation purposes.)

Flat (base) condition durations of skills are likely ~half the listed value. Confusion duration is affected by Master of Misdirection trait, +33%.

Ambush skill: Scepter, Ether Barrage 1,5s C 1s R

Ambush. Blink back a short distance and launch a barrage of chaos orbs at your foe, inflicting either confusion or torment each hit. Condition duration halved for clones.

Damage: (5x) 710
Confusion: 1 stack (7,5s)
Torment: 1 stack (6s)
Shadowstep Distance: 200
Range: 1200

Utility Skill: Crystal Sands (targeted) (not in water) 0.25s C 20s R

Deception. Draw in shards of crystal sand that confuse foes they pass through on their way to your targeted location. The shards form a Mirrage Mirror upon reching their destination.

Damage: (6x) 636
Confusion: 1 stack (duration?)
Range: 900

Utility skill: Sand Through Glass 30s R
Deception. Evade backward and leave behind a mirage mirror.

Distance: 300
Evade: 0,5s
Breaks Stun
*Probably more to it than that, range etc. But the tooltip is obscured.

Utility skill: Mantra of Resolve 2.25s C 12s R
Same+Added… Gain resistance when this skill is fully charged.
Resistance: 2s

Power Cleanse 1s R
Conditions Removed: 3
Number of Targets: 5
Maximum Count: 2
Count Recharge: 24 seconds
Radius: 240
*The rest of the tooltip was blocked. Wasn’t able to see range etc.

Heal skill: False Oasis (not in water) 0.5s C 30s R
Deception. Create a mirage at your current location and heal over time. When the mirage expires, it spaws a mirage mirror.

Healing: 1620
Vigor: (5s) 150 Condition Damage*, 50% Endurance Regeneration
Pulses: 5
Mirage Duration: 3 s
Interval: 1 s
*See: Nomad’s Endurance

ELITE skill: Jaunt (not in water) 0.5s R
Deception. Shadowstep to a target location and confuse nearby foes.

Damage: 266
Confusion: 3 stacks (7.5s)
Conditions Removed: 1
Maximum Count: 3
Count Recharge: 20 seconds
Radius: 180
Combo Finisher: Leap
*The rest of the tooltip was blocked. Wasn’t able to see range etc.

Oh, and this. Don’t know where it popped up…

Mirage Mirror (targeted)
Creates a mirror at target location. Touching the mirror shatters it, granting Mirage Cloak to you and weakening foes.

Damage: 80
Weakness: (6s)
Mirage Cloak: (1s)
Number of Targets: 5
Radius: 180

Sorry for the bad formatting but all in all when you look at the actual mechanics of the new elite spec, I’m quite pleased with what I’m seeing! Hope it helps!

Jaunt: A short trip for pleasure..

Hey!

I just wanted to say that I was wrong and he did mouse over the heal and one of the utilities but it was a fraction of a second at 2:09:32. I’ll update the main post. He might have also moused over a second utility but I’ll have time to watch the video again later tonight.

Also great catches on the utility skills! I’ll definitely edit it and credit you later tonight AresFyra.3570!

@Aluren.1896 You weren’t wrong, they’re just hard to catch! But I’m quite confident that I caught them all. Would love to be proven wrong though.. I’ll hold you to the edit!

Make it neat, and shiny..

My understanding of the Mirage spec is the following: I haven’t played GW2 in a while, but I’ve been playing Mesmer since Beta. The mirage mirrors seems to be a throwback to clone deaths, only stationary. I wonder if the mirror output and the new dodge not! mechanic will be enough to stay in melee, and survive there.. From my point of view, a reliable source of Weakness is very welcomed. Not to mention the Elite!

FYI.. Clones perform Ambush skills too! Can’t wait to see the Ambush skills for the other weapon sets. I’m liking the ones I’ve seen so far.. Will the new axe mechanics impact the focus offhand for example? New descriptions mention phantasmal axes and I’m pretty sure Focus 5 does that too.. Not a major thing but still worth to note.

The traits look good atm.. Some of them have real synergy with existing traitlines and my own personal playstyle. I’ve never been too fond of the Chrono spec, although it has its strengths.. But I believe that the amount of balancing required due to “the potential uses” of CShift/CSplit just isn’t worth it. I’d like to see that changed to an elite skill called Arcane Mimic that echoes utility skills, and have Mimic changed to echo a weapon skill of choice. Just a suggestion..! (In honor of Arcane Echo/Echo..)

Second source btw: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nqj-yOPEudA

Good night for now!

/A4

The new heal skill seems pretty decent. It heals 1620*5=8100 for every 30 sec. The cast time of 1/2 sec is not bad either. The extra vigor provides good synergy with mirage.

The new elite also seems strong. Being able to teleport and remove 1 condition every 20 sec is quite good. It is interesting to see what the port range is. I think it will probably be relatively short.

Our old elites are pretty trash, at least from PvP perspective. I don’t see myself taking moa/mass invis/time warp with their current CD. Both moa and time warp needs CD reduction for PvP.

Grieving stats makes for some digusting glassy hybrid shatter. Holy cow that’s going to be hilarious to use.

Zintrothen.1056:

applies massive amounts confusion and torment on top of plenty of bleeding and other conditions

Weeeell. “Massive” amounts of confusion and torment (and bleeding) without Illusions or Dueling. Uh huh.

I have a feeling you had 4-5 spec lines taken when you thought of it.

CrashTheGrey.1492:

Grieving stats makes for some digusting glassy hybrid shatter. Holy cow that’s going to be hilarious to use.

Condition damage doesn’t work that well with super glassy specs.

You already have things like sinister, viper, destroyer amulets in PvP but no one is playing them seriously.

Kadj.6725:

This is a pvp+solo pve spec and nothing more.

Building up Phantasms to kill things in solo PvE is already pretty terrible, swapping the direct damage of Phantasms for PvP focused conditions isn’t going to make it better.

Ugh sorry that the edits are taking so long, running into the message body length limit.

Here is the updated mantra that definitely wont fit in the first post.

Updated Mantra of Resolve (2.5s cast, 12s cd)
Same as original and Gain resistance when this skill is fully charged.
• Resistance: 2s
• Number of Casts: 2
Power Cleanse (1s cd)
• Conditions removed: 3
• Number of Targets: 5
• Maximum Count: 2
• Count Recharge: 24s
• Radius: 240

Ambush Skills:
Staff Ambush: Chaos Vortex (1s cast, 1s cd)
Ambush. Release a vortex of chaos energy that inflicts conditions on foes and grant
boons to allies.
• Dmg: 216
• Confusion( 2 stacks, 9.25s): 290 Dmg on Skill use, 1175 Dmg
• Torment (2 stacks, 7.5s): 1288 Dmg, 1288 if moving (Typo)
• Fury (3s)
• Might (3 stacks for 8s)
Axe Ambush: Imaginary Axes (.5s cast, 1s cd)
Ambush: Release phantasmal axes that seek out the nearest target after a short delay.
• Dmg (2x) :214
• Seek Range: 400
• Confusion (1 stack, 7.5s): 127 Dmg on Skill Use, 392 Dmg
• Range 200
Scepter Ambush: Ether Barrage (1.5s cast, 1s cd)
Ambush. Blink back a short distance and launch a barrage of chaos orbs at your foe, inflicting either confusion or torment each hit. Condition duration halved for clones.
• Dmg: (5x) 710
• Confusion: 1 stack 7.5s
• Torment: 1 stack 6s
• Shadowstep Distance: 200
• Range: 1200

Levetty.1279:

Building up Phantasms to kill things in solo PvE is already pretty terrible, swapping the direct damage of Phantasms for PvP focused conditions isn’t going to make it better.

We’re back to Deceptive Evasion. Enter combat, axe 2, dodge, jaunt(procs +clone trait), axe 3, ambush, Cry of Frustration. We’d lose moa for it, but gain a large three-skill burst that leaves an entire weapon set and two phantasms off cooldown open for abuse whether the enemy survives the burst or not. (also jaunt is optional I guess, but I’m under the assumption we’ll still want portal/Sig of Illusions/blink and not some other Deception skill.)

There’s not any more buildup than we already need to set up, and I think you may have forgotten just how quickly core mesmer can pull enough clones out for burst with DE. This isn’t “clones are phantasms now”, this is “clones can pressure.” And the pressure is kept up if you use /pistol and you run those traits, etc.

Just saw this, axe 2 skilli has no cool down. Maybe it’s a mistake, but would be cool

Kadj.6725:

Levetty.1279:

Building up Phantasms to kill things in solo PvE is already pretty terrible, swapping the direct damage of Phantasms for PvP focused conditions isn’t going to make it better.

We’re back to Deceptive Evasion. Enter combat, axe 2, dodge, jaunt(procs +clone trait), axe 3, ambush, Cry of Frustration. We’d lose moa for it, but gain a large three-skill burst that leaves an entire weapon set and two phantasms off cooldown open for abuse whether the enemy survives the burst or not. (also jaunt is optional I guess, but I’m under the assumption we’ll still want portal/Sig of Illusions/blink and not some other Deception skill.)

There’s not any more buildup than we already need to set up, and I think you may have forgotten just how quickly core mesmer can pull enough clones out for burst with DE. This isn’t “clones are phantasms now”, this is “clones can pressure.” And the pressure is kept up if you use /pistol and you run those traits, etc.

No, its setting up clones as if they were Phantasms to do the damage, anybody who plays open world PvE can see this spec is kitten. Its a gimmicky PvP only spec.

pico.6402:

Just saw this, axe 2 skilli has no cool down. Maybe it’s a mistake, but would be cool

2 charges, you regain them with 8s cd.

FJSAMA.2867:

pico.6402:

Just saw this, axe 2 skilli has no cool down. Maybe it’s a mistake, but would be cool

2 charges, you regain them with 8s cd.

Oh, was bot sure what it os when I read that. Tnx

Exciton.8942:

CrashTheGrey.1492:

Grieving stats makes for some digusting glassy hybrid shatter. Holy cow that’s going to be hilarious to use.

Condition damage doesn’t work that well with super glassy specs.

You already have things like sinister, viper, destroyer amulets in PvP but no one is playing them seriously.

Having really decent crits while simultaneously stacking condi in something like wvw while abusing stealth is pretty strong. While I wouldn’t advise running 12 pieces of Grieving, the stats it provides gives hybrid builds some really nasty options.

kitten sPvP, the only thing to use there is condi chrono anyways.

Personally I feel like this is going to buff the condi build for raiding at least. Will most likely go axe/torch and scepter/pistol. If phantasms use ambush skills will still be the same goal of placing 3 pistol phants on a boss they will just have more damage, while we cycle between scepter and axe AA and big moves.

The main thing will be having decent damage if we need to swap targets seeing how clones can actually deal nice damage with ambush skills. It won’t be hard to summon 3 clones in a short amount of time or 2 since we can just throw on torch phant.

Levetty.1279:

No, its setting up clones as if they were Phantasms to do the damage, anybody who plays open world PvE can see this spec is kitten. Its a gimmicky PvP only spec.

I am pretty certain that Mirage will be really strong at Open World PvE.
You’ll be perma evading and spamming ambushes all over the place.
(Hint: Sigil of Stamina winkyface )

Ambushes so far are confusion and torment base, crap in PvE. If sword and GS have power ambushes it still won’t help for the same reason Mind Wrack doesn’t make Mesmer good in open world pve. Illusions don’t work well against easily killed mobs and once you have done your big attack, now what? The rest of your skills are kitten.

People keep saying Mirage will be able to evade all over the place but I don’t see how. We already have vigor on shatter in Chaos and Dueling used to give perma vigor, and Mesmer can use Sigils, you’ve never seen Mesmers evading all over the place.

Levetty.1279:

Ambushes so far are confusion and torment base, crap in PvE.

Let’s say torment and confusion damage is crap in PvE, ok. How does condi rev deal a lot of damage via torment if that’s the case? Numbers of stacks. Oh guess what, we just got the option for 20 stacks of these conditions on a single skill not including sharper images.
So let’s say we do 2 ambushes with 3 scepter clones. – since it’s 50/50 we’ll get 20 stacks of torment and 20 stacks of confusion. Additionally we’ll get about 15 stacks of bleeding (considering you’ve got 50% crit chance). How’s that crap for open world?

Illusions don’t work well against easily killed mobs and once you have done your big attack, now what? The rest of your skills are kitten.

We just got a tool to retarget Illusions… Read Axe 3 again

People keep saying Mirage will be able to evade all over the place but I don’t see how. We already have vigor on shatter in Chaos and Dueling used to give perma vigor, and Mesmer can use Sigils, you’ve never seen Mesmers evading all over the place.

I guess you don’t understand what I am saying.
I’m almost certain that even in PvE 2 ambushes like that are potent enough to kill a mob. Sigil of Stamina refreshes your Endurance on every kill to 100%. That’s how you’re evading all over the place.
Evade+Ambush->Evade+Ambush=Kill->Evade+Ambush->Evade+Ambush…
Sure this will be different for Bosses but we’re talking about open world aren’t we? most mobs will die rather quickly if you stick to offensive gear.

Yeah it’s not like Mirage gets 3 dodges or skills that recharge endurance. Just some Vigor options from their heal and a minor trait I think.
However mesmer will be able to spawn some mirrors that grant mirage cloak as well.
Not sure how many skills that’s on but there’s a trait that gives illusions a chance of spawning them when they get shattered.

Me Games Ma.8426:

Levetty.1279:

Ambushes so far are confusion and torment base, crap in PvE.

Let’s say torment and confusion damage is crap in PvE, ok. How does condi rev deal a lot of damage via torment if that’s the case?

It also inflicts burning and poison, does it in an AoE and has decent power scaling on those skills. Has a trait that increases torment damage, among other damage modifiers.

Me Games Ma.8426:

How’s that crap for open world?

Single Target, Confusion and Torment, illusion based.

Me Games Ma.8426:

We just got a tool to retarget Illusions… Read Axe 3 again

Now you are just trolling. Axe is terrible with no damage, retargeting your 3 axe clones isn’t going to be worth bringing that kitten.

Fair enough on the sigil of Stamina though.

I just told you to read axe 3…
It says that it teleports your axe clones to you. The next sentence doesn’t even mention axe clones. It says:
“This attack breaks enemy targeting and your illusions change focus to the targeted foe. "

Topic “illusion based”: imagine we’re dodging the whole time so do our clones. Also we can grab deceptive evasion if generation would be a problem.

Added: since 2 duelist attacks are ebough to kill most pve mobs i guess that 40 condies (even torment and confusion) +15 bleeds should be enough for the same damage.

Axe is terrible damage and its ambush attack looks worse then its auto attack, so Axe clones are going to be useless. If we have Axe in our main hand and aren’t using axe clones then we are back to spending minutes setting up our phantasms again which 6 years of the game has showed us just doesn’t work.

Levetty.1279:

Axe is terrible damage and its ambush attack looks worse then its auto attack, so Axe clones are going to be useless. If we have Axe in our main hand and aren’t using axe clones then we are back to spending minutes setting up our phantasms again which 6 years of the game has showed us just doesn’t work.

The amount of panic about your displeasure without even playing the new spec is baffling to me. Calm down, play it in a week. That being said not every new tree is going to make everyone happy. Get over it.

Trigr.6481:

Levetty.1279:

Axe is terrible damage and its ambush attack looks worse then its auto attack, so Axe clones are going to be useless. If we have Axe in our main hand and aren’t using axe clones then we are back to spending minutes setting up our phantasms again which 6 years of the game has showed us just doesn’t work.

The amount of panic about your displeasure without even playing the new spec is baffling to me. Calm down, play it in a week. That being said not every new tree is going to make everyone happy. Get over it.

We know the mechanics, we have had 6 years of experience in the game to know these mechanics don’t work, we know the damage numbers and condi durations, we don’t need to play them to compare them to what is in this game.

Not every spec is going to please everybody but being usable should be a bare minimum of what to expect out of an elite spec.

Levetty.1279:

Trigr.6481:

Levetty.1279:

Axe is terrible damage and its ambush attack looks worse then its auto attack, so Axe clones are going to be useless. If we have Axe in our main hand and aren’t using axe clones then we are back to spending minutes setting up our phantasms again which 6 years of the game has showed us just doesn’t work.

The amount of panic about your displeasure without even playing the new spec is baffling to me. Calm down, play it in a week. That being said not every new tree is going to make everyone happy. Get over it.

We know the mechanics, we have had 6 years of experience in the game to know these mechanics don’t work, we know the damage numbers and condi durations, we don’t need to play them to compare them to what is in this game.

Not every spec is going to please everybody but being usable should be a bare minimum of what to expect out of an elite spec.

Granted you haven’t tested every single amulet, tree, weapon, and sigil combination with the new tree. You’re just looking for a reason to be angry because the new trait line doesn’t appear to specifically suit your needs, go cry somewhere else until you have a real argument to go off of.