Guild Wars 2

Neverwinter Rogue?

Nope quitting. Anet has made balancing mistakes time and time again, and I’ve had to change my build countless amount of times and regear, this is the “final straw”. Prob going to go play LoL/Crysis until ESO is out. Have fun I guess.

I’m actually starting to level the mesmer myself. Of course, I’m leveling and making it as a condition mesmer first and foremost, so a lot of the nerfs to the mesmer aren’t really nerfs to me.

Blood Red Arachnid.2493:

I’m actually starting to level the mesmer myself. Of course, I’m leveling and making it as a condition mesmer first and foremost, so a lot of the nerfs to the mesmer aren’t really nerfs to me.

Thats because the condition mesmer nerfs came a while ago. ^^

no.
too much invested in gear weapon skins……..but more importantly i’m a shatter build, so only sword2/focus4 took a noticeable hit (and to be fair, sword 2 was OP…..though they should’ve just kept the CD the same).

will drop focus in wvw……and try some different shatter specs.

now…..when the nerf shatter next patch, then it will probably be back to guardian or necro for me.

Hexxen.7216:

Nope. I have no other lvl 80 job and even if I did all my ascended gear is on my Mesmer. Even if Arale doesn’t agree the changes they made particularly, the iC movement and the Vengful Retaliation nerf have broken the three builds I ran for PvE,PvP and WvW. They seriously took everything from me. I am just going to quit probably.

True that bro! My entire build was revolved around vengeful images. I spent 50 gold last week to spec for it and now all my gear is useless to me… Now I am spending even more gold trying to find another build I enjoy playing…. So much frustration. All the other changes to the game are ok by me, but I want this one trait turned back

(I jokingly reported the vengeful images nurf as a bug), Idk, maybe if enough people complain about it, they will change it back. Too bad we cant vote on what they change. It just seriously kitten es me off that every time I find an enjoyable build that isn’t squish, they change things around and **** everyone over- This is exactly what happened to SWTOR, and why it failed so hard…!!! ANET is better than this. Get it right!!!

I’d go back to my Axe warrior but they screwed with its DMG so I have to hit all 3 times in a row to compete with the gs. Wishing I was an ele after today’s patch.

Hexxen.7216:

Even if Arale doesn’t agree the changes they made particularly, the iC movement and the Vengful Retaliation nerf have broken the three builds I ran for PvE,PvP and WvW.

I’m curious as to how.
Were you running a… Phantasm-shattering Sword/Sword Sword/Sword build?

The Vengful Retaliation nerf killed the Immortal Build and my Retaliation Phantasm (WvW and PvP) the move of the iC didnt KILL persay but severely sucked up my PvE Phantasm.

Considering just how much more health the Phantasms have in PvE now, do you really mind the CD that much? I only notice it at all on fast-dying trash mobs. :P

The main issue that arises here is that they decided to make shattered conditions a very good party support trait. The need to shatter collides with the need to keep the phantasms up by default. A lot of mesmers, myself included, have been looking forward to this change. However pushing iCelerity makes you doubt whether you will want to shatter or not. I think that is one of the main reasons for dissatisfaction, at least for my part.

Carighan.6758:

Considering just how much more health the Phantasms have in PvE now, do you really mind the CD that much? I only notice it at all on fast-dying trash mobs. :P

They did increase the health but in high level fractals where taking anything but berserker gear is pretty much pointless they will still get one shoted or killed super fast and thus the CD is more important than the 270% health increase.

lol
You gotta love these threads.

Half you guys want to reroll because you have been brought more in line with other classes. You are still the best WvW class in the game, hands down.

Same skill level, same gear and mesmer wins, the only difference is that now bad mesmers can be killed by classes like Necro for instance.
I was in WvW today and yesterday and for the first time ever i can actualy kill mesmers that are worse players than me, the same or better players still beat me….. maybe i should go start a thread in the Necro section " we can still be beat by same better skilled players – are you gonna re-roll?"

LOL Grow up for chr!st sake

Hexxen.7216:

Nope. I have no other lvl 80 job and even if I did all my ascended gear is on my Mesmer. Even if Arale doesn’t agree the changes they made particularly, the iC movement and the Vengful Retaliation nerf have broken the three builds I ran for PvE,PvP and WvW. They seriously took everything from me. I am just going to quit probably.

vengful retaliation broke your three builds? pls do us a favor and quit.

ArcticRed.3068:

lol
You gotta love these threads.

Half you guys want to reroll because you have been brought more in line with other classes. You are still the best WvW class in the game, hands down.

Same skill level, same gear and mesmer wins, the only difference is that now bad mesmers can be killed by classes like Necro for instance.
I was in WvW today and yesterday and for the first time ever i can actualy kill mesmers that are worse players than me, the same or better players still beat me….. maybe i should go start a thread in the Necro section " we can still be beat by same better skilled players – are you gonna re-roll?"

LOL Grow up for chr!st sake

… how are you determining the skill level of your opponent?

I mean that seriously. It’s not like you can tell just by looking at them how skilled they are.

The point is that the class is now less fun to play. Not because it’s harder, but because you have these options:

1) Go cookie cutter shatter build
2) Have longer cooldown on lots of your skills. Less options during combat = less fun.

I expect to still lose to better players (and occasionally to worse ones) and to beat worse players (and occasionally better ones).

Rerolling is not a search for more victory, it’d be about making your leisure time less unfun.

Personally I’m going to try and find a build that works but it’s not unreasonable to be sad that a combat style you enjoy has been made a lot less enjoyable.

ArcticRed.3068:

You are still the best WvW class in the game, hands down.

Put down the crack pipe. Then you proceed to say that now mesmers can lose 1v1 vs necros… didn’t know being best WvW class was about 1v1s.

ManCaptain.3154:

ArcticRed.3068:

You are still the best WvW class in the game, hands down.

Put down the crack pipe. Then you proceed to say that now mesmers can lose 1v1 vs necros… didn’t know being best WvW class was about 1v1s.

Give me my crack pipe back, you are obviously using it otherwise you would have noticed that i said “same skill and gear, mesmer will win”

Go back to school and no late nights for a week young man!

I’m not re-rolling, I want a challenge, and besides the nerf was coming sooner or later. Besides mesmers should be hard to play.

Hyung.6140:

ArcticRed.3068:

lol
You gotta love these threads.

Half you guys want to reroll because you have been brought more in line with other classes. You are still the best WvW class in the game, hands down.

Same skill level, same gear and mesmer wins, the only difference is that now bad mesmers can be killed by classes like Necro for instance.
I was in WvW today and yesterday and for the first time ever i can actualy kill mesmers that are worse players than me, the same or better players still beat me….. maybe i should go start a thread in the Necro section " we can still be beat by same better skilled players – are you gonna re-roll?"

LOL Grow up for chr!st sake

… how are you determining the skill level of your opponent?

I mean that seriously. It’s not like you can tell just by looking at them how skilled they are.

The point is that the class is now less fun to play. Not because it’s harder, but because you have these options:

1) Go cookie cutter shatter build
2) Have longer cooldown on lots of your skills. Less options during combat = less fun.

I expect to still lose to better players (and occasionally to worse ones) and to beat worse players (and occasionally better ones).

Rerolling is not a search for more victory, it’d be about making your leisure time less unfun.

Personally I’m going to try and find a build that works but it’s not unreasonable to be sad that a combat style you enjoy has been made a lot less enjoyable.

I understand where you are coming from with “having to change builds” or “having to go cookie cutter build” But doesn’t everyone?

The fact remains, that all classes have to adapt to new changes. My Necro has 4 sets of Exotics…. reason – because builds change.
My Ranger has 3 sets of exotics… for the same reason as above. My SB got nerfed to the ground, guess what? Im gonna go buy me some axes and a LB and find a build that works.

Or i could go re-roll…..lmao

You still haven’t answered how you know the skill-level of your opponent.

Carighan.6758:

You still haven’t answered how you know the skill-level of your opponent.

Neither did he.
He asked me how i knew that the player was better or worse than me….
Then he went on to say, and i quote; I expect to still lose to better players (and occasionally to worse ones) and to beat worse players (and occasionally better ones).

So ill just say this, it is quite obvious when you are playing a skilled player by their reaction times, their correct use of CC breakers and CC tools. Their correct use of dodges and heals. The way they don’t use rotations but react to what is happening at the time. That my friend is how you can tell.

The fact that this needs explaining to you speaks volumes

blutstein.2468:

Hexxen.7216:

Nope. I have no other lvl 80 job and even if I did all my ascended gear is on my Mesmer. Even if Arale doesn’t agree the changes they made particularly, the iC movement and the Vengful Retaliation nerf have broken the three builds I ran for PvE,PvP and WvW. They seriously took everything from me. I am just going to quit probably.

vengful retaliation broke your three builds? pls do us a favor and quit.

Sorry? It broke two of my builds and they both relied heavily on my Phantasms having constant retal. You don’t think you are being harsh? Also, I will be quitting one FFXIV comes out.

Hexxen.7216:

blutstein.2468:

Hexxen.7216:

Nope. I have no other lvl 80 job and even if I did all my ascended gear is on my Mesmer. Even if Arale doesn’t agree the changes they made particularly, the iC movement and the Vengful Retaliation nerf have broken the three builds I ran for PvE,PvP and WvW. They seriously took everything from me. I am just going to quit probably.

vengful retaliation broke your three builds? pls do us a favor and quit.

Sorry? It broke two of my builds and they both relied heavily on my Phantasms having constant retal. You don’t think you are being harsh? Also, I will be quitting one FFXIV comes out.

so pls enlighten me, what two (oh really, one post earlier there were three) builds relie heavily on phantasm ret. Do you actually kill your foes with your praised ret.

sry man, this is ridiculous. Go play FF, but i can promise you, you have to adapt there to. Or move on to your next game. Good luck!

ArcticRed.3068:

Give me my crack pipe back, you are obviously using it otherwise you would have noticed that i said “same skill and gear, mesmer will win”

God you are dense. How is does winning 1v1 against necro make mesmer best WvW class?!?!?!

ArcticRed.3068:

Carighan.6758:

You still haven’t answered how you know the skill-level of your opponent.

Neither did he.
He asked me how i knew that the player was better or worse than me….
Then he went on to say, and i quote; I expect to still lose to better players (and occasionally to worse ones) and to beat worse players (and occasionally better ones).

So ill just say this, it is quite obvious when you are playing a skilled player by their reaction times, their correct use of CC breakers and CC tools. Their correct use of dodges and heals. The way they don’t use rotations but react to what is happening at the time. That my friend is how you can tell.

The fact that this needs explaining to you speaks volumes

The difference is that I wasn’t claiming to know the skill level of any individual opponent. I will win and lose a large number of fights, and of those I expect that sometimes I’ll have lost to poor players and sometimes I’ll have beaten better players.

You were claiming that you were losing specific 1v1s to “bad players” pre-patch and now that’s not happening any more.

So I was wondering how in the 20ish hours since the patch you’ve identified these bad players that used to beat you but you are now beating, and how you know it’s the patch that helped.

Obviously this only counts for phantasm mesmers since shatter spec is mostly unchanged. Were you losing a lot to phantasms? How did you try and counter it before, and how is that easier now? How do you know it’s because the mesmer nerfs have made the class ‘balanced’ and not because of the many buffs to necro we all know have happened too?

Of course I’d be even more interested to know how you know “same gear” is now more balanced. It’s impressive you can judge an opponent’s skill level so accurately during combat with all the factors that are included, but judging the rarity and stats of their gear is pretty godly. I’m guessing you take careful note of all the damage numbers you receive from each skill and do a reverse analysis in your head to figure out what gear they must be running? Really impressive stuff.

I get what you’re saying about looking at how players play (of course that’s how everybody judges their opponents) but it’s not like mesmer before was some faceroll easy burst class where you could get lucky and kill a better opponent, or just spam ‘2’ on enemies and get a reasonable amount of kills that way.

All the mesmer nerfed builds certainly took skill to execute previously, and now they’re harder to execute.

Glad that makes you happy, thanks for coming here and sharing!

PS I’m not claiming necros are op, or mesmers are up, or anything of the sort. It just seems like you can’t possibly have evidence that phantasm mesmers are still viable or that ‘same skill’ fights are balanced now, but that confirmation bias is leading you to think so because you’ve beaten a few mesmers since the patch.

Nope, I just uninstalled instead. Last several content updates have been utter trash, and this patch shows how the inmates truly are running the asylum.

My only thought is that 99% of anet must be working on an expansion, and the C team is handling the running of the game.

MakersMark.8420:

Nope, I just uninstalled instead. Last several content updates have been utter trash, and this patch shows how the inmates truly are running the asylum.

I love comments such as these, especially if you consider what a completely psychotic feedback we give as the playerbase.

We complain and complain and complain how the story content is too easy. Here’s Aetherblade Retreat, and now the Zerker Groups are going apekitten because the content punishes you if you run full-damage setups while being nice&relaxed with more defensive groups and some less commonly used abilities (like the rezz abilities).

How’s that to the devs? Do we want more difficult content promoting non-zerker builds now? Or not? Hrm?

Likewise we want PvP balance, but if we get nerfed, it’s bad.
Sure, don’t reduce the CD, but really how’d that work? Reduce duration to two swishes and 1s instead? I’d hate that, would feel really weak then.

We can’t constantly tell the devs what to do, then be upset when they listen. We asked for PvE content which is more difficult in glass cannon setups, we got it now. We’re upset. We asked for higher base health on Illusions and a fix on Signet of Illusions, we got it now. We’re upset, because we expected free buffs instead of losing Signet power (which is a good thing, makes the signet non-obligatory for Phantasm-specs!) and Phantasm-CD.

How does this make any sense? My character feels plenty powerful after the patch. And between the nerfs to sword and the – albeit slight – buff to Scepter, those two are actually growing closer together. Just need that kitten #1 on Scepter to be less slow!
But really, who would you have do the balancing? The players? Look around, none of us has the slightest chance at not running it into the wall within a month.

Sure the devs make a ton of mistakes, especially their QA needs a lot of work.
But overall they listen to feedback, if on a 2-3 months delay. But for example the new dungeon? I predict that’s the only one we’ll see. The CoF groups are going berserk, and they don’t like being told they can no longer #2 through everything. :P

so few players complain that the game is too easy or that they want morevertical progression…they are obviously players who bought the wrong game and want to play another WoW…

Anet hears them fast and proceed doing what they want…answering to their comlaints on the forum

Then few pvp players complains and Anet answer them.

THOUSANDS of players complains about PvE balance and vertical progression…..
Ignore them they are only whiners!!!

They will have lot of people quit once again for many reason…
How long will takes to them to realize that if any patch they do they lose ACTIVE players they are doing something wrong?
They get back for few days some of the inactive…..maybe so they didn t notice yet….

Why didn t we have a SINGLE feedback on PvE /balance that is a catastrophe?

Well that is true, they need to stop listening to sPvP so incredibly much. sPvP is an incredibly super-specialized game-type, subverting or ignoring many staple components of RPGs, and as a result, of GW2 as a whole (being a RPG :P ).

Ofc the problem is that coming from GW1, they have a sizeable ‘eSports’ ( ’ used on purpose…) community who are upset that the game isn’t – or wasn’t – centred around the smallscale group combat.

Really though, enough balancing was done for PvE purposes, but overall I also think enough was done for sPvP. Cut the sPvP balancing (temporarily!), it had it’s say. Now focus 4-5 patches on PvE and WvW balance IMO.

Portal and Veil still have prohibitively long CDs, despite being really marginal skills in PvE. That should not be, they need to be stronger, and they need to be on 20-kitten CDs at most.
Yes yes, incredibly unfair for PvP, but like I said, PvP had it’s say IMO, it was heard and resulted in changes, now it’s time for some PvE-warranted changes. Like, making abilities usable!

I have 5 level 80s and working slowly on leveling the ele, ranger and engineer.
However my main is a Mesmer and will always be.

I’m always confused as hell, when people reroll or switch their main to another profession.

It just shows that you don’t cope with change and are easily demoralized.

Stick with the class you choose and work to make it better.

As others said, its funny when a patch comes in and people rage and quit and go to other games. And once those games get patched they quit them and come back to GW2.

It’s the eternal FOTM-Train, Nadeen. Every game has it. It also has a nice confirmation bias, because people go “It’s always my class getting the PvP nerfbat! ;_;”.
Well yes, duh, if you keep going to the currently considered-overpowered PvP class, sure it will be!

Carighan.6758:

It’s the eternal FOTM-Train, Nadeen. Every game has it. It also has a nice confirmation bias, because people go “It’s always my class getting the PvP nerfbat! ;_;”.
Well yes, duh, if you keep going to the currently considered-overpowered PvP class, sure it will be!

I think I said this to you earlier today but there a lot of people who have played exclusively (or almost exclusively) mesmer who are upset with these changes.

In fact I’ve seen far more of them complaining than I have of any FotM class-switchers!

Generally when we’ve talked about these changes we have tended to agree on the substance but disagree on whether or not we like them, so I’m not bashing you, but I don’t think you should tar all the people who don’t like it as class hoppers.

osif.8673:

I’m staying a Mesmer. It feels a little clunky getting used to the longer CDs, but overall I’m liking my new phantasm staff/GS build and have no problems with similar 1v1s, 1vXs that I had before the patch. Plus phantasms are now much more viable in a group than they used to be. Not saying it’s better than shatter, but phantasm speccs never were when talking about a group setting.

I’m also running this, and I have to be honest, getting used to longer cooldowns is weird, but overall I feel pretty similar to how I did pre-patch. I just swapped out sword/sword for greatsword.

I honestly can’t remember the last time I used a Greatsword in WvW. I do feel that my phantasm build is a little more useful in groups now that I have an AoE phantasm and the possibility of spreading might (before the patch I just went shatter when in groups).

And just this morning I won multiple 1vX fights, so not all is lost. Phantasm is just fine, albeit a bit “slower”

Hyung.6140:

Generally when we’ve talked about these changes we have tended to agree on the substance but disagree on whether or not we like them, so I’m not bashing you, but I don’t think you should tar all the people who don’t like it as class hoppers.

No, I wasn’t trying to imply that.
It was more about the problem of players who said “I was playing class X, they nerfed it, so I switched to (then strongest) class Y, now they nerf it again!”. A sadly rather common concept in MMOs, but not unusual because when you decide to reroll, usually you do tend to at least take a look at the currently strongest class – underdog players excepted ofc.

It always surprises me that people get annoyed at players who play fotm builds and reroll to something better when it is overnerfed.
Part of being good at a game is being able to recognize what your best options are. You don’t get a prize for winning, a prize for playing a bad build but losing, a prize for playing a weak class and a prize for sticking with your overnerfed class when there are better options available to you.

I don’t see many footballers playing with ballet shoes or tennis players wielding miniature rackets because they want a challenge or because they prefer it.

No, people play to win. Not only are those people usually better players naturally due to the mindset, they also gain experience every time they follow the trends. And chances are they will beat players who sneer at rerollers regardless of what class they play anyway.

If you find winning fun, play to win.

Oh, don’t get me wrong, playing to win is mighty fine. But it’s only ok as long as such a player expects to get harshly nerfed in short~medium order and then having to reroll again. Because such is the nature of what they do.

Already started working on my Warrior as of the confusion nerf, feeling more positive about shelving the mesmer for a while now

Well, given that one-hand sword is less than useful and I am working to my legendary scepter, I guess I’ll see what happens.

curtegg.5216:

Well, given that one-hand sword is less than useful and I am working to my legendary scepter, I guess I’ll see what happens.

The sword is still incredibly useful. The nerf was harsh, but let’s be reasonable here, it’s still a great weapon.

Not gonna reroll, its too enjoyable to be part of mesmer community. Much to learn and much to discover.

blutstein.2468:

Hexxen.7216:

blutstein.2468:

Hexxen.7216:

Nope. I have no other lvl 80 job and even if I did all my ascended gear is on my Mesmer. Even if Arale doesn’t agree the changes they made particularly, the iC movement and the Vengful Retaliation nerf have broken the three builds I ran for PvE,PvP and WvW. They seriously took everything from me. I am just going to quit probably.

vengful retaliation broke your three builds? pls do us a favor and quit.

Sorry? It broke two of my builds and they both relied heavily on my Phantasms having constant retal. You don’t think you are being harsh? Also, I will be quitting one FFXIV comes out.

so pls enlighten me, what two (oh really, one post earlier there were three) builds relie heavily on phantasm ret. Do you actually kill your foes with your praised ret.

sry man, this is ridiculous. Go play FF, but i can promise you, you have to adapt there to. Or move on to your next game. Good luck!

Yes, I did kill people with it actually. I am sorry you never experienced the awesomeness of hitting your opponent with 4 sources or about 400 damage retaliation. One of the most popular builds uses the trait as a key factor. Do you read anything on these forums actually or just bash people? Also, iC is what “killed” the other build thus the PATCH killed three builds if you read properly I never said all three builds were killed by vengful but thanks for being a so nice about it. ^^