Guild Wars 2

im sure people have fallen in/out of love with these two but a tweak i would love to see is:

Beserkers being immobile like the wardens currently are and using 100b. Perhaps that would be overly OP and i can understand that people like beserker as is right now cause it cripples and carries itself out of melee range so it isnt 1hit killed by any aoe melee attack. i just think GS on any class should be dps and i do love the wardens aoe effect. I actually wish that was the GS skill but not much point swapping them now that game is launched.

Warden should move. Maybe it should be immobile while not attacking but once its whirling axe starts up it should attempt to move towards its target. If its close enough it would atleast catch the foe some of the time. I mean, arnt all the whirling attacks mobile already even if at a reduced rate like guardians whirling wrath?

Just feel that these two skills should swap their basic effects, beserker = immobile hard aoe hitter and warden = whirling axe with some limited mobility and possibly take beserkers cripple and toss it on here to keep foes in range of warden better.

while im suggesting, is mind blade a terrible skill or am i missing its true function beyond its tiny aoe? I see that it casts fast and hits aoe and hits decent dmg, i just feel using it is clunky and often just ignore it. probably wishful thinking but this would be a fun pull skill. pull up to five foes to where you target and cast mindblade. I know i know i just wish i could wield GS and focus !

The focus is a more versatile weapon with complex uses. The warden’s stationary nature means you can set him on a strategic point and defend it against projectiles (and even reflect them back traited). If you want to use it more offensively, the focus comes with a tool for that built in, too (Void). You would lose these functions and quite frankly dumb down the weapon with your suggestions.

One thing I would love to see, would be for the warden to re-position between attacks. Right now, most enemies (except PvE mobs) will run out of the Warden’s attack range when they’re being hit. This gives me a great opportunity to shatter the Warden as he’s useless when out of range of a fight.

It would be interesting to see a tweak to Warden that would allow him to follow the enemy to melee range between attacks, but remain stationary when he starts his whirl. Right now, he only moves when an enemy runs out of around 1200 range or so.

But I do agree with Gaiawolf that the current mechanic is fine the way it is. The focus/warden definitely has a big learning curve, but once you learn timing, positioning, and learn how to place temporal curtain for void pull to drag enemies into the warden’s circle…the more you’ll love the focus.

A moving Warden would make using him for Deflection (or with Trait, Reflection) nearly impossible, since he’d constantly move out of the way. He’s extremely handy the way he is immobile.

The only change I’d like is for the Warden to be ground-targeted, or at least make it always be conjured between you and the target. Berserker could benefit from a predictable conjure point too (in fact, it could be standard Illusion behaviour; though it really only affects AoE Phantasms).

Yes! Making the warden a GT spell would rock!

I would like to vote for a GT Warden as well.

Only tricky part, how would shatters work if the Warden was GT? Shatter on spot? Cause it wouldn’t have a designated target to run to.

Koega.8653:

Only tricky part, how would shatters work if the Warden was GT? Shatter on spot? Cause it wouldn’t have a designated target to run to.

It could be tied to the closest enemy when it’s conjured, like how Deceptive Evasion Clones target the closest enemy.

It could still require a target tbh, and be bound to the current target. Only difference is, you say where it appears, and it uses it’s PBAE attack there, too.

The fact that a warden is a defensive skill and a berserker is a offensive skill is a bit strange.
Considering that a warden does 2 times the damage a berserker does.

That pretty much shows how messed up the mesmer class is and how little they have tested this game, if they even tested this game.

That’s not the problem really, because your “Warden does twice the damage” is beautifully misconstructing the reality of how the two abilities work.

The reason the Warden does a lot of damage is because its direct damage is very easily avoidable.

Then i suggest you play a mesmer and go to a dummy and test it out for yourself.
A warden which is a defensive skill does twice the damage of a berserker.

Even though a warden stays in 1 place doesnt really matter, in for example pve when a boss or any mob stays in 1 place for a long enough time you are better of using a warden for dps then a berserker.

They will probably end up nerfing the warden to do hardly any damage and keep the berserker in the useless state it is in.

Just to clarify, you know that the final damage number from iWarden (and iDuelist and iBerserker) is the total damage dealt, right? You don’t add all the numbers that popped up together. The Warden is quite powerful but it isn’t leaps and bounds beyond what most other Phantasms do. You should also consider the fact that the iWarden’s attack rate is very slow (long attack + long pause between attacks), so its single target DPS is actually sub-par compared to most other Phantasms.

Anet is unlikely to nerf iWarden for a very minor PvE balance issue (IMO there isn’t one anyway), PvP balance is far more important to them. As you can imagine people generally don’t stay in the Warden’s AoE in PvP. Also, while PvE mobs tend to be stationary they can move around, and the Warden being stationary in melee range also means it’s easily killed by mobs before it can finish its attack.

Daisai.5879:

Then i suggest you play a mesmer and go to a dummy and test it out for yourself.
A warden which is a defensive skill does twice the damage of a berserker.

Ah see, there you’re already making the mistake:
You equalize “Elitist Jerks DPS” with actual damage output of a skill. Which might work in a formulaic game like WoW, but DPS Metres aren’t really a useful metric in GW2 due to the rather dynamic nature of combat.

Or in short:

• Warden deals high damage per attack against a stationary target.
• Warden is stationary throughout the summon.
• A lot of situations in this game aren’t stationary.
• Summing up all situations in all contexts, I’d wager that only PMage can rival PWarden in how low the damage gets.

Sure, in that ideal (= dummy, or dummy-like dungeon boss with no AE and so cleave attacks at all – which are those exactly, of the ~90 dungeon bosses? :P ) situation Warden hits harder. In the other 9999/10000 situation, it can barely even attack. Average them all out => Warden does extremely low damage.

@ Carighan I disagree.

I personally started using Focus/Warden long after hitting level 80, and I feel that, when used correctly, the Warden is a very effective phantasm. It does take some time to get used to and the Warden is not a phantasm that you can cast and forget. It requires more strategy than the other phantasms.

Your enemy runs away? Great, temporal curtain then void…this pulls them right back into your Warden’s attack and cripples them, preventing them from running away too fast.

Your enemy wants to DPS the Warden? Same concept as any other phantasm. They die quickly and usually I only use them for 1-2 attacks then shatter, depending on the situation. If you want more DPS from your phantasm, then protect them. For me, I’ve traited my glamour skills for blind/confusion and I use scepter. They way my utility is set up, thats 3 potential stacks of blind. If you use a staff, drop a chaos storm on him. This is no different than fighting someone who is trying to DPS a Berserker.

I have found the Warden useful for all types of fights. Bosses, PvE, dungeons, WvW, and SPVP. For a real treat, drop the Warden on a zerg in PvP in the midst of chaos. Most zergs are so focused on attacking walls that there is a delay in their reaction when they realize their taking damage from something right next to them rather than from a distance away.

everyone has their preferences… but my playstyle love the Warden. i mostly sPvP, have my phantasm traited for fury, extra damage, and HP… plus ill use signet of illusions… and my warden does WAY more damange than my berserker. Sure, you can just Move away from the warden, but youd be surprised at how many people run through his AE…. and he tends to crit for almost 3 – 4k … if an enemy is stupid enough to stand within m Wardens AE for the full effect, id say they just took at LEAST 8-12k damage… not to mention if they try to open up with some ranged attacks, and it bounces back onto themselves….

the same trait makes curtain reflect projectiles aswell… i laugh so hard when a ranger finally figures out which one is me, and i t hrow down curtain right before his burst, and then pull him down onto his face right after he eats his own damage, pop a warden on top of him and hes done for…

dont get me wrong, the Zerker can do upwards of 10k spikes of damage on successful crits, but since i can never tell what direction hes going to spawn from, sometimes he’s wasted… i feel like the double utility of warden (reflecting + high damage) out weighs the Zerker, for me persoanlly at least.

i also agree, that in intense PvE situations, certain bosses/events, Warden is useless, because he gets wrecked by point blank meelee dmg, but in my experience, the Zerker doesnt get to much farther in the same situations…. he’ll get maybe one successful spin, and then die attempting the second, or just after…

it all boils down to preference, and both are very situational.. but, i still will always prefer temporal curtain over illusionary wave…. more control of the knockdown, swiftness OR cripple on enemy, reflects projectiles, and only 20sec cooldown?? awesomness.

lets not forget either that you can use BOTH, if you really want… ive done this combo and kicked some butt, although i prefer staff / sword-focus

What I would like to see if the iWarden to be a ground target skill. This gives you the option of using it has an offensive damage skill or a strategic defensive skill. Of course keep it immobile.

@Carighan you are the wrong who is wrong here.
DPS has nothing to do with elitistjerks or wow.

The fact remains that a warden is a DEFENSIVE skill and yes its stationairy only so is a aoe made by any class.
Chaos storm is stationary and wont move on its self for example.

Berserker is a OFFENSIVE skill so it makes more sence and should do more damage then a defensive skill like a warden.

Anyway, when someone starts linking a damage from a skill with a game like wow and “elitistjerks” i tend to not even bothering to discuss with such a unexperienced player.

Daisai.5879:

@Carighan you are the wrong who is wrong here.
DPS has nothing to do with elitistjerks or wow.

The fact remains that a warden is a DEFENSIVE skill and yes its stationairy only so is a aoe made by any class.
Chaos storm is stationary and wont move on its self for example.

Berserker is a OFFENSIVE skill so it makes more sence and should do more damage then a defensive skill like a warden.

Anyway, when someone starts linking a damage from a skill with a game like wow and “elitistjerks” i tend to not even bothering to discuss with such a unexperienced player.

I just started playing a Mesmer alt, so everybody correct me if I am wrong, but aren’t virtually all Mesmer abilities Offensive/Defensive in nature? So this whole idea of “iBerserker is offensive so it NEEDS to do more damage” is ludicrous.

Let me break it down:

iWarden punishes players that aren’t paying attention (standing in its attack area) by doing a tone of damage; conversely, it is easily mitigated by being stationary. Once it is no longer doing damage, it can be used defensively to reflect projectiles, apply confusion (another thing that is offensive/defensive). So you can see the duality of the ability.

iBerserker is the same way; it does slightly less damage than iWarden, but it is way way way more reliable in applying its damage (cannot be countered simply by auto-walking for 2 seconds). Additionally, iBerserker applies a cripple, which allows you to kite more easily and keeps melee off of you. This, again, is an offensive/defensive ability.

So your whole argument is null and void (puns intended) because the abilities of this class are not intended to be binary.

I think they are both perfectly fine the way they are.

That’s exactly my point why the damage is so low.
Ofc there are edge cases (stationary bosses with no PBAEs, players who aren’t paying attention, chained Immobilize on players) where the Warden can do it’s full damage, and then it’s very high.

I suspect the “high damage” is however balanced around the fact that more often than not, players are smart enough to realize this thing isn’t moving and has a tiny attack range.