Guild Wars 2

First of all, Let me ask people to avoid replying “L2p” please.

Okay, before I never had any problems vs mesmers, using my mesmer, or any other class for that matter, unless we are talking about someone really skilled than me.

Now, Blinding Dissipation almost makes it impossible to kill a mesmer, unless he is focused.

This trait is an instant damage mitigation not mention it is AoE.

Even with just mindwrack, you can have instant AoE blindness every 12 seconds (10 if traited) NO clones needed so you can you this on the fly.

So now add those 3 more shatter skills, 4 with chrono spec, and you have a very strong defensive mechanic.

I can never really land a clean burst unless they are running out of defensive cooldowns.

Ranger Maul burst (easy to blind)
Engie Prybar (easy to blind)

1.) So how do I counter or play against this? Please don’t tell AA to get rid of the blind, do you want me to do that while phantasms and the mesmer is wailing on me?
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2.) If the mesmer is a condi spec, Please dont tell me to cleanse, I will be spending valuable cleanses just to get rid of the blinds.
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Off topic But very useful information:

And this is just the trait itself.

Now pair this with stealth (decoy – every mesmer will most likely have this)
Mass Invi (another popular choice especially with the manipulation trait)
Torch (another popular OH choice Shatter/Condi Specs)
Torch also has blinds with prestige.

Now again stealth + blind is now stronger over the latter.

Now pair this with distortion (any mesmer will have this, more if traited)

Now pair this with reflects (again a lot of mesmers will have this with the newly revamped manipulation trait)

Blink and Mi will have reflects, Mirror is a 4 second reflect on a 12 second cooldown.

And yet, mesmers are still not that common in high tier competitive play.
Yes mesmers now have strong mechanics, but remember the mesmer theme is in great part preventing the enemy play (lockdown) and even punishing it for playing (reflects, interrupt damage…).

But all professions have their own strength. “before I never had any problems vs mesmers” so it is a good news that you now have problems. No class should cause “no problem” to fight against. Mesmers used to be weak and the update has definitely improved them. They may be currently strong in low-medium tier competitive play, but this is partly because people are not used yet to fight the new mesmers. Let things settle and don’t worry, the nerf war will be tough for mesmers and it has already started!

Silverkey.2078:

And yet, mesmers are still not that common in high tier competitive play.
Yes mesmers now have strong mechanics, but remember the mesmer theme is in great part preventing the enemy play (lockdown) and even punishing it for playing (reflects, interrupt damage…).

But all professions have their own strength. “before I never had any problems vs mesmers” so it is a good news that you now have problems. No class should cause “no problem” to fight against. Mesmers used to be weak and the update has definitely improved them. They may be currently strong in low-medium tier competitive play, but this is partly because people are not used yet to fight the new mesmers. Let things settle and don’t worry, the nerf war will be tough for mesmers and it has already started!

I am not asking for a nerf, never did I mention that right?
FYI mesmer was strong before, it has never been weak in my opinion.
Good news for me that I am now having problems with it? If you ask anyone here the forums, I meant what I said literally.
I don’t wanna be rude but I take pride If I say I do not have any problems with them.
Now even the a not so skilled mesmer can fight on par against me.
Before it was a matter of skill vs skill.
No before we go off topic.

I am asking for tips, and hints?

I am sorry, my message probably sounded rude. I saw many messages in the PvP forum of people asking “how do I fight mesmers now” but who really asked “please nerf the class”. I PvP mostly with mesmer and not with the build which seems the strongest right now (stealth interrupt shatter burst) and I haven’t fought that many other mesmers so I do not know how bad it is to play against them. I just know I am enjoying the patch so far

StickerHappy.8052:

Silverkey.2078:

And yet, mesmers are still not that common in high tier competitive play.
Yes mesmers now have strong mechanics, but remember the mesmer theme is in great part preventing the enemy play (lockdown) and even punishing it for playing (reflects, interrupt damage…).

But all professions have their own strength. “before I never had any problems vs mesmers” so it is a good news that you now have problems. No class should cause “no problem” to fight against. Mesmers used to be weak and the update has definitely improved them. They may be currently strong in low-medium tier competitive play, but this is partly because people are not used yet to fight the new mesmers. Let things settle and don’t worry, the nerf war will be tough for mesmers and it has already started!

I am not asking for a nerf, never did I mention that right?
FYI mesmer was strong before, it has never been weak in my opinion.
Good news for me that I am now having problems with it? If you ask anyone here the forums, I meant what I said literally.
I don’t wanna be rude but I take pride If I say I do not have any problems with them.
Now even the a not so skilled mesmer can fight on par against me.
Before it was a matter of skill vs skill.
No before we go off topic.

I am asking for tips, and hints?

You are NOT asking for tips by saying things like ’don’t ask me to AA and cleanse’. These SHOULD be the ways to deal with blind. AA is an important part of PvP gameplay in this game. You are underestimating AA way too much. However, It’s perfectly fine to openly question the power of a trait. Just don’t pretend you are not.

This trait indeed has problem being unavoidable. We knew it will be a very strong trait even before the patch comes online. It should be fixed that you can avoid it by blocking/evading etc. Since it comes with shatter, players should tend to dodge when mesmer comes close range. That’s exactly the time mesmer tries to burst. Or mesmer uses it for defensive purpose when the opponent is close. Then I think it is a good play if the mesmer can time the skill correct to avoid the big hit. This is essential since now endurance has been nerf’ed and most players can hit harder with their build.

Exciton.8942:

StickerHappy.8052:

Silverkey.2078:

And yet, mesmers are still not that common in high tier competitive play.
Yes mesmers now have strong mechanics, but remember the mesmer theme is in great part preventing the enemy play (lockdown) and even punishing it for playing (reflects, interrupt damage…).

But all professions have their own strength. “before I never had any problems vs mesmers” so it is a good news that you now have problems. No class should cause “no problem” to fight against. Mesmers used to be weak and the update has definitely improved them. They may be currently strong in low-medium tier competitive play, but this is partly because people are not used yet to fight the new mesmers. Let things settle and don’t worry, the nerf war will be tough for mesmers and it has already started!

I am not asking for a nerf, never did I mention that right?
FYI mesmer was strong before, it has never been weak in my opinion.
Good news for me that I am now having problems with it? If you ask anyone here the forums, I meant what I said literally.
I don’t wanna be rude but I take pride If I say I do not have any problems with them.
Now even the a not so skilled mesmer can fight on par against me.
Before it was a matter of skill vs skill.
No before we go off topic.

I am asking for tips, and hints?

You are NOT asking for tips by saying things like ’don’t ask me to AA and cleanse’. These SHOULD be the ways to deal with blind. AA is an important part of PvP gameplay in this game. You are underestimating AA way too much. However, It’s perfectly fine to openly question the power of a trait. Just don’t pretend you are not.

This trait indeed has problem being unavoidable. We knew it will be a very strong trait even before the patch comes online. It should be fixed that you can avoid it by blocking/evading etc. Since it comes with shatter, players should tend to dodge when mesmer comes close range. That’s exactly the time mesmer tries to burst. Or mesmer uses it for defensive purpose when the opponent is close. Then I think it is a good play if the mesmer can time the skill correct to avoid the big hit. This is essential since now endurance has been nerf’ed and most players can hit harder with their build.

Dude the ones I mentioned wouldn’t help at all even if I they did it, thats why I said that.

Yeap you have fair points, but being on a 10 sec icd just on f1 is hard to battle, you can tell me to stay ranged but that works for the GS’ advantage, they can cast izerker too.

Even though it might seem that the mesmer constantly has blinds up, they don’t really. Shatters have a not-insignificant cooldown, and using them purely for blind means they’re not getting much other than blind out of those shatters.

Applying consistent pressure to the mesmer is the best way to keep the blind from being effective. They have to make the choice between blinding at that moment to mitigate the damage, or actually preparing a shatter to do damage. Since blinds are tied into shatters, they don’t get both unless you let them take the time to set both a burst and opportune blind.

Now, particularly as a ranger, you can also use ranged attacks. While mesmer does have significant uptime on reflect, it’s linked to skills that have very obvious animations. Don’t just sit there hammering on the bow without paying attention to them. Wait to rapid fire after they’ve healed, save pbs when you’re certain it’ll hit, that sort of thing.

As an aside, I’m curious as to how you fight thieves. Even with blinding dissipation, thieves still have significantly more access to blind that mesmers do. On top of that, thief blind isn’t tied inextricably to their burst; they’re able to use it without sacrificing some of their main skills. If you’re having this much trouble hitting a mesmer that’s using a pbaoe blind, how are you going to fight a thief using black powder?

Fay.2357:

Even though it might seem that the mesmer constantly has blinds up, they don’t really. Shatters have a not-insignificant cooldown, and using them purely for blind means they’re not getting much other than blind out of those shatters.

Applying consistent pressure to the mesmer is the best way to keep the blind from being effective. They have to make the choice between blinding at that moment to mitigate the damage, or actually preparing a shatter to do damage. Since blinds are tied into shatters, they don’t get both unless you let them take the time to set both a burst and opportune blind.

Now, particularly as a ranger, you can also use ranged attacks. While mesmer does have significant uptime on reflect, it’s linked to skills that have very obvious animations. Don’t just sit there hammering on the bow without paying attention to them. Wait to rapid fire after they’ve healed, save pbs when you’re certain it’ll hit, that sort of thing.

As an aside, I’m curious as to how you fight thieves. Even with blinding dissipation, thieves still have significantly more access to blind that mesmers do. On top of that, thief blind isn’t tied inextricably to their burst; they’re able to use it without sacrificing some of their main skills. If you’re having this much trouble hitting a mesmer that’s using a pbaoe blind, how are you going to fight a thief using black powder?

To be honest pyro, I have the most trouble with mesmers, since we can do a lot of damage from range, and now, as I have said the trait itself is good just fix the dodging part. Although thief still being a close second, especially when I run shatter mesmer.

The problem comes to me when you pair this trait with other mesmer mechanics, AA the blind, okay let me rupt you!

I mean its doable but it is a very very very hard battle for me, considering that I have dueled a LOT of mesmers, from baddies to very good ones. I can never see any opening from a real fight against mesmers with your skill level, rylock, and other people. Unless! I get lucky with the burst from mirror blade stealth.

There is too much to watch out for now.

You still watch for the same thing. Mirror blade burst, izerker, clones running towards you. Nothing has really changed.

Dear Anet,

Please make Mesmers easier for StickerHappy. He works hard and deserves to have easy kills.

Sincerely Naz

Got your back Bro. :P

Nazer.7301:

Dear Anet,

Please make Mesmers easier for StickerHappy. He works hard and deserves to have easy kills.

Sincerely Naz

Got your back Bro. :P

Lol, are you seriously gonna troll me? I came here asking for tips but its funny only pyro has attempted to give one.

PS: If you think I am having trouble with mesmers pre patch, think again.

You did mention pry bar/engineer. What about utility goggles? I normally have it with my SD engi build but there is also a trait in tools that auto procs them on CC/blind. This makes you immune to blind for 10 seconds.

DuckDuckBOOM.4097:

You did mention pry bar/engineer. What about utility goggles? I normally have it with my SD engi build but there is also a trait in tools that auto procs them on CC/blind. This makes you immune to blind for 10 seconds.

Now this is a good idea, but when you are running the old meta build, is this really a very good trade off for one of the other utility skills just to prepare for a mesmer?

Mesmer, thief and guard for the anti blinds. It’s a stun break+fury too. It comes with reveal/vuln on the toolbelt too to further counter some thieves and mesmers. The auto proc trait is also nice although it doesn’t proc on rifle 4 for better or worst when I tried it.

Up to you in the end.

DuckDuckBOOM.4097:

Mesmer, thief and guard for the anti blinds. It’s a stun break+fury too. It comes with reveal/vuln on the toolbelt too to further counter some thieves and mesmers. The auto proc trait is also nice although it doesn’t proc on rifle 4 for better or worst when I tried it.

Up to you in the end.

What was the trait called again?

Now for other classes what do i do with BD?

Reactive lense and lock on are the respective traits in tools for utility goggles and analyze auto procs. They do take place of SD and kit refinement though.

I’m going to echo Pyro here. The real times I felt in danger during our duels was when you were close to me. You had condis and auto attacks cleaving my clones, so any shatter I performed was, yes, blinding you, but ultimately ineffective because I was only landing 1 stack of torment and two of confusion.

It’d be worse for you if you kept your range. Any time I dodge or evade, you’d be blinded (granting me more avoidance) and my Mirror heal is 4 seconds of reflect (and with adventure runes, allows me to dodge again).

BD plus Ineptitude does make fighting Mesmers troublesome. But as you noticed, it was moreso when I was running PU.

I’m also still learning how to play condi (or Rampagers at least, which is still capable of direct damage burst).

Tealots.6095:

I’m going to echo Pyro here. The real times I felt in danger during our duels was when you were close to me. You had condis and auto attacks cleaving my clones, so any shatter I performed was, yes, blinding you, but ultimately ineffective because I was only landing 1 stack of torment and two of confusion.

It’d be worse for you if you kept your range. Any time I dodge or evade, you’d be blinded (granting me more avoidance) and my Mirror heal is 4 seconds of reflect (and with adventure runes, allows me to dodge again).

BD plus Ineptitude does make fighting Mesmers troublesome. But as you noticed, it was moreso when I was running PU.

I’m also still learning how to play condi (or Rampagers at least, which is still capable of direct damage burst).

But you were playing condie and it was hard too. Imagine someone playing with power, a single IP MW will hit for ~2kCrit or more with the blind.

About melee, there is still nothing i can do in range, you can either interrupt me, reflect, etc.

Cast phantasms or nuke me to death in range.

Yeah it must be hard for rangers currently – while I haven’t played ranger for quite a few months, I can appreciate that at the moment vs mesmer it is a hard matchup for the ranger – at least from what I’ve seen/fought against.

Not sure if it helps for your case Sticker but ranger has a trait to remove blind/poison/cripple on dodge.

Being that I’ve played phantrupt for a long time, and having used focus in the past, I’ve always had to be mindful of clearing blinds for my phant summons. Building appropriately can take you a loooong way in this regard at least while playing a Mesmer. So let’s say I’m facing a mes with blinding dissipation who’s trying to utilize his blinds to mess with my summons, or is just doing so haphazardly while going about his shattering.

With the Inspiration line, mantra heal, and MoD, I have instant cast cleansing, or in the case of MoD the ability to clear the blind by burning an insta cast daze. The same can be done with focus, curtain pull clears blind in moment before iWarden summon. With Inspiration you can also use a shatter, the way you might cover a cast with f4 since shatters cleanse. So for mesmers, building with instant cast cleansing in mind allows you to actually eat the blind (which directly outplayes the enemy) and you can go about doing your thang.

Now I know you like Ranger, and what can I say? I have no idea. Disengage, wait for someone else to engage the mesmer, and hit him in the back while he’s not looking. That’s what I’d do :p

StickerHappy.8052:

Now, Blinding Dissipation almost makes it impossible to kill a mesmer, unless he is focused.

• First:

Basic: If you are blinded: first atack can be an autoatack, hit the clone or whatever, doesnt matter.

If its not a condi use a quick condi clean.

• Second:

Take in consideration that this blind to be sucefull its a trade off:
Since you can counter blind with an autoatack or if the mes build dont have much condi damage (actual situation) a condi clean; the mesmer will need to use its usefull shatter as a defensive skill instead of an offensive one.

• Third:

A side for f1 and f2 the other shatters have much longer cds and alredy are invuln/control based, that makes the time of the blind run out.

• Forth:

When you have the mesmer ready to be hit, just use autoatack to begin or do a feint, then hit to your heart content.

• Conclusion: just counter play blind and take in account that the mes its sacrificating important resourses to blind you.

for LB ranger it should be easy match up against condi shatter

condi shatter needs to be melee range to do good dmg (with ip) so he would try to blink to you and shatter

the blind when dodging is 10 sec cd so your only concern is shatter skills which again melee range

for melee classes condi shatter with blind its harder (works against our harder counter, warrior and thieves) but it balance as they can hit harder so 4 blinds wont make huge difference rather if they used right on burst skills.

the problem ppl forget to adapt to the new metas ans skills and play like before and failing.

Silverkey.2078:

And yet, mesmers are still not that common in high tier competitive play.

Did you watch ESL last week? Pretty much every team on stream besides radioactive and the abjured had a mesmer. The general team comp was mesmer, thief, ele, bunker guard/2nd ele, and then one wild card that was generally either an engi or a zerker war.

Sure there weren’t any in the finals on NA, but those are the best teams NA, who are really tight knit groups with no mesmer mains, but it’s ignorant to say that mesmer isn’t common right now when the facts I presented to you are indisputable. And I bet if you watch the tourney today you’ll see tons of memsers. I can think of 5 or 6 on good teams in NA, and 3 or 4 in EU, which I don’t even follow as much.

messiah.1908:

for LB ranger it should be easy match up against condi shatter

condi shatter needs to be melee range to do good dmg (with ip) so he would try to blink to you and shatter

the blind when dodging is 10 sec cd so your only concern is shatter skills which again melee range

for melee classes condi shatter with blind its harder (works against our harder counter, warrior and thieves) but it balance as they can hit harder so 4 blinds wont make huge difference rather if they used right on burst skills.

the problem ppl forget to adapt to the new metas ans skills and play like before and failing.

Mirror heal and blurred frenzy together with ineptitude give me a very easy time against LB rangers.

I lack raw condition burst because of not using scepter, but have some advantages against certain classes/builds.

Curunen.8729:

messiah.1908:

for LB ranger it should be easy match up against condi shatter

condi shatter needs to be melee range to do good dmg (with ip) so he would try to blink to you and shatter

the blind when dodging is 10 sec cd so your only concern is shatter skills which again melee range

for melee classes condi shatter with blind its harder (works against our harder counter, warrior and thieves) but it balance as they can hit harder so 4 blinds wont make huge difference rather if they used right on burst skills.

the problem ppl forget to adapt to the new metas ans skills and play like before and failing.

Mirror heal and blurred frenzy together with ineptitude give me a very easy time against LB rangers.

I lack raw condition burst because of not using scepter, but have some advantages against certain classes/builds.

as it should be as you said melee range .so its mind game . LB can bait your heal and then burst. he can fear you and immobilize you with wolf and dog etc..

thus i think it fair game.

messiah.1908:

Curunen.8729:

messiah.1908:

for LB ranger it should be easy match up against condi shatter

condi shatter needs to be melee range to do good dmg (with ip) so he would try to blink to you and shatter

the blind when dodging is 10 sec cd so your only concern is shatter skills which again melee range

for melee classes condi shatter with blind its harder (works against our harder counter, warrior and thieves) but it balance as they can hit harder so 4 blinds wont make huge difference rather if they used right on burst skills.

the problem ppl forget to adapt to the new metas ans skills and play like before and failing.

Mirror heal and blurred frenzy together with ineptitude give me a very easy time against LB rangers.

I lack raw condition burst because of not using scepter, but have some advantages against certain classes/builds.

as it should be as you said melee range .so its mind game . LB can bait your heal and then burst. he can fear you and immobilize you with wolf and dog etc..

thus i think it fair game.

Yeah, though I also take MoResolve making it easy to cleanse/dodge out of entangle or fears.

messiah.1908:

Curunen.8729:

messiah.1908:

for LB ranger it should be easy match up against condi shatter

condi shatter needs to be melee range to do good dmg (with ip) so he would try to blink to you and shatter

the blind when dodging is 10 sec cd so your only concern is shatter skills which again melee range

for melee classes condi shatter with blind its harder (works against our harder counter, warrior and thieves) but it balance as they can hit harder so 4 blinds wont make huge difference rather if they used right on burst skills.

the problem ppl forget to adapt to the new metas ans skills and play like before and failing.

Mirror heal and blurred frenzy together with ineptitude give me a very easy time against LB rangers.

I lack raw condition burst because of not using scepter, but have some advantages against certain classes/builds.

as it should be as you said melee range .so its mind game . LB can bait your heal and then burst. he can fear you and immobilize you with wolf and dog etc..

thus i think it fair game.

Bait what? Mirror is 4 seconds reflect when traited, you know that right? against an LB ranger I could just pop out my heal without fear.

RF from range? MoD says Hi, stealth then burst.

StickerHappy.8052:

messiah.1908:

Curunen.8729:

messiah.1908:

for LB ranger it should be easy match up against condi shatter

condi shatter needs to be melee range to do good dmg (with ip) so he would try to blink to you and shatter

the blind when dodging is 10 sec cd so your only concern is shatter skills which again melee range

for melee classes condi shatter with blind its harder (works against our harder counter, warrior and thieves) but it balance as they can hit harder so 4 blinds wont make huge difference rather if they used right on burst skills.

the problem ppl forget to adapt to the new metas ans skills and play like before and failing.

Mirror heal and blurred frenzy together with ineptitude give me a very easy time against LB rangers.

I lack raw condition burst because of not using scepter, but have some advantages against certain classes/builds.

as it should be as you said melee range .so its mind game . LB can bait your heal and then burst. he can fear you and immobilize you with wolf and dog etc..

thus i think it fair game.

Bait what? Mirror is 4 seconds reflect when traited, you know that right? against an LB ranger I could just pop out my heal without fear.

RF from range? MoD says Hi, stealth then burst.

bait= use AA or weapon stew . if you dont heal your hp will be 50% if oyu heal he can use stability and burst you with no fear of interupt and so on.

again mind game he try to counter you and you him but not op as you cant kill all rangers every time and the game is not design for 1v1 rather group play. so the ranger can target you his team pressure you to heal and blink/stealth and then he burst you with ease . like thieves looking for 50% hp member to burst it down easily

messiah.1908:

StickerHappy.8052:

messiah.1908:

Curunen.8729:

messiah.1908:

for LB ranger it should be easy match up against condi shatter

condi shatter needs to be melee range to do good dmg (with ip) so he would try to blink to you and shatter

the blind when dodging is 10 sec cd so your only concern is shatter skills which again melee range

for melee classes condi shatter with blind its harder (works against our harder counter, warrior and thieves) but it balance as they can hit harder so 4 blinds wont make huge difference rather if they used right on burst skills.

the problem ppl forget to adapt to the new metas ans skills and play like before and failing.

Mirror heal and blurred frenzy together with ineptitude give me a very easy time against LB rangers.

I lack raw condition burst because of not using scepter, but have some advantages against certain classes/builds.

as it should be as you said melee range .so its mind game . LB can bait your heal and then burst. he can fear you and immobilize you with wolf and dog etc..

thus i think it fair game.

Bait what? Mirror is 4 seconds reflect when traited, you know that right? against an LB ranger I could just pop out my heal without fear.

RF from range? MoD says Hi, stealth then burst.

bait= use AA or weapon stew . if you dont heal your hp will be 50% if oyu heal he can use stability and burst you with no fear of interupt and so on.

again mind game he try to counter you and you him but not op as you cant kill all rangers every time and the game is not design for 1v1 rather group play. so the ranger can target you his team pressure you to heal and blink/stealth and then he burst you with ease . like thieves looking for 50% hp member to burst it down easily

It does not matter, while he is in LB you can 100% safely heal up. Except if he fears you with wolf. Or kds with dog (chances are highly unlikely since this is RNG on a 45 second cd)

I think you got the situations reversed. I am saying LB ranger vs mesmer (in favor of mesmer)

Silverkey.2078:

I am sorry, my message probably sounded rude. I saw many messages in the PvP forum of people asking “how do I fight mesmers now” but who really asked “please nerf the class”. I PvP mostly with mesmer and not with the build which seems the strongest right now (stealth interrupt shatter burst) and I haven’t fought that many other mesmers so I do not know how bad it is to play against them. I just know I am enjoying the patch so far

Lol, you Mesmer are really sensitive right now because you enjoy your broken abusive stuffs right? If you don’t feel like it’s broken, you shouldn’t be worrying about it, and shouldn’t be offended by it either lol..