Guild Wars 2

This is why:

1. If you have a signet equipped (other than sig of sillusion but even this one takes time to pop up) it doesn’t show on clones which any kind of decent player will notice in seconds.

2. Exploration star. bla bla bla everyone talked about this one for long enough and nothing been done after 5+ months.

3. Their attack speed is much slower and very noticeable to someone who pvp enough.

4. Boons. Its okay if clones can’t have boons on them BUT it must show all boons the player have on their clones as well (even tho they’re only boon images and don’t get their effects). Anyone half decent will always use attacks on the mesmer with all the boons which breaks the whole point of fooling your opponent.

5. This one is something i never heard anyone mentioning on this forum. Why don’t clones attack when running into a target for being shattered? lets say im at 900 range and run to my target to rupt with illusionary Wave. Will i be spamming skills while doing so? Yes. this is what clones (notice, i say clones and not all illusions) should be doing when their target is at range and the mesmer uses F1-F3 shatter, they walk to your target while at the same time attacking until they reach melee ranger and explode from shatter.

None of these points would make mesmer OP, just do what they’re supposed to do, fool the enemy.

Anet said the Exploration Star has been fixed but I myself haven’t been able to confirm it yet.

Xavi.6591:

Anet said the Exploration Star has been fixed but I myself haven’t been able to confirm it yet.

I don’t have 100% exploration so i don’t know and haven’t heard about any fix but if it is fixed i will remove it from my 5 reasons.

Would be nice, but they are probably not going to do anything about it. Even during beta we brought up points like this, plus… oh yeah, clones have no OH weapons! and Anet’s response was that clones are only supposed to be a brief distraction; nothing more.

I’d be happy if the bloody things had OH, kitten The ENTIRE point of us using clone-o-rama, is to mindkitten people. Kindly help us out with that.

Anyone with half a clue will spot the clones in a heartbeat. No offhand, standing in position spamming attack one, running straight to the target without attacking. No buffs be it food or skills.

But hey, I remember saying so in the other thread about reducing mesmers hitpoints, and I was getting flamed.

If ppl are dumb enough to take a full 100 blades or stand in a red aoe circle then clones actually being an accurate representation of the player will blow their minds! I do it the other way around- act like a clone :p

I’m amazed at these threads. . . I really am. Turn off all the names of NPCs and enemies, leave only player names, real Mesmer has a name over his head (when not directly in the center of your screen, or already targeting a clone) and guess what, the clones don’t have that name.

The real one has a name!

Funky. . . if you act like a clone it only works against people who don’t do what I’ve shown. No I more often lose players when they stealth and have problems with my tab targeting than I do with noticing which one is the real one and I’m pretty sure that’s probably true of most players.

@ Delo; i’m with you on that one, my sarcasm was intended for the imminent aoe nerf and that a few people seem to think they can just run around in a zerg and be invincible :p I do believe that players who chance across a mesmer for the first time in w3 will be backfooted by the way the class works, especially if they have warrior/guardian as their only character.

Nuka Cola.8520:

5. This one is something i never heard anyone mentioning on this forum. Why don’t clones attack when running into a target for being shattered? lets say im at 900 range and run to my target to rupt with illusionary Wave. Will i be spamming skills while doing so? Yes. this is what clones (notice, i say clones and not all illusions) should be doing when their target is at range and the mesmer uses F1-F3 shatter, they walk to your target while at the same time attacking until they reach melee ranger and explode from shatter.

Related to this, clones also stop moving when attacking.

Example:
My opponent is running away, and I’m running after him, spamming my staff autoattack on the move. You’d assume the staff clones do the same, but no. They run after the target and once in range, they stop moving to fire one autoattack shot. After that they continue to run. Given how slow clones move, usually they end up doing nothing but running, never actually attacking.

Conclusion: Clones are useless for the purpose of deceiving except against noobs… and you really don’t need to deceive noobs anyways. They’re just shatter fodder.

I would like to see off hands added as a visual element, fake boon bar, and attack while running (attack while running should apply to summons for every class). Not sure they can take off the NPC tag (not sure how it’s tied with AI), but that would help against a cheap trick. Basically want clones to survive a glance. There will still be tells – is one dodging, is one attacking faster or attacking with the offhand? Did they use a non-auto-attack move? Did one switch weapons? There are plenty of tells, just want it less obvious.

Snoxx.7943:

Nuka Cola.8520:

5. This one is something i never heard anyone mentioning on this forum. Why don’t clones attack when running into a target for being shattered? lets say im at 900 range and run to my target to rupt with illusionary Wave. Will i be spamming skills while doing so? Yes. this is what clones (notice, i say clones and not all illusions) should be doing when their target is at range and the mesmer uses F1-F3 shatter, they walk to your target while at the same time attacking until they reach melee ranger and explode from shatter.

Related to this, clones also stop moving when attacking.

Example:
My opponent is running away, and I’m running after him, spamming my staff autoattack on the move. You’d assume the staff clones do the same, but no. They run after the target and once in range, they stop moving to fire one autoattack shot. After that they continue to run. Given how slow clones move, usually they end up doing nothing but running, never actually attacking.

Its funny we get this kind of trashy AI in a 2012 game lmao.

@drawing guy. that’s not exactly true. clones are needed for condi builds. a mes can’t stack bizillion conditions like almost all if not all classes can if we don’t have clones up n spamming.

True… and even non condition builds can use staff clones to boost warlocks. Tick that one comment as typing without thinking it fully through.

Yup, all legit problems, as is lack of OH and missing nameplates as Del mentions.

Solution: Clones are just shatter spam bombs for shatter builds, or placeholders in phantasm builds until you can overwrite with a phantasm. Don’t leave them up long, don’t rely on them to confuse halfway decent enemies, and don’t use a build that relies on them being up for any length of time (which I never really see anyway).

Only exception might be condition builds that rely on clones with ranged attacks continuously applying conditions (Staff, Scepter). Ymmv.

Snoxx.7943:

This one is something i never heard anyone mentioning on this forum. Why don’t clones attack when running into a target for being shattered? … Given how slow clones move, usually they end up doing nothing but running, never actually attacking.

This is the same issue that causes Ranger pets to never attack also. The pet AI seems to only have room for one command at a time. They are either running or attacking with a brief pause in between switching from one to the other.

It makes it very easy to avoid pet attacks altogether. For the ranger at least, it also cause pets and enemy mobs to run past each other, turn come back at each other, run past each other again, etc… in a sort of awful joust.

Nuka Cola.8520:

This is why:

1. If you have a signet equipped (other than sig of sillusion but even this one takes time to pop up) it doesn’t show on clones which any kind of decent player will notice in seconds.

True, and even then the SoIllusions takes about 1-3 seconds to appear, which is annoying.
Then again, I find no use for the other Signets in PvE. In PvP, I still don’t like them, personally.

The only Signet I run is Signet of Inspiration for the Jellyfish Fractal Boss and I’m too lazy to change my underwater set, so I run Arcane Thievery, Signet of Inspiration, and the Signet that increases boon duration. Then, when the Jellyfish eats someone, I steal his 25 might and give it to my party.

2. Exploration star. bla bla bla everyone talked about this one for long enough and nothing been done after 5+ months.

It’s fixed, it only shows to allied players. If it’s an enemy, you will not see it. Try going to WvW and look for one, you will never find one on an enemy.

3. Their attack speed is much slower and very noticeable to someone who pvp enough.

This is my main problem both in and out of PvP, it’s not like they have significant damage.

4. Boons. Its okay if clones can’t have boons on them BUT it must show all boons the player have on their clones as well (even tho they’re only boon images and don’t get their effects). Anyone half decent will always use attacks on the mesmer with all the boons which breaks the whole point of fooling your opponent.

That can be a problem, though. What if I gain a boon? What if my clone gains a boon? Easily fixed, yes, but I’d rather have the attack speed fixed than this.

5. This one is something i never heard anyone mentioning on this forum. Why don’t clones attack when running into a target for being shattered? lets say im at 900 range and run to my target to rupt with illusionary Wave. Will i be spamming skills while doing so? Yes. this is what clones (notice, i say clones and not all illusions) should be doing when their target is at range and the mesmer uses F1-F3 shatter, they walk to your target while at the same time attacking until they reach melee ranger and explode from shatter.

Not just that, but Phantasms have a problem when shattering, sometimes they just run up to them and stay for until their normal attack comes off cooldown, then they shatter.

This isn’t as apparent on Clones since their attacks are relatively low on a cooldown.

None of these points would make mesmer OP, just do what they’re supposed to do, fool the enemy.

I agree.

Yeah, boon “icons” should be copied to illusions, but not effects.
They should make clones copy whatever spells you use but do the same crap damage.
Clones should occasionally dodge roll, because if the real Mesmer dodge rolls then you can just go “Right, clones don’t dodge roll, that’s him!”
Also the targetting is a bit revealing for mesmers, if you put a target on him, you can keep track of the real one, and just ignore the clones.

Simple terms, each ability you cast the effect and look is copied, but not the damage, Icons but not effects from boons should be copied, targets should be remove whenever a clone is summoned, and clones should dodge roll every now and then to look real.

Henrik.7560:

Clones should occasionally dodge roll, because if the real Mesmer dodge rolls then you can just go “Right, clones don’t dodge roll, that’s him!”

All your clones should dodge roll whenever the real mesmer dodges.

This would look awesome with 3 clones out. Quadruple dodge rolls.

Snoxx.7943:

Henrik.7560:

Clones should occasionally dodge roll, because if the real Mesmer dodge rolls then you can just go “Right, clones don’t dodge roll, that’s him!”

All your clones should dodge roll whenever the real mesmer dodges.

This would look awesome with 3 clones out. Quadruple dodge rolls.

And it would spawn a clone in a random spot inside of a grid created by all active illusions/player, targetting YOUR target.

Esplen.3940:

Snoxx.7943:

Henrik.7560:

Clones should occasionally dodge roll, because if the real Mesmer dodge rolls then you can just go “Right, clones don’t dodge roll, that’s him!”

All your clones should dodge roll whenever the real mesmer dodges.

This would look awesome with 3 clones out. Quadruple dodge rolls.

And it would spawn a clone in a random spot inside of a grid created by all active illusions/player, targetting YOUR target.

Lol.

I think they should just remove the meaningless clone system and rename Mesmer as the Shaman. Would fit better for this simple-minded game.
Not that I’d want that, but currently clones don’t really play any special role. The only nuisance they cause is that the enemy has to tab through them just like he would tab through ranger pets or necromancer minions.

Liberis.9573:

Will these issues ever be addressed? The AI is terrible…

Of course not but you will get a nice timed exclusive dungeon that goes away in two weeks and is as challenging and rewarding as a random event chain that no one does.

Delofakitten.4231:

I’m amazed at these threads. . . I really am. Turn off all the names of NPCs and enemies, leave only player names, real Mesmer has a name over his head (when not directly in the center of your screen, or already targeting a clone) and guess what, the clones don’t have that name.

The real one has a name!

Funky. . . if you act like a clone it only works against people who don’t do what I’ve shown. No I more often lose players when they stealth and have problems with my tab targeting than I do with noticing which one is the real one and I’m pretty sure that’s probably true of most players.

Exactly, just turn off enemy names and clones are useless anyways lol.

Sometimes I prefer to run without any food or signets to look same as clones but then I enter a wvw area which gives me that kitten annoying outmanned buff, so defeats the purpose!! Argh!