Guild Wars 2

While there are very few condition builds available to us (unless Anet adds more later), I wonder what any of you think about this new stat set (Condition Damage, Toughness, and Vitality).

I personally am glad that there is another condition-based stat set besides Rabid. I may end up using a couple or perhaps half of my gear with Dire along with Rabid for my condition builds.

Considering one of the common disadvantages of going full rabid is lower vitality, if sharper images isn’t used in a condition build, these might be interesting to play with.

Im thinking of a condition bunker build going Full Dire, something like 0/0/20/20/30 (http://tinyurl.com/pymcvmn). It could be interesting.

Let me know how it turns out. I’ve done non-dueling condi builds before, but not with that EQ spec.

The dire stats screams condition thief to me since they have no use for precision (or power) and use carrion to make up for their low HP.

It would be a good choice for a condition-shatter builds that focuses more in the illusion trait line than the meta condition build, although the lack of prismatic understnading/torch traits would hurt survivability even if the mesmer is tankier.

I’m working on a condition signet build with either 10/30/30/0/0 (without torch) or 20/30/20/0/0 (with torch) and having that vitality would help out. I’m also deciding on rune of perplexity or tormenting (since I use scepter) instead of centaur.

My Flowing Images – Shatter build would also benefit with Dire too, so I’m gonna be giving this a try as well.

I think full dire is going to be problematic, since so much condition procs is based on crit chance. Maybe dire armor and earrings/rings, rabit amulet/back and weapons?

Unfortunetly I can never get a trait setup to work decently with condition tanking. 0/0/20/20/30 is good for confusion glamour spec, but it just leaves so much to be desired. 0/0/30/30/10 can get some good condition traits and slap on mantra healing, but will be lacking in actually applying them to groups and miss the mantra cd. 0/30/20/20/0 can increase your roaming capabilities by alot due to evasive traits and better crits, but its going to suck for group condition damage.

This is a stat combo that will make necro terror even kittening ridiculously more OP. Mesmer without prec leaves us with full confusion build…. you NEVER go full confusion.

Even if you do.. Duelist IX + glamour combo is still the best confusion stacking method compared to Cry of Frustration (ridiculous, I know) so.. since you already venture into 20 duelist.. might as well get prec for bleed. It’s a lot more effective.

Unless Anet makes COF a confusion version of mindwrack.. THEN WE’LL TALK ABOUT CONFUSION SHATTER.

I wish they freaking would … and change the Mental Torment Trait to … iunno … apply Torment?

Advent… I love you. Oh btw I want into OMFG is that cool?

I think this armor set will make a lot more Condition Bunker builds appear, centering around staff for conditions. I am going to get a set as soon as I can and test it with glamour builds and such. The downside is that a lot of condition builds rely on Sharper Images and giving up Precision is suicide.

^^^What he said^^^

Advent.6193:

I wish they freaking would … and change the Mental Torment Trait to … iunno … apply Torment?

If it can apply Torment, I’m gonna be using it in all my builds! Seriously, I love torment on the scepter, except it requires a block, whereas warriors and thieves can easily apply 5 or more stacks directly or venom.

Condition mesmers need more than just mainly confusion and sadly, engie has an easier access to apply confusion more and faster than we can.

This will be an interesting set for a condition bunker. Not having precision obviously causes issues for normal Mesmer condition builds, but a bunker build is survival first, damage second, and so taking that sort of hit may be an acceptable sacrifice.

I’m thinking something like 0/0/30/20/20.

Or 0/0/30/10/30, specifically for IP clutch-plays.

I think that the clone spammer build will benefit from it. Well I don’t use the pistol when i use it i take sword so sharper images is just a bonus if it procs and meh if it doesn’t. Also what other stat’s are the adding to the game?

Sorry I don’t have that thorough of an understanding of mesmer. Why would 0/0/30/20/20 or 0/0/30/10/30 be good? I understand the IP thing but, using inspiration automatically says that you’re using phantasm, not typical to a condi mezzy build.

Run that kinda build with heavy Stealth/Prismatic Understanding, Overlord. Trick your gear out with +Boon Duration runes. You’re walking around with nigh-permanent if not permanent Regen/decent access to Protection/Aegis.
Another option’s to run Melandru/Lemongrass, and shake off enemy Conditions quick as all hell.

Advent.6193:

Run that kinda build with heavy Stealth/Prismatic Understanding, Overlord. Trick your gear out with +Boon Duration runes. You’re walking around with nigh-permanent if not permanent Regen/decent access to Protection/Aegis.

Actually use protection duration runes and you have permanent protection. perma regen is easy to attain

Interesting. Closest I come to a “Condi-tank” set is the Melandru-equipped Apothecary/Shaman set I pack. Might have to try that idea, jportell.

I’ma ctually thinking a tank build using this armor will be a reincarnation potential for my immortal build. We will see.

Hmm decent ideas I have to say. I really like prismatic understanding. I was talking more about the reason you would put those into illusions though.

jportell.2197:

I think that the clone spammer build will benefit from it. Well I don’t use the pistol when i use it i take sword so sharper images is just a bonus if it procs and meh if it doesn’t. Also what other stat’s are the adding to the game?

@jportell: Same thinking here. In my clone spammer build, I’ve been mixing in a bit of Carrion with Rabid to improve the health pool. With this new Dire stat combo, will def switch out Carrion for it.
Any gear with MF stat, the MF stat component will be replaced with something else, hopefully interesting for us. I read it somewhere that Rune of Scavenging gets life steal or something but we’ll see.

Overlord.7394:

Sorry I don’t have that thorough of an understanding of mesmer. Why would 0/0/30/20/20 or 0/0/30/10/30 be good? I understand the IP thing but, using inspiration automatically says that you’re using phantasm, not typical to a condi mezzy build.

@Overlord: I’m sure we all agree why a bunker build should spec into Chaos line. Although for sPvP, going stealth heavy (PU spec) would make a bunker build less effective in capping points, but lets just stick with WvW for the moment.

imho, another option for bunker is chaining blind from Glamours field to negate burst attacks and have traited Focus for area denial and projectile protection. Thats the reason to spec into Inspiration (reduced CD for Glamour, traited Focus) and Illusions (Glamours blind and confuse).

Hope that helps.

keenlam.4753:

jportell.2197:

I think that the clone spammer build will benefit from it. Well I don’t use the pistol when i use it i take sword so sharper images is just a bonus if it procs and meh if it doesn’t. Also what other stat’s are the adding to the game?

@jportell: Same thinking here. In my clone spammer build, I’ve been mixing in a bit of Carrion with Rabid to improve the health pool. With this new Dire stat combo, will def switch out Carrion for it.
Any gear with MF stat, the MF stat component will be replaced with something else, hopefully interesting for us. I read it somewhere that Rune of Scavenging gets life steal or something but we’ll see.

Ooooooo Lifesteal. Hmmmm…. Very interesting. But what were the other stats in runes of scavenging?

jportell.2197:

keenlam.4753:

jportell.2197:

I think that the clone spammer build will benefit from it. Well I don’t use the pistol when i use it i take sword so sharper images is just a bonus if it procs and meh if it doesn’t. Also what other stat’s are the adding to the game?

@jportell: Same thinking here. In my clone spammer build, I’ve been mixing in a bit of Carrion with Rabid to improve the health pool. With this new Dire stat combo, will def switch out Carrion for it.
Any gear with MF stat, the MF stat component will be replaced with something else, hopefully interesting for us. I read it somewhere that Rune of Scavenging gets life steal or something but we’ll see.

Ooooooo Lifesteal. Hmmmm…. Very interesting. But what were the other stats in runes of scavenging?

There u go, my friend : http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Superior_Rune_of_Scavenging

keenlam.4753:

jportell.2197:

keenlam.4753:

jportell.2197:

I think that the clone spammer build will benefit from it. Well I don’t use the pistol when i use it i take sword so sharper images is just a bonus if it procs and meh if it doesn’t. Also what other stat’s are the adding to the game?

@jportell: Same thinking here. In my clone spammer build, I’ve been mixing in a bit of Carrion with Rabid to improve the health pool. With this new Dire stat combo, will def switch out Carrion for it.
Any gear with MF stat, the MF stat component will be replaced with something else, hopefully interesting for us. I read it somewhere that Rune of Scavenging gets life steal or something but we’ll see.

Ooooooo Lifesteal. Hmmmm…. Very interesting. But what were the other stats in runes of scavenging?

There u go, my friend : http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Superior_Rune_of_Scavenging

So the lifesteal is going to be updated to the runes of scavenging when magic find is removed? Interesting.

Pyroatheist.9031:

I’ma ctually thinking a tank build using this armor will be a reincarnation potential for my immortal build. We will see.

Yes! Just not featuring retaliation right
Something along these lines maybe (a lot of settlers gear – that and rabid would swap for the new set):
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/mesmer/Guide-The-Immortal-Mesmer-Build/page/10#post2494028

I’m sure your incarnation will be different, but hey, I never gave up on it
I’m curious what you’re thinking about running with the new set …

Traveler’s Runes are getting -IIRC- all stats + condition dmg. That could be interesting…

Advent.6193:

Traveler’s Runes are getting -IIRC- all stats + condition dmg. That could be interesting…

Whoa … coupled with the new dire set (and that nice speed bonus) – 30k HP anyone?
Being facetious there, but man. Some interesting stat combos coming.

Lol with straight exotic soldier’s it isn’t surprising for a mesmer to get 26k maybe 27k. It is a hella lot. A necro with soldier’s US crazy haha. Honestly, straight soldier’s on a necro would probably be around 34k…. Crazy lol

keenlam.4753:

Any gear with MF stat, the MF stat component will be replaced with something else, hopefully interesting for us. I read it somewhere that Rune of Scavenging gets life steal or something but we’ll see.

You got any Links for that? from what i heard gear with Magic find is just getting the Magic find removed and no other stats added or increased. Guess it would be impossible for the same to happen to some of the Runes due to the fact they have so much of it as part of the set.

Overlord.7394:

Lol with straight exotic soldier’s it isn’t surprising for a mesmer to get 26k maybe 27k. It is a hella lot. A necro with soldier’s US crazy haha. Honestly, straight soldier’s on a necro would probably be around 34k…. Crazy lol

Yeah they really need a nerf to the health, seeing as they have DS as well, the health they have should be reduced by 25-30% and given to the class that really needs it – Ele.

ArmageddonAsh.6430:

keenlam.4753:

Any gear with MF stat, the MF stat component will be replaced with something else, hopefully interesting for us. I read it somewhere that Rune of Scavenging gets life steal or something but we’ll see.

You got any Links for that? from what i heard gear with Magic find is just getting the Magic find removed and no other stats added or increased. Guess it would be impossible for the same to happen to some of the Runes due to the fact they have so much of it as part of the set.

Read the front page of GW2, it outlines it clearly as to what is happening with Magic Find.

phokus.8934:

ArmageddonAsh.6430:

keenlam.4753:

Any gear with MF stat, the MF stat component will be replaced with something else, hopefully interesting for us. I read it somewhere that Rune of Scavenging gets life steal or something but we’ll see.

You got any Links for that? from what i heard gear with Magic find is just getting the Magic find removed and no other stats added or increased. Guess it would be impossible for the same to happen to some of the Runes due to the fact they have so much of it as part of the set.

Read the front page of GW2, it outlines it clearly as to what is happening with Magic Find.

I remember reading it was getting removed, nothing about it being replaced with anything.

Dulfy…

All existing drops and crafting recipes that have created Magic Find gear will be replaced with three new combos:
Explorer’s recipes will be replaced with the Assassin’s stat combo (Precision, Power, Critical Damage)
Traveler’s drops will be replaced with the Dire Stat Combo (Condition Damage, Toughness, Vitality)
Pillagers recipes will be replaced with the Hunter’s stat combo (Precision, Power)

ArmageddonAsh.6430:

phokus.8934:

ArmageddonAsh.6430:

keenlam.4753:

Any gear with MF stat, the MF stat component will be replaced with something else, hopefully interesting for us. I read it somewhere that Rune of Scavenging gets life steal or something but we’ll see.

You got any Links for that? from what i heard gear with Magic find is just getting the Magic find removed and no other stats added or increased. Guess it would be impossible for the same to happen to some of the Runes due to the fact they have so much of it as part of the set.

Read the front page of GW2, it outlines it clearly as to what is happening with Magic Find.

I remember reading it was getting removed, nothing about it being replaced with anything.

Just read it, some very interesting changes. It will be interesting to see what happens. I might even stack up on Blue and green items while i can.

ArmageddonAsh.6430:

Yeah they really need a nerf to the health, seeing as they have DS as well, the health they have should be reduced by 25-30% and given to the class that really needs it – Ele.

No way in Hell, bro. Ele’s got better heal abilities, and defensive Boons. Necro gets bounced around like a bloody ragdoll in a prolonged fight. Also, that “DS overflow fix”
seriously reduces their resistance to heavy burst.

Advent.6193:

ArmageddonAsh.6430:

Yeah they really need a nerf to the health, seeing as they have DS as well, the health they have should be reduced by 25-30% and given to the class that really needs it – Ele.

No way in Hell, bro. Ele’s got better heal abilities, and defensive Boons. Necro gets bounced around like a bloody ragdoll in a prolonged fight. Also, that “DS overflow fix”
seriously reduces their resistance to heavy burst.

More heals doesnt mean anything if:

A) ridiculously long cool downs
B) Dont heal for alot unless you trait for i

The healing skills Ele have are meh, you trait/gear to make them better and you will have even less damage then we do now

Cleansing wave for example – 40second cool down for a measly 1,300 heal (without traits, 60 healing stats) sorry but that is awful, I just saw the Ranger Heal, now THAT is the kind of heal Ele need to counter the seriously low health, armor and damage.

Necro have plenty of other defensive options, Plenty of fear, torment, cripple, Spectral skills and easy to gain Life Force. They can also kite with ease thanks to being able to switch between melee and range.

Compare that to ele, forced to either stay melee and deal damage or be at range and deal none, HALF the health, less damage and less armor…

ArmageddonAsh.6430:

phokus.8934:

ArmageddonAsh.6430:

keenlam.4753:

Any gear with MF stat, the MF stat component will be replaced with something else, hopefully interesting for us. I read it somewhere that Rune of Scavenging gets life steal or something but we’ll see.

You got any Links for that? from what i heard gear with Magic find is just getting the Magic find removed and no other stats added or increased. Guess it would be impossible for the same to happen to some of the Runes due to the fact they have so much of it as part of the set.

Read the front page of GW2, it outlines it clearly as to what is happening with Magic Find.

I remember reading it was getting removed, nothing about it being replaced with anything.

You really should check out the stuff that appears in your game launcher after typing in your login-data, you know… ^^

https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/economy-report-brace-yourself-disequilibrium-is-coming/

It’s almost at the bottom.

Edit: Just saw you’ve already read it by now. Nvm then. ^^

Edit 2: It appears the forum is not able to quote more than two posts at once… I’ve actually quoted the whole post with the quote of the quote in it, but it only shows the “outer two quotes” outside of editing mode. -_-

Saturn.6591:

ArmageddonAsh.6430:

phokus.8934:

ArmageddonAsh.6430:

keenlam.4753:

Any gear with MF stat, the MF stat component will be replaced with something else, hopefully interesting for us. I read it somewhere that Rune of Scavenging gets life steal or something but we’ll see.

You got any Links for that? from what i heard gear with Magic find is just getting the Magic find removed and no other stats added or increased. Guess it would be impossible for the same to happen to some of the Runes due to the fact they have so much of it as part of the set.

Read the front page of GW2, it outlines it clearly as to what is happening with Magic Find.

I remember reading it was getting removed, nothing about it being replaced with anything.

You really should check out the stuff that appears in your game launcher after typing in your login-data, you know… ^^

https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/economy-report-brace-yourself-disequilibrium-is-coming/

It’s almost at the bottom.

Edit: Just saw you’ve already read it by now. Nvm then. ^^

Edit 2: It appears the forum is not able to quote more than two posts at once… I’ve actually quoted the whole post with the quote of the quote in it, but it only shows the “outer two quotes” outside of editing mode. -_-

Already read it and i have it so i sign in automatically

ArmageddonAsh.6430:

Overlord.7394:

Lol with straight exotic soldier’s it isn’t surprising for a mesmer to get 26k maybe 27k. It is a hella lot. A necro with soldier’s US crazy haha. Honestly, straight soldier’s on a necro would probably be around 34k…. Crazy lol

Yeah they really need a nerf to the health, seeing as they have DS as well, the health they have should be reduced by 25-30% and given to the class that really needs it – Ele.

Overlord.7394:

Lol with straight exotic soldier’s it isn’t surprising for a mesmer to get 26k maybe 27k. It is a hella lot. A necro with soldier’s US crazy haha. Honestly, straight soldier’s on a necro would probably be around 34k…. Crazy lol

That’s slightly misleading; a necromancer wearing all exotic soldier’s gear can only hit the 30k mark. And personally, considering the sort of sustain that eles have in regards to health through boons and heals, I don’t really think a health boost is warranted. Sure, you have to devote some points into certain traitlines but you have that option. Necromancers and mesmers don’t have those sorts of options available.

Early in this thread someone thought they might start seeing bunker condition builds using the staff for conditions due to the addition of this armor. That’s an interesting idea (especially the 0/0/20/20/30) with Dire; however, you all should keep in mind the value of precision and the dueling trait line to a staff condition build is less tied to Sharper Images than you think.

Critical Infusion (5pt Dueling minor) gives vigor for 5 seconds. I cannot express fully how valuable this has been to me. Staff condition builds need staff clones, and while a rabid setup with no domination points leaves you with low power, shattering is still a valuable way to add to your damage output. If you run outta clones to apply conditions because you shattered then the low damage of your shatters becomes a hindrance. But with Critical Infusion and Deceptive Evasion you can generate a ton of staff clones as well as avoid damage. I am never without the ability to shatter and create a full compliment of staff clones.

In addition to shattering, clone generation can become a problem when facing very high damage foes who rip through your clones like paper. This trait combination helps in that situation as well.

Since it is always possible to bust out a full compliment of clones Ether Feast is always a beast heal.

And finally, Sharper Images adds icing to the cake with this set up. Add in the extra bouncing trait and you’re set for some wonderful condition application. Now a build like this takes a while to get its damage up and is not made for fast kills; but between phase retreat, blink, blurred frenzy, distortion, mass invis, chaos storm, several ways to get chaos armor, and your clones you have plenty of ways to avoid damage while taking almost any opponent down.

Dawdler as I re-read parts of this thread I saw you said you couldn’t quite get condition tanking down. The toughness in the rabid set definitely helps me survive, but the tons of rolling helps at least as much.

Also, remember that with a class like the Mesmer it is not always about mitigating damage through stats as with other classes.

Paraphrasing Mr Prometheus from an old youtube video: “From a design and flavor perspective the mesmer is a wizard that uses deception and chaos to gain advantage over their opponent.” He goes on to say many useful things that you probably already know. But the essence of that statement is embodied in the staff condi build I outlined earlier.

I tank bosses many times when the group needs to all help each other up not by absorbing all the damage but by distracting the boss and avoiding his/her hits. Sometimes even going so far as to start rezzing a fallen ally, to bring me at the head of the aggro list, only to stop and teleport away leaving clones and slowly dragging the boss away so that someone else can finish the actual rezzing.

I know many GS zerkers say they can do the same thing – and we’ve all seen it done – but the margin for error for them is really quite low and you’re comment was about tanking.

This type of build can be used for spvp capturing and holding points as well, not just pve bosses. I hope this helps a bit, if you have further questions feel free to message me in game or post here and ask for my specific trait setup.

Pyroatheist.9031:

I’ma ctually thinking a tank build using this armor will be a reincarnation potential for my immortal build. We will see.

I know this is an old thread to bump, but man I hate all the bazillions of threads to have to dig through when you create one more. My question though is directed at Pyroatheist. Have you had a chance to test this to see if its viable as a revival of your immortal build? I am very interested in the Dire set and also with Traveler’s runes. Is a set incorporating this feasible? I would love to have a decent build that balances strong boon support with condition damage incorporating traveler’s but not sure about the setup. Some words of wisdom here would be great.

So I will be posting a build relatively soon that uses Dire armor, after testing with it I realized that Traveler runes are great but I didn’t get as much as I wanted except OOC mobility. However I was not trying to balance support with damage I was and still am going for high damage output, I could easily see a build however combine Traveler runes with Dire armor if it was focused in this way. With Traveler runes and 30 in Chaos you are at 45% Boon duration with 50& condition duration if you eat Rare veggie Pizza, which is are both good numbers to be sitting at if a balance of support and damage is the goal.

EDIT: Don’t worry about bumping an old thread, it is better than the tons of Perplexity discussions we have going on right now.

Thanks for this reply Deathcon! Fabulous you remembered, can’t wait to see what people are posting now. I figured perplexity might be popular, but I am loving the perma swiftness until they decide to throw us a bone and give us a real swiftness utility skill. I like emphasis on a defense/offense build, and would love to have a high damage/high boon support build that offers great synergy that way.

Freedan.1769:

Pyroatheist.9031:

I’ma ctually thinking a tank build using this armor will be a reincarnation potential for my immortal build. We will see.

I know this is an old thread to bump, but man I hate all the bazillions of threads to have to dig through when you create one more. My question though is directed at Pyroatheist. Have you had a chance to test this to see if its viable as a revival of your immortal build? I am very interested in the Dire set and also with Traveler’s runes. Is a set incorporating this feasible? I would love to have a decent build that balances strong boon support with condition damage incorporating traveler’s but not sure about the setup. Some words of wisdom here would be great.

Yeah, I’ve been testing some things out. All of my results have, unfortunately, been overwhelmingly negative. For a lot of reasons, it just doesn’t have the survivability that my old immortal build had, and it also doesn’t have enough condie pressure to kill most opponents.

That being said, I have been mucking around with a technique that lets me run my old immortal build a good portion as effective, but I’m not quite ready to put up a guide for it yet.

Thank you for your honesty Pyro. To be honest, I haven’t played much lately because I am very ticked off at the moment about my Mesmer’s ability to play builds other than shatter or raw damage. I don’t like how our options have thinned; we are supposed to be a flexible class in this game, why I chose Mesmer to start. I am sick of playing builds with no finesse, no alternate strategy. I like playing to the beat of my own drum; and for me that means making use of other game mechanics. I believe I can be effective killing things using buffs from boons, damage from conditions, and thinking outside the box. I want the developer’s in this game to recognize that weakening builds that celebrate thinking outside the box is totally the wrong attitude. Direct damage is so obvious its lame; I want to win through cunning. I miss glamour builds, and I have always hated the built-in limits to boon duration especially. I still want to use it though. I like buffing boons to increase damage and then turn around and empower allies or buff myself to be effective. I just wish someone would give me the build that will do that the best at this point, because right now I am actually rather weak until I find my focus.