Guild Wars 2

Note: This is mainly for discussion on PvE, but I also do some Wv3 on occasion, so that can be taken into consideration. Preferably a stat assignment that allows me to switch a few of my major traits to accommodate would be ideal.

Basically the title. As I have surfed the forums over the last X amount of time, a good majority of the posts have been focused on heavy-shatter builds. These builds usually run a skeleton frame of 0/20/0/0/30, with the remaining points being spent based on flavor preferences or weapon choice. While I understand the potential a shatter build has, I really don’t like the idea of being pigeon-holed of using 30 in Illusions for IP.

I run Swords as one weapon set, so I go into dueling willingly. But I used to run a build with no more than 5 in Illusions for the 20% CDR. I have amended my build since then, but I still can’t seem to bring myself to do 30 for Illusions. I feel it kills some of my potential survivability in exchange for burst. I know many people get kicks out of seeing huge damage numbers, but I can do pretty decent DPS in dungeon scenarios while not dying just fine.

In fact, in dungeons, I find I am one of the sturdier members of my group that I run with regularly, which consists of 2 warriors, a guardian, a ranger, and myself. I also bring an assortment of utility that is beneficial to my team, as well as damage. I find I enjoy bringing out Phantasms more than shattering my illusions. On boss encounters where I can, I’ll try to keep up 2 or 3 Phantasms at any one time. On encounters where this may not be feasible, I will opt to shatter, but in these scenarios, unless I am in the middle of my sword combo of getting in, pressing 2, and getting out, I don’t shatter next to the boss. The other uses of IP (a free daze and 1 sec immunity with no clones) I feel like I can get by understanding my enemy and timing other abilities appropriately.

I’m just wanting to know what else other people run that doesn’t focus on shattering illusions exclusively, if anything. I’m debating whether or not I should take some points out of the Chaos and Inspiration trees to give me that 30 in Illusions.

I appreciate any discussion.

I run a tanky Mantra build with S/S-GS. Works fine as far as I’m concerned. I’m still relatively low level, but I find myself to be a very viable part of the group. It fits my commando style pretty well.

In PvP where I already have my whole list of traits open, that’s where the fun is. Nearly immune to all status effects, as well as having many, many AoE heals makes life really interesting.

I currently run with a condition build
0/25/25/0/20

I’ve also run plenty of times with a “balanced” reflection-heavy spec (0/20/20/20/10)

I rarely run without the “clone on dodge” Trait, though I have some guildies who LOVE their phantasm build which doesn’t use it.

In my experience, mesmers are pretty diverse. The GS berserker ‘bug’ on the table right now is a little crippling, but otherwise I haven’t noticed too many people in a shatter-dependent build in game. On the forums… there are quite a few, but it doesn’t seem out of the ordinary.

Your build sounds fun! I run 0/25/25/0/20 or /020/25/0/25 condition damage spec staff/scepter-whatever . I hardly ever die and I never let up the pressure on my target, it’s really cool.

I run a staff condition damage build, I do shatter my clones but only when I want to drop more conditions or spread some AoE confusion around. You’d be amazed at the difference that a bunch of +20% crit buffs bouncing off of the boss will do for a group… vulnerability helps too.

Edit: running a 10/25/10/0/25 build at the moment. Upon further reflection, I do shatter my clones a decent amount, but only because I’m generating them so quickly. Utilities are Mirror Images, Radiation Field, Signet of Domination, and Time Warp. Gear is precision, toughness, condition damage (trinkets are power, precision, condition damage only because there isn’t a precision, toughness, condition damage trinket set). Runes are Undead.

Basically, drop as many conditions and buffs around as quickly as possible, keep doing so until the bad guys are dead. Profit.

I’d be very interested to see a good Non-GS build though, could be worth picking up another gear set… what’s this Mantra-based build everybody talks about?

I don’t think I’ve ever seen the dying need to go 30 illusions for IP. granted, as I tend to run the oddest builds ever, but they work. Currently, i’m running 20/0/30/0/20 and a staff. Yes, it uses shatters quite a bit (who doesn’t enjoy 25 stacks of vulnerability ) but it isn’t constant shattering.

But seriously, the skeleton build for shattering does feel confining on a build, but we’re mesmers. we have quite possibly the MOST variety in builds in the game, excluding weapons.

I shatter when appropriate. It’s never at the same time, or part of a “rotation”. The Situation dictates my actions. Sometimes it’s better to stack phantasms. Sometimes your clones are doing little more then distracting, and once they can’t do that, might as well shatter.

When I see that I can pump out another 2 clones, 1 phantasm, I access the situation. If all 3 are up in a tight group, I might mind wrack for the damage, but in a party, I’m more likely to daze. No one thanks you afterwards, but those few seconds the boss couldn’’t do anything helped. If your kitten is really in the sling, maybe shatter for the diversion. Shatter for more confusion if you think it will help, though I personally think this is the worst reason to shatter.

My point being that shattering is just a part of a successful build. It’s 4 skills that you have access too to some degree in every fight. It’s nothing to build off of. Maybe something to build around.

If you are only interested in PvP, and you saw how this one guy bursted hard with shatters, just remember that that particuler combo is learned now, and you will have to learn how to actually play the class now.

When I used to do some wvw I tried a condition-on-death build, it was quite fun.

10/25/20/0/10 and 5 points left for whatever you want to use it on. Traits are crippling dissipation, debilitating dissipation, illusionary defense, compounding power, blade training and deceptive evasion. Use mainhand sword. For skills decoy, mirror images and another of your choice, I used feedback. Offhand is entirely up to you, I usually went sword or focus. Scepter on weapon swap. Use bleed on crit sigil and gear for condition damage and precision.

Basically the idea is to produce clones like crazy and shove them in your opponent’s face. If they choose to kill it, they suffer from crippling dissipation, debilitating dissipation and confusing combatants. If they choose to ignore them, you get more defense and power from illusionary defense and compounding illusions, and your sword clones will continue to apply vulnerability and bleeds with their attacks. Either way you win. Even if you have 3 illusions out you should constantly try to produce more so that the old ones explode in your opponents face, providing near permanent confusion, aoe cripple and one random aoe condition once you get your rotation going. Their condition removal means nothing and will quickly run out if they choose to use them. As a bonus you will almost always have 3 illusions out so if you do choose to shatter they will have maximum effect all the time and heal lots with ether feast. Shattering itself is not recommended in this build though since they don’t trigger on-death traits, so don’t use them too much.

Mainhand sword is essential as the clones spawned while wielding it will run to your target and annoy the crap out of them where they will be in range of on-death traits.

The build is weak against ranged opponents as they can safely kill clones away from the area of effect of clone-on-death, but they won’t be able to catch up to the speed you produce clones once you get close enough. If using a focus you can always pull them closer to you or get some swiftness to catch up to them. If using a torch the stealth from prestige will allow you to get close without taking too much damage and help with your general survivability. Use sword #3 to immobilise once in range. You also lack aoe damage and the dps of a condition bunker/gs glass cannon, and no condition removal unless you include null field or mantra for your last skill. I used sigil of purity in my offhand weapon instead for limited condition removal. So it’s more of an offensive support build where you can run around being a real thorn on the side, applying conditions like crazy and whittling away your opponent’s health with bleeds and confusion damage.

In pve it becomes more defensive and you’ll have lots of survivability if choosing to kite with the constant cripple. Lots of clones and if using torch lots of stealth allows you to take on many mobs at once while doing good bleeding damage.
In PvE they don’t usually go for your clones, and I found that a good way to raise the chance they will go for them is to dodge backwards just before they attack. Don’t dodge sideways or forward, only backwards. It seems to work better, at least in my experience. Even if it doesn’t at the least you get a meat shield for homing ranged projectiles that take the hit for you everytime if you dodge backwards. If you dodge too early the clone will run up to your enemy and they’ll ignore it. Do it just before they swing and they’ll hit and kill the clone as soon as it is generated.

I’m currently running a mantra/signet healing bunker build

10 Dom – Signet recharge. This is mainly for Illusions shatter reset

30 Inspiration – Healing mantras and heal on shatter mostly

30 Illusions – Shatter on self is where the magic begins, every shatter regardless of whether I have summons out is a free 2.5k+ heal. Also run shatters recharge at 25% health (not 50% as it lists sadly). I also run Blind causes confusion so I can pop signet of midnight as a confusion bomb as well as a stunbreak

Running a mix of Cleric and Magic gear with Water/Flock runes for all around survivability and massive healing

I’ve been loving this build since I can just sit there and string together 11 heals before cooldown becomes an issue, and even then, my mantra of healing is ready to be recast (which will also heal me a great deal on chant)

For skills I run Mantra of Healing, Signet of Illusions, Signet of Midnight, Mantra of Confusion, Mantra of Cleansing, Charrzooka (for when I need to do some knockback magic and combo missiles)

im running an hybrid phantasm/condition focused build, using a staff and a GS or sword/pistol depending on the situation

my gear is mainly knight (power/prec/tough) and Carrion (or was it rampager?) jewellry and weapons (power/prec/cond) also 6 undead runes

traits focused on boosting phantasm damage and CD reduction

Kelthien.8593:

I currently run with a condition build
0/25/25/0/20

I’ve also run plenty of times with a “balanced” reflection-heavy spec (0/20/20/20/10)

I rarely run without the “clone on dodge” Trait, though I have some guildies who LOVE their phantasm build which doesn’t use it.

In my experience, mesmers are pretty diverse. The GS berserker ‘bug’ on the table right now is a little crippling, but otherwise I haven’t noticed too many people in a shatter-dependent build in game. On the forums… there are quite a few, but it doesn’t seem out of the ordinary.

I’ve used both of these build with great success. They are two of my favorites (currently using 0/25/25/0/20).

With the Condition build I usually run Decoy/Mirror images and try to be a clone factory to spread more conditions and the on death traits. With MI ready I almost always shatter because I know I can instantly have 3 clones back up before the first 3 blow up.

That’s pretty much how I do it with a Condition build. Since I have so many ways to generate clones/phantasms, I typically shatter quite often. Except on boss fights that don’t insta-kill your illusion’s I try to get 3 iDuelists up asap and just let them keep the bleeds stacking for me.

As good as iPersona is, its a situational skill that is most effective at melee range. For iPersona based builds you are pidgeon-holed into staff or sword/offhand in order to take full advantage of it.

If using a greatsword specific ranged build you can afford to only go 20 in to illusions for illusionary elasticity (which heavily affects mirrored blade) if your are playing ranged since your never going to be close enough for iPersona anyway.

As it currently stands, the illusion tree is a mandatory tree for any build. You are pidgeon-holed into at least 5 points in illusions for the reduced CDs and the talents available from illusions are vastly superior to other trees, such as the last 10 points in domination (which is near useless).

I agree that the Grandmaster traits for other trees should be re-evaluated for more build flexibility.

I didn’t actually see the point of Phantasm-builds before the recent changes, either. They’re inherently tied the ability to provide Phantasm-buffs/-support with them to me, and that still being bugged, rubbish.

Hence, Shatter. All the way. I had a build without dodge-clones the other day, felt completely weird.

Most successful mesmer builds use shatters regularly simply because they are 4 rather powerful abilities that you will always have access to. Though in many builds only 2-3 may be all that useful (MW and Distortion will always be useful). Simply, at least one of the shatters is almost always worth it at any given time unless you are running a phantasm army build. You just have to know the right time.

The only time I don’t shatter is when bringing down a gate or siege in WvWvW after the defenders have been disposed since 3 wardens tend to outdo MW and siege don’t move. I run a 20/20/0/20/10 power/crit build with GS/S-F, but even with only 10 in illusions I shatter often (generally as soon as my next phant is free). The rest of my damage comes from phantasm bursts, reflection (OMG I love Warden’s Feedback), and BF dashes.

For my next build I want to work torch into the fold instead of GS with a power/cond loadout for an even more elusive, skirmishing duelist concept. Not sure how it will work out, but I’m sure I will still be using my shatters quite often. I just can’t see many situations where they would be unfavorable, especially if you keep your power at a reasonable level. Condition damage for CoF in PVP is even more win.

20/30/0/0/20 for pve and dungeon, quite squishy i know but the staff double bouncing plus the warlock criting over 5k damage is quite worth, also there is the pistol phantasm which hits 8 bleed stacks. I run berseker gear.

My combo,:
Staff 3 , 2 , 5 and 4 get close change to sword and pistol 2 then 5 then i get a little away for the 4 and 3.

Its good to see not everyone is on the IP train.

I agree that there is a lot of utility in the Illusions tree, and that probably each tier is better than comparable tiers in terms of variety in the other trees. I like being able to use Phantasmal Haste on boss fights where I can keep Phantasms fighting all the time, and switching it out for an extra bounce on fights where I might be ranged fighting and shattering more often than Phantasm stacking. I’m not saying shattering is inherently bad, but I was just wondering if people used builds that allowed them to do other things other than shatter endlessly (I myself shatter frequently on trash, and in boss encounters where I know my clones will be AoE’d/killed frequently). I’m enjoying seeing the variety posted here. I must admit I don’t see too many mesmers when I am dungeoning and such, so I’m not sure what people are running, but the forums are full of shatters, so I was looking to see how dependent people were(n’t) on shatters.

I tend to run a 20/0/30/0/20 condition damage build in PvE as well as W3, though my groups are usually melee heavy so my extra staff bounce and staff #5 are even more useful. I shatter, of course, but my build isn’t built around shattering. It’s just one of our core mechanics and, honestly, it needs to be used if you’re really doing your “best”.

I run the “Triple Sword Style” mesmer build in PvE, Dungeons & Fractals
Using GS + Sword/Sword, utilites are mostly Manipulation type.
Build numbers 20-30-15-0-5

Running 25(I, X), 30(II,IV,X), 5,0,10(I)
with sword/pistol / Greatsword
in PvE.

I shattered before it was mainstream. #hipster

I run an old clone factory/no shatter build (10/30/20/0/10) using GS and S/P.

Doh, yeah I’m definitely guilty of supporting that shatter bandwagon, but to be honest I actually didn’t run with Illusionary Persona until a few weeks ago. There are definitely some other ideas out there, though some of mine might be outdated by now.

ddoi.9264:

When I used to do some wvw I tried a condition-on-death build, it was quite fun.

This I’ve run before and found it to be pretty good, actually, even in PvE. Most of the AoE was iBerserker (not so good now, obviously) and iWarden, and once two phantasms were up, there was some effectiveness in generating one clone at time, each time waiting for it to get close so that its “on death” explosion would hit. I suppose in PvE cripple isn’t so stellar, but the chaos and confusions one are still worth something.

I enjoyed Confusion/Blind for a while, though I still feel like confusion is not terribly powerful… something like 20/0/0/20/30 with heavy glamour, running scepter/torch and staff, condition damage & duration, and Feedback/Null Field/SoMidnight. It annoys in PvP, but it’s not so hot in PvE where bosses aren’t really affected by Blind.

For specifically non-Illusion builds, there are some condition or healing themed bunker builds that would probably work, centered around staff or restorative mantras/illusions, respectively.

I see a lot of people listing condition builds but I had ran a crit build at mid-level (40-50ish). It was mostly based on greatsword procing criticals 44% of the time and giving phatasms fury and bleeding on their crit procs. It would be fine at 80 but is focused on phantasms surviving.

A better build would probably be 30 Domination 30 Precision and 10 Chaos with sword/sword focusing on daze and mantras:

Illusion of Vulnerability Inflict 5 seconds of vulnerability when you interrupt a foe.
Dazzling Inflicting daze also causes 3 seconds of vulnerability.
Wastrel’s Punishment 5% increased damage to inactive foes.
Halting Strike Deal damage when interrupting a foe.
Rending Shatter Shattering illusions causes vulnerability for 8 seconds to nearby foes.
Harmonious Mantras Mantras can be activated three times before needing to be channeled again.

Critical Infusion Gain 1 second of vigor on critical hits.
Sharper Images Illusions inflict bleeding on critical hits.
Confusing Combatants Your illusions cause 3 seconds of confusion when they are killed.
Blade Training +50 precision while wielding a one-handed sword or a spear. Reduces the recharge of sword and spear skills by 20%.
Deceptive Evasion Create a clone at your current position when you dodge.
Furious Interruption Gain 4 seconds of fury when you interrupt a foe.

Metaphysical Rejuvenation Gain 10 seconds of regeneration when your health reaches 75% (30-second cooldown).
Illusionary Defense 3% reduced damage for each illusion you have in the world.

Mantra of Recovery
Mantra of Distraction
Option – Mantra of Pain , Signet of Domination, Mirror Images, Feedback, Other
Option – Technobabble (Asura) – Battle Roar (Charr) – Prayer to Lyssa (Human) – Call Wurm (Norn) – Grasping Vines (Sylvari)
Time Warp

I am going to give this a try once I collect a second armor set. This build would want mostly the power/precision/crit damage stats w/ precision and crit damage infusions and I am running around in Traveler’s gear for the magic find boost.

IP is really too good of a trait to pass up for a power/precision build because of how it works.

The damage YOU deal is based on the per illusion damage of your shatter. Mind Wrack doesn’t scale linearly like other shatters, it does most of it’s max potential with a single illusion.

For example, if a single Illusion deals 500 damage, two deal 700 (350 each) and three deal 1000 (333 each) then IP causes a single illusion shatter to match, or at least nearly match, a 3 illusion shatter without since you get an extra 500 damage.

*Note numbers are just an example to illustrate the point of how MW scales and how that effects IP. Go to the mists and test your 1/2/3 illusion damage totals (ignoring crits) with and without it. You may be surprised.

I am currently running a Support build which relies on phantams being upthat also has decent crits. It is mostly expermenting I may switch to a more power or Inspiration build with more focus towards shatters but so far I Like what i have
Using staff/ Sword/Pistol In dungeons I tend to go with staff/ Secpter/ Focus
Stats
Dom 10
Dueling 20
Chaos 15
Inspiration 20
Illusions 5

I have a full set of Dwaynma runes and Use energy Sigil and water at the moment
My gear is generally a mix of beserkers and Cleric Jewelry I have a bit of vitality

Traits I tend to use are
Domination Empowered Illusions
Duelist Either Blade training or Phantasmal Fury if in dungeons/ Deceptive evasion
Choas I switch alot from Illusionary Defense/ Debailitating Disspation or Descent in to madness for puizzles
Inspiration Menders purity, Harmonius Mantras

My skills when I am in a small group or solo tend to be
Mantra of Recovery
Mantra of pain
Mantra of Distraction
Feedback
In larger groups Or in dungeons
Mantra of Recovery
Mantra of Pain
Feedback
Null field
My elite tends to be Time warp most of the time.