Guild Wars 2

So I recently decided to main mesmer and I came to these forums expecting a lot of excited threads with how mesmer has become really good. However, instead all I seem to see are threads with a lot of whining about the BUFFS?!!

I don’t understand this, could someone clear this up as to why these buffs are bad? Before when I visited these forums it was posts complaining about why mesmer has been nerfed and was not very strong, but now it’s the opposite… I find this kind of ridiculous.

I personally thing this is where mesmers should be, it makes them closer to GW1 mesmers and it’s put them at the tier they really needed to be.

Yep. This forum hides some sick masochists. Don’t worry, Anet is already on the nerftrain mesmer express, soon we’ll be back to asking for fixes and buffs and all will be well in mesmer world.

Its a mixture of the strange s&m complex some mesmers have here and bad pvp players who have come here to whine especailly since we now have builds that can stand against theives.

It’s also partially because people don’t want themselves to be overpowered. Some people are also not exclusively mesmer players, and don’t want one profession to be simply dominant over the others.

But don’t worry, there’s at least an equal amount of people to also complain about nerfs to balance them out.

FZeroWing.2098:

However, instead all I seem to see are threads with a lot of whining about the BUFFS?!!

I don’t understand this, could someone clear this up as to why these buffs are bad?

You are given candy, It looks delicious, but it turns out to be Harry Potter’s Anyflavored Jelly Bean. That chocolate you just ate? Really poo flavored. That’s what is happening to Mesmers right now.

Everyone was having a grand ol’ time experimenting with builds, learning the new potential metas. Searching for it. Specing, respecing, and then BAM, one after another key trait abilities get utterly butchered.

That time you spent playing around with that trait? That you built around? Wasted. It’s worthless now.

They shouldn’t be making balance changes this soon. They should be fixing bugs with trait interaction for all the classes, but right now, they’re focused on obliterating us. It’s what they do, it’s what they’re good at.

it’s been 2 days. We’ve been nerfed 3 times already. All you mesmers that claim it’s no fun anymore, get ready for some more “fun”.

Soon enough, in the end, all we’ll have will be shatters again. And people will complain that all we have are shatters.

Again.
(pre Chrono, but who knows what would happen then, I wouldn’t bet against it happening the same lol)

I don’t think people are asking for flat nerfs – there are specific traits that look problematic, and generally they take the focus. For example a while back I flagged Confounding combatants, chaotic dampening and PU as very likely to be changed – but that was out of 40+ buffs!

Better to have the actual problems addressed than something completely fine.

Agree with thetarot. It’s the same thing with conditions being “op”. Conditions are op in sPvP partly because they were not really present in high-tier PvP before so people got used to run with hardly any condi-cleanse and without much defense.
Let players get accustomed to the new situation and then see what is really op and nerf it.

FZeroWing.2098:

So I recently decided to main mesmer and I came to these forums expecting a lot of excited threads with how mesmer has become really good. However, instead all I seem to see are threads with a lot of whining about the BUFFS?!!

I don’t understand this, could someone clear this up as to why these buffs are bad? Before when I visited these forums it was posts complaining about why mesmer has been nerfed and was not very strong, but now it’s the opposite… I find this kind of ridiculous.

I personally thing this is where mesmers should be, it makes them closer to GW1 mesmers and it’s put them at the tier they really needed to be.

I may not main my mesmer but you should read the first thing you said and think a bit.

Now people get all kitteny about class forums and who post where but let me break it down to you. We are at he point where some players have invested loads of time on their favorite class purely because they enjoy it. Many of them win or lose have been honing their skills. There is a sense of pride in beating a player using a cheese build that should have beat you on skill alone.

The problem is a great deal of players do not think like this. They play what they know they will win on. In there lies the rub. You have a medium good player who got good at a class/build who now has the tools to strictly dominate other players. For months if not years they have played a build that required a certain amount of skill but now they can beat opponents they had issues with with ease.

You said, “So I recently decided to main mesmer”, but how many times across many class forums have we seen the, “So I recently decided to main x” statement after a major buff? Too many. Memsers aren’t masochist they just want the feeling of beating some one based on skill. I main engineer but refuse to use incendiary powder until burning in general is re-balanced. I am not some masochist but some of the luster is gone when the wins come too easy. Now while the world screams “Nerf!” (because they are losing) some players want nerfs/ rebalancing because its not fun anymore. This might be over some of your heads because the mere sight of a nerf warrants an angry post in your opinions.

Some players love their class so much they actually want to see it balanced and not OP. Novel idea isn’kitten

I feel a lot of Mesmers on this forum played mesmer in GW1. For most of GW1, pre-EOTN, the mesmer was low damage, and required a lot of skill to play in comparison to the other classes.

When GW2 arrived, the class was FAR easier to play than the GW1 Mesmer, which sorta ticked me off. I got over it. Now, the Mesmer has been dumbed down further.

The class had high risk with medium to low reward. So, finding a build that worked and was better than high risk/low reward was satisfying.

TheGuy.3568:

FZeroWing.2098:

So I recently decided to main mesmer and I came to these forums expecting a lot of excited threads with how mesmer has become really good. However, instead all I seem to see are threads with a lot of whining about the BUFFS?!!

I don’t understand this, could someone clear this up as to why these buffs are bad? Before when I visited these forums it was posts complaining about why mesmer has been nerfed and was not very strong, but now it’s the opposite… I find this kind of ridiculous.

I personally thing this is where mesmers should be, it makes them closer to GW1 mesmers and it’s put them at the tier they really needed to be.

I may not main my mesmer but you should read the first thing you said and think a bit.

Now people get all kitteny about class forums and who post where but let me break it down to you. We are at he point where some players have invested loads of time on their favorite class purely because they enjoy it. Many of them win or lose have been honing their skills. There is a sense of pride in beating a player using a cheese build that should have beat you on skill alone.

The problem is a great deal of players do not think like this. They play what they know they will win on. In there lies the rub. You have a medium good player who got good at a class/build who now has the tools to strictly dominate other players. For months if not years they have played a build that required a certain amount of skill but now they can beat opponents they had issues with with ease.

You said, “So I recently decided to main mesmer”, but how many times across many class forums have we seen the, “So I recently decided to main x” statement after a major buff? Too many. Memsers aren’t masochist they just want the feeling of beating some one based on skill. I main engineer but refuse to use incendiary powder until burning in general is re-balanced. I am not some masochist but some of the luster is gone when the wins come too easy. Now while the world screams “Nerf!” (because they are losing) some players want nerfs/ rebalancing because its not fun anymore. This might be over some of your heads because the mere sight of a nerf warrants an angry post in your opinions.

Some players love their class so much they actually want to see it balanced and not OP. Novel idea isn’kitten

I won’t say I’m sure, but why do I feel like thieves don’t even come close to thinking like this. Because I for one am the opposite of your description of Mesmer mains. I’m tired of getting the short end of the stick. What I complain about is not about the nerfs and however unfair they are, but the fact that when it comes to drastic changes, most of the time it’s the mesmers that get hit hard due to nerfcries and only some times on other classes.

Sorry for what you’re seeing now OP. This forum was a really good community. Mesmer went a long time without seeing any real meaningful changes, instead we frequently not nerfs or saw bugs appear that took months to get fixed (iBerserker not landing all of its hits for example). It’s made many people quite a bit jaded.

What the Mesmer needed is what we just got – some major overhauls. Things like baseline IP and Mantras that recharge immediately (rather than after the last charge is used) are things that should have been part of the original Mesmer design.

The fact is we DID end up with some very potent options out of this patch and anyone who didn’t expect some slight nerfs is utterly foolish. Most people are upset because it seems Mesmer is a priority to get nerfed while other classes also received potent options that haven’t been touched yet.

Rest assured there are still some helpful people out there. Though people who were previously helpful have become quite toxic (you know who you are), a lot of it is like a dog whose been beaten flinching when you raise your hand.

Give it time for the nerfs (and ‘flinching’) to settle and Mesmers will realize how much better off and viable we are.

Caelus.7139:

Soon enough, in the end, all we’ll have will be shatters again. And people will complain that all we have are shatters.

Again.
(pre Chrono, but who knows what would happen then, I wouldn’t bet against it happening the same lol)

Looking at chrono traits, it seems to me that it will be useful for shatters and phantasm builds, and shatter/phantasm hybrids… I mean come on, shatter phantasms twice, AND get a free clone when you shatter.

Caelus.7139:

TheGuy.3568:

FZeroWing.2098:

So I recently decided to main mesmer and I came to these forums expecting a lot of excited threads with how mesmer has become really good. However, instead all I seem to see are threads with a lot of whining about the BUFFS?!!

I don’t understand this, could someone clear this up as to why these buffs are bad? Before when I visited these forums it was posts complaining about why mesmer has been nerfed and was not very strong, but now it’s the opposite… I find this kind of ridiculous.

I personally thing this is where mesmers should be, it makes them closer to GW1 mesmers and it’s put them at the tier they really needed to be.

I may not main my mesmer but you should read the first thing you said and think a bit.

Now people get all kitteny about class forums and who post where but let me break it down to you. We are at he point where some players have invested loads of time on their favorite class purely because they enjoy it. Many of them win or lose have been honing their skills. There is a sense of pride in beating a player using a cheese build that should have beat you on skill alone.

The problem is a great deal of players do not think like this. They play what they know they will win on. In there lies the rub. You have a medium good player who got good at a class/build who now has the tools to strictly dominate other players. For months if not years they have played a build that required a certain amount of skill but now they can beat opponents they had issues with with ease.

You said, “So I recently decided to main mesmer”, but how many times across many class forums have we seen the, “So I recently decided to main x” statement after a major buff? Too many. Memsers aren’t masochist they just want the feeling of beating some one based on skill. I main engineer but refuse to use incendiary powder until burning in general is re-balanced. I am not some masochist but some of the luster is gone when the wins come too easy. Now while the world screams “Nerf!” (because they are losing) some players want nerfs/ rebalancing because its not fun anymore. This might be over some of your heads because the mere sight of a nerf warrants an angry post in your opinions.

Some players love their class so much they actually want to see it balanced and not OP. Novel idea isn’kitten

I won’t say I’m sure, but why do I feel like thieves don’t even come close to thinking like this. Because I for one am the opposite of your description of Mesmer mains. I’m tired of getting the short end of the stick. What I complain about is not about the nerfs and however unfair they are, but the fact that when it comes to drastic changes, most of the time it’s the mesmers that get hit hard due to nerfcries and only some times on other classes.

You can’t make a blanket statement about thieves. Many lobbied for nerfs early on for this same reason. They just got forced back into burst and for many (including my SP thief) this has been one of the worst patches for a class I know I could still win on if I played DP.

Every class feels like they got the short end of the stick at some point. The difference is realizing when you have been buffed too much. That takes time but the only people who could really say it feel off are those who main the class. The best rule of thumb is if you stop having trouble handling builds that used to challenge you, you see to consistently win (where you didn’t before), or wins are simply too easy.

Mesmers for a long time along with some non HGH (when HGH was still good) engies, and some ele builds actually required a good deal of skill to pull off. There was a great deal of knowledge that went into winning. Right now too many builds (not just mesmer’s its wide spread) are moving away from skill. Its problematic across the board. This is much more of a shared issue than a, “NERF THIS CLASS ITS SO OP!”. Anet tweaked in a bad way for everybody.

TheGuy.3568:

Caelus.7139:

TheGuy.3568:

FZeroWing.2098:

So I recently decided to main mesmer and I came to these forums expecting a lot of excited threads with how mesmer has become really good. However, instead all I seem to see are threads with a lot of whining about the BUFFS?!!

I don’t understand this, could someone clear this up as to why these buffs are bad? Before when I visited these forums it was posts complaining about why mesmer has been nerfed and was not very strong, but now it’s the opposite… I find this kind of ridiculous.

I personally thing this is where mesmers should be, it makes them closer to GW1 mesmers and it’s put them at the tier they really needed to be.

I may not main my mesmer but you should read the first thing you said and think a bit.

Now people get all kitteny about class forums and who post where but let me break it down to you. We are at he point where some players have invested loads of time on their favorite class purely because they enjoy it. Many of them win or lose have been honing their skills. There is a sense of pride in beating a player using a cheese build that should have beat you on skill alone.

The problem is a great deal of players do not think like this. They play what they know they will win on. In there lies the rub. You have a medium good player who got good at a class/build who now has the tools to strictly dominate other players. For months if not years they have played a build that required a certain amount of skill but now they can beat opponents they had issues with with ease.

You said, “So I recently decided to main mesmer”, but how many times across many class forums have we seen the, “So I recently decided to main x” statement after a major buff? Too many. Memsers aren’t masochist they just want the feeling of beating some one based on skill. I main engineer but refuse to use incendiary powder until burning in general is re-balanced. I am not some masochist but some of the luster is gone when the wins come too easy. Now while the world screams “Nerf!” (because they are losing) some players want nerfs/ rebalancing because its not fun anymore. This might be over some of your heads because the mere sight of a nerf warrants an angry post in your opinions.

Some players love their class so much they actually want to see it balanced and not OP. Novel idea isn’kitten

I won’t say I’m sure, but why do I feel like thieves don’t even come close to thinking like this. Because I for one am the opposite of your description of Mesmer mains. I’m tired of getting the short end of the stick. What I complain about is not about the nerfs and however unfair they are, but the fact that when it comes to drastic changes, most of the time it’s the mesmers that get hit hard due to nerfcries and only some times on other classes.

You can’t make a blanket statement about thieves. Many lobbied for nerfs early on for this same reason. They just got forced back into burst and for many (including my SP thief) this has been one of the worst patches for a class I know I could still win on if I played DP.

Every class feels like they got the short end of the stick at some point. The difference is realizing when you have been buffed too much. That takes time but the only people who could really say it feel off are those who main the class. The best rule of thumb is if you stop having trouble handling builds that used to challenge you, you see to consistently win (where you didn’t before), or wins are simply too easy.

Mesmers for a long time along with some non HGH (when HGH was still good) engies, and some ele builds actually required a good deal of skill to pull off. There was a great deal of knowledge that went into winning. Right now too many builds (not just mesmer’s its wide spread) are moving away from skill. Its problematic across the board. This is much more of a shared issue than a, “NERF THIS CLASS ITS SO OP!”. Anet tweaked in a bad way for everybody.

Well, it’ll be the long run where we can judge whichever situation is the majority then. I’ll give it around two, three weeks. But so far, Anet has struck already, first “fix” patch has been fixes for other classes while we’ve already gotten two nerfs and one for Engi (I think? Just read somewhere). The tally is on.

Gw2 has one of the best ingame communities but one of the worst out of game.

Basically take everything you read here with a grain (bucket?) of salt.

We have a history with buffs. We don’t tend to come out on top.

I think the forum reflects the up-down rollercoaster state of Mesmer right now as hthe profession is beset by both buffs and nerfs at a dizzying pace, exacerbated by the confounding effect of condition damage being overpowered globally, and the designers scrambling to make major changes to numerous interrelated game systems on a live MMO while players are trying to adjust.

That, and an ongoing orgy of straw man bashing, as demonstrated in this thread.

Not seeing a martyr complex, though that won’t stop people from seeing one if they want to.

Yes, Mesmers being Mesmers… some think it’s “cool” to advocate for nerfs and making the class as hard to play as possible.

I sincerely wish such people would main Ranger. I’ve waited years for a nice patch like this and I think the naysayers are being rather…. well TOS prevents me from saying.

FZeroWing.2098:

However, instead all I seem to see are threads with a lot of whining about the BUFFS?!!

If you’re interested in a balanced game, wouldn’t you be interested in nerfs to your own class if you consider things to be too strong?

Serious question, because from the way you seem to not be able to understand this, it’s easy to understand why MMO class forums usually yell bloody murder about every buff another class gets while continuously /wrist-ing about how bad they themselves have it.

I mean… actually, you know what? They could revert all the Mesmer-changes from the patch. That’s a minor thing. Game has much bigger balance- and combat-issues than whether I get 2 stacks of Torment or 1. Could, for starters, swap Shatter off the class-bar and illusion generation onto it. So we have a context free class mechanic.

OP hit the nail on the head lol.

I was one of the people who first said. Holy kitten we got strong, things might have to get toned down a bit.

Now having said that. Anet should wait with fixing things after a while. Every class got some many new tools that there is no point listening to people saying this or that is OP.

From what i have experienced people have already gotten a bit smarter and i don’t feel as strong as the first day of the patch.

Now i just really hope Anet doesn’t go over board in trying to ‘fix’ things way too fast and things ending up unbalanced