Guild Wars 2

Looked thought the patch notes for mesmer but couldn’t find anything for this but, empowered mantras and harmonious mantras have switched places in the domination / dueling trait lines.

Always got to be something they never bother to mention …

Good catch.

Wtf anet.

Well there goes the 30/10/30 build. This messes with pve and pvp in the worst ways.

So other then to have a higher crit chance/damage i cant see much other reason to go 30 deep into dueling line less you plan to use a pistol instead of a off-hand sword, the other gm just aren’t worth it PvE wise.

Well, you could go for a shatter mantra build 10/30/0/0/30 now …

This really annoys me, I had just hit 65 and was traiting towards the 0/30/0/25/15 build and really getting into the play style. I was also very excited to be getting Empowering Mantras soon. Now I feel like those 65 levels of learning how to play the build were useless.

.so they messed up warrior and mesmer… my 2 main classses. great

Csele.1647:

.so they messed up warrior and mesmer… my 2 main classses. great

Yep! And the new trait system will put a lot of new players off of Mesmer because having to wait until 30 to unlock traits and only getting a trait point every 6 levels makes leveling with a Mesmer very challenging. So far, this new patch is severely disappointing to me, which sucks because I was really looking forward to it.

For now i think for PvE stuff the old 10/20/0/25/15 should still be ok for use but will need some time to play around to see if there could be anything better/worth using

Magi.8643:

For now i think for PvE stuff the old 10/20/0/25/15 should still be ok for use but will need some time to play around to see if there could be anything better/worth using

Phantasmal Haste now works with Swordsmen I heard. That could be useful. Trying to come up with good build ideas lol.

I actually like that change.
Now they have to change Empowered Mantras into Empowered Signets.

rip mesmers

What a pain in the kitten . This is going to be a large hit to DPS for most builds. How annoying.

ninjas gentlemen…anet gots some ninjas

maxinion.8396:

rip mesmers

What a pain in the kitten . This is going to be a large hit to DPS for most builds. How annoying.

Don’t forget the ferocity change for icing on the cake <3

Warlord of Chaos.7845:

maxinion.8396:

rip mesmers

What a pain in the kitten . This is going to be a large hit to DPS for most builds. How annoying.

Don’t forget the ferocity change for icing on the cake <3

Considering that crit damage, and 30 in dueling, was the bread and butter of the class’s DPS (with Feedback), this is just

I guess 3/4/0/5/4 is the new best option, or something.

Honestly all I know is my wvw power mes is very depressed Max. I know nothing about pve haha. But yea, this patch was a slap in my mesmers face for power damage in wvw (as if we weren’t already bad in zergs….)

I only benefit from this. Sucks to be you guys.

This must be a bug. Its not mentioned in the release notes anywhere.

Nolzan.3719:

This must be a bug. Its not mentioned in the release notes anywhere.

God I hope so. Have they ever done this sort of thing before, moving traits to different lines and not mentioning it?

I really hope its some twisted joke and it gets fixed. And Sykotic, If I remember, I don’t believe they have done such a thing but I could be wrong.

Considering how many things they silently patch in dungeons without ever noting it in the patch notes (and almost always these are changes of ‘dubious’ value), I wouldn’t be surprised if they just forgot to list it or don’t care to.

Kinda like the ielasticity change eh?

MMOs ninja these changes in all the time without telling anybody. I usually expect it now.

Going to go out on a limb and say this probably has something to do with Power Block.

For those who don’t know, if you throw on Harmonious Mantras, charge a mantra, then switch it out, you keep the 3 charges.

So I think its fairly safe to assume that they were switched around to avoid people using it for extra Distraction charges with Power Block.

That is to say, instead of actually fixing the bug they switched the traits around.

This change basically just completely destroyed mesmers in PvE. Empowering Mantras was pretty much the only thing that made us not completely terrible.

Assuming phaste is fixed I think I’ll try 2/4/0/4/4 or 6/4/0/0/4 (no reflect), but I suspect the correct build may be to roll guardian.

draconx.3102:

This change basically just completely destroyed mesmers in PvE. Empowering Mantras was pretty much the only thing that made us not completely terrible.

Assuming phaste is fixed I think I’ll try 2/4/0/4/4 or 6/4/0/0/4 (no reflect), but I suspect the correct build may be to roll guardian.

Yes, this is pretty much correct.

It’s a real shame if it’s intended… This nerfed some very viable and interesting builds and lessens the potential for some really interesting new builds (mantra/distortion commander build anyone?). It absolutely should’ve been in the patch notes with some sort of explanation. This is a HUGE change for anyone who had run mantras before.

i, for one , really enjoys this change. the new gameplay style it allows fits my style perfectly. it feels more active , more “focused” and infinity more fun! i go 0/30/20/20/0 staff + s/s with celestial in SPVP and just cant seem to die. interrupts give me plenty boons and boost my power & cond damage. very gratifiying to interrupt the guardian droping is elite. you guys should give it a try

maxinion.8396:

draconx.3102:

This change basically just completely destroyed mesmers in PvE. Empowering Mantras was pretty much the only thing that made us not completely terrible.

Assuming phaste is fixed I think I’ll try 2/4/0/4/4 or 6/4/0/0/4 (no reflect), but I suspect the correct build may be to roll guardian.

Yes, this is pretty much correct.

I’ll still main mes, but this is in the back of my mind. :<

If it’s a bug, then the meta won’t change that much compared to the old one, but the all around build will most likely be 0/6/0/4/4

Else we’ll have 4 builds (the first 3 being used most of the time):
Mantra build with phantasmal warden: 6/4/0/4/0
Mantra build without phantasmal warden: 6/4/0/0/4
Lupicus build to maximize feedback damage (in a group situation): 6/6/0/0/2
Full phantasm build: 2/4/0/4/4

Huh… weird. Oddly enough, this might actually work out better for my mantra mesmser.

You people need to keep in mind that we can now instantly retrait as long as we are out of combat. Meaning, go for the maximum amount of damage as long as you don’t need reflect. For the situations you need reflect, move some points into Inspiration and you’ll be fine.

Having Harmonious Mantras in Duelling makes a lot more sense for Mantra builds in general. Empowering Mantras being moved might just have been a side effect. I’m fine with that change – and actually suggested it several times – and it only really hurts extremly gimmicky PvE set ups. Most other builds will be able to move points between Domination and Duelling without a great loss.

For PvE, while it is a nerf at first glance, it might be helpful in the long run balancewise. Since you won’t be able to get all damage modifiers for Phantasms and yourself, there probably won’t be any obvious PvE meta build which I personally appretiate. If it turns out that this means Mesmers not dealing enough damage we might see improvements elsewhere. Phantasmal Haste might also turn out to be more valuable then Empowering Mantras.

Ideally we’d get a chance to retrait every fight – I’m sure there will be people to do so – but without saved templates I doubt people would retrait every fight or for trash mobs. Most go by so quickly that you’d save more time just might stacking then fighting asap.

I can see myself retraiting for Lupi to 6/6/0/0/2 then back afterwards, but probably not for other fights. Half if not most of the reason to get Empowering Mantras in the first place is because the modifiers work during reflects, though, imo.

Scribble.8069:

without saved templates I doubt people would retrait every fight or for trash mobs.

Yep. I like efficient runs as much as the next guy, but I’m not willing to muck with my traits that much without templates. Just not worth it.

Adjusting my GGPR build from 25/30/0/0/15 to 6/4/0/0/4.

Pyroathiest.4168:

Scribble.8069:

without saved templates I doubt people would retrait every fight or for trash mobs.

Yep. I like efficient runs as much as the next guy, but I’m not willing to muck with my traits that much without templates. Just not worth it.

Exactly.

I guess I’d either go with 2/4/0/4/4 relatively throughout, or 6/4/0/4/0 and then change to 6/4/0/0/4 if it will absolutely make a critical difference. Or should that be the other way round? :/

I’ve never felt so reduced to Portal and Lupicus as a Mesmer before… I’m sure it’s still a viable option, but still…

If this is true , its the best thing ive heard about the patch since now !

Sykotic.2596:

Yep! And the new trait system will put a lot of new players off of Mesmer because having to wait until 30 to unlock traits and only getting a trait point every 6 levels makes leveling with a Mesmer very challenging. So far, this new patch is severely disappointing to me, which sucks because I was really looking forward to it.

Honestly though, it feels like pre-DE Mesmer is how it should be, PvE-levelling-wise.
It feels laughably too easy on any other class and post-DE. :S

xallever.1874:

I guess I’d either go with 2/4/0/4/4 relatively throughout, or 6/4/0/4/0 and then change to 6/4/0/0/4 if it will absolutely make a critical difference. Or should that be the other way round? :/

I’ve never felt so reduced to Portal and Lupicus as a Mesmer before… I’m sure it’s still a viable option, but still…

I’m think the same for the 2/4/0/4/4 being are best option for overall PvE build then when it comes to Lupicus or any other heavy reflect encounter to switch to a 6/4/0/4/0.

0/6/0/4/4 could also work if you feel like you want to uses iduelist instead of iswordsman.

Wheeeeeeeeeeeeee!

Well as much as I ser the negative part for a Pve setup I also se how extremely potent this chane is for several wvwvw builds. With a strong condition roaming meta a 3 charge heal who cleanse 2 condis each mesmers suddenly got one of the best condition removals in game. Mantra of condi cleanse + heal mantra with condi cleanse on heal will give 18 cleansed conditions and close to 16 k heal / 20 sec.

The old 0-30-30-10-0 build with condition or hybrid focus just turned into a monster build.

/Osicat

Problem isn’t so much that it wasn’t just in the release note. A few weeks back when they did the whole big livestream event and went over in detail all the changes that were going to be made to traits and why they were making those changes, guess which change wasn’t mentioned then either.

That’s right, this one! Otherwise I’m sure plenty of feedback would have been given (and subsequentially ignored).

I would also like to hear their explanation for why they made the change.

This move is actually brilliant in my interrupt build, it lets me take both empowered mantras with power block and thus be able to interrupt 3 times before I need to recast the mantra… A brilliant move in my opinion, especially for trying to use a interrupt build in a dungeon.

Bunda.2691:

I would also like to hear their explanation for why they made the change.

Probably to open options for Lockdown and interrupt builds; 30/30/10, 10/30/30, and so on. You can now have Confounding Suggestions or Chaotic Interruption with Harmonious Mantra.

I love this change. It fits perfectly for my phantom mantra build. 10-30-0-30-0

I also love this change, best part of patch for me.

This change kills my hybrid on-kill mantra build. Probably will switch to pure power mantra build soon.

You people are out of your kittening minds. If you’re using Mantras on a Mesmer, you’re playing the class wrong. Mantras blow, they always have and they always will. I can’t believe the amount of people in here freaking out over a freakin’ MANTRA change. Do yourselves a favor, go with a 10/30/0/0/30 max DPS shatter build and thank me later.