After a rather long break ive decided to return to Gw2 and start playing my mesmer again. This descision has mostly been triggered by the LFG tool which made finding a pug a walk in the park.
I wasn’t particularly good to be honest but now im ready to be the best i can be.
My introduction tells you that im into pve and more specifically dungeons.
ive spent the past 2 days grinding the forum and reading all the huge walls of text in the vast amounts of guides available on this forum.
However, even with this abundance of information that is available, i get confused / lost rather quickly.
So far ive gathered that you want sword / sword with sword / pistol for max dps. The guides point towards a phantasm build and I’ve toyed around with that for a bit.
For some reason it’s not satisfying to cast the phantasms and let them do the work, besides most fights are over before they are started. especially on trash.
Then there’s evidence of imba dps pointing in the direction of shatter builds. (yes, i’ve found osicats video’s but he seems to focus on pvp and staffs).
This is where opinions start to diverge. pve, pvp and wvw builds are now chaotically mixed, nobody seems to agree on which weapons to use, which rotation to use is even more unclear.
Long story short, im trying to find a good build where im using swords / pistol which focuses on shatter and I could use some pointers in a rotation.
Help is appreciated, but please, dont point me to the guides that are on the forum. i’ve read them all
Shatter is not an option if you want max dps for dungeons and stuff.
0/30/0/25/15 mantra phantasm build will give the the most punch, 10/20/0/25/15 is the alrounder phantasm build as you can use whatever utility you want.
Shatter is, imho, still better in open world, but open world you do not want to run around with just sword in your main hand. GS is your best friend (and nothing creates clones to shatter faster than a GS ^^).
and i say, where is your focus! :p just joking… i really can’t imagine a pve mesmer without focus, tho.
0/30/0/25/15 or 0/30/0/20/20 or 10/30/0/20/10 (all most dps spec atm I guess) are builds meant to have focus in your equip as far as I know.
Teefy, just note that a focus is very useful on fights where reflects are needed and can create a ton of damage with the Warden’s Feedback Inspiration trait. Most groups who understand the mesmer will expect this to be traited and used when necessary.
However, if you must only stick with sword/(sword + pistol), then a 10/30/0/10/20 build will suit you better and gives you the same feedback uptime. 30/30/0/0/10 is a mantra/power/phantasm build and is max dps without reflects I believe, but again, you lose the amazing utility that makes the mesmer class so good to have in dungeons.
If you’re looking for top DPS 30/30/0/0/10 Mantra/Phantasm will do it. It’s noticeably higher than 10/20/0/25/15 but you lose your Focus and Glamor optimization. You also lose Illusionists Celerity but its an effective build if you know the content. I run this build with Knights armor and Runes of Traveler for Phantasms and quality of life. I also have the luxury of running with two WoR Guardians so reflects are less of an issue for me.
I pug in 20/10/0/25/15, I enjoy GSword and I don’t care what anyone else thinks
GL out there
Blood~
*Basically what Bumbler said.
“Real knowledge is to know the extent of one’s ignorance”
A dungeon mesmer without reflection is like a coffee without caffeine.
It looks like it will help you to get things done faster, but it will just leave a bad taste in your mouth in the end.
Most groups who understand the mesmer will expect this to be traited and used when necessary.
And I expect a harem of 200 virgins to fall out of the sky and land on my staff every day. Doesn’t mean it’s gonna happen anytime soon.
It’s beyond unreasonable to expect someone to play their class the way you want them to.
Expecting a mesmer to use a traited focus in dungeons where reflects are a major boon is equivalent to expecting a guardian to use blinds/aegis/WoR or for a warrior to use banners. It shouldn’t be unreasonable to expect someone to play in a non-selfish, group-benefiting way.
What’s with this fascination with 30/30/0/0/10? Drop 5 from Domination and get 20% faster illusion summons with 25/30/0/0/15. The 25pt minor trait is the main reason to go that much into that line.
Lack of DPS meters solve some of the acceptable build diversity problems which is great. There are some things we just wont get passed though like this.
I like to see Mesmers with Focus but if they aren’t running one and have some Mantras up I’m perfectly fine with that. I won’t fault anyone for playing the build they want. I can say that with either Mantra Phantasm or Meta Phantasm build I’ve been on runs where I wished I had brought the other build.
frifox, Harmonious Mantras I guess. If I’m not optimized for reflects then I like to at least have some more support with condition cleanse or stability. But thats my own opinion. IC is very tempting though.
Blood~
“Real knowledge is to know the extent of one’s ignorance”
and i say, where is your focus! :p just joking… i really can’t imagine a pve mesmer without focus, tho.
0/30/0/25/15 or 0/30/0/20/20 or 10/30/0/20/10 (all most dps spec atm I guess) are builds meant to have focus in your equip as far as I know.
The 0/30/0/20/20 isn’t worth it because phantasmal haste is so bugged.
10/30/0/20/10 and 0/30/0/25/15 are the right choices for combining reflection damage + phantasm dps. Most people run these sorts of things, with sword+sword and sword+focus.
What’s with this fascination with 30/30/0/0/10? Drop 5 from Domination and get 20% faster illusion summons with 25/30/0/0/15. The 25pt minor trait is the main reason to go that much into that line.
Guang (an Excelwars Pro) once showed that in a perfect world, and on paper, that 30/30/0/0/10 was highest DPS a mesmer can achieve, and it has sort of stuck. This was also before the second move of illusionist’s celerity from grandmaster to master. In practice, and especially since the IC move, you are right that 25/30/0/0/15 will be better. On paper, where phantasms never die (unrealistic), 30/30/0/0/10 will still be marginally better.
wanted to add that if you are looking to pure dps… change class. mesmer dps sucks, mesmer is meant to have a support side, if you don’t wanna use it, don’t use mesmer at all :p
wanted to add that if you are looking to pure dps… change class. mesmer dps sucks, mesmer is meant to have a support side, if you don’t wanna use it, don’t use mesmer at all :p
That depends on how many Phantasms you can maintain. With Sword and 2x Phantasms up you are doing pretty well, easily on par with most other Zerkers. 3x Phantasms yield some of the higher DPS I’ve been able to test. No phantasms, then you’re pretty low. At least this is the case with 30/30/0/0/10 solo testing. 10/20/0/25/15 is lower but can still be competitive with 3x Phantasms running.
Blood~
“Real knowledge is to know the extent of one’s ignorance”
wanted to add that if you are looking to pure dps… change class. mesmer dps sucks, mesmer is meant to have a support side, if you don’t wanna use it, don’t use mesmer at all :p
That depends on how many Phantasms you can maintain. With Sword and 2x Phantasms up you are doing pretty well, easily on par with most other Zerkers. 3x Phantasms yield some of the higher DPS I’ve been able to test. No phantasms, then you’re pretty low. At least this is the case with 30/30/0/0/10 solo testing. 10/20/0/25/15 is lower but can still be competitive with 3x Phantasms running.
Blood~
100% this. Depends slightly on the phantasms used, but 3x swordsmen is some of the best deeps possible.
I think warden reflects are boosted by Empowered Illusions and Phantasmal Strength but not by player-based % bonuses — those only affect player-cast reflections; Feedback, Temporal Curtain, etc.
I think warden reflects are boosted by Empowered Illusions and Phantasmal Strength but not by player-based % bonuses — those only affect player-cast reflections; Feedback, Temporal Curtain, etc.
Warden reflects do not show up in my combat log which only makes sense if those reflected projectiles becomes phantasm’s projectiles. Those reflected with curtain / feedback do show up in combat log which means those reflected projectiles became mine.
AFAIK the only phantasm boosting traits in fact are the Empowered Illusions and Phantasmal Strength, which should buff warden’s reflects.
Thanks for the confirmation Sandy!
When are you making new solo videos for us?
Haha, nice to see someone interested, once I have the time again I’ll likely get some more videos up, rT is giving me a lot of work, so I spend most of my online time dealing with issues. The next few weeks real life work should decrease though, so who knows?
30/30/0/0/10 – most damage, least utility. Great in open world, “meh” in dungeons, unwanted mesmer in fotm.
10/20/0/25/15 – easy to handle, pretty ok build for pretty much everywhere.
10/30/0/30/0 – best allround build in my option. requires a everlasting changing of traits, even during runs. very flexible, awesome damage for you, your phants and best utility possible.
I want to mention at this point that I play PvE only and I’ve played so many different builds for more than just a couble of hours. I want to learn everything about my beloved mesmer and therefore expirience (even bad ones) has the highest priority. Be not afraid of testing things, the build has to fit for you, not for the elitist!
Ziggs Ironeye – Engineer | Madame Le Blanc – Mesmer | Mentor (PvE) | EU
“Mentoring engineers / mesmers and showing you what you can do with your fantastic class!
Just pm me for my advice! Always eager to help!”
Ran some 25/30/0/0/15 last night. It does feel like it would have higher dps then 30/30/0/0/10 just because its easier to maintain phantasms. Lose some utility with Mantras but its still doable…
I like DPS so I usually run these builds. But I agree with Xyonon “the build has to fit you”. 10/20/0/25/15 is a very strong build, great survivability and utility but lower DPS. In the DPS heavy meta as it is today either should be acceptable IMHO
Blood~
“Real knowledge is to know the extent of one’s ignorance”
frifox – that’s interesting, good to know. How did you test? And can you throw in 0/30/0/25/15? I’m curious how much of a difference EM makes over EI.
Also, to be fair, that’s expected in a non-reflecting scenario. Inspiration is taken more for utility (glamour / focus traits) than anything else; Phantasmal Strength is really just something to mitigate the damage loss from putting so many points in a non-DPS trait line.
If you don’t need your Warden to reflect then moving those into Domination will certainly be better. If your enemy is projectile-based, then suddenly Warden dps goes way, way up.
Funny you should mention the 0/30/0/25/15 build since I tested that too. It was within 1% of the 10/20/0/25/15 non-mantra counterpart. You lose higher feedback dps but gain freedom of utility with the non mantra build.
I test every build under same ideal conditions in hotm vs the indestructible golem. I attack it for 15 minutes and record dps with the gw2dps app.
Frifox, good numbers. With shorter tests, 240000 HP, I see a 22.4% increase from 10/20/0/25/15 Sw/F // Sw/Sw to 30/30/0/0/10 Sw/Sw under those same conditions. GSword and Sw/P 30/30/0/0/10 are both 16.4% increase. No Timewarp used.
Blood~
“Real knowledge is to know the extent of one’s ignorance”
Quick question, if running sword/focus+pistol instead of sword/focus+sword, would 0/30/0/20/20 be better than 0/30/0/25/15? I know off-hand sword would have higher dps than pistol, but I’ve simply started to like pistol more. Just asking since a guildie said 0/30/0/20/20 would be better. 15% more dmg for iDuelist or 20% faster recharge on its attack.
I would say that you are still better off with 0/30/0/25/15 as Phantasmal Haste is essentially a 20% damage bonus to pistol where Phantasmal Strength will benefit your warden (and other phantasms you might use) as well. And as Sanderinoa confirmed above, phantasmal strength will also boost its reflection damage as well. If you were only ever using pistol, then 0/30/0/20/20 would be better, but if you are likely to throw out at least 1 warden per fight, then 0/30/0/25/15 is better.
I sorta recall some posts talking about Phantasmal Haste being bugged. If it’s working both iDuelist and iWarden would benefit. Pretty sure it’s never worked with iSwordsman. Wonder how a 10/15/0/25/20 Sw/Sw/F would work..
Blood~
“Real knowledge is to know the extent of one’s ignorance”
I sorta recall some posts talking about Phantasmal Haste being bugged. If it’s working both iDuelist and iWarden would benefit. Pretty sure it’s never worked with iSwordsman. Wonder how a 10/15/0/25/20 Sw/Sw/F would work..
Blood~
Doesn’t work with warden either. Only duelist benefits, so it’s not really worth it. Would be a very nice build if it wasn’t so bugged.
