Guild Wars 2

Recently hit 80 n ran a few builds through dungeons this weekend. Was having a tough time with Shatter builds, more practice is needed.

I started messing around with this Mantra/Phantasm build. Seems to do pretty good for me so far but I’m looking for input. I usually run Gsword n Sword/Sword but will switch in Staff and sometimes Focus for boss fights. I like the healing that Restorative Mantra does and since I’m not traited for staff I use MoP to supplement damage. I’ll also switch up traits for Focus reflects and Fury for phantasms. Gear is mostly Zerker with some Knights and Soldiers mixed in. I’m looking for a build with good ‘DPS’ and some survivability for PvE content. Am I on the right track here?

TYVM
Blood~

I wouldn’t use MoP in PvE. If you charge it during combat (i.e. use more than your initial three charges) you’d likely end up with less DPS.

In fact Mantra builds in general are more relevant in PvP than PvE. If you’re not going to get Empowered Mantras it probably isn’t worth speccing into Mantras.

I did some napkin math from raw numbers off target dummies. MoP came out to an increase with GSword. I could easily be wrong though.

Would a full Phantasm build be more effective? Sounds like iWarlock does good damage in a group setting. I’m not real interested in a full condition but not opposed to looking at it.

TYVM
Blood~

Embolism.8106:

I wouldn’t use MoP in PvE. If you charge it during combat (i.e. use more than your initial three charges) you’d likely end up with less DPS.

In fact Mantra builds in general are more relevant in PvP than PvE. If you’re not going to get Empowered Mantras it probably isn’t worth speccing into Mantras.

I’m sorry but I disagree. If you use restorative mantras in combination with a support build they are awesome for spam healing your party when things get rough. Also using it in power builds they do a lot of burst damage when used in combos.

Hecate Build Burst/Heal/Daze(or resolve) works great in both pve and pvp

Panacea Build
Amazing support distributing a lot of boons, protection, support and healing. Love this one for dungeons.

As for OP, You can have a look at my three builds and maybe find some ideas that would help your build but so far it sounds you are on a nice track towards getting a build together. Let us know what your testing shows once you figured out how to best optimize it.

Oh yeah, you can abuse MoP and RM for AoE Healing, but I wouldn’t call that a Mantra build. Burst is more relevant in PvP than PvE, so my point holds. So is Daze, for that matter.

Embolism.8106:

Oh yeah, you can abuse MoP and RM for AoE Healing, but I wouldn’t call that a Mantra build. Burst is more relevant in PvP than PvE, so my point holds. So is Daze, for that matter.

Still can’t say I agree. I use mantra of pain and mantra of recovery in my Panacea support build which gives two heals to party on use of each as well as the rune triggers on MoR. It’s a hybrid between mantra and boon builds. You wouldn’t spam mantra of pain unless things get really rough you generally want to use it to top people up in between distributing boons.

As for daze on Hecate build as I mentioned you want to use resolve in dungeons over daze since obviously most bosses in dungeons do not respond to dazes. Great thing about it is that you can dish a lot of damage and swap to mantra healing in seconds to support your group.

To say it’s not a mantra build doesn’t make sense, having all mantra utilities generally doesn’t work well you want to leave at least one open for a different utility but that doesn’t make it any less of a mantra build as long as you use at least two and make them have an important function in your build it’s at the very least a mantra hybrid build you would never really use all of the same utility types as a mesmer (or rarely).

The reason you would call it a mantra build is because mantras have a very distinct different playstyle to other builds as they require more combos and micro management.

Thanks for the input, think I’m looking for more sustained damage output for dungeons. I’ve looked at both builds Fey and I do want to try them but I’m looking for something a bit different to get to really know the class first.

With this build when its online I’ll basically be replacing phantasms, throwing anything that doesn’t create a clone and auto attack, MoP is spammed during other stuff and recharged before a weapon switch. Problem is that I was having a hard time keeping more than one phantasm up at any time. This leads me to think that a Shatter build would do better but then survivability is lower also.

TY
Blood~

I think you’re on the right track. I use a variant of Fay’s Panacea build that is more of a damage focused phantasm build with a secondary support role using Restorative Mantras.

DPS is very high and the support it provides is great, ~2700 heals every time I hit MoP or MoR. Not to mention you are very tanky with high armor and vitality using primarily Soldier’s gear.

The theory behind it is detailed in Fay’s OP on the mantra support build (as well as other mesmers using the same type of build):
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/mesmer/New-Website-Fay-s-Builds-Guides-Mantras/first

My build:
http://tinyurl.com/a95ugq7
http://tinyurl.com/anajlmu

Hope this helps

Thanks Skcamow. I just have a hard time moving away from Harmonious Mantras if I wanna use MoP and MoRec. I think MoP is an increase in damage at 3 charges but a wash at 2 with max range GSword auto, this doesn’t however take into account scaling with power/crit for MoP or GSword Auto if there is any, its simply from numbers on target dummies.

Another thing is that I feel locked into MoRec, MoRes, MoP and Signet of Illusions with my original build losing a lot of utility. Guess I need to mess around some more.

Blood~

Thanks
Blood~

I misspoke before – actually my build is more a variant of Fay’s Hecate build.

And yes I understand not wanting to dump harmonious mantras. I played with them for awhile per Fay’s Hecate build, but found it was actually lessening my ability to heal allies and I wanted more precision. So I traited more in dueling, getting nice condition damage utility from my illusions with the understanding the power I’m losing is going to come back with the superior sharpening stones.

One nice thing about mantras (if you take more than 1), is spam MoP while charging MoR to limit downtime the most. Then when you have to heal, charge MoP really quick first and heal while that charges. Most of the time that back and forth activity heals allies nicely and if the team is in trouble I’ll stop what I’m doing and run in, charge quick and back to fighting.

Of course if everyone is jamming you can just attack at will.

Another suggestion would be to look at Pyroatheist’s Phantasm/Support build. It also uses HM and actually looks a bit similar to mine with some minor variations:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/mesmer/Guide-PvE-Supporting-Phantasm-Build

Have you tried playing w/out HM in a RM build?

I’ve been running a Phantasm/Mantra Hybrid since the Illusionary Membrane nerf.
I was gonna make a thread on it and maybe some videos on how to play it well but, I dunno I guess I got drunk and forgot.

Anyhow,

In general, don’t run zerkers with this build in the Wub, run as much Knight’s as you can.
The extra damage is NOT EVER worth the toughness that you would loose. Phantasm builds better suit drawn out battles, and with this you can generally poop out swordsmen and heal yourself and everyone around you while doing pretty great damage.

That being said, in dungeons feel free to throw on a few zerkers pieces and float around the back end of your group healing while discovering the Treasures of the Deeps but remember that your Phantasms benefit from toughness, its a very important stat that you should gouge as hard as you can.

Personally I run Sword/Sword+Staff And mix it up with the Focus from time to time.
That being said, GS works great with this, as does pretty much any offhand. The one problem is you have to take off those delicious Mantra heals for the reflect trait.
Its more than worth it for range only bosses though.

Thanks for the input guys. I honestly haven’t tried an RM build w/o HM very much so I’ll have to do that. I guess even if MoP x2 is equal damage to AA then its useable to get some healing. I was messing around with a 20/0/20/25/5 GSword n Staff setup because I though iLock would make a big difference but it really didn’t. I like iSwordsman quite a bit, faster attacks and does good damage with Zerker/Knights gear. I’m thinking I’ll go more Knights n see how my stuff survives.

Question, what phantasm is the most effective on your standard boss fight?

TY
Blood~

That’s a tough one – I find the warden gets killed halfway through his attack about 1/2 the time. When he’s able to finish, I’d say he’d be the one. I ran HoTW last night with the build I posted and on Ginva he got a 7880 crit on his last attack, which is pretty nice.

iZerker is strong, but better for AoE. Without a doubt the warden will do the most damage but will get killed the fastest. You could make a case for iWarlock as a boss will generally have many unique conditions, thus high damage attacks (especially if they crit).

Yea, wish the warden wasn’t rooted.

Blood~

Lately, my iWarden often fails to even land a single hit on bosses. It has the greatest damage potential (12 hits, bleeding, aoe, projectile immune), but is still very situational.
For this discussion I ignore the iDefender and iDisenchanter, since they’re not damage dealer.
For me, the iBerserker may be the most effective. It doesn’t start at melee range, so it deals some hits. It deals quite the burst, aoe damage. And for alot bosses/ minibosses the cripple is a lifesaver.

In general, Swordsmen have the highest sustained DPS.
Followed very closely by the Duellist, then Zerker (When it’s not bugged.) with the Warlock and the Warden bringing up the rear.

The Warlock gets a good boost from conditions though, so it can jump right up, the Mage doesn’t get a mention since its useless for power builds.

So in general, Swordsmen.
If it spams AoE, get your pistol trait on spam duellists.
If its a only ranged Boss, put on Wardens Feedback and giggle as you get 3 Wardens whirling completely shutting down the boss and reflecting all its projectiles back at it.

Thanks much.

I moved to a 20/20/0/25/5 build which seemed to work pretty good. I ran with MoP instead of MoRes and had troubles with conditions for a bit but after the switch it wasn’t bad. Problem is when you get in trouble and need some healing it seems your damage can completely shut down if you need to focus on charging mantras. Can feel clunky at times.

I like the S/S game play and the iSwordsman.

Gotta figure out if I want Harmonious Mantras vs Phantasmal Fury and then MoR vs Eather Feast, and Persisting Images vs Restorative Matras vs Mender’s Purity.

Thanks again,

Blood~

clipnotdone.9634:

In general, don’t run zerkers with this build in the Wub, run as much Knight’s as you can.
The extra damage is NOT EVER worth the toughness that you would loose. Phantasm builds better suit drawn out battles, and with this you can generally poop out swordsmen and heal yourself and everyone around you while doing pretty great damage.

That being said, in dungeons feel free to throw on a few zerkers pieces and float around the back end of your group healing while discovering the Treasures of the Deeps but remember that your Phantasms benefit from toughness, its a very important stat that you should gouge as hard as you can.

This was my reasoning as well. Toughness is good for this build, because you 1) have lots of heals, 2) Phantasms play a big role and benefit from your toughness.
I grudgingly decided against gear with main stat toughness however, because it bugs me too much having no points at all in the toughness trait line and then trying to go for a lot of toughness… that just isn’t so great :/

I also would have liked to try Staff with Phantasms, because the synergy is great, but you can’t make a S/S + Staff Phantasm build because you can’t go 20p in 4 trait lines for all the mandatory traits (Phantasm Fury + Sword spec. in Dueling, Staff spec. in Chaos, all the good Phantasm Minor traits in Inspiration + Mantra heals, Additional Bounce in Illusions). Illusionary Elasticity really should be a Tier 1 trait IMO…