Guild Wars 2

I tried to make a good mantra build… but every time I failed because there are more usefull and less boring utilities and healing skills that just fit better into the current gamestyle.

I dont know hoe many people are playing mantras but they are waste of time / cd / utility skill slot for everybody since 4 sec cast time and you have to recast those mantras after fight or whats worse in the middlde of fight

Mantras are ALWAYS dps waste in fights longer than 15 secs. and even in shorter fight everybody will miss blink/decoy + feedback/nullfield

What about making mantras as stacking spell?
lets say:
you get 1 charge every 20/30/40 sec while in combat
you replenish all charges after 5 sec while out of combat

If there is already this Idea sorry for Copy/ignore me.

Thank you for criticism,
Andy

I’m not a fan of Mantra’s either. I think the consensus is that Mantra’s are only good if you trait for them and I think that is an indication of a design flaw.

I really like your suggestion but I don’t think it should replenish all charges out of combat. Also when compared to other skills, each charge is quite weak, its being able to use them when ever you want, whether its back to back or 10 sec later that makes them powerful, so I think gaining a charge every 20 sec should be the maximum.

Traits
Harmonious Mantras
Mantras can be activated three times before needing to be channeled again.
Mantras can gain an additional charge.

Empowering Mantras
4% more damage for each readied mantra.
You gain Might for X sec when gain a Mantra charge.

Protected Mantras
Increases armor while casting mantras.
You gain Protection for X sec when you use a Mantra.

Restorative Mantras
Heal allies when you cast a mantra.
Heal allies when you cast a mantra (less healing since its when you cast it instead of preparing it)

I’ll point out the same things I’ve done in other Mantra threads:

1. As single-slot utility skills, they are fine. You get some excellent condition removal, daze, and bonus damage for a single slot if you need them.

Mantra of Resolve is better at most condition removal than Arcane Thievery. It’s faster removal than Disenchanter. It’s faster than Null Field. It has a lower cooldown than all except Disenchanter.

Mantra of Pain is actually solid burst damage for short engagements. Burning through PvE mobs? Throw in an extra 2 shots of pain every fight, and charge between fights.

Distraction is pretty solid in PvP for specific builds.

Mantra of Concentration is the only ‘meh’ one as an independent ability due to its very short duration of Stability, and due to the alternative choices of Blink and Decoy, with Blink basically doing everything MOC can do, but better.

2. They are also very good when you combine only a few traits with only a few abilities. RM + MoPain/MoRecovery is a classic example. Hmm … actually it’s probably the only example. Anyways.

3. A full 30/30 Mantra build is actually pretty kitten strong for WvW for many reasons. I’ve been running this in WvW for about a week, and it’s been pretty hilarious. I would say more, but that’s basically the first step to getting a nerfbat.

I’ve tried too, I find the recharge channel time far too long. Better off just getting an ability that works when its up, no fuss, no muss.

I tried the healing trait with the pain mantra and the cast is just too long, it takes me out of the game just to spam this thing for marginal healing. Also get tired of hearing the pain mantra monologue, its ironic since I’m using it the heal, the damage isnt high enough for me to care. The stability and condition removal mantras are nice but I already have blink and null field which do a lot more and I dont have to worry about recharge.

I would either shorten the recharge channel cast time or take it out altogether. Its too high a penalty in combat to recharge and out of combat it doesnt matter anyway, just a hassle.

A full mantra build … to my surprise especially when traited migth be more useful than I thought at first and much more tricky to use effectively too.

The fact they are instant and can be casted during other abilities is interesting but difficult to use for me.

Also obviously when multiple charges are down it takes quite some time to recharge.

I found them very lackluster at first.

Now I’m not too sure what to think about them actually.

I feel like I might need to use them more before passing another judgement.

If you don’t like them or they don’t fit your playing style, don’t use them. There are plenty of other options and the last thing we need is Anet messing up with mantras, ruining it for other players with different playing styles/builds than you.

I do use MoP and healing Mantra and I find both of them very usefull as heal/support Mesmer.

I think that some slow auto-charge in combat can be nice. And also numbers of use on readied mantra must be some bright color, not like right now.

But for me – main problem is long mantra-casting time.

Basically, Mantras kitten me off until I forced myself to use them for about 20 hours of gameplay. I forced myself to use a Mantra build while getting map completes on the last 4 zones (giv ecto nao), and for level 75-80 story quests.

Broke the habit of accidentally charging Mantras in combat (this is the biggest thing). Built the habit to charge MoRecovery early. Built the reflex to see how many charges I have remaining. Built the reflex to see which Mantras need charging at a glance (MoRecovery is the hardest one because the icon for the Mantra and for the heal charges are vaguely similar). Built the habit of charging out of combat. Built the habit of charging after zoning.

All of these things you have to do that you don’t have to do for other ‘normal’ abilities. But, once you acquire those skills, Mantras can be pretty fun.

It’s almost like playing another class.

To me, Mesmer learning curve is like this:

1. L2p with clones and phantasms.
2. L2p with advanced phantasm timing and weapon swaps.
3. L2p with shatters.
4. L2p with shatters, phantasms, and weapon swaps.
5. L2p with Mantras.
6. L2p with Mantras, shatters, phantasms, and weapon swaps.

Then you have tangents like L2Portal, but who cares about that right?

Well even if you handle mantra play style perfectly you will be still less efficient than any other builds. And when you come to boss fight you will be less efficient than any other playable char. If you get into prolonged PVP fight you will loose due to 2-3 mantras uselessly occupying your 2-3 utility skills…
Thats why mantras should have some recharge CD without 4 second long cast… It will be more fun… mantras will be great in short fights and still be pretty usefull in long figts. Even if you get 1 charge per 20 sec > 4 sec cast and 20/30 sec CD.

I use GS+4 Mantras + 3stacks/4%dmg +Power/Precision spec in sPVP.

It’s a glass cannon. Don’t expect flexibility. You can take any class down in a matter of seconds but you need to maintain your distance. And with timewarp,, you can just stand there spamming your 1st skill, even a guardian will panic. Other than that, prepared to get pwned.

I think it’s a fair trade. It deals A LOT of damage. If you have evasive tactic at the same time, I’m pretty that would be OP.

I dont think it would be overpowered because whe you are playing glass canoon like this you will never survive longer than 20 sec… specialy in PVP. If you live long enough you will get only 1 charge/period of time so you will have more sustained dps but less spike dmg. But still at the start of the battle your spike will be same. you will only notice change in longer battles, when you dont have to recast 4 neverending seconds to use it.
I think this solution is more fluent and player friendly and not so boring. I hate the moments when I have 4 sec disable because I have bleeds/poison/weaknes + already used mantra so + 4 sec disable… I will be happier if i get only 1 condition removal than this

Mantra builds are fairly powerful, but you need the traits. That’s my main issue with Mantras, too, they feel soooo marginalized without their traits.

I’d prefer if Mantras were a lot more powerful baseline, most traits for them removed, in fact each traitline has one trait which enhances all Mantras in a specific, trait-fitting way. Say Inspirations makes Mantras apply Regeneration to yourself, or Chaos applies a random boon to yourself (MoC, MoR and MoH) or a random condition to the enemy (MoD or MoP).