Guild Wars 2

I hate the mesmer downed state.

The spell used to teleport you away from the mob. At some point (months ago) it either became bugged or was nerfed because now you have like an 75% chance of it teleporting directly beside/under the monster. Please let us choose where we want to teleport so it isn’t suicide to use, so we can avoid traps, etc.

Using the downed state teleport in a group is often the opposite of being helpful because it creates a clone that confuses your group members they have a 50% chance of wasting precious time rezzing the wrong person. These types of clones should only confuse people in PVP. Please make the clone appear as an obvious purple mist to your allies and a less ethereal clone only to your enemies in PVP.

Emissary Vex.5690:

The spell used to teleport you away from the mob.

Not since beta2 at least. It was always random.

Emissary Vex.5690:

At some point (months ago) it either became bugged or was nerfed because now you have like an 75% chance of it teleporting directly beside/under the monster.

No, but you have confirmation bias.

Emissary Vex.5690:

Please let us choose where we want to teleport so it isn’t suicide to use, so we can avoid traps, etc.

Thieves have that, I prefer my stealth + clone over the controlled port, sorry. I feel sorry for Thieves with their weak #2, actually. Not that Thieves are weak as a whole at all.

skill 2 is useless against an average player. its not bad against a bad one as you spam confusion faster but well, you usually dont go down against a bad player.
in a group fight i also dislike it.

Deception is one of the very few Downed skills that’s almost guaranteed to break a stomp, the only way it won’t work is if you don’t have a target to use it on (which generally means 1vs1 against a Thief). It is one of the best Downed #2s.

I feel like it used to teleport me to wherever my cursor was if it wasn’t too far and now it seems like it teleports me next to myself.

the only thing I DON’T like about downed 2 is when people try and rez my kitten clone instead of me…

Our downed skill is actually objectively the second best in the game for its intended purpose: Stopping a stomp. The only one more effective is the ele mist form, but even the thief skill isn’t as effective as ours. As long as we have some target to select, whether it was our fighting target or just a critter, we can stop a stomp with 100% certainty, and you really can’t ask for more than that out of the downed skill number 2. Additionally, our skill number 3 is one of the stronger ones, summoning an extremely powerful phantasm that does serious damage.

During betas I used downed 2 in spvp to port into objects and res myself. Now only thieves can do that. :s

Elementalist has best down state. Can stop one stomp from multiple, retreat to party or friends, wvw go through a gate.

Thief has second best. Can stop 2 stomps from multiple people, and with shadow refuge can fully heal themselves in downstate. Retreat to friends/party.

Mesmer has third best. Can fully stop 1 stomp (from multiple people).

Guardian has forth best. Can fully stop 1 stomp from multiple people, but easy to blind.

Ranger/warrior/Necro/Engineer, to easy to blind, afford, predict, stun break, invul.

The main way I can think to improve mesmer downed state atm is to have the two skill pull the map up for you.

mesmer underwater downed best. stack confusion like devil

Wolfield.9812:

Elementalist has best down state. Can stop one stomp from multiple, retreat to party or friends, wvw go through a gate.

Thief has second best. Can stop 2 stomps from multiple people, and with shadow refuge can fully heal themselves in downstate. Retreat to friends/party.

Mesmer has third best. Can fully stop 1 stomp (from multiple people).

Guardian has forth best. Can fully stop 1 stomp from multiple people, but easy to blind.

Ranger/warrior/Necro/Engineer, to easy to blind, afford, predict, stun break, invul.

Thief can’t stop 2 stomps unless the people are really slow. Also, it is vulnerable to teleports such as blink, steal, shadowstep, lightning flash, or that one thief signet that will move you without interrupting a stomp.

I want an aoe that is powerful enough to one shot people, from full health to dead…

I have to admit that in pvp scenarios, it’s awesome. I always have to get double-stomped because the first one will always miss. In pve, it’s absolutely horrible. It’s almost guaranteed to teleport me right next to whatever is trying to kill me. The phantom is a concern as well because it stands right next to me while I’m in stealth so any aoe targeted at it will stop my healing. It’s also killed rather easily.

I’m willing to trade you guys all my engineer downed state abilities.

:)

Kardiamond.6952:

I’m willing to trade you guys all my engineer downed state abilities.

:)

Lol, don’t you get like… bombs or something? bombs are cool…. yeah.

Ele definitely has the best get out of jail free card. Run into the zerg, do damage, get downed, mist back to your team. Run outside the keep, do some aoe damage to siege, get downed, mist back into the keep.

I do really enjoy mesmer downed state though. It’s good enough to fool bad people, but not so OP that good players can’t do anything about it. Although not picking where you go does have it’s drawbacks. I’d say 10-25% of the time, if I’m unlucky enough to be by a hill or wall, it won’t teleport me very far and I get stomped anyway.

I do thoroughly enjoy the mesmer f4 for stomping people. I love when a guardian goes down and 4 people go to stomp him, including myself. I pop that f4 and the other 3 go flying back from the bubble…. but not me… that’s my stomp =)

Pyroatheist.9031:

Wolfield.9812:

Elementalist has best down state. Can stop one stomp from multiple, retreat to party or friends, wvw go through a gate.

Thief has second best. Can stop 2 stomps from multiple people, and with shadow refuge can fully heal themselves in downstate. Retreat to friends/party.

Mesmer has third best. Can fully stop 1 stomp (from multiple people).

Guardian has forth best. Can fully stop 1 stomp from multiple people, but easy to blind.

Ranger/warrior/Necro/Engineer, to easy to blind, afford, predict, stun break, invul.

Thief can’t stop 2 stomps unless the people are really slow. Also, it is vulnerable to teleports such as blink, steal, shadowstep, lightning flash, or that one thief signet that will move you without interrupting a stomp.

Stealth stops one stomp.
Teleport stops second stomp.

You can say that any class is vulnerable to teleports such as blink, steal, shadowstep, lightning flash, or that one thief signet that will move you without interrupting a stomp. And also the thief second sword teleport, and many others i am sure. We are not talking about the counter to counter down moves. Just the original counter available.

Wolfield.9812:

We are not talking about the counter to counter down moves. Just the original counter available.

Actually, we are.

If you don’t consider how easily countered the down move is then you can’t say which is more effective. The only way to prevent a Mesmer from avoiding you is to stealth stomp him without anyone else nearby, whereas at least three professions can negate the Thief’s teleport.

Personally I’d say that while the Ele is obviously the best, Thief and Mesmer are about the same so far as ‘how good is it’, if I had to vote I’d put Thief on too though.

Thieves get control of their avoidance, allowing them to juke enemies in the right situation. Trust me, Mesmers had the Thief downed skill at one point in beta (though it was the 3 skill and thus delayed). It made us very hard to kill if we could survive long enough. Thieves having it immediately is amazing. A good thief will wait until the last moment to teleport, making reacting to follow him more difficult and getting as much of the CD on his 3 skill down as possible.

The Mesmer downed state isn’t without it’s merits though. Our 2 skill offers both a difficult to counter stomp interrupt and some extra offense in the form of a clone. It’s relatively easy to discern who the real Mesmer is, but even that split second of time it takes to look for the arrow is something. So don’t discount it lightly.

In PvE the stealth makes for a short aggro dump (not as effective as before) and a clone that can take a hit or two while dealing some damage. The teleport is unreliable for avoiding AoE, but a but more reliable than 5 other Professions receive (ie those that don’t get to move).

Also, if its dropping you under enemy feet then odds are you are spamming the button before taking into account what you’re targeting. The teleport is made relevant to your target, so if you hit it before making certain what your target is (ie if you are hitting your 2 weapon skill as you go down) you may have the wrong enemy selected.

Ethics.4519:

Kardiamond.6952:

I’m willing to trade you guys all my engineer downed state abilities.

:)

Lol, don’t you get like… bombs or something? bombs are cool…. yeah.

Yeah our number 3 booby trap is awesome, the only draw back is we never get to use it because our number1-2 are the worse in the game.

If the downed #2 skill would reliably teleport us away from the enemy it would be so much better. I never end up using it unless I’m by myself because it always seems to put me in a more dangerous place than I was before. Too many times have I been moved right into the enemy zerg or directly in the line of fire. Although, I do have to say, Kardiamond is right. We are much better off than the engineer.

mesmer downed state is fine according to me, was able to down and kill enemy necro while downed, necro was lvl 80 with ~75%hp, any my lowest hp when downed was like 1%, then I healed myself, all about timing I’d say

drongas.4189:

mesmer underwater downed best. stack confusion like devil

AYE

I really like the mesmer downed state how it is. Do any of the other classes have so huge spike-dmg (iRogue) in their downed state? I don’t think so.
I did some WvW. My build is full berserker and when fighting vs. other full zerk people it does 40-50% dmg with one attack.

Edenwolf.6328:

I want an aoe that is powerful enough to one shot people, from full health to dead…

Actually, it would just be nice if our downed offensive skill #1 wasn’t almost entirely dependent on confusion for the damage. Thieves have that nasty crippling attack that, in comparison, seems to hit like a freaking truck – and hits multiple foes? Maybe some other downed abilities are more powerful than maybe they should be, and Mesmer is actually fine, but looking at others it feels slightly unfair.

Kardiamond.6952:

Ethics.4519:

Lol, don’t you get like… bombs or something? bombs are cool…. yeah.

Yeah our number 3 booby trap is awesome, the only draw back is we never get to use it because our number1-2 are the worse in the game.

I’m sure I’ve seen Engineers trolling people with those #2 and #3 skills, long enough to give an ally time to revive them. They don’t seem all that bad, can certainly be very annoying to finish them without invulnerability/stability/quickness available.

SSalp.6423:

Do any of the other classes have so huge spike-dmg (iRogue) in their downed state?

ranger. ranger also has great stalling through pet control (canine leaps/wolf fear/stun)
ive hit 7k+ with ele 3 (im sure it can go higher)

- also i kind of like mesmers downed state

Sarie.1630:

I’m sure I’ve seen Engineers trolling people with those #2 and #3 skills, long enough to give an ally time to revive them. They don’t seem all that bad, can certainly be very annoying to finish them without invulnerability/stability/quickness available.

Like any class, if you give us the time to use our number 3, you already pretty much missed your shot.

The issue is we never get to use our number 3. I don’t remember the last time I used it.

I could explain it, but I would suggest trying it yourself in WvW or sPvP. Then you discover the horror.

I have three classes and the down states are all good. Nothing is as OP as the Elementalist one though.

Thief — Teleport is short ranged and only useful if you have allies nearby you or nobodies attacking you. You can’t teleport through doors or off cliffs. The #3 stealths you for 2s which is basically useless in PvE and PvP.

Guardian — Knockback is great for trolling people or using it to give your allies some breathing room to res you. #3 is an AOE heal which can heal downed people as well and usually heals you for about 25% of your bar.

Mesmer — #2 creating a clone is better than Thief #3 because it puts you in stealth for about 3 seconds and can be used immediately. It’s basically a dice roll where you get teleported. #3 creating a DPS clone is ehhh in PvP, but helps rally you in PvE.

ComeAndSee.1356:

I have three classes and the down states are all good. Nothing is as OP as the Elementalist one though.

Thief — Teleport is short ranged and only useful if you have allies nearby you or nobodies attacking you. You can’t teleport through doors or off cliffs. The #3 stealths you for 2s which is basically useless in PvE and PvP.

Stealth in PvP is awesome, it’s another stomp avoidance which allows you time to teleport again. Also, the Thief #3 upgrades your #1 to a big attack that inflicts poison and bleeding, so you still get the typical ‘big hit #3’ skill, with the avoidance added on. Also, until recently, if a Thief survived until he got his #3 available he could dump all aggro on him, even with the recent change the temporary dump is nice.

Mesmer — #2 creating a clone is better than Thief #3 because it puts you in stealth for about 3 seconds and can be used immediately. It’s basically a dice roll where you get teleported. #3 creating a DPS clone is ehhh in PvP, but helps rally you in PvE.

#2’s stealth is only about 1s, it’s meant to drop targets and allow the Clone time to appear. With Prismatic Understanding you can increase it by 1s more.

Kardiamond.6952:

Ethics.4519:

Kardiamond.6952:

I’m willing to trade you guys all my engineer downed state abilities.

:)

Lol, don’t you get like… bombs or something? bombs are cool…. yeah.

Yeah our number 3 booby trap is awesome, the only draw back is we never get to use it because our number1-2 are the worse in the game.

Yeah our number one does very little damage and our number two is a lousy grappling hook that pulls the enemy to us. Because when in a downed state you really want the enemy on top of you. To top it off it only hits what is in front of us and not our target so pets or other player can block it and we still get stomped. Don’t understand why guardians get a knock back as there number two but its our three.

Carighan.6758:

Emissary Vex.5690:

The spell used to teleport you away from the mob.

Not since beta2 at least. It was always random.

I too believe it changed (maybe was fixed) at some point. It always (literally) used to port me back like phase retreat. And it made sense so you could reliably get away from AoE.

/e: it’s also annoying that this does only work with an enemy targeted. If a thief is stomping you from stealth (broken mechanic anyway) and there’s no other enemy nearby, bad luck.

Lantz.7240:

Kardiamond.6952:

Ethics.4519:

Kardiamond.6952:

I’m willing to trade you guys all my engineer downed state abilities.

:)

Lol, don’t you get like… bombs or something? bombs are cool…. yeah.

Yeah our number 3 booby trap is awesome, the only draw back is we never get to use it because our number1-2 are the worse in the game.

Yeah our number one does very little damage and our number two is a lousy grappling hook that pulls the enemy to us. Because when in a downed state you really want the enemy on top of you. To top it off it only hits what is in front of us and not our target so pets or other player can block it and we still get stomped. Don’t understand why guardians get a knock back as there number two but its our three.

Once in the EB jumping puzzle, at the cliff by the well, we had an Engineer wander up to us. Of course we attacked, he had no chance. So he used his rifle to jump the chasm to a ledge with no other way than a leap skill to get to.

He then stayed within range of our attacks, got downed, then pulled one of us across the gap to him. He died, but he stranded one of our number on the ledge so that he had to jump down to get back to us.

@Dastion

I hope it wasn’t an argument tu say our downed state is good.

But yeah, in a rare occasion (playing my engineer since release and I don’t think it has been useful to me for more then 1-2 time) it can be useful.

Kardiamond.6952:

I’m willing to trade you guys all my engineer downed state abilities.

:)

Exactly what I was going to say. After 300 hours on an engy having down state powers that actually DO something is great!

Kardiamond.6952:

I’m willing to trade you guys all my engineer downed state abilities.

:)

No kidding, I will throw my Necro’s in as well.

As others have pointed out Mes downed state is just fine

Mesmer downed state is wonderful in PvP unless you’re trying to do the stomping…

…but it’s a pain in the butt for PvE. I mean, it’s still not the worst, but I’m jealous of eles.

Hmm… I know the ‘port-’n’-clone is thematically in keeping with mesmers, but I wonder if it would be interesting for them to have a 1- or 2-second blur instead as their “stomp break” ability.

It would be a lot better if the big red arrow pointing at the Mesmer wasn’t there after #2. At least make people identify what Mesmer came out of stealth to stomp instead of the giant stomp me sign imo.

Thieves have that, I prefer my stealth + clone over the controlled port, sorry. I feel sorry for Thieves with their weak #2, actually. Not that Thieves are weak as a whole at all.

Playing both, I definitely 120% prefer the Thief’s downed state to any other class’s. Their #3 sucks, the half-second stealth is entirely pointless, but their #2 is awesome, and every class deserves something exactly like it.

The reason it is awesome is not because it lets you get away from an enemy that is fixated on you (let’s face it, very few classes can recover from being downed by a healthy and determined enemy), but because it allows you to reposition. This is vital when downed. If you’re too close to a deadly mob so that other players don’t want to get that close to rez, you can move away. If you drop inside a persistent damage field, you can teleport out of it. It’s brilliant. The Mesmer downed state is one of the least effective out there. Unless there are some very weak enemies nearby to kill you aren’t making it out alive. A better teleport would help.

Now of course I’m mostly talking from a PvE perspective, where “stomping” is not an issue. Stomp dodging is an entirely different element of a class.

Oh yeah, true. For PvE, Thief #2 is one of the strongest ones.
On the contrary for WvW, I feel Thief #2 is weak compared to ours. Too predictable as a whole because the graphics effect is so bloody obvious. Ours works slightly better, at least we stealth + get a clone.

This fixation on “tricking” people with downed state to avoid a stomp is why I never bother stomping in PvP. Instead I just AoE you down, and if someone tries a Mesmer clone they’ll probably still be within AoE radius of the clone, so still dead.