Guild Wars 2

psykles.1573:

I’ve been using blink all day with no problem (in spvp). Countless times, 0 problems.
There are TONS of mesmers in pvp, sometimes 10 in a game, average 3-4 per game.
I’m always in pvp because I enjoy it, no repair bill, free respecs to try everything out.
Endgame content is whatever you make of it.

25% passive speed increase in combat for mesmers is a bad idea.

It’s 4:30am. I’m going to sleep now and probably never coming back to this thread again.
Enjoy.

iLeap is bugged and unreliable in WvWvW. Besides, if you really want to stop a runner we have CC skills for that that work better than any of our “mobile” options.

More to the point, none of your comments address the most pressing issue for mesmers: it was advertised as a mobile class and we were told we’d be getting more reliable swiftness, but we still have trouble keeping up when trying to move around or cross a map. So no, it was not constructive because it dodged the real issue: MOBILITY. How do you get around after you blow your Blink CD? What if your iLeap or Swap misses? What if your target drops the immobilize?

I’m sorry but 1s of speed burst on a 30s CD and a 600 range leap requiring a target are NOT reliable mobility when other classes can leap and use speed buffs even out of combat/without a target.

I also think you don’t understand that speed buffs for us do not affect our clones. Even if we get a speed burst we cannot blast those 9K shatters you like to advertise, because our clones will still be too slow to get there. Personally I like to use Runes of the Centaur simply because you can give swiftness to your clones for those shatters, but I’d rather not have to use my rune setup for that because it gets expensive. That gives me an idea: a signet that gives us a passive speed buff, and the active gives our illusions swiftness, protection, and stability for 3s.

Funny thing is the +25% passive is for out-of-combat only. It’s funny because this should not really be a profession advantage thing. Why even make it selectable at all. Just give everybody +25% by default if that’s what the game needs.

Swiftness differentiation between classes should really be an in-combat thing.

There really should be no advatage to ooc movement speed. I could see in PvP how it’s a build strat for roamers so maybe this can be taken into consideration some how. But just for game enjoyment, ooc movement should be the same, and fixed, for all professions — and fixed at something high (hence “enjoyable”).

@juno:
The thing about that is high mobility and fast movement IMO should be a build spec that classes can go for, just like support, control, and damage. The uses for such a build in spvp and wvwvw are clear, so you should be able to invest in that. The problem with giving everyone the same OOC speed, is that these builds would go away. Everyone would be equally as good at running between cap points and supply lines.

Ideally, I’d like for such things as passive or high uptime speed burst to be build options with moderate investment (more than swapping a utility and less than needing gear/runes) for all classes. Traits are a good spot for that. I’d take all passive and high uptime speed buffs off skills and put them in adept-master traits. And in lines that make sense (that means Dueling for mesmers). That way, only those running certain builds would have the advantage they want instead of certain classes having it inherently and easily.

Since that would be a major overhaul for many classes, the simplest thing to do it give mesmers a movement based utility that is more than 1s of movement on a 30s CD or only has a 13% chance to hit.

@Gaiawolf
tyvm — that makes a lot of sense and you changed my mind. I agree with your statement that it should be a build option for all classes. You suggestion makes the decision meaningful instead of arbitrary by using trait lines.

You know, between temporal curtain and blink, I have no problems keeping up with my zerg in wvw, none. And since I find other uses for both temporal curtain and blink IN combat, it’s fine with me.

However, I DO find something wrong with every class except one getting a perm. 25% speed buff. I don’t find I’m being left behind, but I HAVE to use two skills to keep up with someone using one skill, and that doesn’t seem quite right.

However, honestly, I’d rather see some of those classes debuffed rather than us getting buffed. For example, perhaps thief, elementalist while in air attunement might get 25%, while most of the rest get 10% and a couple at 0%.

A flat +25% across the board, minus one class, just seems conspicuous to me.

In WVW, however, using focus and blink, I have no problems at all… except for the stacking issue. Failing to get my speed buff from my focus even though I run across it perfectly… THAT irritates me.

So, for me, fix the swiftness stacking problem we have, and I’d probably be happy… I’d be happier if they debuffed a few classes down below 25%, but I’ll live with the stacking problem fixed.

“When combined with sword #3 or blink, it makes it practically impossible for people to run away.
Eventually you will catch them and kill them.”

This statement makes me think you have no idea what you’re talking about.

In WvW, mes are just an annoyance now. As a mes, it’s like playing whack a mole. Run an enemy into a keep. (Since you can’t catch them.) Then play combat tag as they pop in and out until their buddies show up to gank you. Izerker is nice to slow them, but they just cure it’s initial strike then outrun it. >.<
Sword 3 would be awesome if I could get within range and switch before the outrun my illusion.

Aether McLoud.1975:

Low mobility is a mesmer weakness, deal with it. Can’t have everything of the cake.

low mobility AND almost no aoe?

pick one or the other. not both. none of the other classes have to give up TWO items over what they gain on mesmers

MMORPG Balance 101

Morfedel.4165:

You know, between temporal curtain and blink, I have no problems keeping up with my zerg in wvw, none.

…I HAVE to use two skills to keep up with someone using one skill, and that doesn’t seem quite right.

… except for the stacking issue. Failing to get my speed buff from my focus even though I run across it perfectly

I strongly agree with your statement. I don’t usually have a problem keeping up with my mates, when I have the focus, the utility skill “Blink”, and the trait “Warden’s Feedback” equipped.

Recently, however, I started to wonder if the 16.5% (33% * 10 sec effect span / 20 sec cool-down span) all-time speed buff is worth the 20 points invested in Inspiration in order to get a single trait.

In an other word, in order to make up the speed gap between the other professions and me, I had to use the phantasm, the iWarden, which is much less capable in WvW and PvP scenes, in exchange for 66% of the speed buff off other professions(16.5% / 25%). And that was when I had the Warden’s Feedback trait(costing me 20 trait points into Inspiration line, which I never really wanted), or it would be only a 52.8% buff of other professions (33% * 10 sec effect span / 25 sec cool down). And this really make no sense to me…

In my opinion, if the officials stated that mesmer would be the second agile profession, then it should be, for example, 25% all time buff just like the other professions, plus Blink.

I had not really noticed this in wvw but I have been doing jumping puzzles with my husband, who plays a necro, and just keeping up with him to get to the puzzle is insane. I use the focus and blink and he is still very far ahead of me. So it takes me 2 slots to try to keep up.. something not quite right. Atleast for the most part it is not game changing, but it would be nice to have the option to keep up with him.

Mesmers have the option to get 100% 33% runspeed, but not for free.

Focus + 2x rune of air, 2x monk, 2x water +20 inspiration + 20 chaos + Signet of Midnight = 100% uptime, or 30chaos no Signet = 100% uptime.

Rune of the Centaur 12sec swiftness, 15sec CD, again 20chaos +signet or 30chaos for 100% uptime.

Both heavy commitments, but its not like the focus buff was useless.

Man you mesmers are one greedy profession. I swear you guys want everything lol.

Morfedel.4165:

You know, between temporal curtain and blink, I have no problems keeping up with my zerg in wvw, none. And since I find other uses for both temporal curtain and blink IN combat, it’s fine with me.

However, I DO find something wrong with every class except one getting a perm. 25% speed buff. I don’t find I’m being left behind, but I HAVE to use two skills to keep up with someone using one skill, and that doesn’t seem quite right.

However, honestly, I’d rather see some of those classes debuffed rather than us getting buffed. For example, perhaps thief, elementalist while in air attunement might get 25%, while most of the rest get 10% and a couple at 0%.

A flat +25% across the board, minus one class, just seems conspicuous to me.

In WVW, however, using focus and blink, I have no problems at all… except for the stacking issue. Failing to get my speed buff from my focus even though I run across it perfectly… THAT irritates me.

So, for me, fix the swiftness stacking problem we have, and I’d probably be happy… I’d be happier if they debuffed a few classes down below 25%, but I’ll live with the stacking problem fixed.

Pretty much this.
I don’t like being left in the dust when a player runs from a fight or when I get out run by a Zerg. To say we have the worst mobility though. Nah, not even. There is so much in our arsenal to move around with its ridiculous. Starting of with in combat mobility: traited speed for each active clone, blink, phase retreat, portal, temporal curtain, rune setups, stealth from 4 sources. Out of combat mobility is where we start lacking but blink plus temporal curtain keep us up just fine. Just swap weapons to whatever you want for combat when your Zerg gets there. Not hard at all.
I’ll say for myself, I’m ok with being slow as long as I can keep everything else for my in combat mobility. Someone said it earlier in the posts " we can’t have everything ".

Mesmer only has one signet worth getting :-\ signet of malice or something. it increases cond damage or whatever.

Lightsbane.9012:

Mesmer only has one signet worth getting :-\ signet of malice or something. it increases cond damage or whatever.

It’s not even used for the cond damage, it’s used for the stun.

And Mesmers are fast enough as is, out of combat. “OH NO, I CAN’T CATCH UP TO MY BUDDY IN THE OPEN WORLD, WHAT DO WE DO?” If he’s your buddy, he’ll wait for you or scout for events.

If you gave Mesmers a signet that would increase mobility out of combat, it would force all PvE Mesmers leveling to run it and would defeat the option of running whatever you want. As for all the complaining about mobility IN combat, when have you ever needed to run 25% faster in a dungeon to kill something? In WvW or sPvP, if we ran 25% faster, we would destroy. Have you ever done a shatter with Focus4 so the clones get swiftness? That’s 33% faster and it’s ridiculous to try and dodge them.

Rieselle.5079:

You can have +speed signet, if my Ele gets to have Portal.

Oh please go ahead and take it. If portal is the mighty reason the entire profession suffers from long ignored bugs, inconveniences and sloppy randomness, I’d be happy to pass that curse over to elementalists. Don’t forget to leave us ride the lightning and all your aoe skills before you leave!

Merle.5693:

Mesmers have the option to get 100% 33% runspeed, but not for free.

Focus + 2x rune of air, 2x monk, 2x water +20 inspiration + 20 chaos + Signet of Midnight = 100% uptime, or 30chaos no Signet = 100% uptime.

Rune of the Centaur 12sec swiftness, 15sec CD, again 20chaos +signet or 30chaos for 100% uptime.

Both heavy commitments, but its not like the focus buff was useless.

Compare this to Engineer, another class that doesn’t have a +25% runspeed signet (or any signets for that matter). For just 20 points in Tools, which I feel a lot of Engineer builds have anyways for +20% recharge on toolbelt and +20% crit damage, they can slot a trait called speedy kits that allows them to perma-swiftness just by clicking one button every 5 seconds. No runes, no boon duration, no need to even use a skill just have those 20 trait points and your choice of kit

Granted engineers have their own problems to worry about but mobility, even in-combat, isn’t one of them, perma-swiftness, rifle 4 + 5, elixir gun 4, rocket boots (and its toolbelt is a small but effective 300 range jump). In fact if I was going to rate classes in terms of mobility even including in-combat, I’d put Thief and Elementalist well ahead of Mesmers who would probably be tied with Engineers and be just barely ahead of Guardians (teleport/leap on their sword/greatsword and a teleport of their own that actually inflicts damage albeit on a 50% longer cooldown).

Super Goose.1467:

Merle.5693:

Mesmers have the option to get 100% 33% runspeed, but not for free.

Focus + 2x rune of air, 2x monk, 2x water +20 inspiration + 20 chaos + Signet of Midnight = 100% uptime, or 30chaos no Signet = 100% uptime.

Rune of the Centaur 12sec swiftness, 15sec CD, again 20chaos +signet or 30chaos for 100% uptime.

Both heavy commitments, but its not like the focus buff was useless.

Compare this to Engineer, another class that doesn’t have a +25% runspeed signet (or any signets for that matter). For just 20 points in Tools, which I feel a lot of Engineer builds have anyways for +20% recharge on toolbelt and +20% crit damage, they can slot a trait called speedy kits that allows them to perma-swiftness just by clicking one button every 5 seconds. No runes, no boon duration, no need to even use a skill just have those 20 trait points and your choice of kit

Granted engineers have their own problems to worry about but mobility, even in-combat, isn’t one of them, perma-swiftness, rifle 4 + 5, elixir gun 4, rocket boots (and its toolbelt is a small but effective 300 range jump). In fact if I was going to rate classes in terms of mobility even including in-combat, I’d put Thief and Elementalist well ahead of Mesmers who would probably be tied with Engineers and be just barely ahead of Guardians (teleport/leap on their sword/greatsword and a teleport of their own that actually inflicts damage albeit on a 50% longer cooldown).

With a class mechanic that basically does everything for them, I would feel that this “lack of mobility” fair trade.

How is Mesmer’s class mechanic any different from Engineer? Both give the class access to four more abilities, and in fact Engineer’s can be argued to be better because you can actually change what abilities you get and using them doesn’t sacrifice the effects of another skill and potential damage. Also, using toolbelt skills is easier. Knowing when to shatter and which shatter to use at the right time while balancing illusions and clones is almost as difficult as managing attunements I would say, yet Mesmers have far less mobility than Elementalists.

Unless you meant that Mesmer’s class mechanic is too powerful to warrant mobility as well in which case I still fall back to Elementalists, who have one of the best, if not the best, class mechanics in the game. What boils down to the equivalent of 2 free weapon slots at the mere cost of mostly being locked into a particular range, short for daggers, medium for scepter, and long for staffs. D/D as a set alone provides more mobility than Mesmers can get with a full skill bar and on top of that you can get a +25% signet, a teleport and Mistform..

Super Goose.1467:

Compare this to Engineer, another class that doesn’t have a +25% runspeed signet (or any signets for that matter). For just 20 points in Tools, which I feel a lot of Engineer builds have anyways for +20% recharge on toolbelt and +20% crit damage, they can slot a trait called speedy kits that allows them to perma-swiftness just by clicking one button every 5 seconds. No runes, no boon duration, no need to even use a skill just have those 20 trait points and your choice of kit

It’s just 10 points in Tools for Speedy Kits, just saying.

All this Mesmer Bashing, feels like I am back in Japan in the late 80s. Why do people think this class has everything is beyond me. It might be strong in sPvP, which I don’t play, but in PvE it is lacking.
I would like to use something else but centaur runes and focus, but for PvE, I am more or less forced to run with this setup to be on par. Honestly, I don’t care about sPvP, and if someone tells me that shooting the door in a siege is overpowered, ah well.
Split PvP/PvE skills if you must, but give us option please.

Mesmers definitely need more speed adjustments. All we received was Signet of Inspiration grabbag chance and a slight increase in duration for swiftness on a specific weapon. Not a utility we can reliably use — which is what it should be. I’m not saying that we should be given a signet that gives +25 percent speed like many other classes have now, but definitely something more should be given without us having to rely on luck/chance or a specific weapon that we may not even use for our build/combat.

We’re Mesmers. We can warp friggen time and fold space with Time Warp and Portals and Teleports. But we can’t manage to do it do give us better speed? Out of all the classes thematically, speed boosting/warping of time makes the most sense for us.

wow people act like it is impossible to play the mesmer in PvE without a constant speedbuff lol.

Every class should get a +25% passive utility skill of some sort. The skill forces a decision to be made for mobility vs. utility. Not having the option on every class is weak. It’s not a combat mechanic (although movement out of combat between strategic points is battle-effecting).

It doesn’t make much sense to give the passive to 5 of 8 professions, but not the remaining 3. You’ll have a hard time arguing that that 3 professions left out are “buffed” in some other fashion that makes them too powerful otherwise.

I’ve stopped playing WvW because I’m tired of this issue in particular. I use to enjoy moving with smaller groups and hitting supply camps, but I’m tired of just being dead the moment any group too large for us to take shows up. Also got tired of every time I would start to win a fight the enemy would just run away.

Also as others have said I’m really tired of temporal curtain not stacking with other swiftness sources. Really all it does is slow you down in the long run in a group as the others pull ahead as they stack longer swiftness durations until you’re no longer close enough to benefit from their swiftness at all. At which point you’re left in the dust waiting on your cooldown hoping you’re not picked off by a lone thief.

I used to play WvW with my mesmer before they created all the LOS issues with the greatsword. Now i can’t find a single reason to play mesmer at all in WvW over Ele/Ranger/Necro or one of the other classes that have a movement speed buff for that sole reason alone. Our zerg starts getting destroyed and we have to run? guess who is getting ganked because i can’t run away quick enough versus everyone else. We see a few people attacking a camp? guess who isn’t going to get any credit for any kind of kill because they are too slow to catch up. I’m running with a zerg to the other side of the map, guess who is at the end of the zerg getting destroyed by the perma stealth 25% swiftness theif?

That pretty much sums up my Mesmer in WvW.

It is also extremely annoying in dungeons when you are “skipping” mobs or running past ridiculous amounts of enemies. I feel like mesmer is the only class who is riding the short bus and everyone else is running ferrari’s