Guild Wars 2

Quite simple, make them untargetable.

I mean, looks at the Guardian, he has spirit weapons that are more utilitarian, and last longer because they’re untargetable

Why not make mesmer illusions untargetable as well, but give them a lifespan, since we can spawn many of them quite fast anyways, a 15 second lifespan for clones and a 20 second lifespan for phantasms would be nice.

And perhaps make the three pink circles drain to indicate the remaining time for the illusions.

You mean for phantasms? Part of the point of clones is having enemies target them instead of you…

no, i mean illusions (clones and phantasms).
plus, when you summon either of those the enemy doesn’t target them, he’ll still be locked on you, only one two skills do the untargeting thing.

and people who have the slightest knowledge of the game and have some logic will ignore the illusions.

at the moment, illusions die to fast to do damage or deceive anyone, but they are still required for numerous skills to be effective.

This would make us even more of a pet class which is what we dont need.

Clones need to be indistinguishable from the player and the damage done by phantasms needs to be brought back to the player. The point of the class is to bring mayhem and confusion not a ranged pet class.

currently it is even inferior to a pet class.
clones and phantasms mean nothing if they die before they can hit even once.

My idea to fix illusions

Are Illusions broken?

currently it is even inferior to a pet class.

Mesmers can summon Illusions 5-10 times as often as pet classes can summon pets.

Pet classes inferior to Mesmers?

EasymodeX.4062:

My idea to fix illusions

Mesmers can summon Illusions 5-10 times as often as pet classes can summon pets.

Pet classes inferior to Mesmers?

illusions are useless if they die as soon as you summon them.
at least pets have much more durability.

So would you say that Illusions die 5-10 times as easily as pets?

EasymodeX.4062:

So would you say that Illusions die 5-10 times as easily as pets?

don’t they!?
not to mention you can switch pets in combat, meanwhile your pet revives slowly.

I was just confirming your perception of the order of magnitude of Illusion fragility compared to pets contrasted to their frequency.

Also, Mesmer Illusions revive slowly?

What would you consider a fast revival versus a slow revival? What “revival” time valuation would you place on a Guardian’s Spirit Weapons?

EasymodeX.4062:

Mesmer Illusions revive slowly?

i was talking about ranger pets.

This idea would fundamentally change everything this class is. It would be like Warriors asking for pets.

Your clones are designed to actually die. That is their purpose. They do almost no damage. They have a number of traits that make them put status effects on enemies when they die. The ONLY weapon that wants to keep it’s clones alive as long as possible is a Staff.

If you get Deceptive Evasion your clone supply is out of control. With a build that has any degree of crit, you have Vigor up almost all the time, allowing you to dodge CONSTANTLY.

Making Illusions in to some sort of Spirit Weapon would make us a turret based class. Last I checked, Engineers have that role pretty well handled.

Ranger pets seem to take around 10 seconds to revive from what I recall, although it’s different in and out of combat. Although, IIRC they auto-revive in 45s in combat, but my memory is fuzzy.

Illusions are awesome and don’t need any changes. What DOES need a change are your expectations:

1. Illusions are designed to provide distractions, both in PvP and PvE.

2. Illusions are designed to be utterly expendable.

3. Illusions are designed to last until they are destroyed or until the enemy dies to give the Mesmer options in long fights.

@EasymodeX

Ranger pets take forever to revive if they die. Currently the only way to bring a pet back to life is to swap pets. If you swap a pet that is currently dead, you trip a 60 second cooldown (45 if you take a trait to reduce it). So you can say if a pet dies it is ‘instant’ to revive them, because you swap to pet #2 instantly. However if that pet dies, you are stuck with a dead pet until that CD is finished.

In short, Ranger pets have a very long CD if you can’t keep them alive. And a dead ranger pet hurts them a lot more than a dead clone, since the pet accounts for a good 25-30% (or more, depending on spec) of their total DPS. This is why Ranger pets take longer to die and are effected by heal spells… their death hurts the ranger quite a bit.

Meanwhile, a dead clone barely affects a Mesmers current DPS, and can be typically resummoned anywhere from instantly to 5 seconds. This is why Illusions die so easily. The cooldowns for the abilities are very short and their relative addition to our power is smaller. They are the epitome of a throwaway tank.

Since pets are becoming a focal point of this discussion, just want to make sure the info and facts are out there.

Rangers have LOADS of abilities that increase pet damage as well as there own as well as other things to help keep them alive, Mesmer Clones and Phantoms die if they get sneezed on even with all the traits and abilities to up the health they have

In my opinion they ARE inferior to Ranger pets it doesnt matter how many damage something can do if it can be killed in 1-2 auto attacks, they HAVE to allow us to summon them often as they die VERY often

Phantasms being untargetable, not using up slots, not shattering, and only lasting a short duration would be preferable.

Clones need to stay targetable for them to have any reason to exist.

Pretty sure phantasms do a kittenload more damage than ranger pets, just saying.

Ranger pets (the dps ones at least, like a cat) do a crazy amount of damage. On the flip side, most mobs kill them very very quickly, unless you are BM specced (which means you usually do less damage with your Bows as well, unless you go pure glass cannon).

Ranger Pets and Mesmer Illusions are really apples and oranges.

One is designed to be a permanant pet. Rangers are balanced with a LIVING pet. This means that one your pet is dead you are at 80% effectivness at best, worse if you are BM spec. They do more damage and live longer, but that is because without them functioning, a Ranger is sub par.

The other is designed to be a disposable pet. Clones exist to distract and soak up hits, to be summoned very quickly, and sometimes adding some debuffs that help us out. Phantasms are clearly designed to do one or two rounds of their damage, at which point if they manage to live longer it’s a bonus. Phantasms are NOT balanced with the idea you have them as a long term turret, if we can get that situation to occur that means the odds have worked htemselves to our favor. We are meant to have them last just long enough to have the spells CD to reset.

I really think that all the people that feel Clones should be more like a Ranger pet or Spirit Weapon, should actually go play a Ranger or Guardian respectively. There is no reason to make the Mesmers defining mechanic copy another classes skills. If you like the other classes skills, well you can play that class!

Munki.9452:

Ranger Pets and Mesmer Illusions are really apples and oranges.

Clones exist to distract and soak up hits, to be summoned very quickly, and sometimes adding some debuffs that help us out. Phantasms are clearly designed to do one or two rounds of their damage, at which point if they manage to live longer it’s a bonus. Phantasms are NOT balanced with the idea you have them as a long term turret, if we can get that situation to occur that means the odds have worked htemselves to our favor. We are meant to have them last just long enough to have the spells CD to reset.

I really think that all the people that feel Clones should be more like a Ranger pet or Spirit Weapon, should actually go play a Ranger or Guardian respectively. There is no reason to make the Mesmers defining mechanic copy another classes skills. If you like the other classes skills, well you can play that class!

QFT. Tbh, I don’t even feel like i’m playing a pet class on my mesmer.

You know what would be neat? If your clones repositioned themselves to surround your target and basically you and your three clones would form an “X” around your target, equidistant from your target with you, and they would mirror your moves and attacks. If you move in, back up, strafe left/right, turn, etc, your illusions would do the exact same thing. If you change targets, they will run up to the new target and reform that “X” (or “Y” or “|” depending on how many clones are out).