Guild Wars 2

After the recent patches Necros are becoming the hardest class for me to kill. It seems if they get in close to you it’s more or less game over. I run cure condi on heal and arcane thief with both it’s not enough to deal with the death machine that they are now days. So far only way I found to beat them is to stay at 1200. So how do YOU deal with a good necro now days?

If they are condi – i pretty much run. we have terrible condition removal compared to the fact that can just pretty much reapply all the conditions in the next 10seconds.

Stay at range, keep an eye out for Staff and Marks. Not alot that you can do, VERY high health as well as DS combine that with all the conditions and utilities they have.

Best bet would be Moa and hope you can burst them down time. Try to get them down to 50% or so, go stealth pop Moa and then full on nuke

Necros are definitely to be respected now in pvp. I ran into a talented one last night in sPvP and noticed something specific about him. He was exceedingly strong in 1v1. However, in a 2v2 or anything more than 1v1 he became much weaker. In pure 1v1, the only way I could compete was to avoid him getting a lock on me. If he bursted me at all there’s simply too few ways to quickly recover. He’d just stack conditions, hit me a couple times and I’d be at half health. As a note, I wasn’t running Melandru runes, but I did have a traited torch and Null Field.

I’ve an 80 necro, but haven’t vested much time into pvp yet for the profession. I’ll have to look into it.

In wvwvw I feel I can controll adn down every necro I faced so far in a 1 vs 1 situation on 2 of my builds. Shatter Cat heavy with 60% condition downtime handle them IF I range juke. That mean, go in, deliver a burst and get out. Dont what ever you do stay in close combat exchange blows versus a necro.

They take dmg, they turn on green bar yes it feel like u have to kill em 2 time but take your time, never stress a fight versus a necro and NEVER fight in close quarters.

Duels in smal area is doomed, you need to juke + stealth 2k~range around alternative use different hights in terrain and line of sight, this way you can go in, do a burst, immune if needed and get out. after 2-3 of this bursts they turn green and you keep preasure + juke out, in the end they die.

Other build I feel i can handle em on is silly but ist the latest “non shatter condition build”, Simply preasure + stealth and so far it worked.

Spvp, if 1 necro I try untill I know if I win or lose, if I lose I stealth and bail. If 2 necros u need a army to take em down, totlay different situation in spvp than wvwvw atm. This alot due to burst is stronger in wvwvw+ lemongras.

/Osicat

There are a few options for dealing with condition necros (and other condition classes for that matter).

The most effective (in my opinion), yet also the most specialized is the Cleansing Conflagration trait in Domination. With that trait, you have two relatively low-cooldown condition removers. If you leave the iMage active, every time it attacks (assuming the attack bounces to you) it will remove an additional condition. I find that if I summon an iMage and leave it sitting on the sidelines, I have no trouble keeping conditions off of me. This is like, the one scenario in which that particular phantasm is actually useful.

The other popular option is to use runes/food to reduce condition duration on you. Hoelbrak and Melandru runes will both reduce condition duration on you, and you can get another 40% reduction from lemongrass poultry soup. That will leave you at around 60% condition duration reduction.

You can also use utilities to supplement the above options. I prefer Arcane Thievery because it helps burst down enemy necros, but Null Field is a good choice too, especially if your build can make good use of the combo field it provides. Mantra of Resolve can also work, but I haven’t used it nearly enough to give a valid opinion of how it fares in combat against a necro.

There are also a number of other traits you could take. Mender’s Purity, Shattered Conditions, and Cleansing Inscriptions are all lesser-used traits which will help reduce the burden of conditions on you. They will probably be harder to work into a quality build, but since we don’t know your build, we can’t reject them completely.

Finally, you can use Lyssa runes to get an emergency cleanse when you use your elite. It can make a big difference if you manage to let the necro unload just about every condition on you.

You will probably see the best results using some combination of the above-mentioned ideas. What you do depends a lot on your build. Try out some of these options and see what works. As for killing enemy necros, just focus on damaging them as much as possible without overextending yourself. They have a lot of health, and if they’re using rabid gear, a lot of toughness. However, they don’t have a ton of active defense for avoiding damage, so you can just wear them down. I have both a condition build which I use for WvW and a phantasm build for tpvp and neither one has much of a problem with necros.

I have actually found interrupts to work very well against necros, halting strikes is usually enough but you can pick up the other traits if you wish, a lot of the necro skills have quite long channel times and are therefore easy to interrupt if you know what to look for, I wouldn’t bother trying to interrupt marks as you will only stop one and they will just cast another and cast the one you interrupted last, but once necros blow all their marks there is little reason to carry on using it as auto attack damage from staff is slow and not so good if the necro is a condition build.

Scepter and dagger is fairly easy to interrupt once you know what the casts look like, I recommend making a necro and playing them for a little bit to familiarise yourself with the cast times. Power builds are seriously crippled by our interrupts as they have frail defenses and ghastly claws/life siphon have such long cast times! If you can withstand deathshroud skills, do so, only interrupt if you can save one for after they come out of it, if a necro can’t inflict their conditions and their health drops too much, they are likely to go into deathshroud and heal right after they come out of it, you want to interrupt the heal as then they will really panic.

If you get feared break out of it anyway you can, stun breaks and condi-cleanses will do the trick, terror damage is too strong to just ignore. You will find that so long as you keep up the pressure and interrupt effectively, you won’t have too many conditions on you anyway.

Mantra of resolve is probably the best condi removal, along with cleansing conflagrations as mentioned above, the reason I say that is null field/phantasmal disenchanter are thwarted by area denial (wells) and aoe damage (certain wells and death shroud 4 and 5), respectively. If you are not a power based build, interrupts still work but you are probably better to take the traits out of chaos, as the might stacks will help you with condi damage, but going condi against necro is always going to be a risk, they have more ways of passing condis back than us.

You kill a necro vizunah style : Run inside a keep and use the AC ! ( Only works in WvW)

I run a condition tank build the bulk of the time. If they are a great cond necro, there is little I can do, but most I can take if I’m careful. I run staff and scepter/torch (torch traited) so I will use my torch skills to start with and wait for them to do some sort of condition spike on me. When they do, I use arcane thievery and watch them panic. Seeing as I’m a condition spec, they usually already have several conditions on them and the new 3 which gets passed over to them can be their down fall if they haven’t been good with the CD’s.

If they have plague signet (which you’ll see on their bar), never use arcane thievery until after they have used that signet or it’s game over for you.

What Nordic said is exactly my experiences with the same/similar setup as his. I too run tank/condie with Staff & Scepter/Torch and I’ve been able to beat most Necro’s 1v1, although many times it’s very close. The really good ones somestimes just ROFL-stomp me in the face though, stacking a condie burst that I could only dream of, but as stated above we have counters . (I don’t use Arc Thievery but might try it out just for that)

I use PU with 3 forms of stealth and Blink, so as Osicat said, a big part of dealing with them successfully is staying away from them. (Also CA and CS help in a similar fashion)

Stay at range (of them and your teammates, epidemic), let your clones hit their marks. A well timed null field or mass invis with lyssa runes can win the fight. Basically I just try to drop some phants on them and stay out of their aoe.

If they get the jump on you or manage to land a cc/condi combo, blow whatever cd’s you have to and just try to reset the fight.

Fighting a decent necro and winning will depend on your build. I’ve had zero luck as a condition build fighting them. Close but no joy. Best I’ve done is with a PU phantasm build. Reset combat distance every time you stealth. My favorite weapon setup for it is sw/pistol and GS. Spread your phantasms out and only use Blurred Frenzy when you have a defensive ability ready. I open with zerker (for cripple) then dualist, I-Mage then run away. Wait till he starts coming after you or kills a phantasm. Decoy then BF, Magic Bullet and reset distance. Things rarely go as planned but remember your priority of range=survival.

PU condi build works for me most of the time(in WvW with sigill of generosity & torch traited). Plenty of stealth, plenty of condi cleansing. The one thing you really wanna do is keep those necros at a healthy distance. And that’s pretty easy with stealth and phase retreat.

Same for power builds. Keeping distance is the most important part. But once they land their condis on you, it’s pretty hard to survive the fight. Cleansing without torch is kinda meh. Conditions are too spammable in comparison to our “regular” cleansing utilites (Nullfield, Arcane Thievery).

Havnt really run into any necromancers that have been all that impressive, tho warriors seem to have changed completely for me. They are either learning or something has changed, either way they seem to destroy my clones befor they even get fully deployed. :/

As Osicat mentioned, the new condition tank builds are solid vs necros. Necros have good condition cleanses, but mesmers can reapply lots of conditions very quickly with the right build. So it’s easy to put on pressure and break stuns / stealth / clear conditions with a traited torch.

I stay with my staff while closing in, if they do anything other than auto attack i, get the kitten out of there dodge or phase retreat. If they crit on the clones they waste the burning trait that has a 10s cooldown or something. Then my fight contineus as normal, use the environment and make unpredictable moves so he/she cant hit you etc.

Recently i found another necro that i simply call OP in duelling situations on open ground….
It uses soldiers amulet and extreme life leeching with all minions… also extreme conditon removal, he was practically immune :/. I would Ileap him and he doesnt even care O.o.
When i did manage to burst him with 25 vulenrability, 4 mind wracks, full blurred frenzy, he would only lose 30% of his health and recover it so quickly by only staring at me :’(.

/cries in a corner

In sPvP, I prefer to burst the necro as if there was no tomorrow, try to dodge their stakitten AoE skills then Arcane Thievery if you’ve got too many dangerous conditions like chill, 8+ bleeding and torment.
If the necro is condition damage, he is usually my 2nd target after thiefs.
If the necro has the golem elite summoned, KILL the golem asap.

Most of these are tips against condition/hybrid necros. What would work against a power necro? They have more ways to get Life force than condition builds do so they can be tanky with the new patch even if they are glass…

I’m currently using a more agressive shatter build with traited torch and arcane thievery. At first, i try to keep my distance, get staff clones, iWarlocks and iMages (important!) and start grinding on his hp. Decoy, Massinvis and Torch #4 is used for repositioning.

After he pops out of deathshroud, is try to burst him, but it’s important to have Blink, F4 or Weaponswap off CD to quickly gain your distance afterwards. Arcane Thievery/Null Field is saved as a panic button against condition bursts.

I usually play the same way against power builds. Arcane Thievery can be nice to steal might from Blood is Power. Also, when he turns Lich or starts spamming DS #1, run and break LoS.

I’ve pretty much accepted that if I encounter a good necro, I will die if I stay and fight fairly. So moa has become my necro-buster, if I can’t burst them down I get the hell out of there.

I’ve find only 2 builds working on necros these days.
Interrupt build 10/30/30/0/0 and cleansing build 20/20/0/30/0.
With Shattered conditions +focus warden u have tons of condi removal. Worked for me with staff, S/F.

Tbh 20-20-30 destroy necros in spvp and wvwvw. The stealth combined with constant preasure from clones and phantasm condition applying drain their health and leav em emty. Just make sure not drag on a revealed buff without have a shatter nr 4 or blink ready.

/Osicat

Osicat.4139:

Tbh 20-20-30 destroy necros in spvp and wvwvw. The stealth combined with constant preasure from clones and phantasm condition applying drain their health and leav em emty. Just make sure not drag on a revealed buff without have a shatter nr 4 or blink ready.

/Osicat

That was a secret for the few condition mesmers out there.
A balanced power gear could also do it.

I currently play two setups, the first one is my favourite for wvw while the other is for pvp.
• 20/20/30/0/0 – staff and scepter/torch – traited torch, traited arcane thievery, melandru/undead runes.
• 0/30/30/10/0 – staff and sword/pistol – mender’s purity, null field, melandru/undead runes.

With rabid gear/jewel and the typical mesmer’s ways to avoid damage it is really hard to die, be it direct or condition damage.
Edit: And its also easy+fast to down someone in 1vs1 or 1vsX.

err atm in spvp u might wanna run when u see one….your condition cleaners arent fast enough to deal with the massconditions put on u. i dont get why 1 class gets given every single condition in the game appart from 1 and that one got nerfed to the ground.
but if u decide to fight. be quick and try to make him wast his stronges conditionspikes, then attack…..

I can take them in WvW because I run Melandru and Traited Torch but in PvP I never face a necro alone because there is very little chance of survival with the new condition meta.

Hexxen.7216:

I can take them in WvW because I run Melandru and Traited Torch but in PvP I never face a necro alone because there is very little chance of survival with the new condition meta.

yup in wvw u can run with food so it easier to take a necro down. after the last 2 patches i went to spvp and decided to back of necros…..

Tbh, have not found one in spvp eather that I culd not destroy with 20-20-30. My guildmates I duel call teh specc troll specc. Its the stealth + clones that do it in combo with steady preasure. I simply stay on the move in stealth and pop clones and phantasm on them and when I pop up I use immuitys, sealth + blink. I dont get the big barrae of condition landed on me and some usage of the heal, + torch cleaners keep my health up.

/Osicat

sPvP fight dirty, shave of damage at a distance use your phants keep higher ground, when you know you got him burst him.

tPvP if you meet one solo, best to just not feed him, to out play him you really have to sacrifice a capture point since you can’t even contest it, and you don’t have time to do that.

WvW Majority of the players are pretty bad just nuke em and you should win. If he does happen to be a decent player you have enough damage to hold pressure unlike sPvP, I’d still say get a better position but you atleast have a chance on a flat plane

Think thats where the problem is in sPvP Daishi. The current spvp setup with area on ground where you HAVE TO STAND to cap/defend is wery bad for some classes who use movment and acctive defense. If I have to care about the point I have a big disadvantage versus a necro who can put a field of mines on the cap part + focus hes dmg in that area.

I just dont give a crap about the point when face a necro and then I can kill him. In tPvP this ins not a valid option and here comes my question to arena net.

WHY do we only have 1 type of Meta in tPvP, 1 kind who give stable area controlling calsses big benefits and forces them into a few builds. I would like to see some capture the flag modes, defuse the bomb etc. Then suddenly more setups and playstyles would be viable.

/Osicat

selan.8354:

i dont get why 1 class gets given every single condition in the game appart from 1 and that one got nerfed to the ground.

You may want to check how many conditions mesmers can apply.

Pick up a condition build and try. If you still cant kill him a least you wont die.

Levitas.1953:

selan.8354:

i dont get why 1 class gets given every single condition in the game appart from 1 and that one got nerfed to the ground.

You may want to check how many conditions mesmers can apply.

Pick up a condition build and try. If you still cant kill him a least you wont die.

i have a condition build! we have other conditions, but they are either rng based or weapon based(like bleed on staff/trident). burn is 3 stacks every 30 sec with torch(hard to stack), poison only if staff equipped(rng based chaosstorm, every 35 seconds), then u got some clone traits,that apply a random condition… thats not my idea of a condition build. they are really hard to stack.
mesmers were masters of confusion, now their main condition is worth nothing. we give up any kind of direct dmg if we spec into it.

glam was specific and one could spec into it(wouldnt recommend that in spvp though as it is more for multiple targets). i knew when i put nullfield down and feedback and pull a target through the fields, i could get nice stacks of confusion and it would deal dmg. now it tickles the enemy.

I don’t have problems stacking conditions, and we mesmers stack different types of conditions as well, which makes it really difficult to cleanse.
I don’t get why people so obsessed with stacking a same type of condition, enemies just clean it with a push of a button.

I have only fought a couple, but I seem to do okay. I’m doing a 20/20/30 build, but it’s a power/crit phantasm build (greatsword and scepter/pistol)

Like Osicat says, you need to use stealth to get distance.

I don’t always win. If I get stacked up in conditions and don’t have null field available, things are going to be bad

I didn’t fight that many condition neros myself. But I seemed to have no real issue with them. I use mirror for healing and also focus traited, so I have quite some skill to reflect their skills. Especially if they wanna use deathly swarm (that is critical, I run rampager setup [20/20/10/20/0] and apply up to 25 bleeding if the fight takes long enogh, I don’t want them to put those bleeds back on me). Works mostly like a charm^^

On the other hand, when I play my heavy condition dmg necro, I have usually no issues fighting mesmer. Except this one time, where a mesmer stunned me and threw me arround like a ball. This is maybe a good way to start, necros usually have just a few or (if it’s my nero) even no stun breaker. If I anticipate my opponent wrong with my necro, then I am mostly roast.

i think on a single target u do have chances to apply conditions and yes i love torment, but i was more referring to condition apply to multiple targets like with glam. reflection is pretty good in wvw, but i always feel like im lacking something.
in wvw a few necros can pretty much turn a chokepoint into a death trap.

well anyways, im hoping the new skills and traits open the path to many new builds!

ArmageddonAsh.6430:

If they are condi – i pretty much run. we have terrible condition removal compared to the fact that can just pretty much reapply all the conditions in the next 10seconds.

Stay at range, keep an eye out for Staff and Marks. Not alot that you can do, VERY high health as well as DS combine that with all the conditions and utilities they have.

Best bet would be Moa and hope you can burst them down time. Try to get them down to 50% or so, go stealth pop Moa and then full on nuke

Excellent advice, i’d like to add

a) Watch out for terror, remember that you can clean this condition with a break stun, and remember that we can do a lot of damage damage with it due our trait named “fear”,

b) Don’t use stability if you are low in health because we can transform it in fear, (preferably don’t stack many boons at once),

c) Watch out for spectral wall, remember that you can dodge through it, (it looks like “line of warden” but green), watch out for marks, you can dodge through them too,

d) With my mesmer and due our horrendous condition removal i use runes of melandru, this should give you the edge on the fight,

Regards !

selan.8354:

i think on a single target u do have chances to apply conditions and yes i love torment, but i was more referring to condition apply to multiple targets like with glam. reflection is pretty good in wvw, but i always feel like im lacking something.
in wvw a few necros can pretty much turn a chokepoint into a death trap.

well anyways, im hoping the new skills and traits open the path to many new builds!

We are not speaking about multiple targets, the thread is about dealing with a good necro. Also, with debilitating dissipation, traited torch and staff you have good ways to apply aoe conditions.
A condition build with PU is one of the best builds to deal with them, period.

@Engels: Stability/fear is not really a problem with a mesmer, however it can be if you steal the boon with arcane thievery.