Guild Wars 2

Title.

I’m decent-ish at mesmer but not that great, would like some advice from other people who play mesmer (or anyone reading this thread really) about how to be more effective at mesmer.

I’m not looking for super specific advice like an entire build and what rotations to use, I can figure those out on my own. I’m looking more for answers to the following questions

• Which classes hard counter mesmer? I’m fairly certain its thief and DH but not entirely sure. Along with this, if a class only hard counters power or condi mesmer but not both could you include that information?

• Which classes does mesmer hard counter? Again, same followup question.

• As a mesmer in the lower skill divisions (I fully expect to be either bronze or low silver), what should my role be? +1ing? Back capping? Tying up some members of the other team in an extended fight? Holding home and mid against the other team?

Blink and Skyhammer, great for mesmers

OriOri.8724:

Title.

I’m decent-ish at mesmer but not that great, would like some advice from other people who play mesmer (or anyone reading this thread really) about how to be more effective at mesmer.

I’m not looking for super specific advice like an entire build and what rotations to use, I can figure those out on my own. I’m looking more for answers to the following questions

• Which classes hard counter mesmer? I’m fairly certain its thief and DH but not entirely sure. Along with this, if a class only hard counters power or condi mesmer but not both could you include that information?

• Which classes does mesmer hard counter? Again, same followup question.

• As a mesmer in the lower skill divisions (I fully expect to be either bronze or low silver), what should my role be? +1ing? Back capping? Tying up some members of the other team in an extended fight? Holding home and mid against the other team?

Still early, but based upon what I am seeing, so far, it is as follows: dragon hunters, elementalists, and warriors are currently all tough match ups for Mesmer. I see at least 2 dh per match and at least 1 ele. I currently do not have to much trouble with thieves in 1v1match ups, but the ones I have faced try for scavenger type kills and move along quickly when you don’t go down right away.

As far as being a hard counter, I haven’t had anything that I couldn’t beat (although DH/Ele takes a considerable effort and many things have to go right), but most match ups have been fairly even whether I win or lose.

As far as your role, that will depend upon your build. I run my staff/scepter-torch somewhere between hybrid and support going for utility rather than niche. I have only seen a few other mesmers and many don’t seem to be running the meta build (although on the few I have seen, they run moa but not seeing any portal play – yet). Interestingly, I have seen a fair amount of engis who have used moa more than the mesmers I have seen. So as far as role, that depends on you and the few people who have asked me about portal are not bothered at all that I am not running it.

Personally being in bronze currently I say the best way to win is to adapt to the skill and composition of your team. I would advise you to evade DH and scrapers for example (those were my hardcounters for me). Otherwise, I think it is also good to go on a 1v1 on close or far with you portal on mid to at least decap the nodes and then go back to mid to help your team particularly if you have no DH or scrapper or ele on your team. If you have a decent thief, I don’t think you need to push for far but rather become that +1 or go into those 1v2 battles to turn the tides of the battle into your favor on close and mid. Other than that, play close attention to the map and watch some top pro player twitch stream like helseth or drazeh or Sindrenner^^. I found their streams quite helpful.

Depends on lots of things. Since there are so many DH and Necro in games now I do close/far capping and only join teamfights on maps like foefire where it’s right inbetween or on occasions where it is reasonable to do so without losing the point. This is because necros for example shine in teamfights and it would be wasted to have them do close/far, especially since their 1v1 isn’t great.

The benefit is that you are strong at 1v1 plus really annoying to kill so you can hold points for a long time even when outnumbered.

I’m not sure about thief hard countering mesmer anymore. If you play the evades/blocks on chrono right, you can nullify most of their bursts and then counter hit them quite good. That is if you are in a 1v1 and have the time to focus the thief, otherwise he will probably just destroy you. But yeah, if the thief permanently ports 2000 range away and in again there’s really not much you can do. But i’d say that’s an issue with thief itself rather than any counter.

DH is kind of a double edged sword. Yes, the traps easily destroy your illusions but on the other hand the illusion triggering the traps take away the danger from you. Overall in a 1v1 against a DH i’d say the mesmer wins if he knows what hes doing. However, most of the time dealing with a DH takes way too long and you could do something much more important with that time.

The class mesmer counters the most is probably revenant, because some of their best dps skills (sword 2, 3) will split the damage depending on how many targets exist. They’re also especially vulnerable to condi builds because of their lack of condi cleanse (if they’re not running ventari/mallyx).

I would say watch Helseth, Frostball or Mischa’s stream as they go into it in far greater detail than I or many others here could.

Power mesmer is weak to thieves, revenant can be a bit tricky and dragon hunters are the bane of your existence. Warriors are easier if you can manage your clones well so they can’t get adrenal healing from them however something I’ve found is in PvP mesmer burst is strong but you can’t 100-0 your counters like you can in WvW so I’ve decided power mesmer would take greater skill to use in PvP than I’m willing to invest ATM.

Condi mesmer would have a bad time vs condi war without resistance removal and anything that can manage conditions well while having stability won’t be an easy fight. You can always turn a fight with Moa though and it’s a really powerful tool in that regard.

To be honest though at lower divisions you always have room to get better and overcome the opponent’s you face through practise and learning especially from watching streamers mentioned above. When you get higher up the divisions counters matter more as while you might win the time taken to win may be longer than its worth.

- DH, Scrappers and Warriors are the hardest for a mesmer. All of them have incredible melee damage while having tons of passive defenses.
- Eles, Necros and Thieves are fair matches. If the opponent is quite skilled it will be hard for you to kill them.
- Revs and Druids should be easy fights, as mesmer can counter them easily.

In low divisions, your best chance will be looking for +1 fights and to control points with Portal.

I play condi chrono with staff/sword+shield. My role is to take home as fast as I can. Then drop a portal there and head to mid to plus my team.

DH seems to me to be a hard counter to condi chrono. You can use your clones to trigger traps from a distance and use distortion if you get pulled in, but their sustain and blocks (hard to Moa or proc phantasms from shield 4) make this is a very tough matchup, since most of your damage comes from your clones that the traps just destroyed.

Scrapper is at best a stalemate for me and the same goes for Druids/Rangers. I give them the edge. If there is an engi on point I call for backup and/or move on because it is a waste of time for me to 1v1 them. The immobilization and focused range fire from rangers is often more than my blocks and invuln can handle, but maybe that is an l2p issue for me as others have commented it should be a favorable matchup.

An exceptional thief is very dangerous, especially if they catch you while your blocks and invuln are on cooldown. Otherwise it is a pretty fair fight with edge to the mesmer.

I haven’t had much problem with eles yet.

Necro is my easiest matchup. I pressure with staff, wait for them to shroud and then Moa. Minion masters are a little harder but very doable.

I hear that mesmer hard counters Rev but honestly I have little experience 1v1ing revs. I just don’t see them that much.

It kind of depends onyour build.

I got bored with the condi meta and play an interrupt power shatter build.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vhAQNAW8OHlphNqB2oBEgilTjqeaz2tlMA2gg6sKiirD-T5ACABAcBAG+IAEWZAA

You can use GS instead of staff but it’s more difficult to stay alive but easier to kill. I usually start with staff to warm up then go for GS.

You have so many interrupts it’s hilarious to fight Necros, they usually don’t pack any stability so they get totally locked down. Rev’s are fun too, they can really get messed up from interrupts, thieves are manageable too. Hardest is DH still, they got a lot of stability and some warriors are a pain in the kitten .

Note, I’m no pro, play in Silver but I’m having fun with it.

For meta condition chrono:

DH hard counters mesmer. Don’t fight them unless you are an expert.

Thief and warrior are the next two biggest threat. You can beat them by playing carefully. But one mistake you will eat huge damage.

Druid can outsustain mesmer in a 1v1. But if you know how to burst with moa, you can take them down relatively fast.

Scrapper loses to mesmer with their meta build. But they can sustain quite a while and you probably wan to moa. Healer tempest also feels similar. You need to know how to burst to kill them.

Revenant and necro are your best targets. It will always be to your team’s advantage if you single them out. They are easy kill in a 1v1.

Your No.1 job is to roam with portal. Don’t be afraid to take any 1v1 except for DH. Try not to 2v2 with a support. Your solo damage is not enough to win the fight. Your biggest presence in teamfight comes from moa, chaos storm, well of eternity, F3 aoe daze, F4 aoe distort. Make the best use of these tools for your team in the teamfight.

Exciton.8942:

Your No.1 job is to roam with portal. Don’t be afraid to take any 1v1 except for DH. Try not to 2v2 with a support. Your solo damage is not enough to win the fight. Your biggest presence in teamfight comes from moa, chaos storm, well of eternity, F3 aoe daze, F4 aoe distort. Make the best use of these tools for your team in the teamfight.

Spot on.

F3 AoE daze is great for interrupting enemy stomps.

F4 AoE invuln is great for giving your teammates safe stomps.

Never stop moving.

What about berserkers? I tend to find them most troubling for my power shatter chrono nowadays.

SaltAndLight.4652:

Exciton.8942:

Your No.1 job is to roam with portal. Don’t be afraid to take any 1v1 except for DH. Try not to 2v2 with a support. Your solo damage is not enough to win the fight. Your biggest presence in teamfight comes from moa, chaos storm, well of eternity, F3 aoe daze, F4 aoe distort. Make the best use of these tools for your team in the teamfight.

Spot on.

F3 AoE daze is great for interrupting enemy stomps.

F4 AoE invuln is great for giving your teammates safe stomps.

Never stop moving.

Can you explain the use of the portal in detail? I see it in a lot of builds but I’ve never actually seen anyone use it.

When do you put down entre? When do you complete the portal? With only a short time to keep entre open and a shorter time to use the complete portal, how do you make this effective?

Zamfir.8462:

Can you explain the use of the portal in detail? I see it in a lot of builds but I’ve never actually seen anyone use it.

When do you put down entre? When do you complete the portal? With only a short time to keep entre open and a shorter time to use the complete portal, how do you make this effective?

Great question! Others with more experience please correct me if I am wrong… but this is what I do.

My initial role is to take home. After I cap it, I step off the circle a few paces and cast Portal Entre on my way to mid. I don’t drop it within the capture radius because there it is easier for the opponent to trap it or wait until I appear and spike. I always try to hide it slightly off the beaten path on the way to mid but still near home. If there is an object nearby like a pillar, rock, tree, etc. I try to drop the portal behind it on the side away from the capture point so I can’t be ranged when I portal back from my opponent who is on the point.

Then while at mid I assist my team and wait as long as I can to cast Portal Exeunt. Sometimes I don’t need to do. But if I see home contested I almost always cast it and portal back to defend home. Sometimes if you are lucky and your team has won mid then some of your teammates may even follow you, just leaving one to cap mid. If you defend home fast enough, you or your teammates can then even portal back to mid using the same ones.

That is an optimal scenario. The truth is you can’t make your teammates use your portals. I have seen countless teammates run right passed mine only to end up at the same place moments later.

Later in matches, if home is clear and we have won the mid fight, I will drop a portal mid and go far. And then depending on the situation I will either portal exeunt immediately to give my teammates at mid (who may have been capping it while I was moving) direct access to far or wait as long as I can to cast portal exeunt and rejoin the fight if I get outnumbered or am losing the fight at far.

If I do not have a portal entre at home and it becomes contested, I will leave what I am doing and drop a portal entre near mid en route to home. In this instance, I may try to hide it or I may put it in an obvious place for my teammates depending on the situation. Whether or not to portal exeunt when you get to home depends on the scenario. If you need help and your team won mid, then cast it upon arrival. If it’s a match up you are sure you can win in timely fashion, wait until you have recapped the point and then cast it and portal back to mid and help your team.

TIP: Try to avoid casting Portal Exeunt on top of downed enemies, as it makes it very difficult to stomp them.

I am sure there are many more uses than these, and I am anxious to see what others have to say on this topic.

Zamfir.8462:

SaltAndLight.4652:

Exciton.8942:

Your No.1 job is to roam with portal. Don’t be afraid to take any 1v1 except for DH. Try not to 2v2 with a support. Your solo damage is not enough to win the fight. Your biggest presence in teamfight comes from moa, chaos storm, well of eternity, F3 aoe daze, F4 aoe distort. Make the best use of these tools for your team in the teamfight.

Spot on.

F3 AoE daze is great for interrupting enemy stomps.

F4 AoE invuln is great for giving your teammates safe stomps.

Never stop moving.

Can you explain the use of the portal in detail? I see it in a lot of builds but I’ve never actually seen anyone use it.

When do you put down entre? When do you complete the portal? With only a short time to keep entre open and a shorter time to use the complete portal, how do you make this effective?

One simple idea is to put portal at mid and you can roam freely to side nodes. If some one is following you, you can immediately portal to mid and support team fight.

It is always good for mesmer come in the middle of the teamfight so many won’t be able to pay attention to your moa and burst.

You can also portal at side nodes. If you win team fight at mid, you can immediately portal away to solidify your advantage. If not, you can escape and make sure the score loss is as small as possible.

All in all, portal gives you control over two nodes. You can make choice where to go when your portal is up. It also puts pressure on opponent. They will always have to pay attention to a node where you lay down your portal. It works great against slow but powerful DHs.

This is great guys, thanks so much. I didn’t really expect more than 2 or 3 responses, but this is awesome. And hopefully this is also helping those too kitteno ask for help themselves.

Also hearing this about portal is interesting. I always viewed it as a team play tool, never even stopped to think about how I could use it personally.

Plot twist: OriOri is actually a warrior main who’s just come here to steal all your mesmer secrets.

Dun-dUn-DUUUUN-N-N-N
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cphNpqKpKc4

~Winner 2016 best response award

Portal can be also nice trolling skill. Onec I got far in forest on the blue side. Then there came an ele (no problem we could not kill each other) but then came scrapper to aid ele so I just tried to keep them bussie for some time. I left portal on point, use all def cooldown witch took some time and then tried to reatret in cheftain way with blink. Scrapper went after me, but ele also made a mistake and he didn’t cap but went out of the ring. I’ve opened portal and was skipping from point to exit 2-3 times. It was fun, they where so confused. And yes it was in low tier.

Ross Biddle.2367:

Plot twist: OriOri is actually a warrior main who’s just come here to steal all your mesmer secrets.

Dun-dUn-DUUUUN-N-N-N
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cphNpqKpKc4

~Winner 2016 best response award

Next you will be telling us he uses a rifle and signet of might while making witty forum posts about busting the meta with comedic YouTube videos!

apharma.3741:

Ross Biddle.2367:

Plot twist: OriOri is actually a warrior main who’s just come here to steal all your mesmer secrets.

Dun-dUn-DUUUUN-N-N-N
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cphNpqKpKc4

~Winner 2016 best response award

Next you will be telling us he uses a rifle and signet of might while making witty forum posts about busting the meta with comedic YouTube videos!

There is only so much room in the world for that sort of greatness, and unfortunately it’s filled.

apharma.3741:

I would say watch Helseth, Frostball or Mischa’s stream as they go into it in far greater detail than I or many others here could.

Could you provide a link to the latter two please? Maybe it’s time to undust my mesmer….

pico.6402:

Portal can be also nice trolling skill. Onec I got far in forest on the blue side. Then there came an ele (no problem we could not kill each other) but then came scrapper to aid ele so I just tried to keep them bussie for some time. I left portal on point, use all def cooldown witch took some time and then tried to reatret in cheftain way with blink. Scrapper went after me, but ele also made a mistake and he didn’t cap but went out of the ring. I’ve opened portal and was skipping from point to exit 2-3 times. It was fun, they where so confused. And yes it was in low tier.

In a similar vein, if you’re overwhelmed at a point you could try dropping a portal where you can hope it won’t be noticed and running. If you were being 2v1’d, often one person will chase you trying to finish you off while the other will secure the point and may then move on (and if the enemy team already had the point, they may both chase you). Wait until you think there’s a good chance they’ve moved on from the point, then portal back. Unless they did leave a point defender there, odds are you’ll be able to at least decap before they respond.

Haven’t tried it in ranked yet this season (mid gold atm), but certainly in previous experience, people in hot pursuit will often miss a portal drop, allowing you to pull them out of position and then portal back to somewhere useful.

Plok.5873:

apharma.3741:

I would say watch Helseth, Frostball or Mischa’s stream as they go into it in far greater detail than I or many others here could.

Could you provide a link to the latter two please? Maybe it’s time to undust my mesmer….

Dunno if Mischa is on twitch or has a YouTube but frostball99 is Frostys account on twitch.

Thanks for all the help and hints! Say, while there are a number of mesmers watching – I’m having a huge problem with getting certain skills to land. When creating wells, aoe, moas, etc. They just don’t seem to proc and go into a short cool down. I’m trying to see if I’ve been interrupted, but it’s not clear that I have. I’ve not been knocked down or pulled, etc. I’ve since practiced trying to drop wells and aoe’s on the run and in practice it always works, but in combat for real, more often then not they fail. I find the best chance of dropping a well or proccing an aoe is to stand still and cast it cold, but then I’m a sitting duck. What mechanic am I missing?

Zamfir.8462:

Thanks for all the help and hints! Say, while there are a number of mesmers watching – I’m having a huge problem with getting certain skills to land. When creating wells, aoe, moas, etc. They just don’t seem to proc and go into a short cool down. I’m trying to see if I’ve been interrupted, but it’s not clear that I have. I’ve not been knocked down or pulled, etc. I’ve since practiced trying to drop wells and aoe’s on the run and in practice it always works, but in combat for real, more often then not they fail. I find the best chance of dropping a well or proccing an aoe is to stand still and cast it cold, but then I’m a sitting duck. What mechanic am I missing?

It sounds like you’re cancelling your own skill, either by activating another skill, dodge rolling, or possibly breaking los?

place continuum split, spam all shatter skills, use signet of illusions and spam all shatter skills once more

once split resets you repeat the above step without the split, collect free wins from bodies of people with billion confusion stacks

Lexander.4579:

place continuum split, spam all shatter skills, use signet of illusions and spam all shatter skills once more

once split resets you repeat the above step without the split, collect free wins from bodies of people with billion confusion stacks

It’s the season to be salty fralalalala lalalala.

DeathReign.7821:

Lexander.4579:

place continuum split, spam all shatter skills, use signet of illusions and spam all shatter skills once more

once split resets you repeat the above step without the split, collect free wins from bodies of people with billion confusion stacks

It’s the season to be salty fralalalala lalalala.

It’s been one hell of a long season…