Guild Wars 2

Hey guys,

So I’m trying to decide between using my PU Power build or my PU Condi build. I know both are relatively viable/meta at the moment, or at least, slight variations of them, so I’m wondering what people like/dislike about being Power vs. Condi. I mostly play just WvW, and some PvE to farm/when I’m bored.

PU Power Builld

PU Condi Build

I was in a crazy 3x Lord SM Battle last night that was just huge mayhem between all 3 servers, and the guild lord resurrected 3 times. I was using my PU Condi and didn’t die once. I was invincible. I’m wondering if that same sort of survivability is possible with my PU Power variation, because you lose a lot of potential at gaining Chaos Armor.

Let me know why you like Power vs. Condi, and also any comments on the builds. Thanks!

condi pu can be ignored sooo easily, enemys can just jump around and do nothing , u cant do anything against that

against power pu they cant do that so easily, but they got it easier killing u due to the fact that killing ur clones wrongly wont hurt them that bad

hace a good day!

edit: btw i like the build in ur signature

If they ignore me and jump around, they’re going to meet a pretty quick death. Conditions stack up fast with 3x Staff clones and me overwriting them for bleed/confusion. The thing with Condi is they can run away easier.

Certainly Blink/Chaos Storm/Phase Retreat helps. But you do lose the Crippling Phantasm, knockback and iLeap immob yeah…

Edit: After analyzing what I gain, and what I lose… I think I’m still gonna go with my PU Condi build. The survivability in Zergs is just insane. I don’t roam solo a whole lot, so I don’t really need to catch anyone. If they want to run, so be it. They aren’t going to kill me though if they stick around.

Eucalyptus.9784:

If they ignore me and jump around, they’re going to meet a pretty quick death. Conditions stack up fast with 3x Staff clones and me overwriting them for bleed/confusion. The thing with Condi is they can run away easier.

Certainly Blink/Chaos Storm/Phase Retreat helps. But you do lose the Crippling Phantasm, knockback and iLeap immob yeah...

Edit: After analyzing what I gain, and what I lose... I think I’m still gonna go with my PU Condi build. The survivability in Zergs is just insane. I don’t roam solo a whole lot, so I don’t really need to catch anyone. If they want to run, so be it. They aren’t going to kill me though if they stick around.

^ This exactly

I hate when people say you can ignore PU Condi builds. You can’t. Scepter #3 is putting confusion on you, staff clones is putting a lot of bleeds and burns on you. Throw in a tormenting sigil in there. Maybe they are using perplexity runes. Maybe iDuelist is putting a ton more bleeds on you as well. And if you kill the clones that’s more bleeds on you, plus weakness. That’s any build that isnt a bunker build.

It’s probably better not to focus a PU Condi Mesmer, because of the torment on block, phase retreat, chaos armor, etc. And pretty how how tanky they are. But to say they do no damage if you aren’t attacking them is a myth. They might not have the highest DPS but the array of conditions that they can put on you is certainly deadly and over time the continuous pressure they can put on you because it is hard to pressure one of these mesmers wins out over time.

The best solution if possible is just to avoid the encounter altogether if you can, but in a group scenario you are seriously going to leave your servermates to die because there is a PU Condi Mesmer?

killahmayne.9518:

Eucalyptus.9784:

If they ignore me and jump around, they’re going to meet a pretty quick death. Conditions stack up fast with 3x Staff clones and me overwriting them for bleed/confusion. The thing with Condi is they can run away easier.

Certainly Blink/Chaos Storm/Phase Retreat helps. But you do lose the Crippling Phantasm, knockback and iLeap immob yeah…

Edit: After analyzing what I gain, and what I lose… I think I’m still gonna go with my PU Condi build. The survivability in Zergs is just insane. I don’t roam solo a whole lot, so I don’t really need to catch anyone. If they want to run, so be it. They aren’t going to kill me though if they stick around.

^ This exactly

I hate when people say you can ignore PU Condi builds. You can’t. Scepter #3 is putting confusion on you, staff clones is putting a lot of bleeds and burns on you. Throw in a tormenting sigil in there. Maybe they are using perplexity runes. Maybe iDuelist is putting a ton more bleeds on you as well. And if you kill the clones that’s more bleeds on you, plus weakness.

It’s probably better not to focus a PU Condi Mesmer, because of the torment on block, phase retreat, chaos armor, etc. And pretty how how tanky they are. But to say they do no damage if you aren’t attacking them is a myth. They might not have the highest DPS but the array of conditions that they can put on you is certainly deadly and over time the continuous pressure they can put on you because it is hard to pressure one of these mesmers wins out over time.

The best solution if possible is just to avoid the encounter altogether if you can, but in a group scenario you are seriously going to leave your servermates to die because there is a PU Condi Mesmer?

well i dont mean jumping around etkittenerally, they just dont kill clones, kite the clones around so they dont explode near them,use blocks heals stealths etc

For roaming I definitely prefer condition PU. Power PU is much squishier and vulnerable to outnumbered situations and ambushes. At least on my T1 EU server I often run into very skilled small roaming groups that make an easy meal out of my power builds while my PU staff condition build has a lot more breathing room. Don’t underestimate 20k health and 3k armor. Clones also inherit armor which adds up.

Both have similar killing power with condition PU having more sustained pressure while power has a lot more control and chasing power. Condition is more passive and noobs will drop like flies without any effort at all. I can’t count the times where my staff clones unintentionally down a random thief while I am fighting their ally. Also high chaos armor uptime from staff2 leaping your fields and the staff4 skill is amazing survivability. The only weakness I have is condition builds, but power has the same problem.

Lastly if you want to flip camps condition PU has a much easier time. If the camp isn’t fully upgraded you can just charge in and start spamming without any risk of dying. Pulling them in a corner into a chaos storm while bombing clone deaths and chaining chaos armor is super efficient and safe. Fully upgraded you have to make a couple of pulls but still no problem.

I prefer power PU over condition PU because power build has more burst damage and YOU control when and what get hit where condi build depends a lot on what your opponent does. When I roam I want to finish a fight as fast as possible because you never know who is going to add on you. Power is also better at chasing. Condi build is a lot tougher but with PU + blink you should be able to disengage most of the time if you are not too crazy even with very little hp and toughness.

killahmayne.9518:

^ This exactly

I hate when people say you can ignore PU Condi builds. You can’t. Scepter #3 is putting confusion on you, staff clones is putting a lot of bleeds and burns on you. Throw in a tormenting sigil in there. Maybe they are using perplexity runes. Maybe iDuelist is putting a ton more bleeds on you as well. And if you kill the clones that’s more bleeds on you, plus weakness. That’s any build that isnt a bunker build.

It’s probably better not to focus a PU Condi Mesmer, because of the torment on block, phase retreat, chaos armor, etc. And pretty how how tanky they are. But to say they do no damage if you aren’t attacking them is a myth. They might not have the highest DPS but the array of conditions that they can put on you is certainly deadly and over time the continuous pressure they can put on you because it is hard to pressure one of these mesmers wins out over time.

The best solution if possible is just to avoid the encounter altogether if you can, but in a group scenario you are seriously going to leave your servermates to die because there is a PU Condi Mesmer?

When they say ignore the PU mesmer people are saying you an engage in the fight and leave as long as you got a decent cleanse available to wipe any condis on you and the pu mesmer can’t really stop you especially the condition version.

I would like to say condi but I just like power more because you are less at the mercy of the enemy closing with you to do anything. Plus, you can have movement speed runes with more compatible stats.

For those saying Power… Does my build linked in the original post as my Power PU Build look like a decent setup? I worry about not having enough Power, but it’s got some good Might stacking potential to make up for that. A lot of Might stacking actually…

I think I’m just too comfortable being an invincible staff user….

People who have played both with similar trait setups… Do you find Greatsword / Sw+T has as good of survivability? Particularly with WvW Zergs? I travel in big groups a lot.

Having played both i definitely prefer Power PU for roaming (in a group of 4+ and zerging).

Condi PU for solo roaming and small groups of 2-3.

Condi PU in my opinion is the superior dueling spec particularly against tanky warriors though the lack of chase / immob will always be an issue. Maybe swap in sword mainhand with torch for the cripple on decoy and immobilize?

oZii.2864:

killahmayne.9518:

^ This exactly

I hate when people say you can ignore PU Condi builds. You can’t. Scepter #3 is putting confusion on you, staff clones is putting a lot of bleeds and burns on you. Throw in a tormenting sigil in there. Maybe they are using perplexity runes. Maybe iDuelist is putting a ton more bleeds on you as well. And if you kill the clones that’s more bleeds on you, plus weakness. That’s any build that isnt a bunker build.

It’s probably better not to focus a PU Condi Mesmer, because of the torment on block, phase retreat, chaos armor, etc. And pretty how how tanky they are. But to say they do no damage if you aren’t attacking them is a myth. They might not have the highest DPS but the array of conditions that they can put on you is certainly deadly and over time the continuous pressure they can put on you because it is hard to pressure one of these mesmers wins out over time.

The best solution if possible is just to avoid the encounter altogether if you can, but in a group scenario you are seriously going to leave your servermates to die because there is a PU Condi Mesmer?

When they say ignore the PU mesmer people are saying you an engage in the fight and leave as long as you got a decent cleanse available to wipe any condis on you and the pu mesmer can’t really stop you especially the condition version.

You missed the point of my argument. My point was more so even if you are not attacking the PU Condi Mesmer it can still put out a lot of damage through staff clones, confusion, etc and if you do kill the clones it is counter-productive as well because you are just inflicting conditions on yourself. It doesn’t rely solely on clone deaths for DPS output as many people say because it has plenty of other damage sources. And people underestimate those damage sources. Yes if it is a 1v1 situation you can simply disengage from them if your class/build can do so I don’t deny that. But in a group fight you are seriously just going to run away and disengage because there is a PU Condi Mesmer, that is if other classes don’t catch up to you?

My point is. They still DO damage. And in many situations, it is more consistent and reliable then power builds and with more survivability.

PU power for 1 minute fight
PU condie for 5 minutes in best case

@OP Can you read my mind? I wanted to open a 3D on this topic but I had other priorities, and now I see your post… you saved me a lot ot time

My condi build is a variation of Osi Napalm build. It gives burn on demand and it greately helps vs “passive” players. Moreover, I have been able to keep up with running enemies by stealing their speed buff with AT. Also I feel sigil of speed is highly underrated.
I literally travel across maps and manage to run away with it most of the times. Ok, it can be stripped off but at least it doesn’t force you in to a rune set or a weapon choice which you do not like. I think it’s 100% worth it and needs you only to kill 2-3 mobs in order to run from one camp to another and recharge the buff (which can be stacked up to 2-3 minutes). Excceptions: wars with 2h sword, thieves with shortbow etc. but hey, who doesn’t struggle with those?!?

Anyway, here it is my build

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fhAQNAW7flsnpIttpxRNcrRSpxY6cO6GUVGpCokjUOA-TVzAwAWUC25gAg4BAAUdlX7PAwE0NNCx0FAWZmRVKgcBA0cEACr0gQATWDA-w

Slightly different from yours. Reasons: I feel 4pts in dom with cripple on death is better than 5pts in dueling & illusions. A bit more power and a slighlty longer conditions, but mainly a good soft cc and one more condi to cover fire, your most important condition (so it doesn’t get cleansed too easily)

Mirror. It fits the build perfectly because of the short cd and thus lets you use the rune bonus at its best. Reflection is just the icing on the cake and let you deal with hambow wars, rangers and thieves very well

Utility. I learnt to live with no blink. The double condi removal is just great, especially now with the meta so condi-centric. AT can be used offensively if needed (stealing speed buff for example) and let MoR do the dirty work.

Survivability is great and damage too, however I am intrigued about running something similar but power based to see the difference so, I was looking for a build with knight stats + PU.

I was looking at your varaint, Eucalyptus. How does it play compared to your condi build? What are the pros and cons?

trooper.2650:

@OP Can you read my mind? I wanted to open a 3D on this topic but I had other priorities, and now I see your post… you saved me a lot ot time

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snip—-

I was looking at your varaint, Eucalyptus. How does it play compared to your condi build? What are the pros and cons?

Hey man, sorry late reply – long day at work.

When I was playing with my PU Power build above the biggest playstyle difference I found, that a few others have mentioned, is it was far less “Passive”. If I wanted something to happen, I had to make it happen. Whereas with Staff out, you can basically use some skills, dodge a few times, and hope the person you’re fighting is silly enough to sit in the middle of 4x bouncing staff attacks and die. Some people like this playstyle, some people don’t.

I didn’t actually play the PU Power style very long, because I found it just made me want to be a Shatter mesmer again. Which is what I’ve done actually. I’m now rolling a 4/4/0/0/6 Shatter, but with full Soldier’s gear and both GS and Sw/Sw cooldown traits. The clone spam is ridiculous, the power is ridiculous, and to be honest the survivability is still pretty high due to such low CD on skills like Blurred Frenzy and Sword block. On top of that I still run Decoy/Blink/Condi Removal mantra. Anyways, that’s a different story.

TL;DR – As people have said, Power is a lot more of an active playstyle with more chase potential, but Staff definitely takes the cake in “long term” fights, because really the longer the fight goes, the higher the advantage is in your favor usually.

Go Hybrid, power and condition. Covers everything
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/mesmer/The-Holy-Hell-Build-2-0/first#post3977712

killahmayne.9518:

oZii.2864:

killahmayne.9518:

^ This exactly

I hate when people say you can ignore PU Condi builds. You can’t. Scepter #3 is putting confusion on you, staff clones is putting a lot of bleeds and burns on you. Throw in a tormenting sigil in there. Maybe they are using perplexity runes. Maybe iDuelist is putting a ton more bleeds on you as well. And if you kill the clones that’s more bleeds on you, plus weakness. That’s any build that isnt a bunker build.

It’s probably better not to focus a PU Condi Mesmer, because of the torment on block, phase retreat, chaos armor, etc. And pretty how how tanky they are. But to say they do no damage if you aren’t attacking them is a myth. They might not have the highest DPS but the array of conditions that they can put on you is certainly deadly and over time the continuous pressure they can put on you because it is hard to pressure one of these mesmers wins out over time.

The best solution if possible is just to avoid the encounter altogether if you can, but in a group scenario you are seriously going to leave your servermates to die because there is a PU Condi Mesmer?

When they say ignore the PU mesmer people are saying you an engage in the fight and leave as long as you got a decent cleanse available to wipe any condis on you and the pu mesmer can’t really stop you especially the condition version.

You missed the point of my argument. My point was more so even if you are not attacking the PU Condi Mesmer it can still put out a lot of damage through staff clones, confusion, etc and if you do kill the clones it is counter-productive as well because you are just inflicting conditions on yourself. It doesn’t rely solely on clone deaths for DPS output as many people say because it has plenty of other damage sources. And people underestimate those damage sources. Yes if it is a 1v1 situation you can simply disengage from them if your class/build can do so I don’t deny that. But in a group fight you are seriously just going to run away and disengage because there is a PU Condi Mesmer, that is if other classes don’t catch up to you?

My point is. They still DO damage. And in many situations, it is more consistent and reliable then power builds and with more survivability.

I understand your point just stating when people say ignore the mesmer they are usually referring to 1v1’s.

In groups PU mesmers damage is diluted your clones are exploding on people that you don’t intend for them to blow up on. People are clumped AOE cleanses going off and usually the PU mesmer is one of the surviving classes while everyone else dies because it’s easier to kill everyone else.

From my experience when we go up against a 5-10 sized group unless the PU mesmer is over agressive and makes a big mistake where we can blow it up we just kill everyone else. Thieves and mesmers usually are the surviving classes from a group wipe in my experience. Why go after the stealth build when we can kill the ele’s, necros, guards, and warriors. I don’t think it happens on purpose it’s just the way it happens if I am fighting a PU mesmer in a group setting and he stealths to drop target I just go kill something else and his phantasm will probably just blow up in the aoe going off around us. There is no real point to wait till the mesmer reappears and find him when my dps is better spent on something I can see for the entire fight. It’s the same concept if you are duo roaming. If I am on my Ele and a friend is on his PU mesmer I know who will get most of the focus fire.

Eucalyptus.9784:

Hey guys,

So I’m trying to decide between using my PU Power build or my PU Condi build. I know both are relatively viable/meta at the moment, or at least, slight variations of them, so I’m wondering what people like/dislike about being Power vs. Condi. I mostly play just WvW, and some PvE to farm/when I’m bored.

PU Power Builld

PU Condi Build

I was in a crazy 3x Lord SM Battle last night that was just huge mayhem between all 3 servers, and the guild lord resurrected 3 times. I was using my PU Condi and didn’t die once. I was invincible. I’m wondering if that same sort of survivability is possible with my PU Power variation, because you lose a lot of potential at gaining Chaos Armor.

Let me know why you like Power vs. Condi, and also any comments on the builds. Thanks!

Also I really like your condition PU build. I would definitely swap out feedback for null field though, since you have the grand total of 0 condition removal without it which can and will kill you, and since you have a tiny cooldown on staff2 it’s another field you can get an easy chaos armor from.

I’d also put a torment sigil instead of strength on your staff. Traveler runes have really good synergy with this specific build (lots of buffs from very high chaos armor uptime in addition to conditions) and are pretty necessary for solo roaming.

Lastly I’d swap a few dire pieces for more rabid, but that is preference, and food you can use super veggie pizza/quality crystal that are extremely effective and cheap (1-2 silver each, I make 100×2 of them every few weeks for about 2 gold or so).

Other than that the build is perfect for solo roaming (OP as kitten actually but shh).

well here is a hybrid PU build that i will be testing when i get home tonight: i started with a Power PU and am very adept with it, i win more or less all duels yet i came across a really good Gs axe/shield war that dps didnt do enough damage to so ive been theory crafting, this is what ive come up with so far,

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fhAQNArfRl0npMtloxRNcrNCuxY6JyNiTGTLlMgfB-TJBFwAOOFAl2fAaZAAPBAA