Guild Wars 2

As a Mesmer player for three solid years, this is actually so broken and down right dirty that I have to make a forum thread about it.

For those of you who don’t know, Continuum Split is basically a time leap or Time Warp for you WoW Mage players. It makes it so that it records a set point in time, with all your ability cd’s health total, condi’s on you, ect.. And then sets you back to that point after a some odd amount of time. In combination with chronophantasma, which makes it so your phantasm respawn (And act as if they were just summoned, aka – Attack instantly) is just too much.

Continuum Split is like the upcoming Facebook dislike button, it’s literally just a kitten you go home kind of ability, worse than Moa ever was.

Let me explain what you can do to people.

You get two to three clones up so that your Continuum Split lasts long enough. Once you’ve done this you simply activate the ability, now you have a few seconds to cast EVERYTHING because it doesn’t matter. Here’s how a good combo looks.

Continuum split -> Gravity Well -> Instantly Distortion (To prevent being interrupted on your Gravity Well cast) -> Decoy – > Phantasmal Berserker -> Mind Wrack -> All your kittening buttons you have left to press in the time frame.

THEN.

Continuum split ends, you’re send back in time to previous position. At this point you have all your health back (If you lost any, loldistortion) You’ve shattered them, you still have a Phantasmal berserker because it respawned from your trait. Your shatter is back up, Gravity Well (A 90s cd) is back up. And you do the entire combo AGAIN. Except you have even heavier shatters because all your prior phantasm RE-kittenING-SPAWNED.

It actually kind of makes me sad, because nothing ever lives long enough for you to do the full bloody combo. You are literally an invulnverable, damage pumping mass of ignorant explosions.

It’s rediculous. Anet I understand you want to make the elite Specs OP enough that they’re mandatory in every build to be competitive so people will buy HoT, but really people are going to buy HoT anyways the game has no subscription, this is just over kill.

Using this combo is like bringing a bloody Gundam to kill a gnat. It’s to much.

TL;DR – The potential of Chronomancer is filthy, I would advise either a 180-300s cd on Continuum Split -or- reduce the duration of the affect so the combo can’t be so lengthy and include literally all of your buttons.

Any feedback or opinions are appreciated, I only play Mesmer so I the only way I stop the combo when its happening to me is to.. Do it to them, yea. Take that.

I don’t want it but def could see it getting a longer cd and I mean a lot longer

The “combo” you discribe only can happen on 1st encounter on pvp when all CDs available, and cause of that easily countered… You know its coming.
Remember if u want to use cs mid match for sure you will have some skills on CD and activating cs will just prolong that CDs.
Its, at max, a 5 seconds time window… just kite. Wells are static on ground, rest of combo easly telegraphed.

TL:DR > l2p

I still think Chrono would be very strong without it, but then the other Specializations have their own op stuff, so eh…i don’t really care, now.

I agree that the encouragement to spam in continuum shift is stupid.

However I don’t believe raising the cooldown is the answer – that will just make players feel too cautious to use it often.

Instead I think limiting the number of skills that can be cast in continuum shift might be an option – for example 3 skills maximum, then you “break the continuum” and revert to your original timeline.

FJSAMA.2867:

The “combo” you discribe only can happen on 1st encounter on pvp when all CDs available, and cause of that easily countered… You know its coming.
Remember if u want to use cs mid match for sure you will have some skills on CD and activating cs will just prolong that CDs.
Its, at max, a 5 seconds time window… just kite. Wells are static on ground, rest of combo easly telegraphed.

TL:DR > l2p

How do I say this with out sounding mean.. You didn’t think about what you said at all.

It’s a short, 90s cd kitten combo. Kite? A mesmer? Sure go ahead, have all 5 members kite and lose the point because of the massive AOE shatter + Gravity Well. Waste your defensives to get away from it. Don’t forget shattering slows you know so kiting is that much harder.

Congrats, you got away, no come back after losing the point and retake it- Oh wait, the entire thing can be done -again-.

That’s the point, that’s why I made the thread, the entire combo merrits some if not all your defensives and in the end it can just be done a second time while the mesmer is completely invulnverable (Or invisible) depending on his choice.

I play a Mesmer, only a Mesmer. This is to strong, all I’m suggesting is that they either lengthen the CD or shorten the window you have to combo.

Curunen.8729:

I agree that the encouragement to spam in continuum shift is stupid.

However I don’t believe raising the cooldown is the answer – that will just make players feel too cautious to use it often.

Instead I think limiting the number of skills that can be cast in continuum shift might be an option – for example 3 skills maximum, then you “break the continuum” and revert to your original timeline.

That’s another possibility, but the purpose of the ability it to take you back in time to a point where you had certain abilities, it would defeat the theme of the ability to put a limit on abilities you can use.

Nerfing the time window you have to press buttons though has the same effect and keeps the theme of the ability.

Haste.8610:

Kite? A mesmer? Sure go ahead, have all 5 members kite and lose the point because of the massive AOE shatter + Gravity Well. Waste your defensives to get away from it. Don’t forget shattering slows you know so kiting is that much harder.

Nop, kite the well and the combo, unless in your pvp tier mirror blade passes objects and clones always reach their targets not dieing in the process. Maybe in your world wells follow the players.
Dunno why im arguing with you when you cry a thing is op cause you want to facetank it like nothing happened and not waste defensive CDs on it… Same strong effect with a rampage… or lets face tank it. Right?
3s well… wont full cap point.

Haste.8610:

Congrats, you got away, no come back after losing the point and retake it- Oh wait, the entire thing can be done -again-.

You are forgetting -again- that poping cs mid fight will prolong your cds.. Im sure when, mid fight, you want to use your cs again you will have, at least, decoy/distortion in cd… (your defensive/longer cds) unless in your pvp tier a mesmer can freely roam without being pressured and matches are passive-sit-on.point-bunk and let time runs out.

@ Haste if you have 5 people in a 240 radius grouped up, thats a mistake from your part. you catch 1-2 people in gravity well max and they can blink out of it or if they can’t they’ve probably got an invuln of some sort. Its alright because the mesmer used a 90s cooldown and you used a 30-50s cooldown to negate that. You are in profit here. I do agree with Csplit being a bit too much and I think limiting the # of skills is a good solution, however, I wouldn’t exactly say 3 skills, rather around 5-7.

Haste.8610:

It’s a short, 90s cd kitten combo.

Um, 90’s not short…

Haste.8610:

Don’t forget shattering slows you know

I must have missed the trait but… how does shattering do this?
Also, it seems like you think slow reduces your movespeed… you know it doesn’t do that, right?

AlphatheWhite.9351:

Also, it seems like you think slow reduces your movespeed… you know it doesn’t do that, right?

Actually in a leap/movement skill, it increases the distance covered
His mesmer has skills changed already for BW4, kappa. He is a chronomancer, he controls the time.

Isn’t destroy the point of CS can stop it and pull the Mesmer back the that point?

Doug Whisper.2465:

Isn’t destroy the point of CS can stop it and pull the Mesmer back the that point?

It does, but people ignore the obvious and cry regardless.

Haste.8610:

FJSAMA.2867:

The “combo” you discribe only can happen on 1st encounter on pvp when all CDs available, and cause of that easily countered… You know its coming.
Remember if u want to use cs mid match for sure you will have some skills on CD and activating cs will just prolong that CDs.
Its, at max, a 5 seconds time window… just kite. Wells are static on ground, rest of combo easly telegraphed.

TL:DR > l2p

How do I say this with out sounding mean.. You didn’t think about what you said at all.

You didn’t either..

It’s a short, 90s cd kitten combo.

Do you know how long 90s is in a fight?
You must not, you must be running around auto attacking, because waiting 90s to do something is a death sentence in pvp.

Kite? A mesmer? Sure go ahead, have all 5 members kite and lose the point because of the massive AOE shatter + Gravity Well.

It doesn’t take 5 people to kill a mes, and if 5 people are on a point with no stability or stun breaks and they walk into red circles then you may need to rethink your team comp and the skill level of the people you play with.
If this is a regular occurrence for you in your spvp match-ups I hate to tell you, but your MMR may be really low.

Waste your defensives to get away from it. Don’t forget shattering slows you know so kiting is that much harder.

slow=/=movement impairment

Congrats, you got away, no come back after losing the point and retake it- Oh wait, the entire thing can be done -again-.

Brush up on your game terms please

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glossary_of_video_game_terms#Cooldown

with the alacrity nerf you aren’t going to have BWE1 CD reduction unless you trait for it.

I play a Mesmer, only a Mesmer. This is to strong, all I’m suggesting is that they either lengthen the CD or shorten the window you have to combo.

Try playing more pvp with people who don’t let clones sit around.
The combo you listed either needs 3 clones and your opponent to be completely oblivious to mesmer mechanics OR afk.

Solori.6025:

Haste.8610:

FJSAMA.2867:

The “combo” you discribe only can happen on 1st encounter on pvp when all CDs available, and cause of that easily countered… You know its coming.
Remember if u want to use cs mid match for sure you will have some skills on CD and activating cs will just prolong that CDs.
Its, at max, a 5 seconds time window… just kite. Wells are static on ground, rest of combo easly telegraphed.

TL:DR > l2p

How do I say this with out sounding mean.. You didn’t think about what you said at all.

You didn’t either..

It’s a short, 90s cd kitten combo.

Do you know how long 90s is in a fight?
You must not, you must be running around auto attacking, because waiting 90s to do something is a death sentence in pvp.

Kite? A mesmer? Sure go ahead, have all 5 members kite and lose the point because of the massive AOE shatter + Gravity Well.

It doesn’t take 5 people to kill a mes, and if 5 people are on a point with no stability or stun breaks and they walk into red circles then you may need to rethink your team comp and the skill level of the people you play with.
If this is a regular occurrence for you in your spvp match-ups I hate to tell you, but your MMR may be really low.

Waste your defensives to get away from it. Don’t forget shattering slows you know so kiting is that much harder.

slow=/=movement impairment

Congrats, you got away, no come back after losing the point and retake it- Oh wait, the entire thing can be done -again-.

Brush up on your game terms please

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glossary_of_video_game_terms#Cooldown

with the alacrity nerf you aren’t going to have BWE1 CD reduction unless you trait for it.

I play a Mesmer, only a Mesmer. This is to strong, all I’m suggesting is that they either lengthen the CD or shorten the window you have to combo.

Try playing more pvp with people who don’t let clones sit around.
The combo you listed either needs 3 clones and your opponent to be completely oblivious to mesmer mechanics OR afk.

Since this seems to be the most well structured reply I’ll use this as my example.

Do any of you play PvP at a competitive level or are you enjoying being OP so much that you’re going to blindly defend what’s clearly broken? I can already tell you’re incredibly bad but that’s to be expected, so I’ll do my best to explain this as -slow-ly (Haha, get it?) as possible.

Kiting, slow doesn’t decrease your movement speed. It makes the cast time on your abilities longer, this makes it harder to kite because you’re especially vulnerable to interrupts which Mesmer just loves to do.

On to the cool down, 90s is not short in a single fight but over the span of the game it is very short, there are weaker abilities with much longer cd’s. Rampage is 180s cd, Lich form is 180s, these, while being undeniably strong don’t turn a fight around as convincingly as a well placed Gravity Well. Even entangle is an 80s cd and it’s nowhere close to Gravity Well.

sigh If any of you three were half decent at Mesmer you might be able to understand why it’s so incredibly broken. The way you talk I can only imagine a bunch of 12 year olds throwing wild Gravity Wells at one person and QQing on the forums saying it’s a balanced ability because you missed. Yes 30-50s defensive is a good trade for a 90s elite but when you catch 4 people and force them all to use that defensive only to throw it down one more time and take the point and gain map control from an effective team-wipe, it’s a little OP.

In the end, if you’re bad you’re not going to be able to do the combos correctly, and you wont see why it’s broken. And if you are you probably wont care anyways and try to defend it. But for those if you who might care -

http://www.twitch.tv/malferian/profile

Prominent Mesmer streamer, access to his past broadcasts are here. Give it a look see, you’ll see some proper combos and maybe begin to understand why Gravity Well and CS needs to be toned down.

Doug Whisper.2465:

Isn’t destroy the point of CS can stop it and pull the Mesmer back the that point?

Ah, I missed this.

Yes it can be used that way, drop off a ledge, combo and port back up to safety. But it’s much more effectively used as old WoW mages would use time warp.

It’s strong point is that it takes you back to that point in time, CD’s included. So you can effectively get 3 clones up (Easily with deceptive evasion) shatter. Blow every major cd including ELITE abilities and have them reset when you’re sent back to your prior point.

Another suggestion would be making this a boon that can be removed. The ability can already be activated early if you don’t want to wait the full duration of the effect, so if it were a buff that could be dispelled, Mesmers would have to think more critically about how long they want to leave it up for fear that someone might dispell it.

I’m not sorry

clipnotdone.9634:

I’m not sorry

One word: mimic. Make it happen. I wanna see a one-man zerg of 9 charr.

clipnotdone.9634:

I’m not sorry

Goon Squad assemble!

BlackBeard.2873:

clipnotdone.9634:

I’m not sorry

One word: mimic. Make it happen. I wanna see a one-man zerg of 9 charr.

Too bad it doesn’t work on elites :p

Haste.8610:

Since this seems to be the most well structured reply I’ll use this as my example.

Do any of you play PvP at a competitive level or are you enjoying being OP so much that you’re going to blindly defend what’s clearly broken? I can already tell you’re incredibly bad but that’s to be expected, so I’ll do my best to explain this as -slow-ly (Haha, get it?) as possible.

If you’re asking if people play mostly spvp ranked que, a lot of us here do.

I thought that would be apparent?

Kiting, slow doesn’t decrease your movement speed. It makes the cast time on your abilities longer, this makes it harder to kite because you’re especially vulnerable to interrupts which Mesmer just loves to do.

I’ll save this for later, but a lot of what you describe is especially for the build you describe is meshing different trait lines, all of which sacrifice something the mesmer brings or needs that’s vital to it’s survival

On to the cool down, 90s is not short in a single fight but over the span of the game it is very short, there are weaker abilities with much longer cd’s. Rampage is 180s cd, Lich form is 180s, these, while being undeniably strong don’t turn a fight around as convincingly as a well placed Gravity Well. Even entangle is an 80s cd and it’s nowhere close to Gravity Well.

A Few things.
Over the span of an entire game the CD arguement becomes irrelevent, Over the span of an entire game many many things can and will happen, but that’s not all.
Many classes over the span of an entire game can and will render your elite pointless at least once if not twice during the entire game.

(entangle is on a 60s CD BTW, you are getting a lot of things wrong about different abilities and effects and I wonder if you are just choosing to complain about the build with no real combat experience from people who are also experienced at the game)

Simply saying.
Calling something OP because it can be used at different intervals every 90s during a pvp match is equivalent to calling
Basilisk Venom
Strength of the Pack
Renewed Focus
Jade Winds
Facet of Chaos

OP because they can be used multiple times as elites throughout a pvp match.
It’s kinda grasping at straws.

sigh If any of you three were half decent at Mesmer you might be able to understand why it’s so incredibly broken. The way you talk I can only imagine a bunch of 12 year olds throwing wild Gravity Wells at one person and QQing on the forums saying it’s a balanced ability because you missed. Yes 30-50s defensive is a good trade for a 90s elite but when you catch 4 people and force them all to use that defensive only to throw it down one more time and take the point and gain map control from an effective team-wipe, it’s a little OP.

That’s what an elite should do?
Did you complain about the AoE SPAMMABLE CC from Shiro?
The AoE 2 second stun from Necro?
The AoE stun from reaper shroud?

Again, you’re grasping at straws about a skill that can be used effectively maybe twice during a match, and that entirely depends on if people decide to sit in a red circle.

To get back to your point from earlier.
That I said I would revisit-

I am sure you are well aware of the requirements of only being able to use 3 trait lines correct.
Can you replicate the mesmer build using this website
http://en.gw2skills.net/
That you feel is OP
And the people that play the class can tell you the 2-3 builds and/or classes that promptly shut it down .

In the end, if you’re bad you’re not going to be able to do the combos correctly, and you wont see why it’s broken. And if you are you probably wont care anyways and try to defend it. But for those if you who might care -

http://www.twitch.tv/malferian/profile

Prominent Mesmer streamer, access to his past broadcasts are here. Give it a look see, you’ll see some proper combos and maybe begin to understand why Gravity Well and CS needs to be toned down.

I think that may be your problem-
You watch people instead of actually playing the game.
Again-
If your opponents are oblivious to the mechanics of a mesmer-
You’re MMR may be low, you may need to play more pvp and get better so that you too can play with a better caliber of people
OR
Ask people in this subsection for advice on how to beat the build you have trouble with, before you cry wolf.
If all you’re doing is basing your opinions and “experience” from streamers, use WTS players who have competed and kept there teams at the top

http://www.twitch.tv/thelordhelseth

Also
I’ll leave this image from the Spvp forum here.
I can tell what the mesmer did wrong from the image- can you?

Haste.8610:

Solori.6025:

Haste.8610:

FJSAMA.2867:

The “combo” you discribe only can happen on 1st encounter on pvp when all CDs available, and cause of that easily countered… You know its coming.
Remember if u want to use cs mid match for sure you will have some skills on CD and activating cs will just prolong that CDs.
Its, at max, a 5 seconds time window… just kite. Wells are static on ground, rest of combo easly telegraphed.

TL:DR > l2p

How do I say this with out sounding mean.. You didn’t think about what you said at all.

You didn’t either..

It’s a short, 90s cd kitten combo.

Do you know how long 90s is in a fight?
You must not, you must be running around auto attacking, because waiting 90s to do something is a death sentence in pvp.

Kite? A mesmer? Sure go ahead, have all 5 members kite and lose the point because of the massive AOE shatter + Gravity Well.

It doesn’t take 5 people to kill a mes, and if 5 people are on a point with no stability or stun breaks and they walk into red circles then you may need to rethink your team comp and the skill level of the people you play with.
If this is a regular occurrence for you in your spvp match-ups I hate to tell you, but your MMR may be really low.

Waste your defensives to get away from it. Don’t forget shattering slows you know so kiting is that much harder.

slow=/=movement impairment

Congrats, you got away, no come back after losing the point and retake it- Oh wait, the entire thing can be done -again-.

Brush up on your game terms please

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glossary_of_video_game_terms#Cooldown

with the alacrity nerf you aren’t going to have BWE1 CD reduction unless you trait for it.

I play a Mesmer, only a Mesmer. This is to strong, all I’m suggesting is that they either lengthen the CD or shorten the window you have to combo.

Try playing more pvp with people who don’t let clones sit around.
The combo you listed either needs 3 clones and your opponent to be completely oblivious to mesmer mechanics OR afk.

Since this seems to be the most well structured reply I’ll use this as my example.

Do any of you play PvP at a competitive level or are you enjoying being OP so much that you’re going to blindly defend what’s clearly broken? I can already tell you’re incredibly bad but that’s to be expected, so I’ll do my best to explain this as -slow-ly (Haha, get it?) as possible.

Kiting, slow doesn’t decrease your movement speed. It makes the cast time on your abilities longer, this makes it harder to kite because you’re especially vulnerable to interrupts which Mesmer just loves to do.

On to the cool down, 90s is not short in a single fight but over the span of the game it is very short, there are weaker abilities with much longer cd’s. Rampage is 180s cd, Lich form is 180s, these, while being undeniably strong don’t turn a fight around as convincingly as a well placed Gravity Well. Even entangle is an 80s cd and it’s nowhere close to Gravity Well.

sigh If any of you three were half decent at Mesmer you might be able to understand why it’s so incredibly broken. The way you talk I can only imagine a bunch of 12 year olds throwing wild Gravity Wells at one person and QQing on the forums saying it’s a balanced ability because you missed. Yes 30-50s defensive is a good trade for a 90s elite but when you catch 4 people and force them all to use that defensive only to throw it down one more time and take the point and gain map control from an effective team-wipe, it’s a little OP.

In the end, if you’re bad you’re not going to be able to do the combos correctly, and you wont see why it’s broken. And if you are you probably wont care anyways and try to defend it. But for those if you who might care -

http://www.twitch.tv/malferian/profile

Prominent Mesmer streamer, access to his past broadcasts are here. Give it a look see, you’ll see some proper combos and maybe begin to understand why Gravity Well and CS needs to be toned down.

Also from your steamer-

A lot of times he would spawn clones-
Continuum Shift-
Spam weapon abilities or get caught in a bad position( OR use his elite on like 2-3 people already mid fight)
then be ripped back

With nothing else to generate clones to shatter ( which is where a lot of damage potential comes from) It is almost effectively wasting a CS

I’m really hoping that’s not what you are basing this complaint on

Iavra.8510:

I still think Chrono would be very strong without it, but then the other Specializations have their own op stuff, so eh…i don’t really care, now.

What he said!

I just got wrecked by what I think was this combo in pvp, I couldn’t do nothing.

The OP’s combo is incredibly easy to avoid… If the mesmer pops Shatter5 w/o having blown any of his CDs, then you know he’s going to throw everything he has at you in the next 3s. Just pop your dodge/block or whatever and now his Shatter5 is on 90s cooldown.

I get that this combo is very powerful. Mesmer, like some other classes with their elites, are showing how sick they are in pvp. But there are two things to consider:
Are we so much more OP than every other elite class? I am not convinced we are, and if so, advocating for nerfs over a single weekend is a poor showing.

Has anyone sat down and gone 1v1 in practice with anyone targeting the CS drop? What I mean is, lets practice as players to look for and target the skills weak spot so we all know the quick counter to this skill. If someone drops it, hit it fast, preferably with an aoe skill. I am not convinced our weakness is being exploited by the player base, who have not had much chance to actually get used to it. These weekend events are kinda bad in my opinion, because a single weekend, or even 3 weekends does not give people time to get used to huge changes in classes. If l2play is for real, I don’t think a weekend is enough time to do it in….give people a beta week, maybe two, to get used to these changes. Its possible Chronomancer could be a weak class going forward once people get its mechanic….I am interested in people’s opinions on this skill in 1v1, 1vX and WvW combat. I think this is great for pve since it lets us dish out better burst damage in pve to stay competitive not even talking about the support aspects.

EDIT: I am going to advocate against limiting the number of activatable skills because I think this hurts us in dungeons/raids/pve content in general. This entire post feels knee-jerk to me for the reasons I mentioned above, and I would rather not see us get nerfed simply because we are a lousy dps sustain class and people scream murder whenever our burst damage(the only damage we have) gets buffed for a class that hasn’t much else going for it.

I agree, Chrono is just a flat out upgrade to Mesmer.

What really bothers me is that the new Time Lapse (Weaver’s ability) is something else that appears in a few other elite specs, that they just add something to the class mechanic, instead of the class mechanic feeling brand new, like they did with Reaper.