Guild Wars 2

So I keep hearing this over and over. I don’t think mesmer is OP. I think the class has a high skill requirement on the part of it’s players. I feel like I’m a decent mesmer. I’m far from the best, and I’m humble about what I can do. But I can’t help but be insulted when someone says mesmer is OP. I work hard as a mesmer and I’ve worked hard to get where I am skill wise. I don’t just walk over everyone like some kind of super man. Telling someone that thinks mesmer is OP this normally gets a remark about how I must be a terrible player in general. I can’t help but be disheartened. So at this point, I’m sick to hell of it. I want some straight answers.

So I’d like to know why mesmer is OP. I feel like this view is mainly a “learn to play” issue, but, as always, I’m open to suggestion. Why am I wrong? Why is it OP?

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/mesmer/GS-iBezerker-a-foo-strategy

Click the link on the original post. Watch the video. Become enlightened.

I’ve already seen that. The video immediately called to mind thieves and warriors to me. Funny how we can interpret things differently.

Wise.8025:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/mesmer/GS-iBezerker-a-foo-strategy

Click the link on the original post. Watch the video. Become enlightened.

Doesn’t explain anything. Mesmer’s have some of the most complex attack chains in the game, they have a distinct lack of foo strategies especially since the GS got broken.

If you want foo, try warrior. (Hundred blades, ????, PROFIT!)

I’ve grown tired of trying to explain to people the complexities of the Mesmer class, so I’m just going to just start using the old WoW forum response:

“The class is fine, learn to play.”

Mesmer is not OP, if you fail with one timing in a 1v2, may happen in 1v1 aswell, you die almost instantly, but however if your timings are correct you can crush anything, well not a 1v5 and up

UnknownFreak.2805:

Mesmer is not OP, if you fail with one timing in a 1v2, may happen in 1v1 aswell, you die almost instantly, but however if your timings are correct you can crush anything, well not a 1v5 and up

Mesmer is not even that strong 1v1, it only happens when bad players get confused by the illusions.

It’s actually incredibly hard to keep any competent melee class off of you, people are realizing now it’s quite easy to keep track of the real Mesmer and just beat their face in, especially Thieves with their myriad stuns, snares and roots. It is because of this that glass cannon shatter builds are essential for Mesmers, you will never kill melee in your face unless you counter their damage with even more of your own.

Of course I have been involved in the humiliating butt kicking of up to 3 enemies before, but they’re always bad puggers. Against good players you should struggle in most 1 on 1s and a 1v2 should be unwinnable. Anything else that happens is the result of playing against bad people and has nothing to do with the Mesmer itself. Those same people would probably have lost to me if I was any other class.

I used to always think of Warrior as an easy kill, until I started going against Warrior players that competently busted out shield stance with good timing and would counter an entire shatter. Stuff like that is what you see with good players, whereas a bad Warrior would just keep trying to Hblades you and probably forget he has a second weapon to swap to.

If people just played at higher levels more often, they’d see this game is incredibly balanced.

ashleydoll.8563:

UnknownFreak.2805:

Mesmer is not OP, if you fail with one timing in a 1v2, may happen in 1v1 aswell, you die almost instantly, but however if your timings are correct you can crush anything, well not a 1v5 and up

Mesmer is not even that strong 1v1, it only happens when bad players get confused by the illusions.

It’s actually incredibly hard to keep any competent melee class off of you, people are realizing now it’s quite easy to keep track of the real Mesmer and just beat their face in, especially Thieves with their myriad stuns, snares and roots. It is because of this that glass cannon shatter builds are essential for Mesmers, you will never kill melee in your face unless you counter their damage with even more of your own.

Of course I have been involved in the humiliating butt kicking of up to 3 enemies before, but they’re always bad puggers. Against good players you should struggle in most 1 on 1s and a 1v2 should be unwinnable. Anything else that happens is the result of playing against bad people and has nothing to do with the Mesmer itself. Those same people would probably have lost to me if I was any other class.

I used to always think of Warrior as an easy kill, until I started going against Warrior players that competently busted out shield stance with good timing and would counter an entire shatter. Stuff like that is what you see with good players, whereas a bad Warrior would just keep trying to Hblades you and probably forget he has a second weapon to swap to.

If people just played at higher levels more often, they’d see this game is incredibly balanced.

I agree with this other than with the dodge/blind/block =’s no phantom/clone mechanic in place right now… and downed skills need some balancing as well.

IMO Mesmer is the weakest class right now because those rules apply to mesmers. No other class has to deal with multi hitting, telegraphed, and delayed attacks just not appearing due to any of those 3 reasons. That imbalance alone means any good player on any class can stop a mesmer in its tracks with minimal effort. They have a chance to avoid the damage on and after the summon in many many ways. If they applied these same rules to all classes, we wouldn’t be complaining… but it’s ONLY mesmer.

SteepledHat.1345:

I’ve already seen that. The video immediately called to mind thieves and warriors to me. Funny how we can interpret things differently.

I guess I was referring to the skill gap required to play mesmer outside of the “Create clone ==> Shatter” rinse and repeat techniques.

Outside of basic illusion generation and deception skills mesmer suddenly jumps in skill required to play it well. A lot of people just don’t see it because they’re still playing vs others that are using the noob OP skill sets. It’s tough to learn a new build when all of the classes have an OP skill set that is commonly used and it feels like they just happen to all counter mesmer everything.

@steepledhat:

Don’t worry about what other people think. There are people who think mesmer is OP, and others that it’s unplayable.

That tells me it’s fairly balanced. So play it, enjoy it, and dust those who are criticizing you off your boot heels

I wont be drawn into this endless and kinda booring discussion on this forum how we are eather op or usless. Everything is not black or white.

I do feel that the ppl who say that as soon a mesmer meet a “skilled” player they loose due to we only win vs ppl cause they going for the clones or fail to dodge the phantasms to be missleading thu. Remember we have ppl rolling the class and comming into this forum to learn about the class, to then have same ppl in thread after thread feed this statement without in any way bring basic facts,proof is not helping them. The correct way would instead be to try work for solutions for any problem you have.

If we are usless vs high ranked players how come top teams like paradigm use Mersmers?

As soon a mesmer win vs someone the player he win is bad, if mesmer lose its due to class be bad. This is a rather iggnorant statement and kinda unfair for the big amount of good mesmers who accualy beat ppl with skill. It also is kinda cheep to blame al misstakes and looses on class mecanics.

I cant talk for the tPvP or sPvP as there is ppl who do this alot more and better but from a wvwvw mesmers point of viev I say that both in smal group play and solo roaming we are in a superb situation. Our 12 man team have 4(!) mesmers, that 30% of the team, and we destroy guild teams alot bigger. In 1 vs 1 or even in 1 vs x You in no way need to blend in with your clones, clones are dmg and resources not decoys.

Nvm I sure some of the forum ppl with the agenda to downwrite the class rather than help ppl out think different but in my oppinion mesmers are in a great spot holding a ground that no other class can cover.

I only wich we can instead of strait on qq left and right try find soulutions on problems ppl have. Alot of skilled mesmers around this forum and if ppl have strait on questions and others have will to help we can work together to be a even stronger class.

/cheers Osicat

A single mesmer running around by themselves is not OP – our popular builds have plenty of counters, just like any other class in GW2. It’s similar QQ you hear re: BS thieves, with players just sitting there and waiting to eat their stealth BS combo and hope the RNG gods are with them that day.

Most of the 1 v [x] you see are against bad players / unorganized players / players caught with their hands in their pants… you name it. A single Mesmer fighting against multiple competent opponents, especially using vent/TS, should simply not be able to win the majority of the time. Yes, there are times when everything you land is max critting in a TW bubble but that should be a rarity vs. the norm.

However, in group play, multiple mesmers synergize much much better with chain TWs/portals. If anything, that’s where the class is really OP, not single play.

ashleydoll.8563:

UnknownFreak.2805:

Mesmer is not OP, if you fail with one timing in a 1v2, may happen in 1v1 aswell, you die almost instantly, but however if your timings are correct you can crush anything, well not a 1v5 and up

Mesmer is not even that strong 1v1, it only happens when bad players get confused by the illusions.

It’s actually incredibly hard to keep any competent melee class off of you, people are realizing now it’s quite easy to keep track of the real Mesmer and just beat their face in, especially Thieves with their myriad stuns, snares and roots. It is because of this that glass cannon shatter builds are essential for Mesmers, you will never kill melee in your face unless you counter their damage with even more of your own.

Of course I have been involved in the humiliating butt kicking of up to 3 enemies before, but they’re always bad puggers. Against good players you should struggle in most 1 on 1s and a 1v2 should be unwinnable. Anything else that happens is the result of playing against bad people and has nothing to do with the Mesmer itself. Those same people would probably have lost to me if I was any other class.

I used to always think of Warrior as an easy kill, until I started going against Warrior players that competently busted out shield stance with good timing and would counter an entire shatter. Stuff like that is what you see with good players, whereas a bad Warrior would just keep trying to Hblades you and probably forget he has a second weapon to swap to.

If people just played at higher levels more often, they’d see this game is incredibly balanced.

Sorry but your wrong, I had 2 fully gear Warriors on me.

In WvW, one in Arah and one in CoF gear.

I am no where near a high damage mez(I am a tank)

I crush them both no problem, hp did not even get below half.

Why all their major skill I saw comming and use 2 on sword are f4(only shatter skill I use)

Also keep defender/warden out and right next to me, made it where they could not go long rang and had to stay up close are over 70% of their attacks would be reflex.

So force them into melee and then out melee them with no clones/invisble.

Warden 3k/bf 2k/1 500/500/800…….get my point not exactly high damage and yet I can take out multy people with no prob.
1v2 I never die, and i got a build like no one else will ever use.

EsLafiel.4517:

ashleydoll.8563:

UnknownFreak.2805:

Mesmer is not OP, if you fail with one timing in a 1v2, may happen in 1v1 aswell, you die almost instantly, but however if your timings are correct you can crush anything, well not a 1v5 and up

Mesmer is not even that strong 1v1, it only happens when bad players get confused by the illusions.

It’s actually incredibly hard to keep any competent melee class off of you, people are realizing now it’s quite easy to keep track of the real Mesmer and just beat their face in, especially Thieves with their myriad stuns, snares and roots. It is because of this that glass cannon shatter builds are essential for Mesmers, you will never kill melee in your face unless you counter their damage with even more of your own.

Of course I have been involved in the humiliating butt kicking of up to 3 enemies before, but they’re always bad puggers. Against good players you should struggle in most 1 on 1s and a 1v2 should be unwinnable. Anything else that happens is the result of playing against bad people and has nothing to do with the Mesmer itself. Those same people would probably have lost to me if I was any other class.

I used to always think of Warrior as an easy kill, until I started going against Warrior players that competently busted out shield stance with good timing and would counter an entire shatter. Stuff like that is what you see with good players, whereas a bad Warrior would just keep trying to Hblades you and probably forget he has a second weapon to swap to.

If people just played at higher levels more often, they’d see this game is incredibly balanced.

Sorry but your wrong, I had 2 fully gear Warriors on me.

In WvW, one in Arah and one in CoF gear.

I am no where near a high damage mez(I am a tank)

I crush them both no problem, hp did not even get below half.

Why all their major skill I saw comming and use 2 on sword are f4(only shatter skill I use)

Also keep defender/warden out and right next to me, made it where they could not go long rang and had to stay up close are over 70% of their attacks would be reflex.

So force them into melee and then out melee them with no clones/invisble.

Warden 3k/bf 2k/1 500/500/800…….get my point not exactly high damage and yet I can take out multy people with no prob.
1v2 I never die, and i got a build like no one else will ever use.

Just because someone has gear doesnt mean they are skilled with their class..
Especially since in this game
Skill > gear.

Osicat.4139:

I wont be drawn into this endless and kinda booring discussion on this forum how we are eather op or usless. Everything is not black or white.

I do feel that the ppl who say that as soon a mesmer meet a “skilled” player they loose due to we only win vs ppl cause they going for the clones or fail to dodge the phantasms to be missleading thu. Remember we have ppl rolling the class and comming into this forum to learn about the class, to then have same ppl in thread after thread feed this statement without in any way bring basic facts,proof is not helping them. The correct way would instead be to try work for solutions for any problem you have.

If we are usless vs high ranked players how come top teams like paradigm use Mersmers?

As soon a mesmer win vs someone the player he win is bad, if mesmer lose its due to class be bad. This is a rather iggnorant statement and kinda unfair for the big amount of good mesmers who accualy beat ppl with skill. It also is kinda cheep to blame al misstakes and looses on class mecanics.

I cant talk for the tPvP or sPvP as there is ppl who do this alot more and better but from a wvwvw mesmers point of viev I say that both in smal group play and solo roaming we are in a superb situation. Our 12 man team have 4(!) mesmers, that 30% of the team, and we destroy guild teams alot bigger. In 1 vs 1 or even in 1 vs x You in no way need to blend in with your clones, clones are dmg and resources not decoys.

Nvm I sure some of the forum ppl with the agenda to downwrite the class rather than help ppl out think different but in my oppinion mesmers are in a great spot holding a ground that no other class can cover.

I only wich we can instead of strait on qq left and right try find soulutions on problems ppl have. Alot of skilled mesmers around this forum and if ppl have strait on questions and others have will to help we can work together to be a even stronger class.

/cheers Osicat

Having to work around these unbalanced rules is why mesmers are the weakest class.

Lets be real honest… most wvw-ers are baddies.

If they can’t stop the summons before they are summoned (blind), during the summon (blind/block/dodge), OR after the summon (block/dodge/kill illusion) then they probably just eat every attack thrown at them and you could kill them with any class by just spamming them.

Also you should never be able to blend in with your clones with everyone having the ability to put a big red target over your head with a single mouse click… I can still do it many times in WvW though by just using stealth and then standing there in my clones and only auto attacking and after. Again… this is due to most WvW-ers being baddies.

Solori.6025:

EsLafiel.4517:

ashleydoll.8563:

UnknownFreak.2805:

Mesmer is not OP, if you fail with one timing in a 1v2, may happen in 1v1 aswell, you die almost instantly, but however if your timings are correct you can crush anything, well not a 1v5 and up

Mesmer is not even that strong 1v1, it only happens when bad players get confused by the illusions.

It’s actually incredibly hard to keep any competent melee class off of you, people are realizing now it’s quite easy to keep track of the real Mesmer and just beat their face in, especially Thieves with their myriad stuns, snares and roots. It is because of this that glass cannon shatter builds are essential for Mesmers, you will never kill melee in your face unless you counter their damage with even more of your own.

Of course I have been involved in the humiliating butt kicking of up to 3 enemies before, but they’re always bad puggers. Against good players you should struggle in most 1 on 1s and a 1v2 should be unwinnable. Anything else that happens is the result of playing against bad people and has nothing to do with the Mesmer itself. Those same people would probably have lost to me if I was any other class.

I used to always think of Warrior as an easy kill, until I started going against Warrior players that competently busted out shield stance with good timing and would counter an entire shatter. Stuff like that is what you see with good players, whereas a bad Warrior would just keep trying to Hblades you and probably forget he has a second weapon to swap to.

If people just played at higher levels more often, they’d see this game is incredibly balanced.

Sorry but your wrong, I had 2 fully gear Warriors on me.

In WvW, one in Arah and one in CoF gear.

I am no where near a high damage mez(I am a tank)

I crush them both no problem, hp did not even get below half.

Why all their major skill I saw comming and use 2 on sword are f4(only shatter skill I use)

Also keep defender/warden out and right next to me, made it where they could not go long rang and had to stay up close are over 70% of their attacks would be reflex.

So force them into melee and then out melee them with no clones/invisble.

Warden 3k/bf 2k/1 500/500/800…….get my point not exactly high damage and yet I can take out multy people with no prob.
1v2 I never die, and i got a build like no one else will ever use.

Just because someone has gear doesnt mean they are skilled with their class..
Especially since in this game
Skill > gear.

Think you’re right there, I have staff lvl78 exotic, my pistol and sword are lvl80 rare, so if you are playing skillfully as I do sometimes you can beat any one, it’s not the gear that is making the kill, it’s the skill I would say. And you can not just attack if you vs a thief… you need to stun them all the time else they cloak and deal tons of damage to you, or escape, cause they know you will crush them. There’s a counter to every class, but some are harder to crush easily. I have failed a lot, but you have to fail and learn to be able to kill them next time. And think what you made wrong, this can make you win vs the next player.

And EsLafiel, if you missclick… what happens then?

I’m not going to retype this, but read this post:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/mesmer/Objectively-there-s-not-reason/first#post948193

Read the whole thing, the TL;DR is mesmers are op. Keep in mind, most of the techniques and abilities referenced in that post require high amounts of skill and/or coordination. This is most certainly not a FOO strategy situation.

UnknownFreak.2805:

Solori.6025:

EsLafiel.4517:

ashleydoll.8563:

UnknownFreak.2805:

Mesmer is not OP, if you fail with one timing in a 1v2, may happen in 1v1 aswell, you die almost instantly, but however if your timings are correct you can crush anything, well not a 1v5 and up

Mesmer is not even that strong 1v1, it only happens when bad players get confused by the illusions.

It’s actually incredibly hard to keep any competent melee class off of you, people are realizing now it’s quite easy to keep track of the real Mesmer and just beat their face in, especially Thieves with their myriad stuns, snares and roots. It is because of this that glass cannon shatter builds are essential for Mesmers, you will never kill melee in your face unless you counter their damage with even more of your own.

Of course I have been involved in the humiliating butt kicking of up to 3 enemies before, but they’re always bad puggers. Against good players you should struggle in most 1 on 1s and a 1v2 should be unwinnable. Anything else that happens is the result of playing against bad people and has nothing to do with the Mesmer itself. Those same people would probably have lost to me if I was any other class.

I used to always think of Warrior as an easy kill, until I started going against Warrior players that competently busted out shield stance with good timing and would counter an entire shatter. Stuff like that is what you see with good players, whereas a bad Warrior would just keep trying to Hblades you and probably forget he has a second weapon to swap to.

If people just played at higher levels more often, they’d see this game is incredibly balanced.

Sorry but your wrong, I had 2 fully gear Warriors on me.

In WvW, one in Arah and one in CoF gear.

I am no where near a high damage mez(I am a tank)

I crush them both no problem, hp did not even get below half.

Why all their major skill I saw comming and use 2 on sword are f4(only shatter skill I use)

Also keep defender/warden out and right next to me, made it where they could not go long rang and had to stay up close are over 70% of their attacks would be reflex.

So force them into melee and then out melee them with no clones/invisble.

Warden 3k/bf 2k/1 500/500/800…….get my point not exactly high damage and yet I can take out multy people with no prob.
1v2 I never die, and i got a build like no one else will ever use.

Just because someone has gear doesnt mean they are skilled with their class..
Especially since in this game
Skill > gear.

Think you’re right there, I have staff lvl78 exotic, my pistol and sword are lvl80 rare, so if you are playing skillfully as I do sometimes you can beat any one, it’s not the gear that is making the kill, it’s the skill I would say. And you can not just attack if you vs a thief… you need to stun them all the time else they cloak and deal tons of damage to you, or escape, cause they know you will crush them. There’s a counter to every class, but some are harder to crush easily. I have failed a lot, but you have to fail and learn to be able to kill them next time. And think what you made wrong, this can make you win vs the next player.

And EsLafiel, if you missclick… what happens then?

not that big of deal even if they hit me with one of their major attacks.

I never been hit with anything that did over 5k to me. Even hundred blades dont do that much on me.

I just stop them from hitting me, since no reason to let them do damage to you anyway.

Ps theif is not hard, if ya time bf right then all their damage is gone if their backstab theif. (just because you cant see them, dont mean it not easy to tell when they about to attack you, and then us bf or f4 to make him wast his skills.)and if their long range just set up a reflex field.

Other then their shadow field, all other invisible don’t last long and so easy to time them. Which you can pull them out of their shadow field and make it useless.

Anyway I was talking towards the point of Saying Mesmer is force range, because their melee sucks.

When I am Melee, and I pretty much never die.

Because I don’t go for a giant serge in damage and then suck for a bit.

My damage stay the same 100% of the time at a good lvl, and so skills that are made to protect you vs high lvl damage, is useless vs me and all it does is stop normal damage from me for a couple of secs.

I am steady basically, even if I mess up I wont die.

Only people I ever have even semi problem with is people that is 100% cd build.

It really depends on the player skill. Many new players complained about how hard it is to level a mesmer. But after we get to lvl 80, that’s where the fun starts.
We get to try out different build and play style, and we learn how our skills work together. I learn a new thing or two every time I play my mesmer.