Guild Wars 2

Just want to show my gratitude towards Anet for the upcoming changes to mesmer.
It really shows that the class is still receiving some love from the devs and you guys are listening to the community (especially regarding to the major bugs)

I’m very excited and looking forward to these changes.

.. at least until we mesmers get hit with a barrage of nerfs again.

On a less positive note, I’m a bit concerned with putting such a strong condition like torment on an autoattack that the mesmer and clones can inflict simultaneously.

It’s good that mesmers are becoming more and more a master of torment condition, but this might prove too strong and guarantee subsequent nerf. I might be wrong, so let’s see how it plays out.

Again, thank you Anet.

I’m sure Anet will balance the clone/torment capabilities on Scepter if it becomes too powerful. But I agree 100%, I was SO happy reading the notes. Let’s hope they deliver!

Call me grumpy, but I am withholding my thanks till I see working iWarden.
As for other changes… I remember what happened to Power Block, so I’ll wait here too.

Well as the saying goes, any patch were Mesmer isn’t nerfed is a good patch.

That is about the best I can say for the patch.

The best counter to PU was to ignore them, now you won’t ba able to do that.

Don’t thank them for something as mindless as giving you an extremely strong condition that you can essentially have a 100% uptime on with multiple stacks. And before any of you say L2P or cleanse it, it’s on your AA, cleanses won’t work. A mesmer can just stealth with clones active while their target gets torment stacked on them. Conditions on AA need to go, let alone strong conditions. The other changes were fine, but the torment was just stupid.

Still pretty sure you can just run away from a condi mes after the patch, how can they catch you? I don’t think the torment AA is going to be enough to really stop you from just leaving the fight. Granted that is wvw, spvp this is def a buff.

MSFone.3026:

Still pretty sure you can just run away from a condi mes after the patch, how can they catch you? I don’t think the torment AA is going to be enough to really stop you from just leaving the fight. Granted that is wvw, spvp this is def a buff.

So it’s still fine if the enemy simply has to run away? Sure, give me a build that forces my enemy to either run away or stick around and die, makes perfect sense.

warriorjrd.8695:

MSFone.3026:

Still pretty sure you can just run away from a condi mes after the patch, how can they catch you? I don’t think the torment AA is going to be enough to really stop you from just leaving the fight. Granted that is wvw, spvp this is def a buff.

So it’s still fine if the enemy simply has to run away? Sure, give me a build that forces my enemy to either run away or stick around and die, makes perfect sense.

What exactly have you lost if you run away from a 1v1 in WvW?

Yeah, I’ll hold my thanks until I see these supposed changes realize in actuality.

Levetty.1279:

warriorjrd.8695:

MSFone.3026:

Still pretty sure you can just run away from a condi mes after the patch, how can they catch you? I don’t think the torment AA is going to be enough to really stop you from just leaving the fight. Granted that is wvw, spvp this is def a buff.

So it’s still fine if the enemy simply has to run away? Sure, give me a build that forces my enemy to either run away or stick around and die, makes perfect sense.

What exactly have you lost if you run away from a 1v1 in WvW?

It’s bad balancing, though I do agree with you, ONLY in WVW. PVP that’s an entirely different beast. If you’re forced to retreat from someone in PVP then you sacrifice a point. That’s grounds for a loss =P. That said, if it’s a condi PU build, they’ll be forced to decap their own point so at the very least you can cause a stalemate.

I’m not thanking them yet. Call me pessimistic, but they said the same things last time and delivered it unfulfilled.

Last time they promised the Illusionary Elasticity buff, warden fix, and a big list of the bugs they were going to fix but failed to deliver. I’m sure they will “forget” to do some things in this same patch

Edit:

I’m sure they’ll also manage to mess up and completely bug a totally random skill, just like their “floater issue” back then with iZerker.
That or they do some tool tip “bug fixing”

LumAnth.5124:

Last time they promised the Illusionary Elasticity “buff”, warden “fix”

fixed it for ya

warriorjrd.8695:

Don’t thank them for something as mindless as giving you an extremely strong condition that you can essentially have a 100% uptime on with multiple stacks. And before any of you say L2P or cleanse it, it’s on your AA, cleanses won’t work. A mesmer can just stealth with clones active while their target gets torment stacked on them. Conditions on AA need to go, let alone strong conditions. The other changes were fine, but the torment was just stupid.

You have no vision but a dark one.
So let’s say they have stacked 25 torment..let’s just say…
1)Oh, it can be cleansed in foul swoop..there is no variety of conditions here. Successful condition stackers have poison. burning, bleeding..not just one condition.
2) Clones are easily destroyed..they are not turrets which can’t be crit or condi hit.
3) generosity will cause major problems to a profession that has limited removal. Considering torment will be the major condition by far, which one do you think generosity will affect every 9 seconds?..think about it.
4)To invest in imbued torment GM trait, and take DE that leaves you with 20 points to place in power to get condi damage, and no points to invest Master tier scepter skill. As a condition build, it is wildly so spread you can’t invest in it perfectly without losing something entirely valuable.

Your too doom and gloom for a build you haven’t even seen in affect yet.

CntrlAltDefeat.1465:

warriorjrd.8695:

Don’t thank them for something as mindless as giving you an extremely strong condition that you can essentially have a 100% uptime on with multiple stacks. And before any of you say L2P or cleanse it, it’s on your AA, cleanses won’t work. A mesmer can just stealth with clones active while their target gets torment stacked on them. Conditions on AA need to go, let alone strong conditions. The other changes were fine, but the torment was just stupid.

You have no vision but a dark one.
So let’s say they have stacked 25 torment..let’s just say…
1)Oh, it can be cleansed in foul swoop..there is no variety of conditions here. Successful condition stackers have poison. burning, bleeding..not just one condition.
2) Clones are easily destroyed..they are not turrets which can’t be crit or condi hit.
3) generosity will cause major problems to a profession that has limited removal. Considering torment will be the major condition by far, which one do you think generosity will affect every 9 seconds?..think about it.
4)To invest in imbued torment GM trait, and take DE that leaves you with 20 points to place in power to get condi damage, and no points to invest Master tier scepter skill. As a condition build, it is wildly so spread you can’t invest in it perfectly without losing something entirely valuable.

Your too doom and gloom for a build you haven’t even seen in affect yet.

Yes, allow me to kill your clones while you ready up another one with your AA chain, I won’t even bother killing you because you can keep the torment and the clones up. Like I said, you apply torment on your AA, no condi cleanse can compete with that at all. Don’t give me this “just cleanse” it argument when you can literally re-apply it less than 2 seconds later. In fact if you have clones up it won’t just be you applying the torment, so there is literally no point in cleansing it at all. Don’t pretend like mesmers only have torment as a condition. You have plenty of access to bleeds it’s not even funny, you can get burns as well. Generosity sigil is what, like 40 gold or something now?

I have nothing wrong with torment itself, even if mesmer had a utility that gave me 25 stacks for 1 minute. The thing I’m annoyed with is they have it on their AA. Applying it won’t be a challenge at all, and maintaining will be a joke. Throw in condition duration and watch it stack up. I will say again, I have nothing wrong with the condition, merely it’s ease of use with it being on an AA. It shouldn’t be that easy to maintain or apply, end of story.

CntrlAltDefeat.1465:

warriorjrd.8695:

Don’t thank them for something as mindless as giving you an extremely strong condition that you can essentially have a 100% uptime on with multiple stacks. And before any of you say L2P or cleanse it, it’s on your AA, cleanses won’t work. A mesmer can just stealth with clones active while their target gets torment stacked on them. Conditions on AA need to go, let alone strong conditions. The other changes were fine, but the torment was just stupid.

You have no vision but a dark one.
So let’s say they have stacked 25 torment..let’s just say…
1)Oh, it can be cleansed in foul swoop..there is no variety of conditions here. Successful condition stackers have poison. burning, bleeding..not just one condition.
2) Clones are easily destroyed..they are not turrets which can’t be crit or condi hit.
3) generosity will cause major problems to a profession that has limited removal. Considering torment will be the major condition by far, which one do you think generosity will affect every 9 seconds?..think about it.
4)To invest in imbued torment GM trait, and take DE that leaves you with 20 points to place in power to get condi damage, and no points to invest Master tier scepter skill. As a condition build, it is wildly so spread you can’t invest in it perfectly without losing something entirely valuable.

Your too doom and gloom for a build you haven’t even seen in affect yet.

Osicat proved that a 0/6/6/2/0 set up with heal mantra and cleanse mantra has enough cleanses to deal with the conditions of anything other than a dhuumteror necro 1v1. And yeah you’re delusional if you don’t think this is too strong. Engi turrets may not be paper, but they’re on a relatively long cooldown. Clone death explosions will punish you while the mesmer dodges or autoattacks and sets up another one. I played PU when it first came out and now I’m disgusted I ever tried it. I kitten myself of playing a real, skillful mesmer build for so long because of that toxic cheese..

2s torment doesnt make mesmer a free win comparing with necro scepter ,ranger short bow , war sword , its strong but not op yet .Also mesmer is still super weak to condition even they are using condition build. This is not even any close to Dhuumfire ever was . Mesmer doesnt have something instantly cast and instantly work like necro has for that op burn proc.

Also scepter attack speed is really slow and half time it will miss ,clone AA goes same way .You do have l2p and sidestep or range a mesmer or just kill him before he does anything too much to u and your team .
I played CI build for a while now with zero condition removal. I did just fine against this stupid bunker meta .

I’m so tired with those theories which always happened before actual patch and said “omfg” mesmer will be op"even it’s just a fix for us .And then when patch hit ,war will be happy like they always do for over a year. Because game "balance "did carry them a lot which made them think passive heal ,passive condition removal every sec ,mindless aoe , heavy armor and high mobility those things are standard need to even play tpvp.

To all those wars who always like trolling here , level one mesmer through gameplay and play shatter in tpvp now .Then you have right to judge "op mesmer "

nearlight.3064:

Osicat proved that a 0/6/6/2/0 set up with heal mantra and cleanse mantra has enough cleanses to deal with the conditions of anything other than a dhuumteror necro 1v1. And yeah you’re delusional if you don’t think this is too strong. Engi turrets may not be paper, but they’re on a relatively long cooldown. Clone death explosions will punish you while the mesmer dodges or autoattacks and sets up another one. I played PU when it first came out and now I’m disgusted I ever tried it. I kitten myself of playing a real, skillful mesmer build for so long because of that toxic cheese..

a 0/6/6/2/0 set isnt enough to clean engi nades condition im pretty sure its only enough to counter condition war . You are still weak to half necro builds and condition thief (well lets say condition thief isnt problem here since no one plays condition thief tpvp ). And finally lets say condition mesmer will be better than spirit ranger as it is now with portal for team support .That’s all. It might be too strong for wvw roaming where u can just run away. But in tpvp where the meta (guard/war/ele)stay same ,condition build isnt a best way to go after patch even it will be a super easy cheese mode. Come on you dont even have same aoe condition perssure as necro and engi.

I’m stil playing skillful CI and shatter build in tpvp for reasons.

Thank you. T__________T This feeling, I don’t know how to describe it….

Fay.2357:

Yeah, I’ll hold my thanks until I see these supposed changes realize in actuality.

^ this.
Even the April 15 changes sounded nice during the announcement…

Well, I think thanks are certainly in order at this point because they are trying to address things that people have pointed out need addressing – iLeap, Warden, and elasticity on staff clone. If someone tries to do something to help you and you say “f-u” until you see if they succeed, you are not really likely to motivate them to continue to try to help you.

I fully grant that if the fixes don’t work, the value of the patch is much lower. Also, it’s possible that some of the changes are going to be OP and that will cause much backlash. But I’ll hold off on drawing conclusions until I see them in the game.

For the moment, I’m having fun doing some theorycrafting which I think is a good sign that the patch contains some material changes. Thx ANet!

eldenbri.1059:

Well, I think thanks are certainly in order at this point because they are trying to address things that people have pointed out need addressing – iLeap, Warden, and elasticity on staff clone. If someone tries to do something to help you and you say “f-u” until you see if they succeed, you are not really likely to motivate them to continue to try to help you.

ANet is not a charity and these people are not unpaid volunteers; they are professionals and we are their customers. I’m not gonna thank them because they tried to fix their product… iWarden has been broken for what, 9 months now? If your mechanic failed to fix your car twice would you thank him if he manages to fix it the third time, 9 months later?

Menaka.5092:

eldenbri.1059:

Well, I think thanks are certainly in order at this point because they are trying to address things that people have pointed out need addressing – iLeap, Warden, and elasticity on staff clone. If someone tries to do something to help you and you say “f-u” until you see if they succeed, you are not really likely to motivate them to continue to try to help you.

ANet is not a charity and these people are not unpaid volunteers; they are professionals and we are their customers. I’m not gonna thank them because they tried to fix their product… iWarden has been broken for what, 9 months now? If your mechanic failed to fix your car twice would you thank him if he manages to fix it the third time, 9 months later?

No, I would quit giving him service, left horrible reviews in every way I could, advised anyone that asked to not go there, and lastly I would have gone to a competent mechanic that would fix the mistakes made by the first one.

I truly don’t understand how people are thinking that fixing what they broke is worth a thanks.

Fay.2357:

Yeah, I’ll hold my thanks until I see these supposed changes realize in actuality.

Im with Pyro on this one. We can talk all we want about things on paper but really its gonna require in game testing to see how good the changes actually are. The only exception to this is the torment on auto which is going to make PU Mesmer broken.

Anyway, its kinda funny pyro how I used to disagree with you way back when and now my opinion is becoming more and more like yours. Just thought about that now :o

Even though they didn’t physically show us that Iwarden is fixed. I believe them whole heartedly and look forward to giving up my days as a interrupt mesmer to becoming the best condi pu clone spamming beast that I can possibly be.
Now, can anyone point out a pretty scepter skin for me?

Dei Veien.2456:

Even though they didn’t physically show us that Iwarden is fixed. I believe them whole heartedly and look forward to giving up my days as a interrupt mesmer to becoming the best condi pu clone spamming beast that I can possibly be.
Now, can anyone point out a pretty scepter skin for me?

Is this even a real question? No matter what case there’s only 1 viable scepter skin Princess wand

Dei Veien.2456:

Even though they didn’t physically show us that Iwarden is fixed. I believe them whole heartedly and look forward to giving up my days as a interrupt mesmer to becoming the best condi pu clone spamming beast that I can possibly be.
Now, can anyone point out a pretty scepter skin for me?

Princess Wand, Immobulus, Lovestruck Scepter, Nightmare Scepter, Peacemaker’s Scepter, Tormented Scepter and Wupwup Wand. This is, of course, assuming you have a color scheme between pink and purple.

the clones giving torment as well is a great idea because it changes how mesmers will play scepter forever. We will rely less on phantasms and more on clones, which is pretty incredible.

however im wait more excited for the mantra of pain change. this has been my secret weapon forever and now im going to … abuse it even more

Hah! Yeah Azure, I hear ya. I love MoP too and I get quite a bit of QQ about it already, now it’s just going to be wholesome clean fun. Let the paper DAoC scrubs cry about Torment on what is still a slow and sub-par weapon, come patch day I don’t think we’ll hear much about this Scepter discussion anymore, but loads of crying about IE, and Mesmers entrance into the ranged AoE spike damage department.

Anyone remember how we easily could stack 20+ bleeds with our Trident AA? I do. Not sure about Anets decision to nerf it, but if this Scepter AA buff sticks more than two months I would like to have my Trident nerf reversed please. Just saying….

Because underwater damage is so important these days?

Actually I seriously love Mesmer underwater, and I love underwater combat. I’m use to MMO’s with flying mechanics and underwater is as close as I can get.

But yes thank you Anet for buffs and bug fixes with no nerfs!
There’s still more work to be done though.

Hi there
I just feel the need to revive this thread so we can warmly show our gratitude for buffing mesmers this patch.

Not sure about u guys but I am happy with most of the changes, especially Anet did deliver in terms of promised bug fixes (cough… iWarden…cough).
Also I can feel much love in the new sexy animation of MoP and MoD. Nicely done.

So thank you Anet.

Yup – definitely want to add my thanks. Only a couple of the changes affected my build, but it’s nice to see all the changes and fixes.

And I love the new combat log – nice work Anet!

Dude. Just the leap change is insane, I’m using sword in all game types and it just changes my life. The warden fix is also welcome after months of inactive phantasms in PvE.

GG Anet.

I like it, also. Unfortunately, there are some mesmers crying about the buff and wanting a nerf, again. Sigh!

What exactly are we supposed to be thanking them for? Fixing weapons that were broken? Weapons that are still weaker than they originally were?

It may be just fixing what was broken, but at least they did that. Still a plus.