Guild Wars 2

Okay so bear with me here, this isn’t an entirely original Idea but after seeing Trigr’s Countless Suicide spec,( https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/mesmer/Guild-Wars-2-Mesmer-Countless-Suicide-Spec/first#post973631 ) I thought to myself.. you know you take it and tweak it a bit and use Scepter You have a crazy clone killing spec.

So pretty much The Idea is the same you want to kill your clones, not shatter them kill them, and Scepter kills clones faster than any other weapon in the game.

So here’s the spec.
10/25/10/0/25

http://www.guildhead.com/skill-calc#mzmMzc0MzMaLrmMbLlmapa0pVzaVcV08kir7khT7khf707khT7khf7kIa70V7ow27ow17ow27ow17ow2

Game play: Much like The Countless Suicide Spec the point of this spec is to get three clones out asap, then start killing them, this is where scepters auto attack is very strong because every third Auto Attack kills a clones applying Cripple, a Random Condition, and Confusion on everything in an PBAoE of the clone. Another benefit of Scepter is that it spawns clones on top of your target not away from. So as clones die and spawn it will be on top of the target.

Now there are 5 floater points in this Build you can pop anywhere you like. I popped mine into Illusions to get the 3 Might on Shatter because while this is mainly a clone kill spec it’s also a confusion based spec, (which IMHO is extremely powerful even in PvE. ) so we will be hitting Cry of Frustration only when we can instantly re-spawn 3 more clones (which is almost on CD. As we can generate clones like crazy.) and 50 more condition damage.

Crit is also important because you still want your clones to apply bleed when they crit and bleed = more condition damage.

Anyways just a Theory craft build not expecting this to be widely received but I’m using it right now and it’s not to shabby, but it offers some options for people sick of phantasm and shatter specs.

-Enjoy
Feel free to add critiques, criticism all that below. Like I said not a perfect build but it’s a lot of fun and does decent damage.

It will kill to slowly in open world imo to replace shatters

it looks like it would be ok for dungeons as a sustained condition damage build, if you can manage to not have your clones killed every half dozen seconds or so when bosses do thier thing. However the clone generation is pretty decent so it shouldnt be an issue, scepter auto attacks are fast so u ought to be able to get some fairly high bleed stacks on your own, with a earth sigil and scepter clones.

Probably dont need mirror for generation, so you can bring utility like phantasmal defender or disenchanter (or in some fights like the fractal squid, bring arcane thievery + sig inspiration for teamwide 25 stacks of might)

I would consider sig of illusions

Looks like a ok build, will have to upgrade my condition set to try it out though.

Open World killing is def a bit slower, but I’m finding that killing ing larger groups is the way to go with it and I still Mind Wrack in the open world just to get things down faster.

Dungeons and WvW is where this build is doing it’s best for me. Scepter could def still use some tweaking on Anets side but hey at least it’s another option for people bored with shatter, or Phantasms., and sick of GS/Staff/ and Sword.

I would probably take sword offhand, 1 for the block (potential free clone also) and 2 the illuision is a short-ish cooldown

nono, its bad, as bad as a weapon can be in this game. BAD. I ran staff/scepter+pistol heavy shatter/condition build and you know what? i never lost a 1vs1 (spvp) BUT does that mean the stupid scepter was useful? NO. Staff/pistol was doing their job and scepter was wasting space.

Eh sounds like you’re condemning without even trying, like I said I realize it’s not a be all end all spec, but it’s not terrible and makes Scepter playable.

I am in no way or shape or form saying Scepter doesn’t need fixed, but this spec makes it playable and not to bad at that.

Seems all well and good if it’s how you want to use your clones in PvE and dungeons but i just don’t see the application or viability of this kind of build in WvW or sPvP at all.

This also seems to be vastly inferior to shatter spamming or outright dps for the following reasons.

Cones do not chase or run unless a target is out of range, meaning that even when said clone gets replaced, it wont apply conditions on anything it isnt close to.

Conditions are very underwhelming on a Mesmer aside from confusion, unless stacked very high. the amount of clone replacement needing to take place in order to keep a large and substantial amount of conditions on a target this way would require some extreme micro management as well as constant vigor. even then, it may still be impossible to do outside of PvE.

Scepters Auto Attack deals very low dmg and clones apply no conditions outside of traited bleeding on a crit.

Players move around a lot, people have finally begun to learn that they need to be moving constantly to be most effective. This means counting on clones dieing close to your target is very very risky.

The Scepter is built to surpress burst classes with a few stacks of confusion as well as generating a slow flow of clones to send in for a shatter, it also comes with a block/blind just in case you need it. This isn’t a condition based weapon, that would be the staff, and honestly the traits based on clone death are more to give your enemies a “ kitten if I do, kitten if I dont” approach to fighting off a phantasm or trying to locate a Mesmer in a cluster of clones.

More power to you for the idea, but it’s not something i would recommend for the majority of Mesmers to use.

I would never run this in any form of pvp, only i a dungeon if i ran it, just for theory to practice sakes

The scepter is so slow I feel like if I want to use it’s full capabilities it’s better to use 2 offhands with only the scepter as the mainhand weapon or the autoattack chain rarely even completes.
I dunnou it’s not a very fun weapon to use as it is.

One thing they could try is replacing the confusion on the third attack to blind. Even if that would require a rework of the block.

Whatever is to happen it is going to have to fall in the guideline of confusion and/or blind. That is the theme of the weapon.

I think the onlly solution that works within their framework will require a percent chance for a condition (blind or confusion) to occur. I would start with %33 chance of 1 confusion on first attack , clone on second , blind on third (unsure of the probability). Cooldown between completion of second attack and cool-off of third should be equal to maintaining the auto-attack , to prevent spamming clones. This change would make scepter clones useful and make scepter desirable for condition specs. The weapon is already an excellent power/crit weapon.

WvW player here.

I used the “on death” traits for my clones a while, but like Swish said, it’s rather unlikely for a clone to explode near anything useful when they get replaced. And even if the enemy actively kills my clones, they do it often from range or with AoE attacks. No “on death” effect applied either.

About scepter clone generation: It looks fast on the first view, but actually I think it’s very slow. One clone every 2 seconds, are you kidding me? A good player will probably dish out 3 clones, shatter, pump out another 3 illus and shatter again, all within only a little more than 2 seconds. That’s how the game is played.

Scepter is okay as a starter weapon for low level mesmers, when you have no traits and not utilities yet to generate your illusions.

I used it again in pvp last night and its apparent that this weapon is just far superior as an offensive power/crit tool than a condition or defensive one. I can appreciate that it fills the roll of single target ranged damage (GS is basically an aoe one), but this class really needs a dedicated “selfish” condition damage weapon (staff is a group oriented weapon)

I was doing 5k on power 3 after a shatter or two finishing with diversion (not counting confusion). Even sword 2 can’t do as much (confusion gives scept the edge).

I would use scepter in this build if every 1 spam spawned a clone. So each hit would be generating aoe conditions which is kind of unique.

So far we’ve heard ANet state they want Scepter to be a defensive weapon. The scepter cooldown reduction trait also points to it being a condition-spec weapon. Scepter fills a hole in the Mesmer’s arsenal of a defensive, 1h’ed ranged weapon, but it is currently very lackluster. The changes are simple:

-Further adjustments to auto-attack speed (e.g. similar to Necro’s scepter auto-attack). The issue is the link between waiting for the projectile to hit the enemy before the start of the next attack in the chain, so you can either make it instant (like the Necro’s) or further increase projectile speed. The Scepter needs a strong auto-attack because its other skills are very situational.

-Add confusion to first 2 attacks chains to make it a true condition damage weapon and reduce direct damage to balance it out. Currently Scepter is actually a much stronger power-based weapon than a condition one.

-Change Scepter 2 skill to a defensive skill that synergizes with Scepter 3. For example an instant cast shield that blocks the next attack and Blinds the target when you’re struck (and perhaps a small AoE blind centered around the Mesmer if nobody strikes you after X secs). The Scepter 3 skill is nearly unusable in PvP in its current state due to being so easily interrupted and such a change will enhance the usability of both skills.

-Scepter 3 should have a cripple attached to it. It is way to easy to LoS/out-of-range the skill currently. Reduce it’s direct damage as necessary.

Thing is with scepter1, continuously landing a full auto-attack chain is impossible. It is extremely unreliable.

Only high HP mobs like bosses and champions, or very stupid players, will stand still and live long enough for scepter auto attack in a build like this to actually be effective.

In most cases you are much better off just actually killing quickly with a decent build.

I rarely ever get to cast Ether Clone with the sceptre, be it PVE or WvW, unless I’m feeling particularly lazy. For me the Mesmer sceptre shines with Illusionary Counter/Counterspell and Confusing Images. By the time I’m done casting both (and Phantasmal Duelist), I’d have swapped to my second weapon set, Shatter and sit on 12 stacks of Might.

Even with Debilitating Dissipation, the rate of Clone generation with the Sceptre Chain is way too slow. Even if you sit and spam #1, it takes 2 seconds to generate a Clone. Upon Clone death, you’re not even guaranteed to get the 3x Bleed stack. Confusing Combatants? That single Confusion stack lasts for 3 seconds. That’s, on average, 1 PVE mob attack or approximately 700 damage on a player from 2 skills.

Skyro.3108:

So far we’ve heard ANet state they want Scepter to be a defensive weapon. The scepter cooldown reduction trait also points to it being a condition-spec weapon. Scepter fills a hole in the Mesmer’s arsenal of a defensive, 1h’ed ranged weapon, but it is currently very lackluster. The changes are simple:

-Further adjustments to auto-attack speed (e.g. similar to Necro’s scepter auto-attack). The issue is the link between waiting for the projectile to hit the enemy before the start of the next attack in the chain, so you can either make it instant (like the Necro’s) or further increase projectile speed. The Scepter needs a strong auto-attack because its other skills are very situational.

-Add confusion to first 2 attacks chains to make it a true condition damage weapon and reduce direct damage to balance it out. Currently Scepter is actually a much stronger power-based weapon than a condition one.

-Change Scepter 2 skill to a defensive skill that synergizes with Scepter 3. For example an instant cast shield that blocks the next attack and Blinds the target when you’re struck (and perhaps a small AoE blind centered around the Mesmer if nobody strikes you after X secs). The Scepter 3 skill is nearly unusable in PvP in its current state due to being so easily interrupted and such a change will enhance the usability of both skills.

-Scepter 3 should have a cripple attached to it. It is way to easy to LoS/out-of-range the skill currently. Reduce it’s direct damage as necessary.

All of those idea sound wonderful. The only time scepter was ever good was when it had confusion on its auto attack but then it was removed.

How to fix Scepter:
1) Change the #1 attack to be a single attack that has a 33% chance to apply a stack of confusion, 33% chance to generate a clone at the target, and a 33% chance to only do damage.
2) Change the #2 ability to not only produce a clone, but also teleport you away from the attacker.
3) Change the #3 ability to be a (3x) bouncing attack that applies 3 stacks of confusion to a target per bounce.

How to fix Staff:
1) Replace #1 Vulnerability with Poison.

scepter 1 should be replaced with winds of chaos, scepter 2 should be changed to grant aegis for 3 seconds and spawn a clone at the target – and be on 4 second cooldown.

There, scepter fixed and properly established as a condition bunkering weapon.

Taldren.7523:

How to fix Scepter:
1) Change the #1 attack to be a single attack that has a 33% chance to apply a stack of confusion, 33% chance to generate a clone at the target, and a 33% chance to only do damage.
2) Change the #2 ability to not only produce a clone, but also teleport you away from the attacker.
3) Change the #3 ability to be a (3x) bouncing attack that applies 3 stacks of confusion to a target per bounce.

How to fix Staff:
1) Replace #1 Vulnerability with Poison.

Sorry to say it so brutally but these are no fixes but how to make our weapons OP. (Seriously the staff is one of the best weapons of the game)

The scepter need a single change on either #1 #2 or #3 to do okay. Stop daydreaming guys. The devs need to keep the game balanced.

Animando.7956:

Taldren.7523:

How to fix Scepter:
1) Change the #1 attack to be a single attack that has a 33% chance to apply a stack of confusion, 33% chance to generate a clone at the target, and a 33% chance to only do damage.
2) Change the #2 ability to not only produce a clone, but also teleport you away from the attacker.
3) Change the #3 ability to be a (3x) bouncing attack that applies 3 stacks of confusion to a target per bounce.

How to fix Staff:
1) Replace #1 Vulnerability with Poison.

Sorry to say it so brutally but these are no fixes but how to make our weapons OP. (Seriously the staff is one of the best weapons of the game)

The scepter need a single change on either #1 #2 or #3 to do okay. Stop daydreaming guys. The devs need to keep the game balanced.

It’s not brutal mate … its ignorant, sorry to say.

1. Our current scepter #1 is 3 attacks that summons a clone on the 3rd attack (33%) and is supposed to apply a stack of confusion (33%), but is currently bugged. It isn’t mathematically any different to do a single attack with a 1/3 chance of each possibility.

2. Are you saying that Staff #2 is overpowered? Because that creates a clone and teleports you away from the attacker in addition to breaking stun.

3. Currently this applies 5 stacks of confusion over 5 seconds to a single target. How is applying 3 – 6 stacks to a target OP with a non-channel attack??

I really don’t know why people jump on the “OP” label without actually thinking things through before they speak.

Any ‘fix’ likely has to maintain scepter as a power/crit option.

Make Scepter #1 a physical projectile.

They’re woefully lacking, and it opens up the option to flesh out #1 via the rest of your build with combo fields (or allies’) and not just having it do it on its own.

Taldren.7523:

1. Our current scepter #1 is 3 attacks that summons a clone on the 3rd attack (33%) and is supposed to apply a stack of confusion (33%), but is currently bugged. It isn’t mathematically any different to do a single attack with a 1/3 chance of each possibility.

2. Are you saying that Staff #2 is overpowered? Because that creates a clone and teleports you away from the attacker in addition to breaking stun.

3. Currently this applies 5 stacks of confusion over 5 seconds to a single target. How is applying 3 – 6 stacks to a target OP with a non-channel attack??

I really don’t know why people jump on the “OP” label without actually thinking things through before they speak.

1. The tooltip wasn’t changed since they removed the confusion from the clones. Nearly 30% of the tooltips are bugged in this game. Never heard the devs actually want the auto-attack to cause confusion (directly or through the clones).
2. There is a little difference between TP+clone generation and TP+clone+block+damage. And #2 is the only clone generator of the staff.
3. Channeling is a big downside. Removing it allows you to block the next attack meaning you can benefit from the confusion without getting hit.

I did not say your ideas were bad. I like them and wish they would be implemented. I only think that if every skills of the scepter get a buff, then the weapon would be OP. (Perma confusion in PVP). I’d love it since I play mesmer but I’m just being realist: it’d be good to get any buff (and it’d be only one skill, I don’t believe the devs would do more).

Animando.7956:

Taldren.7523:

1. Our current scepter #1 is 3 attacks that summons a clone on the 3rd attack (33%) and is supposed to apply a stack of confusion (33%), but is currently bugged. It isn’t mathematically any different to do a single attack with a 1/3 chance of each possibility.

2. Are you saying that Staff #2 is overpowered? Because that creates a clone and teleports you away from the attacker in addition to breaking stun.

3. Currently this applies 5 stacks of confusion over 5 seconds to a single target. How is applying 3 – 6 stacks to a target OP with a non-channel attack??

I really don’t know why people jump on the “OP” label without actually thinking things through before they speak.

1. The tooltip wasn’t changed since they removed the confusion from the clones. Nearly 30% of the tooltips are bugged in this game. Never heard the devs actually want the auto-attack to cause confusion (directly or through the clones).
2. There is a little difference between TP+clone generation and TP+clone+block+damage. And #2 is the only clone generator of the staff.
3. Channeling is a big downside. Removing it allows you to block the next attack meaning you can benefit from the confusion without getting hit.

I did not say your ideas were bad. I like them and wish they would be implemented. I only think that if every skills of the scepter get a buff, then the weapon would be OP. (Perma confusion in PVP). I’d love it since I play mesmer but I’m just being realist: it’d be good to get any buff (and it’d be only one skill, I don’t believe the devs would do more).

1. I was in Alpha when they made the change … the change was that the Scepter clone’s Ether Bolt would no longer provide confusion. (That was OP) There was no note anywhere saying that Scepter 1 was supposed to be changed. As such, it is a bug until clarified or fixed.
2. Its Stun Break+TP+Clone vs Block+TP+Clone as you can’t use a channel during a stun. The damage to be removed for as little as it does in the condition builds that actually use scepter.
3. Channel has both benefits and drawbacks all to itself. You can’t just push the negatives and say that not being channeled is a pure benefit. The reason to go with a bounce is to provide scepter with some form of AE as it is the only MH weapon the mesmer has without one.

As you can see … OP this isn’t once you apply reason. It isn’t any more powerful than the current scepter … just a lot more reliable and useful.