Even with all the “nerfs” i still feel the tankiest. When I did 4 dungeons today I was the only one standing a number of times kiting legendary bosses while my party was running from the WP all the way at the entrance of the dungeon. I have absolutely 0 traits in tough/vit and my HP with my GS is around 18.7k But i still feel the most survivable. My build is exactly the same now as nerf.
I dont see the problem fellow memsers have with the shatter GCD. It’s there to prevent an exploit and rightly so. 0.25sec is nothing. It’s less than it takes you to create a new batch of illusions for another shatter.
It was never ment to work as it did, it was a bug getting exploited so it needed a fix.
I dont see the problem fellow memsers have with the shatter GCD. It’s there to prevent an exploit and rightly so. 0.25sec is nothing. It’s less than it takes you to create a new batch of illusions for another shatter.
It was never ment to work as it did, it was a bug getting exploited so it needed a fix.
It’s a band aid patch (even the devs have said so) which is meant to only be temporary. People who use iPersona are probably the ones most affected since there a several occasions when you might want a quick daze or distort to save you from an incoming burst right after you’ve used another skill. It’s not a big issue for lot of player but there are also several situations where it can literally be a matter of life or death for your character.
Sure its only temorary? I do not like the patch but i can understand why they had to do it. I hope this will be really fixed soon, instead of putting on such CD.
“oh, so i kitten in my pants or take the panalty”.
The .25 sec gcd isn’t going to effect your survivability at all. Every skill in the game has a .25 sec activation time or more, correct? This means if your not rolling your face on F1-F4 then you should notice a target is about to attack you. Use your F3 then give yourself 1 sec to do whatever you want. That means you can activate every shatter and still have .25 sec left to spare.
On another note, with our damage potential we should not be able to absolutely counter and shut down any target without needing to set it up or pay attention. As it is right now, If my target is not a bunker and I have all my shatters up, as soon as I engage them I can kill them in around 2 seconds or less while being immune to dmg and cc. If they are a bunker they now have 6 stacks of confusion on them and I still have defensive utilities. If I so choose I can do it from stealth and the target cant even react for 1 sec.
In my opinion we are still the best pvp class in the game. If played right we are the hardest class to track. We have some of the fastest activating burst. We even have short cd pets that do kitten damage and track targets. Even if they don’t get to their target because they are being focused, they are still used to make your target put damage on them instead of yourself.
All 100% behind the change, obvious fix for obvious broken mechanic. Will be much less whining about mesmers in other threads of other classes now
If you think that anything short of Anet turning Mesmers into the worst pvp profession in the game will stop other classes from complaining, you are in a dream world.
All 100% behind the change, obvious fix for obvious broken mechanic. Will be much less whining about mesmers in other threads of other classes now
If you think that anything short of Anet turning Mesmers into the worst pvp profession in the game will stop other classes from complaining, you are in a dream world.
Not true, I think they should be one of the best PvP professions, just like in GW1. However, mesmers are one of the best PvP professions and you don’t need an obviously broken mechanic to win.
^ We are still amazing at PvP. I fought 1 guardian/1thief/and I think a warrior and stomped all but 1 of them I think in WvW. The fight was so close to their WP that I couldn’t tell if it was them coming back or more people coming.
All 100% behind the change, obvious fix for obvious broken mechanic. Will be much less whining about mesmers in other threads of other classes now
If you think that anything short of Anet turning Mesmers into the worst pvp profession in the game will stop other classes from complaining, you are in a dream world.
Not true, I think they should be one of the best PvP professions, just like in GW1. However, mesmers are one of the best PvP professions and you don’t need an obviously broken mechanic to win.
I think they should be too.
But as long as they’re even somewhat competent, people are going to kitten about mesmers until the end of ArenaNet’s servers, and probably years afterwards while recounting GW2.
I think the consensus here has been that no one’s upset that the broken mechanic was “fixed” (We’ll say ‘fixed’ because the truth is a whole other post), we’re just upset that they fixed it the way they did and that they coupled that hindering fix with a nerf.
Now, I knew Shattered Strength was going to be nerfed, but I had hoped the devs would see to some sort of compromise and give us 2 stacks of Might.
I, at least, would have not posted a single time in complaint were that the case.
3 stacks of Might it was so easy to hit 25, I’m really good at shatter rotations so mine just shot the kitten up.
I stopped playing this game with my guild after it was decided that phantasms must have a delay before attacking on top of also requiring line-of-sight to even spawn (GG), and we each have over 1,000 hours clocked in the original Guild Wars (an example of an actually good MMORPG). It’s pretty sad considering the majority of us beta-tested this game too. We had such high hopes… and now we just play Battlefield 3. If this is what MMORPGs have become, then we’re not wasting our time anymore.
Anyone who says Zerk is the average Joe build is an average Joe.
Ah, it seems like you are slightly mistaken on how this mechanic works. Allow me to explain it more precisely.
If you have 3 clones out, and use a shatter, these clones effectively no longer exist. The three dots on the gui will still be filled, but you can spawn more clones immediately without causing the older clones to be overwritten (they would immediately die in that case). Basically what it does is that when you use a shatter, your clones become a living projectile attack, no longer permanent creations on the battlefield, but another guided attack heading your way, freeing up the slots for more clones to be created.
With the bug, this transformation of current clones into guided missiles was not done completely, and so the guided missiles got double-loaded when mind wrack was used immediately after the first shatter, as if someone reached into the missile, and added an extra stack of C4 to the payload. The only thing that needed fixing was preventing this extra loading from occurring. Everything else about this mechanic worked perfectly.
Ohh, I see now. That makes sense.
I can’t really say much more about it then. Hopefully devs can explain what was the intention of the .25s cooldown (maybe having the possibility of too many clones exploding nearly at once was too much and needed a short cooldown?).
With a cooldown this short, I’m betting it’s a latency issue. Probably they want to make sure that the server has a chance to mark the clones before another shatter occurs.
Anything I post is just the opinion of a very vocal minority of 1.
But as long as they’re even somewhat competent, people are going to kitten about mesmers until the end of ArenaNet’s servers, and probably years afterwards while recounting GW2.
I think the consensus here has been that no one’s upset that the broken mechanic was “fixed” (We’ll say ‘fixed’ because the truth is a whole other post), we’re just upset that they fixed it the way they did and that they coupled that hindering fix with a nerf.
I see what you’re saying. I don’t play a mesmer though and my point was that as a non-mesmer I think mesmers should be very good in PvP.
Right now I think ANet is only concerning themselves with fixing the major issues that they see in sPvP. This is because they’re working on getting the game ready for tournaments. So we’re going to see a lot of changes like this that combine nerfs and fixes. I’m guessing here, but based on my experience with GW1 (baring emergency imbalance issues) this is what I suspect will happen with the metagame balancing…
STAGE 1 (this year)
The warrior will be slowly buffed up for sPvP and nerfed in PvE.
The mesmer and thief will be nerfed and nerfed in sPvP (and PvE) until they think and/or their data shows that the warrior is competitive with them. (So brace yourselves for more incoming nerfs/fixes/tweaks.)
The elementalist will receive continual minor buffs/changes intended for sPvP balance.
The guardian is a wild card and I have no idea what ANet will do with them. They seem to like them as they are.
All of the other professions will receive mostly minor “testing” changes and data/feedback will be collected. Mostly though ANet will ignore them in favor of not making any changes that break sPvP balance.
STAGE 2 (six months to a year)
Thieves and mesmers will get small sPvP tweaks because ANet over-nerfed them a little. They will get bigger buffs for PvE because all of the changes for sPvP have made them even less effective in PvE.
Warriors and Elementalists will have only minor sPvP tweaks and probably a few PvE nerfs.
The guardian is still a wild card and I have no idea what ANet will do with them. They seem to like them as they are.
The other professions will receive somewhat drastic changes based on the small changes/tests made previously.
STAGE 3 (one to two years)
Minor tweaks/emergency imbalance tweaks for the warrior, thief, mesmer.
The guardian is still a wild card and I have no idea what ANet will do with them. They seem to like them as they are.
Any of the other professions that are doing okay after a few significant buffs will continue to see balance and class concept tweaks (probably necro and ranger).
Any of the other professions that are not doing well will have major overhauls (I’m guessing engineer will fall into this category since it seems to be the dervish of GW2).
Like I said, this is all only a guess based on what happened during GW1. So far the metagame balancing seems to be following the exact same trend though. So, I think even if it isn’t exactly right it’s going to be close. Maybe somebody who knows more about sPvP than I do will say otherwise though.
Well I just wish they would split the tweaks between pvp and pve they did it for thieves why not mesmer? On a brighter note… I was running WvW with a staff ele and it took a Magumma ranger, engineer, and a d/d ele to bring me down after the staff ele was killed. lol… so we are still good… but I hope the nerf bat is not swung to hard core plus how are we not competitive against warriors? THEY FREAKING insta down me… soooo really?
But seriously, warriors are kind of meh in tPvP. Which will be the metering stick for ANet. They’re better now than they were and they’ll get better still. ANet has stated they like where the warrior is. And I think they base a lot of their metrics on how many people play what profession. Those two things make me think that the mesmer, thief and guardian will be the nerfed classes. I could be wrong though.
Update hurt a little, having more trouble tagging mobs with MF gear even though that’s ok I don’t need gold xD. But seriously I find it redundant in the sake of PvP balance because I’m only really noticing it vs Rangers and cantrip d/d eles…
Condi ranger will have regular conditions that are really hard to remove with one condi remover even if I can get him really low and have a downed fight (with all/most shatters hitting), as to before where if he did not doge my shatters, he would die.
and Ele healing is just to strong… burst them down to a sliver and they heal to full in 5 seconds while no our C/Ds it’s like a guardian with perma book, they may take hits hard but that last little bit to keep them down is such a struggle to get. (spent 3 rounds dueling an ele and first 2 matches no one downed until last 3 min on 3rd map)
And everyone else who complained about mesmer burst still complains. So unless A-net is trying to force cantrip and condi rangers to be a soft counter to shatter it’s kind of redundant.
“I control time and space; you can’t break free.~” “Maybe I was the illusion all along!”
ANet doesn’t just nerf things because people complain about them. They rely heavily on metrics. Too heavily if you ask me.
I wish that were true but unfortunately that does not seem to be the case.
As for new thoughts on this topic, I’ve gotten used to the GCD though I by no means am happy with it, I am however willing to live with in the hopes that it is a temporary fix as we have been told. I just hope this isn’t one of those temp fixes that gets forgotten about.
What did ANet nerf solely because people complained about it? And what makes you think that they’ve done this? They’ve always stated that they rely heavily on metrics to determine what they do and do not change in the metagame. And since a lot of their changes don’t make any sense to me and/or are not a great source of complaint on the forums I’m assuming they are seeing things in the metrics. It’s possible I’m wrong and they don’t care about metrics any more but I doubt it.
I come to the mesmer thread to get a good laugh every now and then. Complaining about the little mesmer nerfs is like listening to a rich person complain about how their Hennessey Venom didn’t come in yellow. These nerfs are the “first world problems” of GW2.
I love my mesmer and I am still killing every glass cannon in 2 seconds or less. Every good player running a balanced build only takes around 5 seconds. I cant think of one class or set up I cant beat unless i do something stupid. I cant say the same on my engi and my ranger. Although my d/d ele never dies he certainly cant kill another d/d ele. It would just be an eternal battle (or any well played bunker).
We have it so good as mesmers. Whenever I want to utterly destroy people I get on my mesmer. When I want to actually have to try and use skill I get on my engi. When I want to be extremely annoying I play my ele and proceed to initiate fights with 10 people then make them chase me in circles while I laugh my kitten off. The only class that does as much damage as us and as quick is a thief and they are the easiest class to counter next to d/d ele.
I come to the mesmer thread to get a good laugh every now and then. Complaining about the little mesmer nerfs is like listening to a rich person complain about how their Hennessey Venom didn’t come in yellow. These nerfs are the “first world problems” of GW2.
I love my mesmer and I am still killing every glass cannon in 2 seconds or less. Every good player running a balanced build only takes around 5 seconds. I cant think of one class or set up I cant beat unless i do something stupid. I cant say the same on my engi and my ranger. Although my d/d ele never dies he certainly cant kill another d/d ele. It would just be an eternal battle (or any well played bunker).
We have it so good as mesmers. Whenever I want to utterly destroy people I get on my mesmer. When I want to actually have to try and use skill I get on my engi. When I want to be extremely annoying I play my ele and proceed to initiate fights with 10 people then make them chase me in circles while I laugh my kitten off. The only class that does as much damage as us and as quick is a thief and they are the easiest class to counter next to d/d ele.
Oh look another PvP player who thinks his is the only mode that matters.
Oh look another PvP player who thinks his is the only mode that matters.
First off I never mentioned pve because its a non issue unless your still gearing for wvw. If you are just one of those players that likes to just run fractals and random dungeons for fun, well then your in luck because time warp gets you into any group you want.
I have never been denied a spot on my mesmer and wvw damage does equate to pve damage. I do 2x the damage output than my engi/ele and if i want to roll support I can run in my clerics gear and provide 3k aoe heals every 4 seconds an 310 heals a tick from my phantasms regen. At the same time I can have warlocks up hitting for 5k or more depending on how many people put conditions up in that party. I would also have room to share boons like my might from weapon swapping.
If your crying about aoe damage, I am perfectly fine with my 7k shatters and sword damage.
Oh look another PvP player who thinks his is the only mode that matters.
First off I never mentioned pve because its a non issue unless your still gearing for wvw.
Typical elitist PvP player response. Funny thing is the PvP players are the worst in the game because they refuse to learn how to use the game mechanics or counter things.
I love how you partial quote me when I actually break down how we are useful and good in pve. Its a non issue because there is no end game pve and there are no real boss mechanics. There just high hp mobs with easy to counter mechanics. Pvp players would be the best type of players imo because they actually have to counter someone that isnt programmed to follow a set pattern that is easily learned after the first encounter…
Btw this typical pvp elitist does pve every day with his guild.
I love how you partial quote me when I actually break down how we are useful and good in pve. Its a non issue because there is no end game pve and there are no real boss mechanics. There just high hp mobs with easy to counter mechanics. Pvp players would be the best type of players imo because they actually have to counter someone that isnt programmed to follow a set pattern that is easily learned after the first encounter…
Btw this typical pvp elitist does pve every day with his guild.
Yeah man, completely 100% exploration of the world isn’t mandatory to make a legendary or anything.
PvP players being better would normally apply but the players in GW2 just don’t want to learn how the game works, they don’t want to dodge, they don’t want to kill illusions, in fact they hate it when damage comes from any kind of pet hence why Rangers are now being called OP even though they are the least viable in PvP. And most of all they don’t want to learn what other classes can do and how to counter them. PvE monsters can deal with shatter Mesmers, PvPers can’t figure it out.
I love how you partial quote me when I actually break down how we are useful and good in pve. Its a non issue because there is no end game pve and there are no real boss mechanics. There just high hp mobs with easy to counter mechanics. Pvp players would be the best type of players imo because they actually have to counter someone that isnt programmed to follow a set pattern that is easily learned after the first encounter…
Btw this typical pvp elitist does pve every day with his guild.
Yeah man, completely 100% exploration of the world isn’t mandatory to make a legendary or anything.
PvP players being better would normally apply but the players in GW2 just don’t want to learn how the game works, they don’t want to dodge, they don’t want to kill illusions, in fact they hate it when damage comes from any kind of pet hence why Rangers are now being called OP even though they are the least viable in PvP. And most of all they don’t want to learn what other classes can do and how to counter them. PvE monsters can deal with shatter Mesmers, PvPers can’t figure it out.
Are you quoting me by accident? I don’t understand how world exploration was affected by the new update that this thread was discussing. The nerf to shattered strength didn’t kill your exploration ability and neither did the .25 second gcd on shatters. I pointed out how our pve damage is still really good. Our might stacking isn’t stupid op anymore but we did keep our stack duration which was buffed in a previous patch. The .25 gcd doesn’t effect pve since pve monsters skill activation time is at 1/2 a sec or above so you can get 2 shatters off to prepare or stop a skill.
If your going to complain about the lack of perma swiftness then I will suggest you grab a cheap mf set for exploring and throw some runes of the centaur in them. Use mantra heal and profit from perma swiftness.
Your spiel about pvpers in GW2 really shows me your just here to complain. Your statement basically says everyone who pvps in GW2 is bad and doesn’t understand game mechanics. You should try explaining to Osicat how he is bad and doesn’t understand game mechanics (since he pvps). I would like to see how you manage to explain that one seeing as he is a respected mesmer and does guides and videos to explain mechanics and builds. I am sure instead of doing that you will just change your statement to say, “well only most pvpers are bad is what I meant”. You still wont have facts to back this up though.
On the ranger pets being op topic, I cant seem to find any threads taken seriously with complaints about rangers. That would be just as funny as someone complaining about how op engi is.
Lets face the facts. Mesmer is hands down the best class in the game at the moment in pve and pvp. We provide great support while still dishing out great damage (if your in the proper gear and spec) in pve and pvp. We are always excepted into groups for runs, when engis, thieves and sometimes rangers are not. We have amazing escape ability. If speced properly we can heal uninterrupted 3700+ (full clerics with phantasm can net around 4000) hp every 4 seconds. Guardians cant even do that constantly and neither can an ele so that makes us the highest heal per min in the game. On top of that you can spec shatters to heal you an extra 1000 if you need it. We can spec to do around 17k+ burst instantly without running around with 10k-12k health (like a thief). We have multiple ways to stealth, reflect and go immune. We have the best reliable means of stacking confusion. I mean seriously what else do you want for us?
I love how you partial quote me when I actually break down how we are useful and good in pve. Its a non issue because there is no end game pve and there are no real boss mechanics. There just high hp mobs with easy to counter mechanics. Pvp players would be the best type of players imo because they actually have to counter someone that isnt programmed to follow a set pattern that is easily learned after the first encounter…
Btw this typical pvp elitist does pve every day with his guild.
Yeah man, completely 100% exploration of the world isn’t mandatory to make a legendary or anything.
PvP players being better would normally apply but the players in GW2 just don’t want to learn how the game works, they don’t want to dodge, they don’t want to kill illusions, in fact they hate it when damage comes from any kind of pet hence why Rangers are now being called OP even though they are the least viable in PvP. And most of all they don’t want to learn what other classes can do and how to counter them. PvE monsters can deal with shatter Mesmers, PvPers can’t figure it out.
Are you quoting me by accident? I don’t understand how world exploration was affected by the new update that this thread was discussing. The nerf to shattered strength didn’t kill your exploration ability and neither did the .25 second gcd on shatters. I pointed out how our pve damage is still really good. Our might stacking isn’t stupid op anymore but we did keep our stack duration which was buffed in a previous patch. The .25 gcd doesn’t effect pve since pve monsters skill activation time is at 1/2 a sec or above so you can get 2 shatters off to prepare or stop a skill.
If your going to complain about the lack of perma swiftness then I will suggest you grab a cheap mf set for exploring and throw some runes of the centaur in them. Use mantra heal and profit from perma swiftness.
Your spiel about pvpers in GW2 really shows me your just here to complain. Your statement basically says everyone who pvps in GW2 is bad and doesn’t understand game mechanics. You should try explaining to Osicat how he is bad and doesn’t understand game mechanics (since he pvps). I would like to see how you manage to explain that one seeing as he is a respected mesmer and does guides and videos to explain mechanics and builds. I am sure instead of doing that you will just change your statement to say, “well only most pvpers are bad is what I meant”. You still wont have facts to back this up though.
On the ranger pets being op topic, I cant seem to find any threads taken seriously with complaints about rangers. That would be just as funny as someone complaining about how op engi is.
Lets face the facts. Mesmer is hands down the best class in the game at the moment in pve and pvp. We provide great support while still dishing out great damage (if your in the proper gear and spec) in pve and pvp. We are always excepted into groups for runs, when engis, thieves and sometimes rangers are not. We have amazing escape ability. If speced properly we can heal uninterrupted 3700+ (full clerics with phantasm can net around 4000) hp every 4 seconds. Guardians cant even do that constantly and neither can an ele so that makes us the highest heal per min in the game. On top of that you can spec shatters to heal you an extra 1000 if you need it. We can spec to do around 17k+ burst instantly without running around with 10k-12k health (like a thief). We have multiple ways to stealth, reflect and go immune. We have the best reliable means of stacking confusion. I mean seriously what else do you want for us?
All I want is for changes that come about because of people that call for nerfs on the sPvP thread or the “hardcore” tPvPers who pay because there are so many ask that the change be split between PvP and PvE that way the game experience FOR THE MAJORITY OF THE PLAYERBASE is not ruined…
I’m not going to bother to reply to that YourOwnFear. You are just choosing to purposefully ‘miss understand’ what I am saying and out right lying. I couldn’t even finish reading all that.
I’m not going to bother to reply to that YourOwnFear. You are just choosing to purposefully ‘miss understand’ what I am saying and out right lying. I couldn’t even finish reading all that.
I didn’t misunderstand any of what you said. What did I out right lie about? I don’t blame you for not finishing reading. I wouldn’t want to come to grips with being utterly torn apart in every part of my argument either. I am also glad you actually provide so much information in your posts so we can actually debate some “issues” with mesmers.
If your honestly having problems then you should post exactly what aspect you are having problems with because it seems to me that you honestly don’t know how to use a mesmer to its full potential.
