Guild Wars 2

Xeph.4513:

Yet again; Ranger and Engi use projectiles and that’s why their aoe cleaves can be countered easily, mesmers are using a beam attack which goes through any anti projectile abilities etc.

Yet again? You never made any mention of Ranger/Engi projectiles. What are you reiterating?

Being a beam attack also means it doesn’t pierce past your target, making it a more difficult AoE to utilize while still being just as easy to avoid by virtue of taking a single step to the side. When attempting to use a line attack from range every step they take is several you have to make to realign the attack.

There is also the whole not a projectile finisher aspect too. There are many factors that go into it, and yet none of those change that it’s easily the most limited and hardest to control AoE in the game, requiring not only a straight line but specific targeting to utilize. That’s a far cry from the one man army death ray you are making it out to be, to such an extent that you would declare the need for a nerf to an underwhelming base mechanic without giving due consideration to the fact that its the build that makes the mechanic worthwhile.

P.S. While I do think you overreacted before considering all of the aspects and ANet’s “it’s something to watch” approach is better, I do want to thank you for hopping in to defend your opinions.

Xeph.4513:

Hello;
Firstly I would like to make one thing clear, I never said that shatter damage was over the top, I merely stated that I think that as it is right now shatter does too much, and in conjuction with the new saptial surge buffs it could very well push things over the edge.

I also want to clarify that I understand a lot about the mesmer 20 20 0 0 30 build; I have played the build since beta weekends.

The thing is if the saptial surge changes go in, as karl explained it to be, then it would be very “OP”, firstly the beam would be cleaving all 3 targets for the same amount of damage, in addition to the greatswords ability to spawn illusions ontop of the target, this could create immense cleaving potential. (Mind you I am only talking about Spvp here and nothing to do with wvw or pve)
These changes would force every Spvp team to focus the mesmer first, because rezzing with a gs mesmer standing around would not be an option anymore. Simply spamming GS 1, Mirror blade, berserker and Mindwrack means that people will be taking immense damage, having their boons ripped off and taking confusion damage, including the constant damage they would be taking from the mesmer who will be standing at 1000-900 range.

This is why I believe in order for those changes to go through then shatter should be looked at, at least moving the shatter removes boons into the grandmaster tree. Otherwise things will get stupid very very fast.

Also I am sorry if people are upset about how we articulate our questions, but we are also under heavy time constraints during the show, and don’t have the time to express ourselves aswell as we would like.

Thank you.

I think the shattering removing boons would being moved up to GM would be great… Then we can get HM down from grandmaster… That kills two birds with one stone don’t you think? They said they want to make mantras stronger/more popular… Changing the tree it is in would be a very good thing… And this would also keep people having to choose either GS training or HM… There by making GS not be the first choice people go to if they want to run a mantra build… Just a thought… And I think this is why so many people don’t go up to mantras because 30 points for HM is just a little too much and not getting a lot.

And also I am very concerned about the bugs that could accompany these changes… Just look at the last change they made… They messed around with the torch and the GS phantasm became buggy… The patch didn’t even touch the GS… So that is another HUGE concern for many of us here because every patch we login and its like a box of chocolates “Patch notes say this… but WHAT REALLY HAPPENED?” Is what goes through many peoples mind.

As Mesmer, my Concern is, I feel Persecuted and Brutally targeted for being a Mesmer class. Nearly every patch that are released, we get Onslaught of Nerfs, and more Nerfs.
Why so harsh to us? When will you ever be Satisfied with us? How much more Pain must we Endure? When will the Torment End? Haven’t we Suffered enough?

Dastion.3106:

Xeph.4513:

Yet again; Ranger and Engi use projectiles and that’s why their aoe cleaves can be countered easily, mesmers are using a beam attack which goes through any anti projectile abilities etc.

Yet again? You never made any mention of Ranger/Engi projectiles. What are you reiterating?

Being a beam attack also means it doesn’t pierce past your target, making it a more difficult AoE to utilize while still being just as easy to avoid by virtue of taking a single step to the side. When attempting to use a line attack from range every step they take is several you have to make to realign the attack.

There is also the whole not a projectile finisher aspect too. There are many factors that go into it, and yet none of those change that it’s easily the most limited and hardest to control AoE in the game, requiring not only a straight line but specific targeting to utilize. That’s a far cry from the one man army death ray you are making it out to be, to such an extent that you would declare the need for a nerf to an underwhelming base mechanic without giving due consideration to the fact that its the build that makes the mechanic worthwhile.

P.S. While I do think you overreacted before considering all of the aspects and ANet’s “it’s something to watch” approach is better, I do want to thank you for hopping in to defend your opinions.

I have mentioned it several times, and it has been on the pvp forums before; regardless its not about side stepping it, its when a target is downed that cleave damage really shines and its very simple to target the downed enemy and move in any direction for the desired effect. Also the problem isn’t with aiming the beam attack, since anyone running in the direction of the beam will be cleaved since its a constant attack.
Its far superior to projectile cleave, also we get the pierce for free whilst rangers and engineers need to trait for it.

I love the suggestion about bringing HM down, and moving shatter removes boons up.

Xeph.4513:

Dastion.3106:

Xeph.4513:

Yet again; Ranger and Engi use projectiles and that’s why their aoe cleaves can be countered easily, mesmers are using a beam attack which goes through any anti projectile abilities etc.

Yet again? You never made any mention of Ranger/Engi projectiles. What are you reiterating?

Being a beam attack also means it doesn’t pierce past your target, making it a more difficult AoE to utilize while still being just as easy to avoid by virtue of taking a single step to the side. When attempting to use a line attack from range every step they take is several you have to make to realign the attack.

There is also the whole not a projectile finisher aspect too. There are many factors that go into it, and yet none of those change that it’s easily the most limited and hardest to control AoE in the game, requiring not only a straight line but specific targeting to utilize. That’s a far cry from the one man army death ray you are making it out to be, to such an extent that you would declare the need for a nerf to an underwhelming base mechanic without giving due consideration to the fact that its the build that makes the mechanic worthwhile.

P.S. While I do think you overreacted before considering all of the aspects and ANet’s “it’s something to watch” approach is better, I do want to thank you for hopping in to defend your opinions.

I have mentioned it several times, and it has been on the pvp forums before; regardless its not about side stepping it, its when a target is downed that cleave damage really shines and its very simple to target the downed enemy and move in any direction for the desired effect. Also the problem isn’t with aiming the beam attack, since anyone running in the direction of the beam will be cleaved since its a constant attack.
Its far superior to projectile cleave, also we get the pierce for free whilst rangers and engineers need to trait for it.

I love the suggestion about bringing HM down, and moving shatter removes boons up.

I think that move alone would really allow much more build diversity… Sure right now we can go all out in a 30/30/0/0/10 Mantra build… But there goes all survivability because we have no illusionary invigoration (unless you take out precise wrack) and you get no iPersona… And you can get 20% more base dmg if you use empowering mantras but that’s only if they are readied so people just kinda ready them then generally forget about them… And iPersona is a life saver in more than one situation. Where as the defensive mantra’s…. Not really.

And just curious though… They mentioned boon hate…. (Not disagreeing with you at all.) But they mentioned they wanted better ways to remove boons…. Right now when we shatter with shattered concentration we do that… Then we are discussing them nerfing shatters in a way by moving the ability to remove boons up a tree… To me that seems to make it harder to remove boons… I mean why introduce a new skill, trait, debuff, whatever when some classes (mesmers, thieves, necros) have built in mechanisms t remove/manipulate boons… The introduction of this “boon hate” would likely introduce bugs with it as well. …. Just an observation… Discuss either way.
Edit: I think if they do introduce this go it should go to necro either way… Make it a GM trait in spite.“Boon hate: do 3% more damage for each boon on your target. Affects single target only.”This would not only give a direct hard counter to bunkers it would allow necros to get some burst. But it would also allow burst against boon strong bunkers

if there is any change to shatter i hope it is done in a way that only hits mindwrack specs. a blanket nerf to shatter would be silly if it also hits phantasm/ condition specs.

Burnfall.9573:

As Mesmer, my Concern is, I feel Persecuted and Brutally targeted for being a Mesmer class. Nearly every patch that are released, we get Onslaught of Nerfs, and more Nerfs.
Why so harsh to us? When will you ever be Satisfied with us? How much more Pain must we Endure? When will the Torment End? Haven’t we Suffered enough?

Yes, at this rate, they may actually make mesmers – - GASP – - only slightly op!

In all seriousness (which is hard to return to after seeing a post like that), mesmers are in a very good place right now and I know a lot of people that have been playing only mesmer or one of the other 1st class professions in this game don’t really comprehend how much of a difference there is between classes.

I agree with the OP in that I do also hope that the new changes which are supposed to open up viable alternatives do need to be thoroughly tested since GW2 is, relatively, a very buggy game and a lot of the bugs don’t get fixed for a long time.

However, some of the criticism of the piercing on the GS has turned to bitter complaining over something that is a buff just because it’s not as much of a buff as people would like to think it is. As someone that’s predominantly played a ranger, I can assure you that being able to pierce with the auto attack of your highest dps ranged weapon is certainly a good thing.

Gonna break this one up.

Xeph.4513:

I have mentioned it several times, and it has been on the pvp forums before;

I don’t follow your every post man. You only compared us to Thief’s in this discussion, so I was reasonably confused why I was being treated as if you had to repeat yourself to someone particularly dense.

regardless its not about side stepping it, its when a target is downed that cleave damage really shines and its very simple to target the downed enemy and move in any direction for the desired effect.

Again, you’re using broad generalizations of “it’s easy/op/etc” without any logical support. We learned this in elementary school, things at the center of a circle (the circle being your 900-1000 or so preferred radius) can more easily move a degree than things on the outter portion of a circle. If any enemy goes from standing directly in front of your target to 45 degrees from there (to the left or right of your target) they move only a few units while you would need to move over 1,000 units to compensate the new angle to hit both, possibly also requiring you to change targets. I don’t know about you, but my enemies are rarely stupid enough to stack or charge single file for me.

Also the problem isn’t with aiming the beam attack, since anyone running in the direction of the beam will be cleaved since its a constant attack.
Its far superior to projectile cleave, also we get the pierce for free whilst rangers and engineers need to trait for it.

Again, why are people charging straight down an obvious beam attack? It’s far from subtle, less so than an arrow or a bullet. In addition, while those attacks have the added bonus of piercing behind your intended target (allowing you to focus whomever you choose and still get the line of damage effect) this only effects those between you and your target. So unless you’re selecting targets for maximum AoE benefit (and thus not focus firing) it isn’t near as useful, and even then requires baby sitting. Oh, and Engineers get it for free as well.

Let me reiterate: I know Shatter can be potent, but you’re allowing your opinion of shatter to be influenced by a build. The build does need to be tuned down, but that is true now, never mind changes to a specific weapon. A knee-jerk “it must be nerfed before you buff GS!” response is extremely premature. Don’t get me wrong, I fully expect some Shatter nerfs, but discussion of such should be done in a logical manner which takes various factors into account. Done properly, any nerf will affect only the top-end, as the low-end is rather pitiful.

Also, I’ll point out again that Karl obviously had something about Mesmers that he wanted to discuss but was told No by Jon. There are too many unknowns about what is in development to make knee jerk decisions.

Agony.3542:

I don’t quite understand the hate on GS mindstab.
What do you people want? A skill that removes up to 5 boons, slightly increases the GS damage output (dont be fooled by the number that pops up, keep in mind that GS auto needs more time to complete its attack than mindstab) and have it hit up to 5 targets on a big AoE?
Are you kittening me?

if they are going to nerf shatter dmg, that’s one way to balance it, in addition to one attack from other MH weapons.

Elementalist are going to be getting this type of line attack with the hope that it will improve Scepter usage. The fact that the beam targets one person and goes up until that person and not through makes the skill usage on this very high while very hard to use effectively. It might, in fact, add some damage to the profession overall but I’m willing to bet that unless it’s used amazingly it won’t affect it nearly as much as many people seem to believe it will.

The fear is simple, they are adding damage without mentioning where it’s going to come from, nothing is free being the main idea. Given the other issues people have with Mesmer it feels natural to come from the hardest hitting attacks we have, but does it have to hit the base of those attacks (shatters)? I think the question is, “How do they balance extra damage without negatively impacting the lesser used builds and weapons?”.

Delofakitten.4231:

Elementalist are going to be getting this type of line attack with the hope that it will improve Scepter usage. The fact that the beam targets one person and goes up until that person and not through makes the skill usage on this very high while very hard to use effectively. It might, in fact, add some damage to the profession overall but I’m willing to bet that unless it’s used amazingly it won’t affect it nearly as much as many people seem to believe it will.

The fear is simple, they are adding damage without mentioning where it’s going to come from, nothing is free being the main idea. Given the other issues people have with Mesmer it feels natural to come from the hardest hitting attacks we have, but does it have to hit the base of those attacks (shatters)? I think the question is, “How do they balance extra damage without negatively impacting the lesser used builds and weapons?”.

A note of rather high importance though is the Shatter bug (which is still there by the way) a simple matter of making a bunch of ranged clones using a shatter then making more quickly while they are running to the target and pop another shatter before the ranged ones explode. This yields a tough to line up (albeit not THAT tough), but devastating blow. Fix that bug and then check to see how much damage shatter are REALLY doing. This bug triggers extremely often whether you are intending it to or not and when they actually fix it the game gets much easier to balance a Mesmer.

What bug with shatters do you keep referring to? What keeps triggering this bug? Usually the damage is matched in the tooltip unless the shatters crit and if you are specced right nearly all will crit.

Dastion.3106:

Gonna break this one up.

Xeph.4513:

I have mentioned it several times, and it has been on the pvp forums before;

I don’t follow your every post man. You only compared us to Thief’s in this discussion, so I was reasonably confused why I was being treated as if you had to repeat yourself to someone particularly dense.

regardless its not about side stepping it, its when a target is downed that cleave damage really shines and its very simple to target the downed enemy and move in any direction for the desired effect.

Again, you’re using broad generalizations of “it’s easy/op/etc” without any logical support. We learned this in elementary school, things at the center of a circle (the circle being your 900-1000 or so preferred radius) can more easily move a degree than things on the outter portion of a circle. If any enemy goes from standing directly in front of your target to 45 degrees from there (to the left or right of your target) they move only a few units while you would need to move over 1,000 units to compensate the new angle to hit both, possibly also requiring you to change targets. I don’t know about you, but my enemies are rarely stupid enough to stack or charge single file for me.

Also the problem isn’t with aiming the beam attack, since anyone running in the direction of the beam will be cleaved since its a constant attack.
Its far superior to projectile cleave, also we get the pierce for free whilst rangers and engineers need to trait for it.

Again, why are people charging straight down an obvious beam attack? It’s far from subtle, less so than an arrow or a bullet. In addition, while those attacks have the added bonus of piercing behind your intended target (allowing you to focus whomever you choose and still get the line of damage effect) this only effects those between you and your target. So unless you’re selecting targets for maximum AoE benefit (and thus not focus firing) it isn’t near as useful, and even then requires baby sitting. Oh, and Engineers get it for free as well.

Let me reiterate: I know Shatter can be potent, but you’re allowing your opinion of shatter to be influenced by a build. The build does need to be tuned down, but that is true now, never mind changes to a specific weapon. A knee-jerk “it must be nerfed before you buff GS!” response is extremely premature. Don’t get me wrong, I fully expect some Shatter nerfs, but discussion of such should be done in a logical manner which takes various factors into account. Done properly, any nerf will affect only the top-end, as the low-end is rather pitiful.

Also, I’ll point out again that Karl obviously had something about Mesmers that he wanted to discuss but was told No by Jon. There are too many unknowns about what is in development to make knee jerk decisions.

Grandmaster Coated Bullets Pistol shots pierce. (Engineer Trait), they don’t get it for free sadly.
Anyways the fact that people need to keep a constant presence of mind in which direction the mesmer will be cleaving with his beam, in essence makes that too strong, it gives mesmers a huge dps increase when it was never needed in the first place.
There is infact no real reason to buff the GS auto attack, its simply a rather stupid buff, that in conjunction with shatters is simply too strong.
Also the request was never to nerf shatter damage, it was the fact that shatter has too much tied into it for a simple F1 click (Rips 3 boons, 3 confusion stacks, Vulnerability (if traited) and massive aoe damage) and thats just looking at one shatter.

Mind you a lot of people, are trying to say that mesmer is dead if shatters are nerfed, and I can assure you that is not the case, I think that most mesmers playing at high end have stopped using shatter; well at least I haven’t run shatter in competitive play for the last 2 months.
There are better alternatives.

Anyways simply said, mesmers don’t need this buff at all, the class just needs nerfs in the utility department, other than that its perfectly fine.

Xeph.4513:

Grandmaster Coated Bullets Pistol shots pierce. (Engineer Trait), they don’t get it for free sadly.
Anyways the fact that people need to keep a constant presence of mind in which direction the mesmer will be cleaving with his beam, in essence makes that too strong, it gives mesmers a huge dps increase when it was never needed in the first place.
There is infact no real reason to buff the GS auto attack, its simply a rather stupid buff, that in conjunction with shatters is simply too strong.
Also the request was never to nerf shatter damage, it was the fact that shatter has too much tied into it for a simple F1 click (Rips 3 boons, 3 confusion stacks, Vulnerability (if treated) and massive aoe damage) and thats just looking at one shatter.

Mind you a lot of people, are trying to say that mesmer is dead if shatters are nerfed, and I can assure you that is not the case, I think that most mesmers playing at high end have stopped using shatter; well at least I haven’t run shatter in competitive play for the last 2 months.
There are better alternatives.

Anyways simply said, mesmers don’t need this buff at all, the class just needs nerfs in the utility department, other than that its perfectly fine.

What do you run outside of a shatter spec? What’s funny is Nero said “Right now its 20/20/0/0/30 or….” Just curious what other good builds there are for tPvP. I tried runing pyro’s tank build but the defender goes down way to fast in a 1v>2 so that kills the mesmers ability to tank right there… And yes if specced it can rip boons and add vulnerability with a button push… But in this case the mesmer is taking 2 dom traits and ignoring mental torment which (WHY?) especially when the major trait to inflict vulnerability isn’t really needed when we have dazzling… So really it comes down to we can strip boons (3per shatter isn’t TOO much) but it does encourage a shatter heavy spec… And stack 3stacks of confusion with a shatter is very weak in PvP because confusion is weak in PvP…. But in all honesty i still feel that when compared to engi’s mesmers can’t really stack confusion as high for as long as an engi can… Which I just find very weird considering that in more than one place confusion was kinda advertised as a condition that was made with mesmers in mind… The last patch engi’s got more and better access to it made me just feel like confusion isn’t mesmers “special” condition any more… I mean we need to heavily invest into different trait trees to start accessing it to the level that engineers get with 3 different skills… Kinda lame.

Edit: And I think dastion is referring to rifle auto attack on engi’s… http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Hip_Shot

I said Rifle Engineer earlier. Hip shot pierces by default, which makes it analogous to the new spatial surge with the afforentioned differences.

And options like Vulnerability or Boon removal are just that – options. So long as other viable options exist it’s balanced, if not then the focus should still be on adjusting the options. Personally, I find I have enough boon removal with null field, and both Mind Stabs, instead I prefer Mental Torment and GS Mastery when I focus on shatter bombing – though I too like to try and mix it up, it’s undoubtedly effective.

Making Mantra builds more viable would be an excellent step, though that’s in the ‘wait and see’ category.

Really, Delofakitten said it best in this entire thread thus far.

Xeph.4513:

Dastion.3106:

Gonna break this one up.

Xeph.4513:

I have mentioned it several times, and it has been on the pvp forums before;

I don’t follow your every post man. You only compared us to Thief’s in this discussion, so I was reasonably confused why I was being treated as if you had to repeat yourself to someone particularly dense.

regardless its not about side stepping it, its when a target is downed that cleave damage really shines and its very simple to target the downed enemy and move in any direction for the desired effect.

Again, you’re using broad generalizations of “it’s easy/op/etc” without any logical support. We learned this in elementary school, things at the center of a circle (the circle being your 900-1000 or so preferred radius) can more easily move a degree than things on the outter portion of a circle. If any enemy goes from standing directly in front of your target to 45 degrees from there (to the left or right of your target) they move only a few units while you would need to move over 1,000 units to compensate the new angle to hit both, possibly also requiring you to change targets. I don’t know about you, but my enemies are rarely stupid enough to stack or charge single file for me.

Also the problem isn’t with aiming the beam attack, since anyone running in the direction of the beam will be cleaved since its a constant attack.
Its far superior to projectile cleave, also we get the pierce for free whilst rangers and engineers need to trait for it.

Again, why are people charging straight down an obvious beam attack? It’s far from subtle, less so than an arrow or a bullet. In addition, while those attacks have the added bonus of piercing behind your intended target (allowing you to focus whomever you choose and still get the line of damage effect) this only effects those between you and your target. So unless you’re selecting targets for maximum AoE benefit (and thus not focus firing) it isn’t near as useful, and even then requires baby sitting. Oh, and Engineers get it for free as well.

Let me reiterate: I know Shatter can be potent, but you’re allowing your opinion of shatter to be influenced by a build. The build does need to be tuned down, but that is true now, never mind changes to a specific weapon. A knee-jerk “it must be nerfed before you buff GS!” response is extremely premature. Don’t get me wrong, I fully expect some Shatter nerfs, but discussion of such should be done in a logical manner which takes various factors into account. Done properly, any nerf will affect only the top-end, as the low-end is rather pitiful.

Also, I’ll point out again that Karl obviously had something about Mesmers that he wanted to discuss but was told No by Jon. There are too many unknowns about what is in development to make knee jerk decisions.

Grandmaster Coated Bullets Pistol shots pierce. (Engineer Trait), they don’t get it for free sadly.
Anyways the fact that people need to keep a constant presence of mind in which direction the mesmer will be cleaving with his beam, in essence makes that too strong, it gives mesmers a huge dps increase when it was never needed in the first place.
There is infact no real reason to buff the GS auto attack, its simply a rather stupid buff, that in conjunction with shatters is simply too strong.
Also the request was never to nerf shatter damage, it was the fact that shatter has too much tied into it for a simple F1 click (Rips 3 boons, 3 confusion stacks, Vulnerability (if traited) and massive aoe damage) and thats just looking at one shatter.

Mind you a lot of people, are trying to say that mesmer is dead if shatters are nerfed, and I can assure you that is not the case, I think that most mesmers playing at high end have stopped using shatter; well at least I haven’t run shatter in competitive play for the last 2 months.
There are better alternatives.

Anyways simply said, mesmers don’t need this buff at all, the class just needs nerfs in the utility department, other than that its perfectly fine.

I agree with this, although I won’t really mind getting the buff. However, I do like the staff a lot and it’s already behind the GS in so many situations as it is, so it will be even harder to justify taking it after this.

jportell.2197:

Xeph.4513:

Grandmaster Coated Bullets Pistol shots pierce. (Engineer Trait), they don’t get it for free sadly.
Anyways the fact that people need to keep a constant presence of mind in which direction the mesmer will be cleaving with his beam, in essence makes that too strong, it gives mesmers a huge dps increase when it was never needed in the first place.
There is infact no real reason to buff the GS auto attack, its simply a rather stupid buff, that in conjunction with shatters is simply too strong.
Also the request was never to nerf shatter damage, it was the fact that shatter has too much tied into it for a simple F1 click (Rips 3 boons, 3 confusion stacks, Vulnerability (if treated) and massive aoe damage) and thats just looking at one shatter.

Mind you a lot of people, are trying to say that mesmer is dead if shatters are nerfed, and I can assure you that is not the case, I think that most mesmers playing at high end have stopped using shatter; well at least I haven’t run shatter in competitive play for the last 2 months.
There are better alternatives.

Anyways simply said, mesmers don’t need this buff at all, the class just needs nerfs in the utility department, other than that its perfectly fine.

What do you run outside of a shatter spec? What’s funny is Nero said “Right now its 20/20/0/0/30 or….” Just curious what other good builds there are for tPvP. I tried runing pyro’s tank build but the defender goes down way to fast in a 1v>2 so that kills the mesmers ability to tank right there… And yes if specced it can rip boons and add vulnerability with a button push… But in this case the mesmer is taking 2 dom traits and ignoring mental torment which (WHY?) especially when the major trait to inflict vulnerability isn’t really needed when we have dazzling… So really it comes down to we can strip boons (3per shatter isn’t TOO much) but it does encourage a shatter heavy spec… And stack 3stacks of confusion with a shatter is very weak in PvP because confusion is weak in PvP…. But in all honesty i still feel that when compared to engi’s mesmers can’t really stack confusion as high for as long as an engi can… Which I just find very weird considering that in more than one place confusion was kinda advertised as a condition that was made with mesmers in mind… The last patch engi’s got more and better access to it made me just feel like confusion isn’t mesmers “special” condition any more… I mean we need to heavily invest into different trait trees to start accessing it to the level that engineers get with 3 different skills… Kinda lame.

Edit: And I think dastion is referring to rifle auto attack on engi’s… http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Hip_Shot

I will make a video explaining several different mesmer builds, including mantra builds; hopefully if I can get nero to make this a joint project we will have it out soon.

When it comes to comparing staff to GS… its kinda the apples and oranges argument… GS is a great longrange power house that can kite/cripple and cause vulnerability… Pure offensive weapon no mixing and matching… It is for killing people. Staff is a major defense weapon… Phase retreat is an amazing oh s*** button and chaos armor/chaos storm are both better defense then offense… So really it depends on how you want to play. If you want a high dmg offense build… Run GS… If you want a little defense in your shatter build run staff….

Xeph.4513:

]

I will make a video explaining several different mesmer builds, including mantra builds; hopefully if I can get nero to make this a joint project we will have it out soon.

Just don’t copy some of the already well known builds. I’m intersted in seeing other builds that are used further up.. Haven’t really seen a good break down of the glamour confusion bomb build.

Xeph.4513:

Anyways simply said, mesmers don’t need this buff at all, the class just needs nerfs in the utility department, other than that its perfectly fine.

When was the last time you used a scepter?

jportell.2197:

What bug with shatters do you keep referring to?

I editted it out of my post mostly due to the fact that it’s been awhile since I’ve tested it, it might have been fixed by now and until I do test it I won’t put it back in my post.

If it has in fact been fixed then the devs are best served to work on the scaling of the shatters from traits, especially percentage based boosts.

Delofakitten.4231:

jportell.2197:

What bug with shatters do you keep referring to?

I editted it out of my post mostly due to the fact that it’s been awhile since I’ve tested it, it might have been fixed by now and until I do test it I won’t put it back in my post.

If it has in fact been fixed then the devs are best served to work on the scaling of the shatters from traits, especially percentage based boosts.

The only bug related to shatters that I could think of is the shattered strength bug from back in december that was hot fixed…Or the adding of the GCD to prevent more than 1 shatter from being procced on the same illusion… And the damage from shatters isn’t really too high when compared to skills like ele fire grab (5k), backstab/any thief stealth skill, 100B, or a Shortbow ranger… They are all really on par it seems… The problem that xeph brought up was with what shatters do plus the new added GS beam attack (shatter perks not damage)… The actual damage… Is only good depending on taking mental torment and precise wrack. Plus shattering with the proper combo diversion/MW both must be 3 clones… Now xeph and I discussed the removing a boon on hit being moved up a tree… That way the damage isn’t really hurt and we are able to keep shatters as AoK for the most part.