What Mirrage is.

What Mirrage is.

in Mesmer

Posted by: FaboBabo.3581

FaboBabo.3581

I’ve been reading lots of Comments about people complaining about mirrage. " should be power" " give joust 900 range" , " should give Group support" " does nothing a chrono or base mesmer cant do" does not synergize with base mesmer traits" , and more Stuff like that.

First of all u need to understand what a specilization is; it focuses in a special aspect of the class. Chrono has the supportive theme , while mirage CLEARLY has the dueling / condi theme.
Mirrage is selfish and thats a good Thing. If u wanna be a supporter olay chrono and get over it.

3 charges with 20 sec cooldown on a teleport and ppl complain about 400 Range.. Like seriously did u get the skill overall ? Its one of the most powerfull skills in gw2 when talking about pvp/wvw. It can cover DMG , range/mobility, cleanse.. The ability to repositin urself 3 times in a row is insane.

Ppl mentioned condi chrono could burst the same ammount of condis as mirrage…. Ur either the most insane chrono i have ever seen or u were reaaaally bad with mirrage. I cant do 30 stacks confusion on a single target as chrono in 2 seconds…

EDIT ; I cant do 30 stacks CONDITIONS on a single target as chrono in 2 seconds.

To make this further specialized. Mirrage is more of a Killer, where Chrono is more of a bunker, IN MY OPINION. U can Kill ppl with both specs. U can def places with both specs. Mirrage will still be better in bursting ppl down, while chrono will still be better in holding points under hardpressure. That beeing said ; Power Lockdown Chrono + Condi Mirrage would be a nice Duo

(edited by FaboBabo.3581)

What Mirrage is.

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Posted by: Levetty.1279

Levetty.1279

No, an elite specilization is supposed to introduce new ways to play a class along with new mechanics.

Mirage is a worse way to play the dueling theme that the core Mesmer was based around.

What Mirrage is.

in Mesmer

Posted by: apharma.3741

apharma.3741

No, an elite specilization is supposed to introduce new ways to play a class along with new mechanics.

Mirage is a worse way to play the dueling theme that the core Mesmer was based around.

The traits for mirage are pretty strong for power builds, it gives protection after mirage cloak for reducing damage from a spike after a dodge, stunbreak and cleanse on dodge and – condition damage when you have regen. Jaunt becoming 600 range makes it a great escape and condition cleanse elite.

Basically it gives power builds a little cleansing and damage mitigation as well as enhanced escape with sword all in one line. The utilities are mostly bad but mirage advance with a reduced cast time would be pretty strong for power builds to burst in, return and kite for a bit without having to burn more utilitiy skills on getting out of melee.

What Mirrage is.

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Posted by: Levetty.1279

Levetty.1279

Anet could delete entire trait lines and claim thats an elite spec and people would defend them.

What Mirrage is.

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Posted by: FaboBabo.3581

FaboBabo.3581

How is mirrage worse in dueling then base mesmer ?

What Mirrage is.

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Posted by: FaboBabo.3581

FaboBabo.3581

Im not defending the spec at all. Im just pointing out some Things. Tbh mirage mirrors ARE bad designed in the way the mesmer “cant decide” where to spawn them. Still “joust” needs nothing. Still chrono will never condi burst like mirrage.

Btw i would Change the protection to barrier.

What Mirrage is.

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Posted by: apharma.3741

apharma.3741

Anet could delete entire trait lines and claim thats an elite spec and people would defend them.

I’m speaking for WvW where you have -20% condition duration food or +40% endurance regen food and energy gives a full dodge so you can run double energy and have 3 dodges in 10s with permanent vigor and food.

Stunbreak on dodge is just troll. I think a lot of the traits are lazy, poorly designed and don’t like them but I’m not going to deny how strong they are if you build right.

What Mirrage is.

in Mesmer

Posted by: musu.9205

musu.9205

op is one of those people who only watched woodenpotato video and came here to enlighten us how over tuned mirage is .

1. for that burst , you need 3 scepter clones , IH gm trait , likely illusion trait line. and after that u need to burn your defensive tool : dodge . have fun doing so called 2 s burst in pvp .

2. that is not a 20s cd 400 range tele . also mirage has no dodge movement. and this elite skill is not good enough for that loss

3.mirage gains an axe , which is not a ranged weapon . so no ranged dps from mirage .

4. mobility ,even you take axe + elite , you still dont have enough mobility comparing to simple dodge roll . not to mention dodge jump .

5. the ambush is weak , even you take IH ,its still not that good unless you have 3 clones . so mirage does not really have good condition damage in pvp ,

6. for pve , given the fact mirage has trouble to generate clones , someone already tested : you do slight more dmg with mirage trait line , but you still use 3 iduelist ,
the only real gain is Dune Cloak and maybe axe , everything else is trash for pve dps . and it seems if there are adds around axe dps will be far less than its one test golem.
and lets be honest sitting with 3 duelists for max dps is not new playtyle or fun one .

so yep , it is worse than core mesmer.

What Mirrage is.

in Mesmer

Posted by: musu.9205

musu.9205

No, an elite specilization is supposed to introduce new ways to play a class along with new mechanics.

Mirage is a worse way to play the dueling theme that the core Mesmer was based around.

The traits for mirage are pretty strong for power builds, it gives protection after mirage cloak for reducing damage from a spike after a dodge, stunbreak and cleanse on dodge and – condition damage when you have regen. Jaunt becoming 600 range makes it a great escape and condition cleanse elite.

Basically it gives power builds a little cleansing and damage mitigation as well as enhanced escape with sword all in one line. The utilities are mostly bad but mirage advance with a reduced cast time would be pretty strong for power builds to burst in, return and kite for a bit without having to burn more utilitiy skills on getting out of melee.

i see your point , but at this point , its more like you forced mirage trait line into a power shatter build , its more about burst damage a core mes can do in wvw .

for Mirage Advance , it is not a stunbreak , also range is only 900 with 3/4 s cast time .it can only be used if you are in 900 range . blind is nice tho .

blink is way better .

even we ignore chrono line , any other trait line is better than mirage for a power build

What Mirrage is.

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Posted by: apharma.3741

apharma.3741

No, an elite specilization is supposed to introduce new ways to play a class along with new mechanics.

Mirage is a worse way to play the dueling theme that the core Mesmer was based around.

The traits for mirage are pretty strong for power builds, it gives protection after mirage cloak for reducing damage from a spike after a dodge, stunbreak and cleanse on dodge and – condition damage when you have regen. Jaunt becoming 600 range makes it a great escape and condition cleanse elite.

Basically it gives power builds a little cleansing and damage mitigation as well as enhanced escape with sword all in one line. The utilities are mostly bad but mirage advance with a reduced cast time would be pretty strong for power builds to burst in, return and kite for a bit without having to burn more utilitiy skills on getting out of melee.

i see your point , but at this point , its more like you forced mirage trait line into a power shatter build , its more about burst damage a core mes can do in wvw .

for Mirage Advance , it is not a stunbreak , also range is only 900 with 3/4 s cast time .it can only be used if you are in 900 range . blind is nice tho .

blink is way better .

even we ignore chrono line , any other trait line is better than mirage for a power build

Not really, the current issue with power mesmer in WvW isn’t the damage, we got tons of that if we take domination and duelling, the issue is surviving against the variety of builds you come across.

If you want plenty of condition cleanses you need to take inspiration and/or usually well of eternity and/or a cleanse utility if chrono but then you lack the defences of chaos line for protection, a bit of regen but mainly PU/BD. If you pick both chaos and inspiration you will lack damage.

This is why I say mirage isn’t bad because of the traits, it gives you that extra condition removal and stunbreaks from jaunt and elusive mind. You get that protection for after a dodge which is when good players would try to burst you and renewing oasis is decent at reducing condition damage. You also get enhanced escape via the sword ambush skill and jaunt.

The best way to do damage as a power mesmer is to blink in or use stealth to get close to the enemy to mirrorblade and mindwrack. The problem is you end up in melee range with the GS so it’s usually either a knock back and kite or switch to sword and use defences/stealth to put some distance between you. Mirage advance essentially allows you to get close and do this, same with Jaunt if it became a 600 range without burning too many cool downs to then get away again. You also preserve your blink which is invaluable for power mesmers.

What Mirrage is.

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Posted by: FaboBabo.3581

FaboBabo.3581

op is one of those people who only watched woodenpotato video and came here to enlighten us how over tuned mirage is .

1. for that burst , you need 3 scepter clones , IH gm trait , likely illusion trait line. and after that u need to burn your defensive tool : dodge . have fun doing so called 2 s burst in pvp .

2. that is not a 20s cd 400 range tele . also mirage has no dodge movement. and this elite skill is not good enough for that loss

3.mirage gains an axe , which is not a ranged weapon . so no ranged dps from mirage .

4. mobility ,even you take axe + elite , you still dont have enough mobility comparing to simple dodge roll . not to mention dodge jump .

5. the ambush is weak , even you take IH ,its still not that good unless you have 3 clones . so mirage does not really have good condition damage in pvp ,

6. for pve , given the fact mirage has trouble to generate clones , someone already tested : you do slight more dmg with mirage trait line , but you still use 3 iduelist ,
the only real gain is Dune Cloak and maybe axe , everything else is trash for pve dps . and it seems if there are adds around axe dps will be far less than its one test golem.
and lets be honest sitting with 3 duelists for max dps is not new playtyle or fun one .

so yep , it is worse than core mesmer.

1. No u dont need 3 clones. Ambush alone gives 5 stacks of Conditions, which is a good condi Burst. Every Clone after urself makes the ambushes insane.
1.1 ; Core mesmer simply does not own this. Core Mesmer won’t do ANY bonus dmg.
1.2 I dont need to burst ppl in the first second of the fight. I can simply fight my enemy and have an advantage everytime i dodge. I dont need to play with my ambush only, cause axe 3 is 5 stacks confu at least, joust has 3 confu at least, my auto doese 2 conditions now, axe 2 is spammable, torch has more burst options.

-> Ambushes are a bonus, which u can play with on higher mesmer lvl.

2. If ur referring to “Jaunt” i wonder why im still writing.. ; Here’s the wiki for “Jaunt” ;

“Shadowstep to a target location and confuse nearby foes.

Damage; Damage: 266 (1.0)?
Confusion; 3 Confusion (5s): 113 Damage On Skill Use, 330 Damage
Miscellaneous effect ; Conditions Removed: 1
Maximum Count: 3
Count Recharge: 20s
Radius: 180
Combo Finisher: Leap
Range: 400"

Shadowstep, 400 Range , Recharge 20 s ??

3.Necro gets an offhand weapon -> no mainhand weapon for necro , Necro can’t do autoattacks anymore….

Now without sarcasm ; We have scepter and Staff? (Mirage is condi if u dont got that allready)

4. Dodge roll is 300 units i think ?. So twice a dodge roll is 600 units. Tripple Joust is 1200 Units. Clearly the dodge roll has more movement then the new elite. Not to mention the superspeed core Mesmer gets when dodging.

5. Ambushes are better versions of normal Auto Attacks for scepter, Staff and Axe (didnt test others). I previously explained why ambushes are strong, simply because they are a bonus. And again 5 Stacks of conditions is never a joke.

Core mesmers dodge interrupts EVERY Cast.
Mirrage Mesmers dodge wont interrupt anything.

Core Mesmer can’t dodge while beeing stunned.
Mirrage Mesmers can dodge while beeing stunned (even without the trait)

Did i fall for a Troll or are Ppl reaally that ignorant?

Edit ; dont get me wrong dudes ; i know bout the issuses Mirage has. Ambush staff feels like enemy could drink a tea after dodging, infinite horizon should be baseline , more speed after dodge for making up the non movement effect… list goes on, but god kitten , some tweaks here and there and everything is fine. I could even life with the current state of mirrage, just cause i like the playstyle a lot.

It has no other playstyle then Base mesmer ur saying ? I never jump flipped arround as base mesmer that often as i did on mirrage. I’d wonder if anyone properly could get me as a target in the first 5 – 10 seconds of the fight ; if he wants to click on me , im allready gone again.

(edited by FaboBabo.3581)

What Mirrage is.

in Mesmer

Posted by: musu.9205

musu.9205

No, an elite specilization is supposed to introduce new ways to play a class along with new mechanics.

Mirage is a worse way to play the dueling theme that the core Mesmer was based around.

The traits for mirage are pretty strong for power builds, it gives protection after mirage cloak for reducing damage from a spike after a dodge, stunbreak and cleanse on dodge and – condition damage when you have regen. Jaunt becoming 600 range makes it a great escape and condition cleanse elite.

Basically it gives power builds a little cleansing and damage mitigation as well as enhanced escape with sword all in one line. The utilities are mostly bad but mirage advance with a reduced cast time would be pretty strong for power builds to burst in, return and kite for a bit without having to burn more utilitiy skills on getting out of melee.

i see your point , but at this point , its more like you forced mirage trait line into a power shatter build , its more about burst damage a core mes can do in wvw .

for Mirage Advance , it is not a stunbreak , also range is only 900 with 3/4 s cast time .it can only be used if you are in 900 range . blind is nice tho .

blink is way better .

even we ignore chrono line , any other trait line is better than mirage for a power build

Not really, the current issue with power mesmer in WvW isn’t the damage, we got tons of that if we take domination and duelling, the issue is surviving against the variety of builds you come across.

If you want plenty of condition cleanses you need to take inspiration and/or usually well of eternity and/or a cleanse utility if chrono but then you lack the defences of chaos line for protection, a bit of regen but mainly PU/BD. If you pick both chaos and inspiration you will lack damage.

This is why I say mirage isn’t bad because of the traits, it gives you that extra condition removal and stunbreaks from jaunt and elusive mind. You get that protection for after a dodge which is when good players would try to burst you and renewing oasis is decent at reducing condition damage. You also get enhanced escape via the sword ambush skill and jaunt.

The best way to do damage as a power mesmer is to blink in or use stealth to get close to the enemy to mirrorblade and mindwrack. The problem is you end up in melee range with the GS so it’s usually either a knock back and kite or switch to sword and use defences/stealth to put some distance between you. Mirage advance essentially allows you to get close and do this, same with Jaunt if it became a 600 range without burning too many cool downs to then get away again. You also preserve your blink which is invaluable for power mesmers.

i meant what makes a power shatter mirage work is power shatter itself with its burst damage ,blink and stealth .
if you want sustain, inspiration chrono are all better .

What Mirrage is.

in Mesmer

Posted by: musu.9205

musu.9205

1. No u dont need 3 clones. Ambush alone gives 5 stacks of Conditions, which is a good condi Burst. Every Clone after urself makes the ambushes insane.
1.1 ; Core mesmer simply does not own this. Core Mesmer won’t do ANY bonus dmg.
1.2 I dont need to burst ppl in the first second of the fight. I can simply fight my enemy and have an advantage everytime i dodge. I dont need to play with my ambush only, cause axe 3 is 5 stacks confu at least, joust has 3 confu at least, my auto doese 2 conditions now, axe 2 is spammable, torch has more burst options.

-> Ambushes are a bonus, which u can play with on higher mesmer lvl.

2. If ur referring to “Jaunt” i wonder why im still writing.. ; Here’s the wiki for “Jaunt” ;

“Shadowstep to a target location and confuse nearby foes.

Damage; Damage: 266 (1.0)?
Confusion; 3 Confusion (5s): 113 Damage On Skill Use, 330 Damage
Miscellaneous effect ; Conditions Removed: 1
Maximum Count: 3
Count Recharge: 20s
Radius: 180
Combo Finisher: Leap
Range: 400"

Shadowstep, 400 Range , Recharge 20 s ??

3.Necro gets an offhand weapon -> no mainhand weapon for necro , Necro can’t do autoattacks anymore….

Now without sarcasm ; We have scepter and Staff? (Mirage is condi if u dont got that allready)

4. Dodge roll is 300 units i think ?. So twice a dodge roll is 600 units. Tripple Joust is 1200 Units. Clearly the dodge roll has more movement then the new elite. Not to mention the superspeed core Mesmer gets when dodging.

5. Ambushes are better versions of normal Auto Attacks for scepter, Staff and Axe (didnt test others). I previously explained why ambushes are strong, simply because they are a bonus. And again 5 Stacks of conditions is never a joke.

Core mesmers dodge interrupts EVERY Cast.
Mirrage Mesmers dodge wont interrupt anything.

Core Mesmer can’t dodge while beeing stunned.
Mirrage Mesmers can dodge while beeing stunned (even without the trait)

Did i fall for a Troll or are Ppl reaally that ignorant?

Edit ; dont get me wrong dudes ; i know bout the issuses Mirage has. Ambush staff feels like enemy could drink a tea after dodging, infinite horizon should be baseline , more speed after dodge for making up the non movement effect… list goes on, but god kitten , some tweaks here and there and everything is fine. I could even life with the current state of mirrage, just cause i like the playstyle a lot.

It has no other playstyle then Base mesmer ur saying ? I never jump flipped arround as base mesmer that often as i did on mirrage. I’d wonder if anyone properly could get me as a target in the first 5 – 10 seconds of the fight ; if he wants to click on me , im allready gone again.

1. good condi or not , with one clone , you can not do 2s 30 stacks confusion burst . you bring this up yourself . i proved you are wrong . and if we talk about constantly condi pressure like 5 stack confusion from one ambush . chrono does that better . coz chrono has better illusion generation and shorter cds also shield gives 2 phants .
“2s 30 stacks of confusion ” does not work . you need burst or not , chrono does it bette in real pvp.
have fun to play axe in pvp with current numbers + cast time + skill3 path issue on a melee weapon lol

2. count recharge =/= recharge . like i said you do not understand what you are talking about .

3. axe as a melee weapon is bad for its damage in pvp , skill 3 is nice but it is slow and has path issue . while you dont have to use axe , but the point is mirage brings less useful , since of the good thing about elite spec is new weapon to play around

4. dodge does not have a 60s cd . you can also dodge jump for some position thats hard to reach .

5. i think you only checked damage number which is just slightly better than most weapons AA . do you know there are something called cast time , pre cast after cast ?
do you know you lose dps if you interrupt your aa chain , also do you know some ambush attack roots you while some are slow as hell ?and again ambush can not be just bonus. especially with mirror is worse lol . if ambush is some little bonus ,then mirage does not have elite mechanic lol . and many here disagree with you about power level of ambush attacks.

6. you can cast while dodging or stuned is nice , but our point is , this is too gimmick for us to replace any core mesmer traitline with mirage especially the new dodge removes movement too .

7 . “I’d wonder if anyone properly could get me as a target in the first 5 – 10 seconds of the fight ; if he wants to click on me , im allready gone again.”

my friend tried mirage with all stealth + teleports + staff , i targeted on real mesmer everytime while i aoe down all his clones . if you cant target real mesmer with all those new visual effect , you are new to mes? i guess.

im sorry , everyone who played mesmer for more than few days or even hours could pick up real one no matter how hard you try . also thats not a new playstyle for mes.

What Mirrage is.

in Mesmer

Posted by: musu.9205

musu.9205

it never took me longer than 1s to pick up real mirage with my 200 ping during a fight .

5-10s lol dude , you are playing different game .

What Mirrage is.

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Posted by: Hot Boy.7138

Hot Boy.7138

I agree that Mirage is pretty awesome. I love it. Nonetheless, it could be improved. There are some issues but they aren’t a big deal and will likely be an easy fix for the devs.

What Mirrage is.

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Posted by: FaboBabo.3581

FaboBabo.3581

K maybe 2 second 30 Confu was too harsh for a pvp situation, lets go the full burst combo;
: YES THAT MEANS ENEMY DOES NO DODGE WHAT HE WILL DO SO THIS IS THEORETICAL!

torch 4 into Jaust -> 4 Burn , 3 Confu
torch 5 into axe 2 -> 9 Burn , 3 Confu , 3 Torment
axe 2, dodge weapon swap, scepter ambush -> 2 clones -> rougly 7 stacks torment and 7 stacks confusion
-> Sharper Images trigger on clones, lets add 5 stacks bleeding assuming u got a 50% Crit Chance.
-> 9 Burn , 10 Confu , 10 Torment , 5 Bleeds

F2 Shatter with 2 clones and 1 Phantasm -> Blind = 2 Stacks Confusion + 8 From normal F2 + 4 stacks Torment.
9 Burn, 20 Confu, 10 Torment, 5 Bleeds.

kitten ur right. Its only 20 stacks. We still got both pistol skills , all Scepter Skills , 3 Shatters , every utility and 2 Jausts. (And of course i got both dodges too cause im using sigil of energy…)

Reduce it ALL by 50% and u still got an insane condi Burst.

2. Count recharge and recharge basically have the same meaning in which u can jump every 20 seconds. Explain the difference please. The only thing charge system has is that u can theoretically lower ur initial cooldown by stacking charges. If u used all 3 Charges its nothing more then ; 20 sec TP, 400 range.

3. I agree with pathing problems and overall slowness, thats a thing im aware of ( And will 90% fixxed in the next month so i won’t talk about this) Axe meele attack me be kitten for power , but having TWO conditions on the auto Hit is pretty good, dont u think ?

4. Now i get what u meant by Recharge system =/= recharge. U are seriously saying that Jaust has a 60 Sec cooldown. This is …. wow …. Are u goin to tell me u would wait for all 3 charges to use it once ? WTH?

About dodge Jump ; Jaust. U got three charges, use em with brain.

5 I have no single idea about the dmg of the Ambushes vs normal Basic attacks. Its about the Condis. Mirrage is about Condis. Im never referring to ANY power based build. Doin 5 Stacks of confusion or Torment in 1,5 seconds (scepter) is better then doin 3 stacks of torment in the same time. (rougly cast time of Ambush + Auto attack speed of scepter in comparison)
So to answer ur question ; yes i heared of cast times etc, and i could prove mathimatically that ambushes are still better dmg-wise. Not to mention what happens if we get clones to do the ambush with us .

6 . Try illusion , dueling , mirage , u won’t miss Chaos that much is my opinion.

7. it was not me who fight myself, so to answer ur question ; no im not new to mesmer , maybe my enemies were, since it was beta weekende and much new ppl hang arround.

Dont want to say is extremely difficult to target , but with the right timing mesmer jumps can disrupt ur targeting . And dont get me wrong here . 1 Sec is all u need to tell which one is the right mesmer, but targeting is another thing.
Missclicking , cause the mesmer just used a jump/teleport mechanic will happen more frequently then on core mesmer. Can be proofed mathimatical too. When it happens once with Core mesmer, while they used Blink, it pretty much can’t happen again (Yeah stuff, mimic , bla bla, mirrage has this tools too). While on Mirrage if it happens with blink it can happen again with jaust , jaust , jaust, and all the other new teleports , shadowsteps etc.

(edited by FaboBabo.3581)

What Mirrage is.

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Posted by: apharma.3741

apharma.3741

i meant what makes a power shatter mirage work is power shatter itself with its burst damage ,blink and stealth .
if you want sustain, inspiration chrono are all better .

Yes sustain is better from inspiration chrono but that won’t make for a great power build because you lack damage. I’m not saying mirage is better for sustaining I’m saying it’s better for not getting completely destroyed by condi or getting instagibbed because of the traits.

If you want to play sustained mesmer it’s condi all the way atm as you get the sustained damage and sustained health regen and it’s debatable if mirage will be better than chrono in that regard.

What Mirrage is.

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Posted by: musu.9205

musu.9205

K maybe 2 second 30 Confu was too harsh for a pvp situation, lets go the full burst combo;
: YES THAT MEANS ENEMY DOES NO DODGE WHAT HE WILL DO SO THIS IS THEORETICAL!

torch 4 into Jaust -> 4 Burn , 3 Confu
torch 5 into axe 2 -> 9 Burn , 3 Confu , 3 Torment
axe 2, dodge weapon swap, scepter ambush -> 2 clones -> rougly 7 stacks torment and 7 stacks confusion
-> Sharper Images trigger on clones, lets add 5 stacks bleeding assuming u got a 50% Crit Chance.
-> 9 Burn , 10 Confu , 10 Torment , 5 Bleeds

F2 Shatter with 2 clones and 1 Phantasm -> Blind = 2 Stacks Confusion + 8 From normal F2 + 4 stacks Torment.
9 Burn, 20 Confu, 10 Torment, 5 Bleeds.

kitten ur right. Its only 20 stacks. We still got both pistol skills , all Scepter Skills , 3 Shatters , every utility and 2 Jausts. (And of course i got both dodges too cause im using sigil of energy…)

Reduce it ALL by 50% and u still got an insane condi Burst.

2. Count recharge and recharge basically have the same meaning in which u can jump every 20 seconds. Explain the difference please. The only thing charge system has is that u can theoretically lower ur initial cooldown by stacking charges. If u used all 3 Charges its nothing more then ; 20 sec TP, 400 range.

3. I agree with pathing problems and overall slowness, thats a thing im aware of ( And will 90% fixxed in the next month so i won’t talk about this) Axe meele attack me be kitten for power , but having TWO conditions on the auto Hit is pretty good, dont u think ?

4. Now i get what u meant by Recharge system =/= recharge. U are seriously saying that Jaust has a 60 Sec cooldown. This is …. wow …. Are u goin to tell me u would wait for all 3 charges to use it once ? WTH?

5 I have no single idea about the dmg of the Ambushes vs normal Basic attacks. Its about the Condis. Mirrage is about Condis. Im never referring to ANY power based build. Doin 5 Stacks of confusion or Torment in 1,5 seconds (scepter) is better then doin 3 stacks of torment in the same time. (rougly cast time of Ambush + Auto attack speed of scepter in comparison)
So to answer ur question ; yes i heared of cast times etc, and i could prove mathimatically that ambushes are still better dmg-wise. Not to mention what happens if we get clones to do the ambush with us .

6 . Try illusion , dueling , mirage , u won’t miss Chaos that much is my opinion.

7. it was not me who fight myself, so to answer ur question ; no im not new to mesmer , maybe my enemies were, since it was beta weekende and much new ppl hang arround.

Dont want to say is extremely difficult to target , but with the right timing mesmer jumps can disrupt ur targeting . And dont get me wrong here . 1 Sec is all u need to tell which one is the right mesmer, but targeting is another thing.

1. https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Sigil_of_Energy_
also lol you know , even we ignore u burned a lot of cd , and took more than 2 to do that . how about take chrono , press shield 4 twice and 5 stun some little chick and shatter it 3 times . much easier ,reliable , and you can still have moa lol while u dont need rely on crit hit …. also that flying axe 2 animation , you will be interrupted the second you do that lol .

lets be honest that burst is not as good as you think .

2. 20s cd , a elite slot for a teleport with 400 range which is slightly away from melee range . and you pick this over moa ?

3. again , cast time and range , you might wanna try war axw or firebrand axe before you saying mirage axe aa is good .

4. i mean , moa is far better .even we ignore moa , gravity well is better too . with its 400 range, in most case you have at least to burn through 2 charges to escape from aoe .

5. by damage i meant all damage type .https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Mirage
check this yourself , be aware the cast time does not include things like after cast . only ambush that is clearly better than AA is Ether Barrage which can be easily dodged or spear one (but underwater combat lol), axe ambush seems better too but if you read the tooltip carefully , your dps will be ruined by adds in pve and worse for team fight in pvp .

6. lets ignore chrono , even you take inspiration line , you will have far better condi removal and sustain . mirage is struggling to compete with core mes trait line . also duel /illu / mirage you will be farmed by thief , condi bomb , meditrap DH and you cant kill druid or scrapper .

7. dont forget you lose 25% passive movement buff from chrono which is a lot in pvp and wvw .

8. just like original game , others will get used to mirage fairly fast after PoF. people said about opness of mesmer before gw2 release and how they cant figure who is real mes etc etc . we all know how that went out . as for people who cant do this , i dont think we should balance game around skill clickers .

What Mirrage is.

in Mesmer

Posted by: musu.9205

musu.9205

i meant what makes a power shatter mirage work is power shatter itself with its burst damage ,blink and stealth .
if you want sustain, inspiration chrono are all better .

Yes sustain is better from inspiration chrono but that won’t make for a great power build because you lack damage. I’m not saying mirage is better for sustaining I’m saying it’s better for not getting completely destroyed by condi or getting instagibbed because of the traits.

If you want to play sustained mesmer it’s condi all the way atm as you get the sustained damage and sustained health regen and it’s debatable if mirage will be better than chrono in that regard.

i meant inspiration or chrono , sorry i didnt type it right .
mirage gives us sword ambush + elite tele which are nice but they are just not enough in my eyes .

and bigger problem with power mirage for me is that the playstyle is still
pretty much a power shatter which i played for like 3 years .

well tbh if anet makes sword ambush from clones trigger interrupt traits , then thats something . im big fan of CI build .

What Mirrage is.

in Mesmer

Posted by: Carighan.6758

Carighan.6758

Mirrage is selfish and thats a good Thing. If u wanna be a supporter olay chrono and get over it.

You can hardly call it “selfish” if it doesn’t do much more than a Chrono does while also supporting the party.

The strength of heart to face oneself has been made manifest. The persona Carighan has appeared.

What Mirrage is.

in Mesmer

Posted by: FaboBabo.3581

FaboBabo.3581

“press shield 4 twice and 5 stun some little chick and shatter it 3 times "
Great Burst ; Go into a fight , Block 4 Seconds , then start doing Things!

Burning a lot of Cd = Torch 4+5, Axe 2, F2.
U burnt= Shield 4 + 5, Fx,Fy,Fz

U burnt one Skill more then i Did (while u still did less Dmg) Nice Argument.

1. Shatter 3 times is a maximum of 3 stacks torment and 10 Stacks Confusion. This is not even close to the things mirrage can get in this time ? (still not referring to power dmg on both sides)
Second thing about this ; Ur not relying on Crit overall. The Crit gives u 5 Stacks of bleed in the maths i did. If u want cut those 5 stacks. Mirrage still has more Condis, more Condi Burst.

2. U said something about gettin interrupted when starting a cast right? Yeah i think u did. I just copy that senseless argument. Tbh i would take jaust since it fits my playstyle more. I just want to point out that it is a relyable choice.

3. Well i still think havin 2 conditions on the auto chain is a good thing. Maybe firebrand auto is 100 times stronger. Doesnt make mirrage auto weaker.

4. Ur not refferring to situations here. Clearly there are times in which gravity well will be better, or Moa, or Mass invisibilty, or anything else. If u wanna catch someone out of ur Gravity well Range it’s useless. If u wanna CC someone within ur Range and u got Jaust; it’s useless. Jaunt still stays good at its flexibility.

5. Again and again ; ambushes are a BONUS. Core Mesmer would simply do normal basic attacks. Mirrage dodges (no cast time)- Instantly casts ambush.
Mesmer dodges (0,5 sec cast time), Mesmer starts casting anything else. U are targeting Dps loss of Mirrage, where there is no loss, but overall just less bonus dmg (Cause adds can block etc).

6. Remember what point 6 was ? “6. you can cast while dodging or stuned is nice , but our point is , this is too gimmick for us to replace any core mesmer traitline with mirage especially the new dodge removes movement too .”

This has NOTHING to do with condition Cleanse, but i can talk about this too, cause u are very right on this point. We loose Condition Cleanse and therefore are forced to take the mantra or disengage heave condi pressure. Additionaley we will disengage every resistance Class.

One thing i need to mention is that i was referring to WvW all the time. This occurs to PvP too in some aspects, but im sure aware of sigil of energy is 25% in Pvp.

The wvw status allows me to just walk away in situations i cant handle.

Ur right when saying in Pvp this Build may have not enough Condition Cleanse.
I’d suggest mantra cleanse, torch and jaust. With the ability to blind frequently , dodge frequently and the given condi removal u could still be competetive ; needs RL testing for sure.

7.Yes u do ; base mesmer isnt owning the movementpeed, but can still be a viable roamer. Something to be aware off, but no argument to kitten over Mirages.

8. U cant get used to randomness. If u are about to click the mesmer , and then he ports, u didnt target him. U can of course train to click faster, but thats overall skill and has nothing to do with mesmer personally. As i mentioned before, chances of missclick are mathimacally higher on mirrage then on base mesmer / chrono. Im not reffering to any shiny effect. I said before ; u can tell who is the right mesmer in under 1 sec. But click it then.

One Last thing ; ppl mentioned it very often now.

“condi chrono can do same /more condi Burst then mirrage”

Proof it. Simply show me the maths. Right now all i saw was ; “Chrono has same condis, u are stupid.” Doesnt even touchs me at all when i can proof u the opposite…

(edited by FaboBabo.3581)

What Mirrage is.

in Mesmer

Posted by: FaboBabo.3581

FaboBabo.3581

Mirrage is selfish and thats a good Thing. If u wanna be a supporter olay chrono and get over it.

You can hardly call it “selfish” if it doesn’t do much more than a Chrono does while also supporting the party.

it is selfish cause it provides any bonus only to himself. Not like his ambushes would make his group do bonus Conditions. He does Bonus Conditions. He gives himself Protection , regen , vigour. He has not a single Group support. This is what selfish means.

And again ; Dont fool me with saying chrono does the same condis / even more Condis then Mirrage.

Mirrage condis LAUGHS about Chrono Condis.

What Mirrage is.

in Mesmer

Posted by: musu.9205

musu.9205

“press shield 4 twice and 5 stun some little chick and shatter it 3 times "

1.can’t you figure that during 3 shatters , you can still do most things you did with mirage on chrono while your foes are stuned .like torch 4 etc etc
only thing missing is that ambush + axe which is bad weapon in pvp .and as i proved . chrono has more condi pressure in much reliable way .

2. 400 range is bad for one click usage .

3. well just give you an idea how other class melee weapon works . if mirage axe aa has worse condi / direct dmg than others . it is weaker .thats the point .if thats not called weaker , what should be considered weaker ? like literally

4. 900 range aoe cc with radius of 240 ,its 1100+ range . have fun to catch someone with 400 range tele lol

5. your point was ambush is stronger , i proved thats wrong for most of them . then you dodged this and start talking they are bonus so whatever. now they are almost just like AA (if we count the damage while dodging , if not they are weaker than aa)

6. its not about just condition cleanse its about overall sustain .i dont mind it has worse sustain than chrono , but its damage is not that good to justify such horrible sustain .

7. well 25% movement buff and dodge roll are a lot . thats why anet even gave us that trait in chrono . traveler rune on mes was meta for a while in pvp .

8. currently there are only one or two skills which are supposed to detarget mirage : axe 3 and illusionary ambush , and it seems not to work in demo .

and i prefer they dont do those stupid detarget thing . it only makes mesmer more annoying which we dont need for many reasons .

like you said its more about your foes skill ,thats the exact point , the usefulness depends on others , and mes has little control .its just bad design and makes game harder to balance for what an annoying class that stomps newbies and is useless in high level play ?

when i said i can pick up real mesmer i meant i clicked on real one and attack that one . in 1s with 200 ping and my friend mirage used maxed stealth + teleport + staff .

why you think its hard ? a person with pink effect teleport around on your screen once or twice .you may want to check some fps gameplay video if you think thats hard to click .

its still not gonna fool any skilled players more than 1s .

What Mirrage is.

in Mesmer

Posted by: FaboBabo.3581

FaboBabo.3581

“press shield 4 twice and 5 stun some little chick and shatter it 3 times "

1.can’t you figure that during 3 shatters , you can still do most things you did with mirage on chrono while your foes are stuned .like torch 4 etc etc
only thing missing is that ambush + axe which is bad weapon in pvp .and as i proved . chrono has more condi pressure in much reliable way .

2. 400 range is bad for one click usage .

3. well just give you an idea how other class melee weapon works . if mirage axe aa has worse condi / direct dmg than others . it is weaker .thats the point .if thats not called weaker , what should be considered weaker ? like literally

4. 900 range aoe cc with radius of 240 ,its 1100+ range . have fun to catch someone with 400 range tele lol

5. your point was ambush is stronger , i proved thats wrong for most of them . then you dodged this and start talking they are bonus so whatever. now they are almost just like AA (if we count the damage while dodging , if not they are weaker than aa)

6. its not about just condition cleanse its about overall sustain .i dont mind it has worse sustain than chrono , but its damage is not that good to justify such horrible sustain .

7. well 25% movement buff and dodge roll are a lot . thats why anet even gave us that trait in chrono . traveler rune on mes was meta for a while in pvp .

8. currently there are only one or two skills which are supposed to detarget mirage : axe 3 and illusionary ambush , and it seems not to work in demo .

and i prefer they dont do those stupid detarget thing . it only makes mesmer more annoying which we dont need for many reasons .

like you said its more about your foes skill ,thats the exact point , the usefulness depends on others , and mes has little control .its just bad design and makes game harder to balance for what an annoying class that stomps newbies and is useless in high level play ?

when i said i can pick up real mesmer i meant i clicked on real one and attack that one . in 1s with 200 ping and my friend mirage used maxed stealth + teleport + staff .

why you think its hard ? a person with pink effect teleport around on your screen once or twice .you may want to check some fps gameplay video if you think thats hard to click .

its still not gonna fool any skilled players more than 1s .

Ok u are a troll i get it now. Wp so far.

What Mirrage is.

in Mesmer

Posted by: Ithilwen.1529

Ithilwen.1529

How is mirrage worse in dueling then base mesmer ?

Having played Mirage, ( I main a core PU Mesmer because I dislike the way Chrono was treated and don’t wish to play as a bruiser type, ) The core is a superior spec.

Mirage ambush is slow, makes one vulnerable to use and doesn’t do enough damage to pull it’s weight.

The mirage teleport skills, such as axe 3, have a nasty habit of landing in the wrong spot. This destroys there usefulness.

Speaking of the axe, it has negligible defensive value. This is an especially large flaw in a weapon designed to be used at “knife fight” range.

The Mirage’s power/condi attack ( ambush) is dependent on clones. Unfortunately, the axe doesn’t generate clones well and clones are super delicate. They have a very short life expectancy in PvP. So, the Mirage’s basic mechanic is tied to a resource that is nearly impossible to retain. On top of that, you lose the heal potential of shattering if you preserve the clones to power ambush.

For all these reasons and more, Core Mesmer is a much better duelist spec.

Mesmerising Girl

What Mirrage is.

in Mesmer

Posted by: musu.9205

musu.9205

“press shield 4 twice and 5 stun some little chick and shatter it 3 times "

.

Ok u are a troll i get it now. Wp so far.

you are proved to be wrong about pure numbers

i linked wiki page for you to check the actual tooltip and dmg numbers (including condi and direct) and im troll ?

telling you that people can click on real mirage very fast is trolling ?
math is hard

What Mirrage is.

in Mesmer

Posted by: FaboBabo.3581

FaboBabo.3581

“press shield 4 twice and 5 stun some little chick and shatter it 3 times "

.

Ok u are a troll i get it now. Wp so far.

you are proved to be wrong about pure numbers

i linked wiki page for you to check the actual tooltip and dmg numbers (including condi and direct) and im troll ?

telling you that people can click on real mirage very fast is trolling ?
math is hard

xD Go ahead

What Mirrage is.

in Mesmer

Posted by: FaboBabo.3581

FaboBabo.3581

“press shield 4 twice and 5 stun some little chick and shatter it 3 times "

.

Ok u are a troll i get it now. Wp so far.

you are proved to be wrong about pure numbers

i linked wiki page for you to check the actual tooltip and dmg numbers (including condi and direct) and im troll ?

telling you that people can click on real mirage very fast is trolling ?
math is hard

also lol you know , !!even we ignore u burned a lot of cd!!, and took !!more than 2 to do that!! . how about take chrono ,!! press shield 4 twice and 5 stun some little chick and shatter it 3 times!! . much easier ,reliable , and you can still have moa lol while u dont need rely on crit hit …. also that flying axe 2 animation , you will be interrupted the second you do that lol .
lets be honest that burst is not as good as you think .

Gimme more

“press shield 4 twice and 5 stun some little chick and shatter it 3 times "
Great Burst ; Go into a fight , Block 4 Seconds , then start doing Things!
Burning a lot of Cd = Torch 4+5, Axe 2, F2.
U burnt= Shield 4 + 5, Fx,Fy,Fz
U burnt one Skill more then i Did (while u still did less Dmg) Nice Argument.

" chrono has more condi pressure in much reliable way ." good proof

“1.can’t you figure that during 3 shatters , you can still do most things you did with mirage on chrono while your foes are stuned .like torch 4 etc etc " – “also lol you know , !!even we ignore u burned a lot of cd!!”

then again u can click on a enemy in 0,0000000000001 sec. If he blinks 0,00000000000001sec before u (ACCIDENTALY) U wont target him. This will happen more often with mirrage since they got more Blinks. Math’s done.

“4. 900 range aoe cc with radius of 240 ,its 1100+ range . have fun to catch someone with 400 range tele lol”
Hm i jaust 3 times and then use pistol 5 ? If we go all in i do blink into 3 Jaunts into Pistol 5 ? Base Mesmer is technically not able to compete with fast traveling from mirrage.

Even if we go most kitten up way, mimic , blink , blink , gravity well
Mirrage still goes , mimic , blink , blink , jaust , jaust , jaust , pistol 5, covering way more range then Chrono or base Mesmer.

Again ; Proof it with numbers. Show me how much stacks of which conditions u can burst onto someone in which time, exactly like i did with torch4,5-axe2,axe2,dodge,ambush,shatter

Dont send me links with pure damage numbers.

(edited by FaboBabo.3581)

What Mirrage is.

in Mesmer

Posted by: musu.9205

musu.9205

your number based on "torch 4 into Jaust → 4 Burn , 3 Confu
torch 5 into axe 2 → 9 Burn , 3 Confu , 3 Torment
axe 2, dodge weapon swap, scepter ambush -“
then you said your combo is ”Torch 4+5, Axe 2, F2“

shameless is only word here .

and also just you know : shield block is 1.5 each anet nerfed it long time ago , and shield 5 is for stun not for dmg . just like other things you know little about them so i linked wiki page for you but reading is too much effort i guess.

but im glad you are so triggered lol

What Mirrage is.

in Mesmer

Posted by: FaboBabo.3581

FaboBabo.3581

your number based on "torch 4 into Jaust -> 4 Burn , 3 Confu
torch 5 into axe 2 -> 9 Burn , 3 Confu , 3 Torment
axe 2, dodge weapon swap, scepter ambush -“
then you said your combo is ”Torch 4+5, Axe 2, F2“

shameless is only word here .

and also just you know : shield block is 1.5 each anet nerfed it long time ago , and shield 5 is for stun not for dmg . just like other things you know little about them so i linked wiki page for you but reading is too much effort i guess.

but im glad you are so triggered lol

Again ; Proof it with numbers. Show me how much stacks of which conditions u can burst onto someone in which time, exactly like i did with torch4,5-axe2,axe2,dodge,ambush,shatter

i forgot the jaust y. My bad. Good i mentioned it early. How’s ur combo ?

Whatever , i won’t reply again if ur not posting the actual combo u’re referring to do “same condi burst” as mirrage.

(edited by FaboBabo.3581)

What Mirrage is.

in Mesmer

Posted by: Carighan.6758

Carighan.6758

And again ; Dont fool me with saying chrono does the same condis / even more Condis then Mirrage.

Mirrage condis LAUGHS about Chrono Condis.

On a target dummy, sure. Try getting those clones to attack anything in real gameplay and you’ll be lucky to get one clone to do what you want, nevermind 2 or 3.

The strength of heart to face oneself has been made manifest. The persona Carighan has appeared.

What Mirrage is.

in Mesmer

Posted by: musu.9205

musu.9205

your number based on "torch 4 into Jaust -> 4 Burn , 3 Confu
torch 5 into axe 2 -> 9 Burn , 3 Confu , 3 Torment
axe 2, dodge weapon swap, scepter ambush -“
then you said your combo is ”Torch 4+5, Axe 2, F2“

shameless is only word here .

and also just you know : shield block is 1.5 each anet nerfed it long time ago , and shield 5 is for stun not for dmg . just like other things you know little about them so i linked wiki page for you but reading is too much effort i guess.

but im glad you are so triggered lol

Again ; Proof it with numbers. Show me how much stacks of which conditions u can burst onto someone in which time, exactly like i did with torch4,5-axe2,axe2,dodge,ambush,shatter

i forgot the jaust y. My bad. Good i mentioned it early. How’s ur combo ?

you forgot about weapon swap and scepter ambush too . and energy sigil too .

let me keep the number froms all those skills but only count 4 skills usage and guys i find something amazingly op . lol

What Mirrage is.

in Mesmer

Posted by: FaboBabo.3581

FaboBabo.3581

your number based on "torch 4 into Jaust -> 4 Burn , 3 Confu
torch 5 into axe 2 -> 9 Burn , 3 Confu , 3 Torment
axe 2, dodge weapon swap, scepter ambush -“
then you said your combo is ”Torch 4+5, Axe 2, F2“

shameless is only word here .

and also just you know : shield block is 1.5 each anet nerfed it long time ago , and shield 5 is for stun not for dmg . just like other things you know little about them so i linked wiki page for you but reading is too much effort i guess.

but im glad you are so triggered lol

Again ; Proof it with numbers. Show me how much stacks of which conditions u can burst onto someone in which time, exactly like i did with torch4,5-axe2,axe2,dodge,ambush,shatter

i forgot the jaust y. My bad. Good i mentioned it early. How’s ur combo ?

you forgot about weapon swap and scepter ambush too . and energy sigil too .

let me keep the number froms all those skills but only count 4 skills usage and guys i find something amazingly op . lol

No problem if u cant find the original post 10 post before. here’s a copy

torch 4 into Jaust -> 4 Burn , 3 Confu
torch 5 into axe 2 -> 9 Burn , 3 Confu , 3 Torment
axe 2, dodge weapon swap, scepter ambush -> 2 clones -> rougly 7 stacks torment and 7 stacks confusion
-> Sharper Images trigger on clones, lets add 5 stacks bleeding assuming u got a 50% Crit Chance.
-> 9 Burn , 10 Confu , 10 Torment , 5 Bleeds
F2 Shatter with 2 clones and 1 Phantasm -> Blind = 2 Stacks Confusion + 8 From normal F2 + 4 stacks Torment.
9 Burn, 20 Confu, 10 Torment, 5 Bleeds.

Edit ; i forgot 3 stacks of torment from the second axe 2. Oh Btw u can chain the second axe 2 into a second Jaust to get both procced immediately. After hatin WP video ur sure aware about it.

And this is not amazingly Op. Its just a fact …
Now im asking again <3

Show me urs !

(edited by FaboBabo.3581)

What Mirrage is.

in Mesmer

Posted by: FaboBabo.3581

FaboBabo.3581

And again ; Dont fool me with saying chrono does the same condis / even more Condis then Mirrage.

Mirrage condis LAUGHS about Chrono Condis.

On a target dummy, sure. Try getting those clones to attack anything in real gameplay and you’ll be lucky to get one clone to do what you want, nevermind 2 or 3.

I played the Beta. Was fun. I mentioned the combo like 2 times here. I asked ppl several times to showcase how chrono can do the same. I never get an answer oô

What Mirrage is.

in Mesmer

Posted by: Windwalker.7421

Windwalker.7421

I don’t know why everyone is talking about Mirage being a Condie spec, when clearly it is at least as strong for Power as it is for Condie. It also actually makes sense that Axe is condie focused, because anything besides a melee range condie weapon would have automatically invalidated another weapon option. So I think Anet did good there, trying to make Axe something useful but different for Mesmers without destroying existing weapons.

Yes, it needs some work, as do many aspects of Mirage. However, honestly, how would you make Axe a pure Power weapon and make it better than Sword? The Mirage Sword is extremely mobile, provides strong hard CC via Dom traits, and also creates a clone. All that with BF, which is still one of the best skills in the game.

Power Mirage is fine and at least as good as Condie Mirage, with the blatant difference that it provides a viable Power Mesmer build option, which clearly Chrono already provides for Condie-focused play.

Still Anet managed to make Mirage Condie very different from Chrono. It is much more single-target focused, and can deliver a more sustained barrage of Conditions. It is also much more mobile than Chrono, but also much more squishy and reliant on that mobility to stay alive.

I’m certainly not saying Mirage doesn’t still require some significant improvements, but clearly Anet has come up with an Elite that will provide two additional ways to play a Mesmer, both Power and Condition. Both will be played and both will be viable in their own ways. (That is not to say they will both be more optimal than Chrono, it would be sad if that were the case!)

As for core Mesmer…sorry, I don’t buy it. A Mirage will crap all over core Mesmer…even that is a bit unfortunate, but it’s not like Chrono doesn’t do the same.

What Mirrage is.

in Mesmer

Posted by: Daishi.6027

Daishi.6027

Mirage is supposed to juke, leave people guessing, and evade.

To bad our jukes are “meh” and more limmited compared to what core thief can do.

No one is going to actually fall for illusions even with a target drop, and the sheer amount of AoE just renders the concept useless in the few instances it could have mattered.

And we don’t even have that much doge, half of it they expect us to run around and grab mirrors before they expire despite their short time.

Not that I don’t think you can get kills on mirage, the demo weekend was clearly contrary to that, and the kills great like the rush old power shatter used to give. But it feels like Chrono, and Thief are just better long term options unless clone hiding becomes a real thing. But no one has time for that off point, and on point it’s just a good way to get decapped.

“I control time and space; you can’t break free.~”
“Maybe I was the illusion all along!”

(edited by Daishi.6027)

What Mirrage is.

in Mesmer

Posted by: musu.9205

musu.9205

And again ; Dont fool me with saying chrono does the same condis / even more Condis then Mirrage.

Mirrage condis LAUGHS about Chrono Condis.

On a target dummy, sure. Try getting those clones to attack anything in real gameplay and you’ll be lucky to get one clone to do what you want, nevermind 2 or 3.

I played the Beta. Was fun. I mentioned the combo like 2 times here. I asked ppl several times to showcase how chrono can do the same. I never get an answer oô

you mentioned full combo twice , lied about it 3 times and then you still think your number is right with your 4 skill usages ?

and what i said is an actual combo used in meta chrono condi build lol i even mentioned a stun for chrono to actually hit something .

you got so many facts wrong , and shamelessly call people who linked wiki page troll.

i havent seen a joke like energy sigil on pvp build for a while .

your 2s 30 stacks of confusion wet dream was busted from very beginning , and you still refuse to check mirage skill tooltips .

list things you said are simply wrong :
energy sigil
ambush attack damage
shield block duration
detarget mechanic
count recharge
ambush attack being bonus (devs said its a special mechanic for mirage )
and more

What Mirrage is.

in Mesmer

Posted by: FaboBabo.3581

FaboBabo.3581

And again ; Dont fool me with saying chrono does the same condis / even more Condis then Mirrage.

Mirrage condis LAUGHS about Chrono Condis.

On a target dummy, sure. Try getting those clones to attack anything in real gameplay and you’ll be lucky to get one clone to do what you want, nevermind 2 or 3.

I played the Beta. Was fun. I mentioned the combo like 2 times here. I asked ppl several times to showcase how chrono can do the same. I never get an answer oô

you mentioned full combo twice , lied about it 3 times and then you still think your number is right with your 4 skill usages ?

and what i said is an actual combo used in meta chrono condi build lol i even mentioned a stun for chrono to actually hit something .

you got so many facts wrong , and shamelessly call people who linked wiki page troll.

i havent seen a joke like energy sigil on pvp build for a while .

your 2s 30 stacks of confusion wet dream was busted from very beginning , and you still refuse to check mirage skill tooltips .

list things you said are simply wrong :
energy sigil
ambush attack damage
shield block duration
detarget mechanic
count recharge
ambush attack being bonus (devs said its a special mechanic for mirage )
and more

Thats it. I am 100% right with energy sigil(in WvW , as i stated it).

Quote ; “One thing i need to mention is that i was referring to WvW all the time. This occurs to PvP too in some aspects, but im sure aware of sigil of energy is 25% in Pvp.”

I am 100% right with ambush CONDITION APPLYING. I was wrong with shield Block duration which means following ; innstead of doing “nothing” the first 4 seconds, ur combo is doing nothing the first 3 seconds -> great improvement. I was never talking about detarget mechanic. All i said about count recharge is true. Beeing a bonus and a special mechanic doesnt cut into eachother.

I never lied. I will admit that i FORGOT to mention some parts of the combo, as i needed to write it like 10 times.

May i ask the 10th time ; can i see ur combo on chrono WITH STACKS of condition?
No i can’t. Why? U know ur combo won’t have the condi pressure u promised.

Btw we can do this forever bro ^^ Dont overfeed urself

Finally a Quote of urself ; show us the build , rotation , so we can compare this with core condi mes like its anything hard lol"

Yeah dude , just show me ur combo , like its anything hard lol.

(edited by FaboBabo.3581)

What Mirrage is.

in Mesmer

Posted by: musu.9205

musu.9205

And again ; Dont fool me with saying chrono does the same condis / even more Condis then Mirrage.

Mirrage condis LAUGHS about Chrono Condis.

On a target dummy, sure. Try getting those clones to attack anything in real gameplay and you’ll be lucky to get one clone to do what you want, nevermind 2 or 3.

I played the Beta. Was fun. I mentioned the combo like 2 times here. I asked ppl several times to showcase how chrono can do the same. I never get an answer oô

you mentioned full combo twice , lied about it 3 times and then you still think your number is right with your 4 skill usages ?

and what i said is an actual combo used in meta chrono condi build lol i even mentioned a stun for chrono to actually hit something .

you got so many facts wrong , and shamelessly call people who linked wiki page troll.

i havent seen a joke like energy sigil on pvp build for a while .

your 2s 30 stacks of confusion wet dream was busted from very beginning , and you still refuse to check mirage skill tooltips .

list things you said are simply wrong :
energy sigil
ambush attack damage
shield block duration
detarget mechanic
count recharge
ambush attack being bonus (devs said its a special mechanic for mirage )
and more

Thats it. I am 100% right with energy sigil(in WvW , as i stated it).

Quote ; “One thing i need to mention is that i was referring to WvW all the time. This occurs to PvP too in some aspects, but im sure aware of sigil of energy is 25% in Pvp.”

I am 100% right with ambush CONDITION APPLYING. I was wrong with shield Block duration which means following ; innstead of doing “nothing” the first 4 seconds, ur combo is doing nothing the first 3 seconds -> great improvement. I was never talking about detarget mechanic. All i said about count recharge is true. Beeing a bonus and a special mechanic doesnt cut into eachother.

I never lied. I will admit that i FORGOT to mention some parts of the combo, as i needed to write it like 10 times.

May i ask the 10th time ; can i see ur combo on chrono WITH STACKS of condition?
No i can’t. Why? U know ur combo won’t have the condi pressure u promised.

Btw we can do this forever bro ^^ Dont overfeed urself

Blink back a short distance and launch a barrage of chaos orbs at your foe, inflicting either confusion or torment each hit. Condition duration halved for clones.

“K maybe 2 second 30 Confu was too harsh for a pvp situation, lets go the full burst combo”

what you said "for a pvp situation " then u listed energy sigil .
all of those i consider as lies.

you can name them whatever you like but that wont change people will say those are lies .

and you did talk about how people cant re click real mirage which is detarget otherwise what were you talking about ?

you said
“5. Ambushes are better versions of normal Auto Attacks for scepter, Staff and Axe (didnt test others). I previously explained why ambushes are strong, simply because they are a bonus. And again 5 Stacks of conditions is never a joke”

i told you check cast time etc also consider you have to burn your dodge for that especially staff , and you saying you are right about it ?
and you saying you tested axe ambush even tho you ignored the facts its damage will be ruined by adds or more enemy players .

and now you are lying that u were talking about wvw all the time ?

and ambush attack is the core mechanic about mirage , i already said , go watch dev stream or something .

and you are wrong about axe AA being strong , i said go check other axe AA and mirge axe AA is weaker . but you refused to define what weaker means .

you really lack self respect in this post .

What Mirrage is.

in Mesmer

Posted by: FaboBabo.3581

FaboBabo.3581

And again ; Dont fool me with saying chrono does the same condis / even more Condis then Mirrage.

Mirrage condis LAUGHS about Chrono Condis.

On a target dummy, sure. Try getting those clones to attack anything in real gameplay and you’ll be lucky to get one clone to do what you want, nevermind 2 or 3.

I played the Beta. Was fun. I mentioned the combo like 2 times here. I asked ppl several times to showcase how chrono can do the same. I never get an answer oô

you mentioned full combo twice , lied about it 3 times and then you still think your number is right with your 4 skill usages ?

and what i said is an actual combo used in meta chrono condi build lol i even mentioned a stun for chrono to actually hit something .

you got so many facts wrong , and shamelessly call people who linked wiki page troll.

i havent seen a joke like energy sigil on pvp build for a while .

your 2s 30 stacks of confusion wet dream was busted from very beginning , and you still refuse to check mirage skill tooltips .

list things you said are simply wrong :
energy sigil
ambush attack damage
shield block duration
detarget mechanic
count recharge
ambush attack being bonus (devs said its a special mechanic for mirage )
and more

Thats it. I am 100% right with energy sigil(in WvW , as i stated it).

Quote ; “One thing i need to mention is that i was referring to WvW all the time. This occurs to PvP too in some aspects, but im sure aware of sigil of energy is 25% in Pvp.”

I am 100% right with ambush CONDITION APPLYING. I was wrong with shield Block duration which means following ; innstead of doing “nothing” the first 4 seconds, ur combo is doing nothing the first 3 seconds -> great improvement. I was never talking about detarget mechanic. All i said about count recharge is true. Beeing a bonus and a special mechanic doesnt cut into eachother.

I never lied. I will admit that i FORGOT to mention some parts of the combo, as i needed to write it like 10 times.

May i ask the 10th time ; can i see ur combo on chrono WITH STACKS of condition?
No i can’t. Why? U know ur combo won’t have the condi pressure u promised.

Btw we can do this forever bro ^^ Dont overfeed urself

Blink back a short distance and launch a barrage of chaos orbs at your foe, inflicting either confusion or torment each hit. Condition duration halved for clones.

“K maybe 2 second 30 Confu was too harsh for a pvp situation, lets go the full burst combo”

what you said "for a pvp situation " then u listed energy sigil .
all of those i consider as lies.

you can name them whatever you like but that wont change people will say those are lies .

and you did talk about how people cant re click real mirage which is detarget otherwise what were you talking about ?

you said
“5. Ambushes are better versions of normal Auto Attacks for scepter, Staff and Axe (didnt test others). I previously explained why ambushes are strong, simply because they are a bonus. And again 5 Stacks of conditions is never a joke”

i told you check cast time etc also consider you have to burn your dodge for that especially staff , and you saying you are right about it ?
and you saying you tested axe ambush even tho you ignored the facts its damage will be ruined by adds or more enemy players .

and now you are lying that u were talking about wvw all the time ?

and ambush attack is the core mechanic about mirage , i already said , go watch dev stream or something .

and you are wrong about axe AA being strong , i said go check other axe AA and mirge axe AA is weaker . but you refused to define what weaker means .

you really lack self respect in this post .

nice combo ok i see now what u meant as u said chrono deals more conditions. Seriously i need to work arround my rotations. Pvp means Player vs Player. I mentioned i was talking about Wvw 6 houres before. Try reading my posts. I never said Axe AA is great. I said its not bad, and 2 conditions on and AA are great. U dont need to burn a dodge for ambushes ; this is why i said they are a bonus; whenever u dodge with proper reasons, u deal bonus dmg afterwards. Cast time starts as soon as u get mirrage cloak ( maybe 0,25 s later), which means u have 0,5 secs invunerablity. I mentioned Axe ambush problems several posts before. I said u were right on thath one tehcnically but ur perspective is wrong since base mesmer or chrono would never deal even a signle amount of bonus after they dodged.

I thaught with detargeting u mean axe 3 and the new utility which is DEtargeting.
U’re referring to me saying REtargeting the Mirrage WHILE he jumps x times more then base Mesmer is mathimatically harder to do. Am still 100% Correct with it.

Dude i actually have a brain. I know ur trolling since i’ve told u i know. It’s just ; i Have the Time and it’s like sudoku ; brain training We can have some fun together. U can call me if u want, we have a nice chat, i’d bring arguements, you’d say “no u lie”, i’d show u facts, you’d say “no facts lie”, it would be a great Talk !

Btw when referring to a pvp situation i led some parts of the combo untouched, cause i KNOW i won’t have 3 clones up ever. For Pve hell i give u 43 stacks of confusion EASY.

Answer of musu ; see u lied again as u said “we go into full combo” 100%

(edited by FaboBabo.3581)

What Mirrage is.

in Mesmer

Posted by: apharma.3741

apharma.3741

This topic has descended into mud throwing and wrestling but with significantly less naked bodies of the gender/apache helicopters you prefer.

What Mirrage is.

in Mesmer

Posted by: Carighan.6758

Carighan.6758

What I don’t get is… why not just send 3 bleed-proccing Pistol Phantasms after your target?

Easier to spawn (Chrono and all), more versatile, last, don’t eat dodges and hey, they deal direct damage, too. 15 stacks of bleeding every 5 seconds, plus all the direct damage, plus you’re free to do other things like apply more conditions, CC targets or survive. For extra burst, time a shatter well.

The strength of heart to face oneself has been made manifest. The persona Carighan has appeared.

What Mirrage is.

in Mesmer

Posted by: FaboBabo.3581

FaboBabo.3581

This topic has descended into mud throwing and wrestling but with significantly less naked bodies of the gender/apache helicopters you prefer.

I’d wish we’d have apache helicopters ):

What Mirrage is.

in Mesmer

Posted by: musu.9205

musu.9205

nice combo ok i see now what u meant as u said chrono deals more conditions. Seriously i need to work arround my rotations. Pvp means Player vs Player.[/quote]

all we know in gw2 pvp means spvp while wvw is wvw .you only checked.

i meant you got facts wrong thats it , its not something shameful or big deal .just accept that . no one is going eat you for that .
but instead you got triggered and kept changing what your words mean . also many things clearly showed you did not test much of mirage in real gameplay .like axe ambush .or even fully read those tooltips.

why i have to prove a well known condi build’s condition pressure (which is meta for like 1.5 year only changed amulet )to you .

https://metabattle.com/wiki/Build:Chronomancer_-_Chronophantasma_Shatter

its you who made theory craft based on wrong information which needs to be proved useful in pvp .

you said this yourself " but having TWO conditions on the auto Hit is pretty good, dont u think"

now you saying you said its not bad . pretty good has a simple meaning you know , one does not include “not bad”

you were talking " I’d wonder if anyone properly could get me as a target in the first 5 – 10 seconds of the fight ; if he wants to click on me , im allready gone again."
yeah that totally means axe 3 retarget lol like come on .

you have a brain but not much of dignity .
all those words you said you can find them yourself in this very post and then you lied times and times .anyway im done .

What Mirrage is.

in Mesmer

Posted by: FaboBabo.3581

FaboBabo.3581

What I don’t get is… why not just send 3 bleed-proccing Pistol Phantasms after your target?

Easier to spawn (Chrono and all), more versatile, last, don’t eat dodges and hey, they deal direct damage, too. 15 stacks of bleeding every 5 seconds, plus all the direct damage, plus you’re free to do other things like apply more conditions, CC targets or survive. For extra burst, time a shatter well.

While this occurs to PvE only i think i cant give u any proper discussion about this. I’m not a pve player and it would bother too much of my time to actually do the math for the most DPS on Both elite. For this specific Question I’d wait for Mirrage beeing released and watch its actual DPS output when fully mastered. I think even musu mentioned in another post that in PVE Condi Mirrage will have more dmg then Condi Chrono but looses alacraty etc…

Seriously i dont know which one has more dmg in a perfect rotation, which is what most pve hardcore players aim for. Holding dps as chrono may be easier, but if mirrage provides more dmg, high lvl pve play will take mirrage, IF the other problems in not taking chrono (ala, quickness), can be solved elsewhere without loosing dps there.

To debate on Pve Status u have to consider every single number on every single Class, to form a meta Group.

What Mirrage is.

in Mesmer

Posted by: FaboBabo.3581

FaboBabo.3581

nice combo ok i see now what u meant as u said chrono deals more conditions. Seriously i need to work arround my rotations. Pvp means Player vs Player.

all we know in gw2 pvp means spvp while wvw is wvw .you only checked.

i meant you got facts wrong thats it , its not something shameful or big deal .just accept that . no one is going eat you for that .
but instead you got triggered and kept changing what your words mean . also many things clearly showed you did not test much of mirage in real gameplay .like axe ambush .or even fully read those tooltips.

why i have to prove a well known condi build’s condition pressure (which is meta for like 1.5 year only changed amulet )to you .

https://metabattle.com/wiki/Build:Chronomancer_-_Chronophantasma_Shatter

its you who made theory craft based on wrong information which needs to be proved useful in pvp .

you said this yourself " but having TWO conditions on the auto Hit is pretty good, dont u think"

now you saying you said its not bad . pretty good has a simple meaning you know , one does not include “not bad”

you were talking " I’d wonder if anyone properly could get me as a target in the first 5 – 10 seconds of the fight ; if he wants to click on me , im allready gone again."
yeah that totally means axe 3 retarget lol like come on .

you have a brain but not much of dignity .
all those words you said you can find them yourself in this very post and then you lied times and times .anyway im done .

[/quote]

Dont got a single Fact wrong. Im not using the word spvp, dont got the knowledge there. I’d say everyone gets me right when i say “pvp-situation”.

I thaught u were talking about axe 3 and utlity since u are a troll and ur ignoring 50% of the things i said. This brought me to the conclusion u would simply turn the words in my mouth(which u did several times), by saying i would talk about those skills.

“why you think its hard ? a person with pink effect teleport around on your screen once or twice .”

This further brought me to the conclusion u were talking about axe 3 and the new utilitys.

U dont need to justify a well known meta Build. U need to justify the sentence

[“proved you are wrong . and if we talk about constantly condi pressure like 5 stack confusion from one ambush . chrono does that better.”]

Again show me ur rotation, show me how chrono is better in applying Condis. Even if ur referring to the word constantly like serious.

Pistol 4*3 , scepter 3 off cooldown, shatter once or twice, auto attacking. This is it ? This is ur constant condi applying which is BETTER then mirrage?

Not like Mirrage COULD do the same ….no he can additionaley use every dodge as a bonus dmg instead of loosing dps while dodging. Mirrage can use axe 3 and axe 2, while scepter 3 is on cooldown.

What are ur goin to do as Chrono ?
STAFF AUTOS !!!
Sword 2 once or twice ?
Shield 5 ?

Oh oh oh got it now ; ur doin wells for the group support. Arent u? Sure they have no cast time and provide such a great condi pressure!

U could do ur super cool combo like ; randomely block 2 times at the start of a fight, using 3 shatters randomely, throw some torch 4 and torch 5 into and voila ; u just did nothing.

Ps ; oh u stuned something with Shield 5..maybe…

(edited by FaboBabo.3581)