Guild Wars 2

Mesmer has been my favorite class out of all the classes. I’ve shared all off the wonders of jump puzzle cheating with portals and the tears of defeat to make anyone angry when they finish off one of my clones instead of me.

Personally, I could care less if I don’t win every fight, everyone loses from time to time. However after playing other classes for a while I couldn’t help but to turn back to my mesmer for a brief moment then remember why I dislike playing.

IF I could ONE thing with the Mesmer is would just to be allowed to use my clones at will without having to have a target on someone. Just going to give a simple example

Lets throw a thieve in the picture, mind you when one of them goes in stealth what’s the first thing that comes in mind? He/She about to come throw a dagger in my back or line something up for a painful attack. Mind you I almost have the same amount of stealth skills as them with the only exception is mine are double edge swords. I’m basically using them at the cost of some offensive play. (still shatter for days though).

If ANYTHING I rather be allowed to still have someone’s hp bar traced even when under stealth conditions so I could at least summon my clones and illusions around me. Sure they wouldn’t be allowed to attack until someone appears but I feel as though a Mesmer should have the right to go. “Oh I can’t see you but even still you have to figure out which one of me is the real one or I’m going to mess you up.”

It’s not too much of a rant against the thieve class, I have a lvl 76 one and I have to tell you. Out of all the classes that I played, I feel no…“effort” in it. (No offense to the class players.)

Mesmer is fine, a l2p issue.

ViciousVyne.2935:

Mesmer is fine, a l2p issue.

Mesmer isn’t fine…but I’m finding it hard to disagree with the rest of your post for this specific thread.

Fay.2357:

ViciousVyne.2935:

Mesmer is fine, a l2p issue.

Mesmer isn’t fine…but I’m finding it hard to disagree with the rest of your post for this specific thread.

Mesmer is no where near fine, and I swear people with the L2P response can never bring up any real input. I’m pretty sure the people that even use that are the people who only play one class period =-=

Shomaruki.7395:

Fay.2357:

ViciousVyne.2935:

Mesmer is fine, a l2p issue.

Mesmer isn’t fine…but I’m finding it hard to disagree with the rest of your post for this specific thread.

Mesmer is no where near fine, and I swear people with the L2P response can never bring up any real input. I’m pretty sure the people that even use that are the people who only play one class period =-=

I only play mesmer, period.

Thieves are not an insurmountable obstacle for pretty much any mesmer build. In a duel, it’s absolutely possible to kill a thief if you’re skilled enough. The reason thieves are said to hardcounter mesmers in PvP is because of the different roles that the classes play. The mesmer role is to provide teamfight utility and damage, while the thief role is to eliminate high-priority targets. You can fight a thief 1v1…you just can’t fight them while succeeding in your role, and that means the thief is succeeding in theirs.

You mention that nobody ever brings up any real input? Well, you never asked any real questions that input could be provided on. Your entire post is literally just aimless complaining about thief mechanics and wishing for drastic mechanic changes that will obviously never happen. If you want feedback and help, you need to provide specific questions or concerns that people can respond to. You will literally never see “l2p” as a response to a post that reads like ‘hey, I’m having trouble against thieves in these situations with these builds, anyone have advice or recommendations?’ You will always see “l2p” with posts that read like ‘omg thieves are so overpowered I can’t do anything about them, they always kill me nonstop, we should get big changes so that we can beat them all the time’. Your post is the latter case.

Mesmer=plrrrrrtCaCAPooPoosplootch!!!!… but fun to play. But im gonna go Super Meta.. eith r-t@rd Eng or Warrior.

Fay.2357:

The mesmer role is to provide teamfight utility and damage, while the thief role is to eliminate high-priority targets. You can fight a thief 1v1…you just can’t fight them while succeeding in your role, and that means the thief is succeeding in theirs.

How could you guess that thieves won’t be able to succeed in that role if this change is implemented? I know it makes it easier to prepare shatters for when they get out of stealth, but what else?

Fay.2357:

Your entire post is literally just aimless complaining about thief mechanics and wishing for drastic mechanic changes that will obviously never happen.

Fay.2357:

we should get big changes so that we can beat them all the time’

Oh, please show us how drastic this change would be before saying that. If the only thing you can say is that this change would make it so that mesmers can beat thieves all the time… well, it’s not just the mesmers that need to L2P then.

Yaar.8527:

Oh, please show us how drastic this change would be before saying that. If the only thing you can say is that this change would make it so that mesmers can beat thieves all the time… well, it’s not just the mesmers that need to L2P then.

This would be a titanic change in how the game functions at a very basic level. If you can maintain a target through stealth, that leads to a lot of very awkward questions. Can only mesmer vs thief maintain a target through stealth? Can thief do it on mesmer? Can mesmer do it on other classes that are stealthed? Can other classes do it to mesmer and thief too? What does that target show, does it show boons and conditions? Currently, having a target necessarily means that you can use attacks on that target. This would need to be completely changed so that you could apparently only cast phantasms on a target, but use no other attacks.

Basically, this change could literally remove the entire concept of stealth from the game. Whether or not that in and of itself is a bad thing is another discussion for another day, but that’s what this could do.

Other than the massive game-mechanic altering consequences of this change, it would specifically make thieves quite easy to deal with as any mesmer with damaging phantasms. Phantasms like to attack instantly upon their target becoming available. If you can still summon phantasms on a stealthed thief, you can easily get 3 phantasms up—instakilling the thief when they unstealth unless they dodge. This means that thieves would be unable to use any attack that doesn’t allow them to immediately dodge when they exit stealth. This is obviously an awful idea.

As I said earlier, only poor mesmers find thieves an impossible fight. As I also said earlier, the reason why thieves are considered a hardcounter to mesmers in PvP has nothing to do with that individual 1v1 matchup and everything to do with how the roles of the two classes interact.

okay so, first of all mesmer and theif cna share roles, but also play different roles. the main role (in spvp atleast) for either class is nuke burst damage. there are pros and cons to each class but 8/10 times the theif does it better and its more reliable. the only real thing a mesmer brings to a table better than a theif is portals and boon stripping, possbiyl moa but already we are talking abotu high level high organized team play, something which 95% of players are not involved in. unless you compete in weekly ELS and other tournaments on a regular basis, you are not involved in high level play. end of story.
secondlt theif “hardcounters” mesmer not because of the role but because of the skill sets and class mechanics of both. 9/10 theives will run some sort of spammable blind or stealth, d/p theif being the hardest for mesmers. this is because it renders half of the mesmers skills useless just based of class mechanincs (talking summoning clones and phhantasms, anything that requires a target).
saying that it doesnt mean mesmers cant win fights or duels even, they jstu have to be smart, counter stealth and wait for opputrune momemnts and usually have a pre-setup burst, cuz either class can 1shot the other (talking meta builds shatter mesmer here) they have to know when to f3 daze and interupt certian theif skills and be able to play ahead of a theif, which usually isnt too hard, especially against d/p its just the class mechanics make it hard. playing agasitn d/p is very predictable but you get hard countered before the fight even starts.
either way theif is just more reliable in the current meta, wvw is a different story where theives really only shine in roaming, as do mesmers but altelast mesmer bring some zerg utility inn portal veil null field.
anyway thanks for listening, im drunk

Zzero.4316:

anyway thanks for listening, im drunk

haha you username sounds like it’s pronounced by a drunk.

Fay spelled it out quite perfectly; don’t think anyone is surprised there. To add to it, not only would we be able to setup the stage so that the Thief is in trouble when they come out of stealth, we would be able to do that from stealth. That is even nastier.

Thieves have a large amount of mobility and evasion, but not enough to reasonably deal with 3 phantasms attacking every ~3-4s while their Mesmer is also throwing butterflies at them.

Even if they did manage to down you through all of that, they’d need to make sure they had stealth long enough to down you, so they’d likely need to waste a Shadow Refuge cooldown.

Overall, that’s asking quite a lot.

If you wanted something more substantial to complain about with our illusions, I suggest you complain about the various targets in PvE that:

• you can summon phantasms on, but they refuse to damage
• can’t even summon illusions on
• illusions having survival trouble in large-scale encounters (issue in PvP too).