Guild Wars 2

I don’t mean to complain but it seems like most classes think we take zero skill to perform. Is this because of our confusing mechanics? I don’t get it. I was dueling a thief and facerolling them and they told me to switch to another class, so i switched to necro, and then i was told to switch to a fair class. Is it ignorance? Arrogance? What creates the mesmer hate?

Ignorance, arrogance, immaturity, idiocy, take your pick.

^ what pyro said. mostly people that cant figure this class out. they never played one and then whine cause they cant find the real mesmer. i play mesmer and yes mes can kill me but i can handle them. so people just blindly hate mes and i think some devs dislike mes too deep inside.

Apparently in speaking with the thief it turned out to be projected displeasure because they were new to their class but didn’t want to show it (especially because they have legendaries).

I’m not sure. This may be an unpopular opinion here, but I think Mesmer is one of the most balanced classes in the game next to Guardian/Engi. waits for my fellow Mesmer-users to flame me There are ALOT of issues with most classes, and I honestly feel like others are either severely OP or UP.

That being said, I played with some people recently that didn’t know how to stomp the right Mesmer. -____- I think that says enough.

MailMail.6534:

I’m not sure. This may be an unpopular opinion here, but I think Mesmer is one of the most balanced classes in the game next to Guardian/Engi. waits for my fellow Mesmer-users to flame me There are ALOT of issues with most classes, and I honestly feel like others are either severely OP or UP.

That being said, I played with some people recently that didn’t know how to stomp the right Mesmer. -____- I think that says enough.

Incendiary Powder Engi with balthazar runes is definitely not balanced.

MailMail.6534:

I’m not sure. This may be an unpopular opinion here, but I think Mesmer is one of the most balanced classes in the game next to Guardian/Engi. waits for my fellow Mesmer-users to flame me There are ALOT of issues with most classes, and I honestly feel like others are either severely OP or UP.

That being said, I played with some people recently that didn’t know how to stomp the right Mesmer. -____- I think that says enough.

well depending on what game modes u play and how. some of us play wvw raids in organized groups and see the issues which u might not experience. and i think thats what the devs do aswell. they watch spvp they watch hotjoins, they dont see many bugs, they dont see issues with ai, they dont see the ai bugs that show more in larger group encounters.
people that play spvp, hate mes, cause they dont wanna have to think when mashing 11111. mes uses your attacks against u, the more u mash buttons the more u hurt yourself, but all this is not what the mes problems are. the mes lacks at other places and saying it is balanced is your opinion of course but based on a a little narrowminded pov. mes is not balanced cause we lack in different game modes,

Daniel Handler.4816:

I don’t mean to complain but it seems like most classes think we take zero skill to perform. Is this because of our confusing mechanics? I don’t get it. I was dueling a thief and facerolling them and they told me to switch to another class, so i switched to necro, and then i was told to switch to a fair class. Is it ignorance? Arrogance? What creates the mesmer hate?

You have the lowest skill floor of all classes and the second most uptime on stealth, I wonder.

You have AI that stays until destroyed or shattered on extremely low cool downs while you dodge around and basically laugh. A decent Mesmer would not lose to anyone in a 1v1 and would only die in a 2v1 if all players are on a even skill floor.

It is not ignorance or arrogance unless you want to take into account Mesmer/Thieves who think they are skilled for stealthing around.

I hear ya brotha!!! Decap engis aren’t balanced either, but I think overall, engi is more balanced than other classes. Let’s not derail the thread though with that discussion.

I think people who choose to main Mesmer are on the higher end of skill level (pats self on back). That being said, when the “average” player faces a decent mesmer main, they get frustrated because like someone said, they can’t just 1111 him to death.

eta – you’re right. I only play pvp, but I have heard that Mesmers lack a role in wvw other than using glamours.

Vanthian.9267:

You have the lowest skill floor of all classes and the second most uptime on stealth, I wonder.

You have AI that stays until destroyed or shattered on extremely low cool downs while you dodge around and basically laugh. A decent Mesmer would not lose to anyone in a 1v1 and would only die in a 2v1 if all players are on a even skill floor.

It is not ignorance or arrogance unless you want to take into account Mesmer/Thieves who think they are skilled for stealthing around.

I smell a ticked-off Warrior main. With all due respect, isn’t the accusation of “lowest skill floor” generally tossed at your class of choice? Stealth uptime, I’ll grant you; however, it’s on reasonable-to-“long as all F” C/Ds. As for the AI business, stick around this forum, you’ll find plenty of Mesmer players who’d rather the class mechanics weren’t so AI-heavy.

With that said, I do disagree with certain nerfs to the Warrior profession. Especially the wackiness done unto Longbow. However, a decent Warr is still a major threat, and I’d think we can agree on that fact.

MailMail.6534:

I hear ya brotha!!! Decap engis aren’t balanced either, but I think overall, engi is more balanced than other classes. Let’s not derail the thread though with that discussion.

I think people who choose to main Mesmer are on the higher end of skill level (pats self on back). That being said, when the “average” player faces a decent mesmer main, they get frustrated because like someone said, they can’t just 1111 him to death.

eta – you’re right. I only play pvp, but I have heard that Mesmers lack a role in wvw other than using glamours.

ah i see your point very well then. yeah spvp i still am having fun on my mes. wvw is just lacking the role and aoe and a lot of the things u can use in spvp. imagine all your illusions would always go poof the moment u pop them.
but yeah people hate on mes. they hated us even more in wvw when we had our glamour builds. caus glamour punished u hard for button mashing. i think mes should be even more punishing imo. more aoe punish skills would be nice and maybe bring back some of mes role in wvw.
yhats why people love thieves. 1111,2222,1111 and u can just constantly put pressure on your target, but if they do this to a mes or accidently to a clone, it hurts them. (btw my favorite part about the mes. punish mindless spamming, yay)

We also have a lot of rather nasty tricks for 1v1 encounters. Not necessarily strong ones, but nasty.

And since – for whatever reason – plenty players value 1v1 a lot, that annoys them.

Vanthian.9267:

Daniel Handler.4816:

[…]

You have the lowest skill floor of all classes and the second most uptime on stealth, I wonder.

You have AI that stays until destroyed or shattered on extremely low cool downs while you dodge around and basically laugh. A decent Mesmer would not lose to anyone in a 1v1 and would only die in a 2v1 if all players are on a even skill floor.

Stealth and AI (lol) aside you are talking about the warrior bro.
The only way to perform easy duel win with a mesmer is that your opponent is watching you like a kid that does not know what will happen to him. Someone aware won’t have so much trouble against an ordinary mesmer. Unless he doesn’t know anything about mesmer, what is seen these days. I faced people that could not tell the difference between my clone and I while I lied on the floor.
The other way to be deadly is to be realy fast and accurate. It requires so much timing and focus that a single mistake can screw you up. So please, don’t talk about low skill floor. It’s your ignorance that’s make us strong.

Vanthian.9267:

You have the lowest skill floor of all classes

rofl

Sure, mesmer has the lowest skill floor. That’s why we see so many mesmers running around, you know, like every second character on any map is a mesmer.
Apparently it also has toughness/vitality which are always there and do not require any skill to use them.
And wears heavy armor. Also is easy-peasy to level.
Considering this, you totally should roll the mesmer, instead of playing that squishy nerfed bugged support class (in the game where support classes are not supposed to exist at all) you’re playing now, yeah.

Oh wait, someone said that Mesmer has the lowest skill floor of all classes? LAWL

Let’s face it.

Mesmer is easier to get into PvP than most professions, because your clones distract enemies while you can learn how to play.

This is true especially if you’re fighting begginers. The detargetting and multiple characters makes it all overwhelming, and by the time they detect the real you they are already dead.

Now, I don’t have much experience in late competitive/skilled play, but I’m assuming this changes with time, experience and effort.

To sum up, it’s the Mesmer’s unique clone ability that confuses them and the fact they need to keep targeting the real one that makes new players frustrated when they play against one.

It is easy to explain. You are disliked for the same reason all professions that have AI pets are hated for.

Mesmer creates clones/phantasms that deal a large amount of their damage from a third party perspective. This damage if reflected is directed back at the source, not the creation of the source. When it is also taken into consideration that clones/phantasms automatically go on recharge upon cast, which every other profession AI does not go on recharge until it is destroyed (necro minion/guardian spirit weapons/ ranger spirits) It now means this 3rd party damage is very spammable. In practice when a player can create sources of damage at location A against a player and move away to location B while damage is still being done at location A is asinine to put it politely. It defeats the very purpose of PvP. It reduces it to player vs player+AI damage. That is why mesmer is disliked..because it is badly created profession That offers little team buffs, is spam friendly and large amounts of its damage is AI controlled and doesn’t require the mesmer to remain in range, or even in the greater vicinity in theory.

lazycalm.5186:

Let’s face it.

Mesmer is easier to get into PvP than most professions, because your clones distract enemies while you can learn how to play.

This is true especially if you’re fighting begginers. The detargetting and multiple characters makes it all overwhelming, and by the time they detect the real you they are already dead.

Now, I don’t have much experience in late competitive/skilled play, but I’m assuming this changes with time, experience and effort.

To sum up, it’s the Mesmer’s unique clone ability that confuses them and the fact they need to keep targeting the real one that makes new players frustrated when they play against one.

If only the clones moved and weren’t made out of hard spaghetti noodles.

Targeting.

That’s the only thing I find annoying – especially with stealths and illusions. Spotting the mesmer is easy – only takes a second. Cycling through targets to reselect them is tedious. I believe it’s the very poor archaic targeting system that has held this game back.

Thinking about it, I must be kittening annoying to fight!

The only thing that bugs me are PU mesmers that refuse to die – pretty much every other type of mesmer build is challenging enough to play against but has attacks which are clearly choregraphed which allows you to actually interact with their bursts with your own mitigation.

This game needs more choreographed skills full stop though, getting thrown in the trash can and having no idea what the hell even hit me just drives me mad.

Mesmer is the profession that destroys noobs.
Noobs get confused by the illusions and can’t target figure a way to target the mesmer.

Probably just one of the reasons people “hate” mesmers, but something I’ve been noticing since PvE players invaded sPvP.

I would hate mesmers if I didn’t play one. How do you deal with someone who is hidden most of the time and can spike huge damage while stealthed? When you do casth the mesmer off guard he just blinks away.
Lets be honest in wvw roaming mesmers and thieves are miles ahead of other classes.

I think that thief and (pre-patch) warrior hate > mesmer hate.
Thief is probably the most hated class in this game.

I used to care, then I stopped care what other classes thought of me.

Then after fought endless of cowardly running warriors, guardians etc, or been hunted by packs of guildgroups of ppl who dont want anythinge else than jump into the 1 vs 1 I just doing to jump/dance/laught I started to care again.

Good roamers usualy dont hate mesmers and I often have good convs/wave and emoting with other roamers. Them you treat with respect-

Pve,er in big groups are the biggest haters and ivadin wvwv from time to time. Al this ppl who hate us now feed my heart with their tears, I can spend endless time to troll ppl. Jump inot a 3 vs 1, down somone and stomp, then fast throw a ram on him and stealth + blink, favo emote.

/Osicat

I main warrior, and once went into spvp with a mes.

Dominated because both classes are faceroll

Cause we are pink.

Have you ever seen tarantino’s reservoir dogs?

xD

Don’t forget Moa! lol

I conducted a poll and the results are thieves are the most hated profession in the game.

And now you know.

Haha cheers Xavi, I knew it,

Tbh I find mesmers rather quite , pink and butterflyich

/Osicat

Our class is just similar to thieves in that we crush inexperienced people. Coupled with the fact that people don’t like being confused and they don’t like losing. We’re actually not as strong as people think in 1v1 if the player knows how mesmers work. All of our tricks and burst have very obvious animations and are fairly easy to predict. People who have trouble with this are simply people who aren’t very good. Landing pretty much any hard hitting skill requires us to either be next to our opponent (which is risky for a light armor class) or for them to be caught off guard.

Xelic.8674:

Mesmer is the profession that destroys noobs.
Noobs get confused by the illusions and can’t target figure a way to target the mesmer.

Probably just one of the reasons people “hate” mesmers, but something I’ve been noticing since PvE players invaded sPvP.

Everyone has to spend time either cycling through next target or selecting target with the mouse – it’s not that it is difficult, it’s that it is tedious. Especially if fighting a PU mesmer with multiple stealths.

Noobs might take longer or fail altogether, but even good players will have to keep on top of the targeting “minigame” – they just do it faster. Still think it’s a silly system, but anything different would likely require a new game altogether.

Difficult to target the real Mesmer. This remind me the pain to level up my Mesmer while many have power leveled and went to Orr for farming. Among the desert zones I frequently encountered veterans with several range and melee mobs. From there I learned how to read the battle and to decide which I should avoid and which I should focus to nuke first.

Time flies and I now have characters as Engineer, Guardian, Ranger and Elementalist. I found that playing other professions is very forgiving. Engineer, Guardian and Elementalist have various ways to get healing, health regeneration and conditions cleansing. Guardian and Elementalist have access to different forms of protection. And all of them can have pet or pets and don’t need to worry about losing dps across flights when their targets die. Furthermore, even now I have well equipped my Mesmer, his dps is not particularly spectacular as my less equipped Guardian and Elementalist.

During the Escape from Lion Arch episode, I notice that a lot of players got caught by a veterans Krait which can summon two Ettins. However, its manchanic basically was a Mesmer summoning Phantasms under a different cloth. With this realization, as long as I could interrupt his long summon cast it was no threat at all. If other players had triggered the Ettins, I would avoid them and focus on the Krait while used Spatial Surge to melt the Ettins down.

As a Ranger I use trap to slow down my opponents. Now I adopt a similar strategy in my Mesmer with help of sigil. I tried skills combo on my Mesmer before Karka event and was not impressed. However, skills combo is very essential on my Elementalist and Guardian. Now I tried to revisit this aspect in Mesmer. Play other professions help me get a better grip of GW2 game mechanic and become a better Mesmer. Mesmer is my main and I enjoy its style.

Curunen.8729:

Targeting.

That’s the only thing I find annoying – especially with stealths and illusions. Spotting the mesmer is easy – only takes a second. Cycling through targets to reselect them is tedious. I believe it’s the very poor archaic targeting system that has held this game back.

Thinking about it, I must be kittening annoying to fight!

It’s this. Half the time you’re fighting the UI and that’s really frustrating.

Cycling to target is awful because the target selection makes no sense and is unpredictable… If I could easily see that in three button presses, I’d cycle to the desired target, that’d make things a lot easier.

…and clicking on target often fails even when your mouse is directly on the target.

We are pretty. Nerds hate pretty people.

They hate what they dont understand. Ppl who know how mesmer works dont hate the class or even worse player that is behind that clkitteners will hate whatever you do. If you beat them you are noob cuz you using X ( X = PU, shatter, clones, you name it) if they beat you then you are noob, lowbie etc. Maybe if you just stand on one place shouting: “Hey everyone, free kill here. Come kill a mesmer, effort free, just today!” maybe, but one big maybe it would be ok for them. I say screw them, play what you like how you like and if they dont like it let them complain to someone who cares.

Mesmer lowest skill floor by far in any 1v1 situation. The AI does all the work.
Mesmer = MM necro.

The problem with your opinion, Loki, is that ANet does seem to actually hand the QQers what they cry for. (WvW Confusion Debacle, Hambow nerfs, the breaking of the original D/D Ele, etc.)
As for you, a t s e. You at least part-time a Thief. You should be bloody accustomed to folk whinging about you; why in heck come to another class’ forums and do the same? Seems a tad … hypocritical, truly.
Regarding comments about fighting the UI to target someone; folk wonder why I want MMOs to toss Tab-Targeting into a fire towards its inevitable destruction. Tab-Targeting makes a fight worse on both sides, IMHO, and an “active” combat system shouldn’t need it in the least.

a t s e.9614:

Mesmer lowest skill floor by far in any 1v1 situation. The AI does all the work.
Mesmer = MM necro.

lowest skill floor he says

Well thats sad indeed but you cant change that. If ANet will listen to crybabies we can do nothing about it. But you can ignore ppl that “demand” that you play by their “rules” or they will flame you. If the game gives you opportunity to play “the AI does all the work” mesmer and you enjoy it why would you care if someone dont like you for that?

Amen. Phant’s not my thing, but it’s still a class tool. Although, I rather wish it weren’t the best for dungeons … of course, I may as well wish ANet got their condition-stacking in order, if I’m going to go into Wishville.

Imo it’s PU. PU builds (condi especially) take little skill to play. I love Mesmer. It’s one of my favourite classes. I hate the fact most people seem to think you have to take it to be viable in WvW though. It’s not the only viable build, it just makes builds OP. Mesmer probably has the best most balanced traits of any class in the game (I play all the classes, quite a bit). You can take any number of trait combinations and make it work. Hell, you can even go glassier than any class and make it work WITHOUT PU.

PU does have one of the lowest skill floors of any build, but a high skill ceiling, the latter being like all mesmer builds. I remember a guildy of mine speccing PU condi one day, and laughing at how easy it was to kill people. He mains warrior kitten , the most generally OP (and widely recognised as being so) class in the game atm.

lazycalm.5186:

Let’s face it.

Mesmer is easier to get into PvP than most professions, because your clones distract enemies while you can learn how to play.

This is true especially if you’re fighting begginers. The detargetting and multiple characters makes it all overwhelming, and by the time they detect the real you they are already dead.

Now, I don’t have much experience in late competitive/skilled play, but I’m assuming this changes with time, experience and effort.

To sum up, it’s the Mesmer’s unique clone ability that confuses them and the fact they need to keep targeting the real one that makes new players frustrated when they play against one.

This is the thing.
Specifically the part in bold.

Mesmers tend to roll over beginners. We’re not a class that’s particularly friendly to people that don’t know how we work.
Most people, once they reach the level of “competent” in a competitive game mode, can deal with mesmers without too much trouble.

But I think we’re forever doomed to be flamed by noobs.

I think people hate us more because it’s easier for the common pve’er to become overwhelmed and confused without actually denting the real mesmer.

For a veteran player or someone that actually understands how to fight a mesmer. it isnt so hard for them.

So this becomes a
In hotjoin spvp, you faceroll newbs
In Tpvp, you are overshadowed by classes that can do what ever role you choose better ( portal aside)

This is pretty much the problem.
You dont see good teams with a lot of mesmer’s
You do see warriors,engies,thieves, necro’s, and guardians a lot though.

ah yes, blaming the pve’ers. I mostly do solo arah but when I pvp it’s not that hard for me to pick out the real mesmer.

Well, mesmers do take skill but once mastered, are by far the best duelers. Only competitor is a d/p thief who waits for the right moment to burst however can just as easily be blown to bits if they overstep that attempt. I’ve watched some high level pvp 2v2, its like putting 2 beta fish into the same tank and waiting for one to get ripped to shreds (not recommended kids).

I can’t say I hate them atm, because clearly there is a bug with the summons atm and bugs should have no say in regards to balance. However even before the recent bugs Mesmer clones could hit like a truck and the Mesmer could spec to be near impossible to take down while vanishing and recovering to full. Some people I’ve come across use Mesmer primarily because they’re not as coordinated and the AI help them keep up with the fast paced but at the same time its annoying watching AI do all the work while they just hop around. It’s sad when phantasms and clones are more useful than a ranger’s own pet.

From a thief perspective I envy mesmers. They can do anything we can do and then some, while also supporting allies to some degree. Its a thief enchanted with +1, which is upsetting. Even without a shatter spec they can still burst or melt you in seconds.

From a warrior perspective, kinda don’t have one. They give me trouble time to time but warrior is drowning in defenses naturally. Also I don’t play him often.

From a necro perspective luckily I’m mid range so I don’t get kited as much but lack of evasion makes it really easy to get locked down or interrupted. Only thing helping me keep up is DS to wipe out a majority of the clones/phantasms but I have to use it carefully or they interrupt me. Often mesmers just teleport just outside my range and maintain near perma cripple with occasional immobilize to where I’m just limping around while slowly melting.

From a ranger perspective, don’t play it anymore. Gave it many tries, its either far to boring to play or simply not good enough to deal with the meta.

From a engineer perspective, don’t play it as much but aside from condi Mesmer I don’t have any issues. I can dodge and aoe the summons all day, and from traits it’s hard to lock me down.

Even still, I would bet thief gets more hate than mesmers which I don’t understand why. Maybe more people play thief because its easier to learn than Mesmer?

I think people would hate rangers if they got killed by it repeatedly.
People automatically assume you are running a cheese build now whenever they get beat in a fair fight or they find you difficult to kill. The idea that they where out played is just incomprehensible especially if you are playing a class like mesmer where a single trait is so well known yet seems to be so unknown at the same time. (the amount of times I have had people ask me if I am running pu when regen appears on my buff bar)

1. AI
2. AI with strong passive dmg
3. CC
4. blinks
5. Stealths
6. Dazes/stun chains
7. high evade up time
8. Invulnerabilities
9. strong condi
10. Moa
    
    it’s not that Mesmer don’t take skill to play, they are just annoying to fight since they bring everything that people HATE to fight in this game, into every single Mesmer build

The same reason why people hate thieves. You can’t be war or guardian and faceroll the keyboard and win a fight against a mesmer or a thief. Apparently condition builds against the classes with poor condition cleanse don’t exist in this game.

CntrlAltDefeat.1465:

It is easy to explain. You are disliked for the same reason all professions that have AI pets are hated for.

Mesmer creates clones/phantasms that deal a large amount of their damage from a third party perspective. This damage if reflected is directed back at the source, not the creation of the source. When it is also taken into consideration that clones/phantasms automatically go on recharge upon cast, which every other profession AI does not go on recharge until it is destroyed (necro minion/guardian spirit weapons/ ranger spirits) It now means this 3rd party damage is very spammable. In practice when a player can create sources of damage at location A against a player and move away to location B while damage is still being done at location A is asinine to put it politely. It defeats the very purpose of PvP. It reduces it to player vs player+AI damage. That is why mesmer is disliked..because it is badly created profession That offers little team buffs, is spam friendly and large amounts of its damage is AI controlled and doesn’t require the mesmer to remain in range, or even in the greater vicinity in theory.

This is pretty much why, pvpers lose their mind when faced with any kind of AI and start freaking out on the forums., saying weird things like ‘Mesmer has the lowest skill floor’. They can’t understand that the illusions have as much AI as just putting your skill 1 on auto and are pretty much just killable dots.

I wish I could kill backstab or Warrior’s Hammer but apparently power block was OP.

Dei Veien.2456:

(the amount of times I have had people ask me if I am running pu when regen appears on my buff bar)

Despite being a Power based Interrupt build, I frequently get accused of being a condi based PU build.

People…