Guild Wars 2

I play WvW mostly.

I sometimes see people are saying mesmers are the wrost class to play and most trash class. But from what i experienced condi scepter/torch staff PU mesmers are extremely powerful and hard to kill and most of people just dont care about or run from them if u see them in wvw. only weakness is that u wont kill anyone if others decide not to fight or care about u. I know mesmers lack of mobility and prob others but i think PU condi is really strong. what are ur thoughts?

PU builds are extremely survivable, but many Mesmers don’t find them to be very fun to play, because like you say: chances are, the opponent’s just going to run away rather than bothering to fight you. If they stay, sure, you can wear them down, but that’s about it. Other builds can be fairly fun to play, but pale in comparison to what other professions can do, both in damage and survivability.

In PvE, there’s just plain no reason to bring a Mesmer for a dungeon or fractal unless you want to use Portal. Aside from that, just about everything a Mesmer can do, a Guardian or Thief can do better, while bringing better damage and boons to the party as well. Until either the Mesmer is reworked or PvE starts rewarding condition damage and boon removal, the Mesmer’s just going to be a pale imitation of other professions.

I’m fine not being the most damaging profession, so long as we can bring other things to the table, but at the moment, most of what a Mesmer can do—no matter how cool those tricks are—just isn’t valuable.

That build is for solo roaming of havoc groups. Try running that in a Zerg. Try dps objects in wvw. It is a one trick pony. Sure log in roam solo and feel strong just don’t play the rest of the game. Funny this is an mmo not a platform system. Mesmer is the only glass taken from a solo platform game transferred over with portal and veil; a sad attempt to make mesmer a team player.

PU condi mesmer (like Blackwater or Napalm Cat) is a good build overall, but it has some limitations:

• Takes a while to kill anyone who doesn’t trigger blocks or cleave the clones. (You can condi burst but it’s not as big as a necro’s, in my experience.)
• Can’t really chase, unless the enemy is pretty slow and you’ve got a lot of practice with staff ports.
• Isn’t really any better at soloing camps than any other decent roaming build.
• Is middling at best in team fights.
• Has slow low-damage projectiles and a single 30-second area effect field in ZvZ (vastly inferior to ele).
• Sucks at killing siege and area denial in sieges.

Imagine a bunker guardian standing out near south camp sentry challenging people to fights, and winning most of them: is that the best “roaming” build? That’s kinda Condi PU in a nutshell.

People say mesmer is a class with serious problems (I wouldn’t say “bad” per se) because:

• The core class mechanic is summoning illusions, but like half of them are bugged (Warden, Illusionary Leap), designed to fail (Illusionary Leap again), or do nothing of substance (Mage).
• A lot of damage comes from phantasms, which just die instantly in large-group fights.
• The class has very little area-effect damage, on the whole. This greatly diminishes its value in ZvZ. (You’ve still got Veil, so you’ll never be useless.)
• Track record of big nerfs. Like the big confusion nerf (followed by introducing Perplexity runes, which actually make other classes better at confusion anyway). Or the change to glamours that basically made the mesmer’s biggest ZvZ function utterly dead.

well reason is simple. mesmer is still capable to shine somewhat in 1v1 encounters. we all agreed with that. but most of the time u dont have those encounters. in spvp u will face multiple enemies and yes to still survive u will need a lot whereas with any other class u can do things easier.
in wvw mes is fading away and only reason to bring it is veil. pve… sorry but the loot is terrible u get on mes. especially if its multiple enemies. while im still strong in 1v1, i lack everything in groupplay. if this was a single player game, i wouldnt even complain, but i like other game modes. i love wvw and it used to be fun, but now wvw is a grind on mesmer. i can t deal aoe dmg, its hard to survive, i cant kill regen war, my illusions are useless, i have no stability, i got barely any multitarget skills, i have a hard time to keep up with my team due to out of combat speed being terrible and on top of that, mes has soo many bugs, its not even funny.
lately ive only played my necro and shelved my mesmer i have been playing since release. i used to raid with AVTR in wvw and yes we did kill a ton of players with glamour and even with triforce after that. countless nerfs though have destroyed the fun for mes though and the bugs keep adding up. so yeah thats why mes has reached to bottom of the bottoms….

anet already nerfed mesmer damage and aoe abilities.

Mesmer are one of the lowest damage classes in the game.

One build, strong in one scenario – purely 1v1 or 1vX fights.

It’s a case of extremes:

- one cheese build (particularly Condi), powerful because of one trait and stealth, mindlessly easy to play in 1v1, 1vX scales with skill.

- all the remaining builds (what few of them remain that haven’t been broken beyond repair) require considerably more skill depending on scenario (ie not 1v1 phantasm in 1v1…), and are often at a disadvantage to other classes in the different game modes.

This is the problem – PU being buffed hurts the class as a whole, because many players can’t see further than it and assume mesmer is very powerful – when in reality all other builds need help/work.

If you enjoy being a martyr, then mesmer is for you!

Glamour mesmer is still very, very -useful- in WvW because null field and blinding melee train can change the outcome of a fight. Feedback on golems, liches, or zerker eles can be powerful. Veil of course. You do very powerful things. You just don’t really get rewarded, personally, for doing them.

I mean… my staff auto attack crits for like 500 damage. I can’t go melee in a fight. Phantasms are more or less useless. We rely on sigils like tormet/ fire/ and stuff to tag people to get any bags at all. We can spec to take out squishies in zerg backlines but even then other professions are much much better at it(thieves, killshot, lich form, HgH engineers(still a thing unfortunately), zerker LB signet rangers and so on). No matter what we build fully for in WvW, classes can build fully for it and out perform us EXCEPT for martyring our tags and damage for utility. We can make the difference in fights but it just doesn’t feel good nor does it really go noticed.

In sPvP we have the same problems, but the individual skill of a player can shine moreover making the class perform well. However, as it’s been stated by top mesmers in tPvP, they feel if they were playing one of the top professions/ builds instead of a mesmer, they would be getting better results without a doubt(and I was the same way. My tPvP win rate was 80% since playing Ele from launch. I switched to memser recently again, and I just can’t carry nor do I feel as impactful(win rate currently 69%. I went like 2-9 with mesmer).

I’ve tried nearly a dozen builds in the passed two years on mesmer, and none of them have been outstanding(original phant mesmer, maybe. The damage was very good).

I can’t comment on PvE. It’s not my thing. But I can imagine the inflated damage and AoE to make it comparable to phantasms being useless in ZvZ.

As to how to fix it? It’s been suggested to at least make phantasms invulnerable for the first 2-3 seconds of conjuring them to ensure the first attack. This would help PvE and WvW a bit. It wouldn’t effect sPvP that much since it’s super rare a phantasm will die before attacking once anyway. It’s more of a quality of life change, I believe. Working and effective phantasms would be a boon in all game modes.

selan.8354:

well reason is simple. mesmer is still capable to shine somewhat in 1v1 encounters. we all agreed with that. but most of the time u dont have those encounters. in spvp u will face multiple enemies and yes to still survive u will need a lot whereas with any other class u can do things easier.
in wvw mes is fading away and only reason to bring it is veil. pve… sorry but the loot is terrible u get on mes. especially if its multiple enemies. while im still strong in 1v1, i lack everything in groupplay. if this was a single player game, i wouldnt even complain, but i like other game modes. i love wvw and it used to be fun, but now wvw is a grind on mesmer. i can t deal aoe dmg, its hard to survive, i cant kill regen war, my illusions are useless, i have no stability, i got barely any multitarget skills, i have a hard time to keep up with my team due to out of combat speed being terrible and on top of that, mes has soo many bugs, its not even funny.
lately ive only played my necro and shelved my mesmer i have been playing since release. i used to raid with AVTR in wvw and yes we did kill a ton of players with glamour and even with triforce after that. countless nerfs though have destroyed the fun for mes though and the bugs keep adding up. so yeah thats why mes has reached to bottom of the bottoms….

I agree with you. I now roll my necro in wvw and it is so much fun to play and i truly enjoyed zerg fights, which never happen when i roll my mesmer

Why ?
Not viable value on GvG except veil.
Hard countered by thieves which you cannot escape from in pvp and roaming.
Obliterated by condi bunkers aoes if you try to keep a point on pvp.

MidoriMarch.8067:

I play WvW mostly.

I sometimes see people are saying mesmers are the wrost class to play and most trash class. But from what i experienced condi scepter/torch staff PU mesmers are extremely powerful and hard to kill and most of people just dont care about or run from them if u see them in wvw. only weakness is that u wont kill anyone if others decide not to fight or care about u. I know mesmers lack of mobility and prob others but i think PU condi is really strong. what are ur thoughts?

Why bring a Mesmer when I can bring a better profession? That’s the mentality amongst many players nowadays. Mesmer can be considered the worse class in specific departments, but we still have a lot to offer through our utilities. Damage will very on the type of build you’re running.

The reason PU Condi is strong, because you’re able to survive quite well and still putout decent damage through conditions. Damage can be lackluster in group play, or against condition removal builds. It depends on the entire situation, especially with what it can and cannot offer.

Players don’t want to waste their time, since PU wins a majority of fights (1v1, 2v1). I think players want a Mesmer to be squishy, so they feel like they have an advantage. Another reason is mostly skill amongst many builds. You’ll hear many saying, “PU doesn’t take skill.”

PU trait upsets people, when really they need to look at the entire build. They also need to look at our survival within the build and outside the build. To me, PU is a strong build, but there’s better builds from other professions out there. PU may seem easy to play, but there’s other builds that are better, yet easy to manage.

Mesmers are a bit weaker than other classes, that’s for sure. However, the reason why they’re the worst class to play is how bugged they are. Many of their skills don’t work properly, so playing as a Mesmer is more annoying than fun.

Well at least we’re the most elegant profession.

And PU is a good trait but it kind of sucks that anet wants us to rely on clones for defense, which in pvp is absurd when fighting good players. PU is a nice way to actually give us surivability, but in return you essentially have to forfeit your capture point.

There’s power PU too !

Miku Lawrence.6329:

There’s power PU too !

Yeah power PU is pretty nice when you’re on veil duty for your guild and you want to stay alive, especially with torch cleanses. You can even spec to have stronger shatters and whatnot, you just can’t lock targets down and mindwrack them as frequently and without the 4th self shatter, but when you have thieves in your gank squad, that hardly makes a difference.